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Re: The MVDP hotel incident "today" vs. "when I was a kid" [echappist] [ In reply to ]
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The video shows one party knocking on the door, giggling and clearly knowing what they are doing.

There is then a lot of noise, screaming in a hijinks hilarity sound from the offending party. Vidoe of MVDP is inconclusive looking more like it is from his room.

There is no video to support the claim:

People occupying land are entitled to the quiet enjoyment of that land, whether they are an owner or tenant. A legal nuisance is a substantial and unreasonable interference with that quiet enjoyment, and is categorised into either public or private nuisance.

In this case the Door knockers have:

  • undertaken an activity or intrusion that causes fear.

The door knockers could have been imprisoned for 6 months and fined 15K
They are also liable for civil litigation and MVDP could make a case.


Given that he copped to a 1500 fine, suggests maybe he did perhaps go a bit too far as he would otherwise have a strong case. But have to ask why the police did not bring the door knockers and their parents in and say well here it is you will be charged with nuisance and held in the cells, or you can all STFU and take a caution.
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Re: The MVDP hotel incident "today" vs. "when I was a kid" [stevie g] [ In reply to ]
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stevie g wrote:
The video shows one party knocking on the door, giggling and clearly knowing what they are doing.

There is then a lot of noise, screaming in a hijinks hilarity sound from the offending party. Vidoe of MVDP is inconclusive looking more like it is from his room.

There is no video to support the claim:

People occupying land are entitled to the quiet enjoyment of that land, whether they are an owner or tenant. A legal nuisance is a substantial and unreasonable interference with that quiet enjoyment, and is categorised into either public or private nuisance.

In this case the Door knockers have:

  • undertaken an activity or intrusion that causes fear.

The door knockers could have been imprisoned for 6 months and fined 15K
They are also liable for civil litigation and MVDP could make a case.


Given that he copped to a 1500 fine, suggests maybe he did perhaps go a bit too far as he would otherwise have a strong case. But have to ask why the police did not bring the door knockers and their parents in and say well here it is you will be charged with nuisance and held in the cells, or you can all STFU and take a caution.

I think in the eyes of the law he maybe did go too far technically, and I imagine he pled guilty to get it over and done with, you would think any decent lawyer would not have allowed a plea to be made within 48 hours like that. Makes you question who was giving them legal advice.
There are already anti-cycling comments on various news sites that are not even related to the actual case.
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Re: The MVDP hotel incident "today" vs. "when I was a kid" [Amnesia] [ In reply to ]
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Yes no doubt. MVDP and the hotel should have done better. Hotel should have evicted the door knockers.
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Re: The MVDP hotel incident "today" vs. "when I was a kid" [stevie g] [ In reply to ]
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stevie g wrote:
Yes no doubt. MVDP and the hotel should have done better. Hotel should have evicted the door knockers.


Possibly the most accurate commentary in the thread IMHO. Doli Incapax applies here, but once MVDP is involved in an incident producing injuries to the other party (and self defence vs female kids is a long bow) then the legal process should be charged with finding out whether he is liable ie, not the attending cops. He pled guilty, so it cannot be too tough a stretch. The kids certainly need a kick up the rear, but it wasn’t his job.

And they could not have stayed in a less cycle aware spot. Bet the kids had no idea who they were being arsehats too
Last edited by: Gustavo: Sep 29, 22 1:16
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Re: The MVDP hotel incident "today" vs. "when I was a kid" [Amnesia] [ In reply to ]
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Amnesia wrote:
stevie g wrote:
The video shows one party knocking on the door, giggling and clearly knowing what they are doing.

There is then a lot of noise, screaming in a hijinks hilarity sound from the offending party. Vidoe of MVDP is inconclusive looking more like it is from his room.

There is no video to support the claim:

People occupying land are entitled to the quiet enjoyment of that land, whether they are an owner or tenant. A legal nuisance is a substantial and unreasonable interference with that quiet enjoyment, and is categorised into either public or private nuisance.

In this case the Door knockers have:

  • undertaken an activity or intrusion that causes fear.

The door knockers could have been imprisoned for 6 months and fined 15K
They are also liable for civil litigation and MVDP could make a case.


Given that he copped to a 1500 fine, suggests maybe he did perhaps go a bit too far as he would otherwise have a strong case. But have to ask why the police did not bring the door knockers and their parents in and say well here it is you will be charged with nuisance and held in the cells, or you can all STFU and take a caution.


I think in the eyes of the law he maybe did go too far technically, and I imagine he pled guilty to get it over and done with, you would think any decent lawyer would not have allowed a plea to be made within 48 hours like that. Makes you question who was giving them legal advice.
There are already anti-cycling comments on various news sites that are not even related to the actual case.

I don't know. If it was me and I lost my cool and grabbed some kids who were messing with me, and ended up arrested for it, I'd just pay the fine, get my passport back and high tail it out of the country before things got any worse. It will blow over shortly and he'll be fine.

I would assume once he's out of the country he's essentially immune to any further criminal or civil consequences.
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Re: The MVDP hotel incident "today" vs. "when I was a kid" [ThisIsIt] [ In reply to ]
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ThisIsIt wrote:
Amnesia wrote:
stevie g wrote:
The video shows one party knocking on the door, giggling and clearly knowing what they are doing.

There is then a lot of noise, screaming in a hijinks hilarity sound from the offending party. Vidoe of MVDP is inconclusive looking more like it is from his room.

There is no video to support the claim:

People occupying land are entitled to the quiet enjoyment of that land, whether they are an owner or tenant. A legal nuisance is a substantial and unreasonable interference with that quiet enjoyment, and is categorised into either public or private nuisance.

In this case the Door knockers have:

  • undertaken an activity or intrusion that causes fear.

The door knockers could have been imprisoned for 6 months and fined 15K
They are also liable for civil litigation and MVDP could make a case.


Given that he copped to a 1500 fine, suggests maybe he did perhaps go a bit too far as he would otherwise have a strong case. But have to ask why the police did not bring the door knockers and their parents in and say well here it is you will be charged with nuisance and held in the cells, or you can all STFU and take a caution.


I think in the eyes of the law he maybe did go too far technically, and I imagine he pled guilty to get it over and done with, you would think any decent lawyer would not have allowed a plea to be made within 48 hours like that. Makes you question who was giving them legal advice.
There are already anti-cycling comments on various news sites that are not even related to the actual case.


I don't know. If it was me and I lost my cool and grabbed some kids who were messing with me, and ended up arrested for it, I'd just pay the fine, get my passport back and high tail it out of the country before things got any worse. It will blow over shortly and he'll be fine.

I would assume once he's out of the country he's essentially immune to any further criminal or civil consequences.

No, he most certainly is not immune to any further action even when out of the country. This, in the simplest sense, enabled him to get his passport returned and leave the country. Australia has extradition laws etc with most countries. He is not immune to anything simply by leaving the country. Worse still, he may be subject to an exclusion order for Australia for the next 3 years, and every time he completes an arrival card/declaration he now has a criminal record he may have to declare (the threshold for what needs to be declared obviously differs between countries). The implications are not overly minor, especially for an athlete who needs to travel constantly for their career. I have heard he is now appealing things, but that is word of mouth as I have not had a chance to read the news yet.
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Re: The MVDP hotel incident "today" vs. "when I was a kid" [Amnesia] [ In reply to ]
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Amnesia wrote:
ThisIsIt wrote:
Amnesia wrote:
stevie g wrote:
The video shows one party knocking on the door, giggling and clearly knowing what they are doing.

There is then a lot of noise, screaming in a hijinks hilarity sound from the offending party. Vidoe of MVDP is inconclusive looking more like it is from his room.

There is no video to support the claim:

People occupying land are entitled to the quiet enjoyment of that land, whether they are an owner or tenant. A legal nuisance is a substantial and unreasonable interference with that quiet enjoyment, and is categorised into either public or private nuisance.

In this case the Door knockers have:

  • undertaken an activity or intrusion that causes fear.

The door knockers could have been imprisoned for 6 months and fined 15K
They are also liable for civil litigation and MVDP could make a case.


Given that he copped to a 1500 fine, suggests maybe he did perhaps go a bit too far as he would otherwise have a strong case. But have to ask why the police did not bring the door knockers and their parents in and say well here it is you will be charged with nuisance and held in the cells, or you can all STFU and take a caution.


I think in the eyes of the law he maybe did go too far technically, and I imagine he pled guilty to get it over and done with, you would think any decent lawyer would not have allowed a plea to be made within 48 hours like that. Makes you question who was giving them legal advice.
There are already anti-cycling comments on various news sites that are not even related to the actual case.


I don't know. If it was me and I lost my cool and grabbed some kids who were messing with me, and ended up arrested for it, I'd just pay the fine, get my passport back and high tail it out of the country before things got any worse. It will blow over shortly and he'll be fine.

I would assume once he's out of the country he's essentially immune to any further criminal or civil consequences.


No, he most certainly is not immune to any further action even when out of the country. This, in the simplest sense, enabled him to get his passport returned and leave the country. Australia has extradition laws etc with most countries. He is not immune to anything simply by leaving the country. Worse still, he may be subject to an exclusion order for Australia for the next 3 years, and every time he completes an arrival card/declaration he now has a criminal record he may have to declare (the threshold for what needs to be declared obviously differs between countries). The implications are not overly minor, especially for an athlete who needs to travel constantly for their career. I have heard he is now appealing things, but that is word of mouth as I have not had a chance to read the news yet.

Could he be charged with any further crimes given that he already plead guilty to whatever it was they charged him with? I assume the cops got all the relevant information at the time from the aggrieved family.
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Re: The MVDP hotel incident "today" vs. "when I was a kid" [ThisIsIt] [ In reply to ]
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ThisIsIt wrote:
Could he be charged with any further crimes given that he already plead guilty to whatever it was they charged him with? I assume the cops got all the relevant information at the time from the aggrieved family.

I am not a lawyer so I cannot comment as accurately as others.
But certainly pleading guilty to one charge does not make you immune to further prosecution on related charges.
In this situation there would almost certainly be nothing further to be charged with though, from what we know.
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Re: The MVDP hotel incident "today" vs. "when I was a kid" [Amnesia] [ In reply to ]
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Amnesia wrote:
ThisIsIt wrote:

Could he be charged with any further crimes given that he already plead guilty to whatever it was they charged him with? I assume the cops got all the relevant information at the time from the aggrieved family.


I am not a lawyer so I cannot comment as accurately as others.
But certainly pleading guilty to one charge does not make you immune to further prosecution on related charges.
In this situation there would almost certainly be nothing further to be charged with though, from what we know.

IANAL but I would think his biggest worry would be a civil suit. He must have reasonably deep pockets and would seem to be an obvious target. Not sure how it works in Oz but in the US the ambulance chasers would be all over this.
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Re: The MVDP hotel incident "today" vs. "when I was a kid" [eb] [ In reply to ]
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Quote:
IANAL but I would think his biggest worry would be a civil suit. He must have reasonably deep pockets and would seem to be an obvious target. Not sure how it works in Oz but in the US the ambulance chasers would be all over this.



Not sure they'd be all over it in the US. Going up against deep pockets can be tough. His lawyers would have the resources to dig deep into the girls upbringing and past behavior. Maybe also counterclaim for damages for not being able to race.

________
It doesn't really matter what Phil is saying, the music of his voice is the appropriate soundtrack for a bicycle race. HTupolev
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Re: The MVDP hotel incident "today" vs. "when I was a kid" [eb] [ In reply to ]
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The nuisnace door knockers can be sued , this one is going away
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Re: The MVDP hotel incident "today" vs. "when I was a kid" [eb] [ In reply to ]
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eb wrote:
Amnesia wrote:
ThisIsIt wrote:

Could he be charged with any further crimes given that he already plead guilty to whatever it was they charged him with? I assume the cops got all the relevant information at the time from the aggrieved family.


I am not a lawyer so I cannot comment as accurately as others.
But certainly pleading guilty to one charge does not make you immune to further prosecution on related charges.
In this situation there would almost certainly be nothing further to be charged with though, from what we know.


IANAL but I would think his biggest worry would be a civil suit. He must have reasonably deep pockets and would seem to be an obvious target. Not sure how it works in Oz but in the US the ambulance chasers would be all over this.

Doesn't tend to happen here in Oz.
We have ambulance chasers for medical misadventure and car accidents etc, but not this stuff....
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Re: The MVDP hotel incident "today" vs. "when I was a kid" [Amnesia] [ In reply to ]
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Amnesia wrote:
ThisIsIt wrote:

Could he be charged with any further crimes given that he already plead guilty to whatever it was they charged him with? I assume the cops got all the relevant information at the time from the aggrieved family.


I am not a lawyer so I cannot comment as accurately as others.
But certainly pleading guilty to one charge does not make you immune to further prosecution on related charges.
In this situation there would almost certainly be nothing further to be charged with though, from what we know.

Sure, I was thinking cop to the charge that was given since it wasn't so bad, pay the fine and get gone. OTOH, stick around, try to fight it, and end up being charged with some worse crime or get "trapped" there over some civil suit. Not sure if the latter could happen or not, but I wouldn't take the chance on it.

Good luck trying to get money out of him if he's back home.
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Re: The MVDP hotel incident "today" vs. "when I was a kid" [Amnesia] [ In reply to ]
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Amnesia wrote:
eb wrote:
IANAL but I would think his biggest worry would be a civil suit. He must have reasonably deep pockets and would seem to be an obvious target. Not sure how it works in Oz but in the US the ambulance chasers would be all over this.


Doesn't tend to happen here in Oz.
We have ambulance chasers for medical misadventure and car accidents etc, but not this stuff....

That's good to hear. Most of my knowledge of the Australian legal system comes from watching 'Rake', so I might be a little confused.
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Re: The MVDP hotel incident "today" vs. "when I was a kid" [eb] [ In reply to ]
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eb wrote:
Amnesia wrote:
eb wrote:
IANAL but I would think his biggest worry would be a civil suit. He must have reasonably deep pockets and would seem to be an obvious target. Not sure how it works in Oz but in the US the ambulance chasers would be all over this.


Doesn't tend to happen here in Oz.
We have ambulance chasers for medical misadventure and car accidents etc, but not this stuff....

That's good to hear. Most of my knowledge of the Australian legal system comes from watching 'Rake', so I might be a little confused.

What is Rake??
That’s coming from an Aussie!
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Re: The MVDP hotel incident "today" vs. "when I was a kid" [Amnesia] [ In reply to ]
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Amnesia wrote:
What is Rake??
That’s coming from an Aussie!

Rake was a TV series that IMO was hilariously funny.

https://en.wikipedia.org/...Australian_TV_series)

https://www.imdb.com/title/tt1587000/
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Re: The MVDP hotel incident "today" vs. "when I was a kid" [eb] [ In reply to ]
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eb wrote:
Amnesia wrote:
eb wrote:
IANAL but I would think his biggest worry would be a civil suit. He must have reasonably deep pockets and would seem to be an obvious target. Not sure how it works in Oz but in the US the ambulance chasers would be all over this.


Doesn't tend to happen here in Oz.
We have ambulance chasers for medical misadventure and car accidents etc, but not this stuff....

That's good to hear. Most of my knowledge of the Australian legal system comes from watching 'Rake', so I might be a little confused.

I started watching Rake after seeing this post. It’s pretty funny. I’m watching the zebra episode & it cracks me up. He’s fanning himself with the tail. Ha ha!
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Re: The MVDP hotel incident "today" vs. "when I was a kid" [Barks&Purrs] [ In reply to ]
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Barks&Purrs wrote:
eb wrote:
Amnesia wrote:
eb wrote:

IANAL but I would think his biggest worry would be a civil suit. He must have reasonably deep pockets and would seem to be an obvious target. Not sure how it works in Oz but in the US the ambulance chasers would be all over this.


Doesn't tend to happen here in Oz.
We have ambulance chasers for medical misadventure and car accidents etc, but not this stuff....


That's good to hear. Most of my knowledge of the Australian legal system comes from watching 'Rake', so I might be a little confused.


I started watching Rake after seeing this post. It’s pretty funny. I’m watching the zebra episode & it cracks me up. He’s fanning himself with the tail. Ha ha!

I'm glad you're enjoying it! I do recommend starting at the very beginning, but yeah, the zebra episode was hilarious.
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Re: The MVDP hotel incident "today" vs. "when I was a kid" [eb] [ In reply to ]
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I don’t know how to start at the beginning. I’m watching with prime video and all the previous seasons are not available— they’re listed but prime won’t let me buy access. :(
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Re: The MVDP hotel incident "today" vs. "when I was a kid" [j p o] [ In reply to ]
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j p o wrote:
ThisIsIt wrote:
Amnesia wrote:
ThisIsIt wrote:
Amnesia wrote:
ThisIsIt wrote:
Amnesia wrote:
Is anyone else finding the whole saga a little bizarre?
I am keeping in mind there are two sides to every story, and the truth is somewhere amongst that.
I have read some nasty stuff on twitter about this, which is hard to know whether what we are hearing from MvDP is the most accurate representation of the events, or it’s just a troll making stuff up. I won’t repeat it on here but it did make me question the events as they unfolded.
My kids would be severely punished if I found out they were doing something like this. Seems like an absolutely feral thing to be doing at that time of night in a hotel. They were guests. Where were the parents?
Was a great week of racing. A shame it’s stories like this that get more coverage.


Yes bizarre, I haven't even read a proper story on it since cyclingnews puts most things behind a paywall now.


There was a thread on twitter, with a new user chiming in saying they were there, have it on film etc. Hard to know if it was just a troll etc or for real. There has been a reasonable amount of coverage over here about it, non paywall stuff.


Why were the girls knocking on his door?

And what's going on over there, 14 year old boys are often enough shitheads, but girls doing this?


Honestly just seems like a prank taken too far, kids being annoying. Knocking/ringing the bell then running. He said they did it 3 times, they said once. Not sure if its a thing elsewhere, but is a pretty "common" stupid prank. Happened to us at our house for a while until we found the little shi$t head doing it and told his parents.


Yes, common enough, just seems like it would be far more likely to be boys than girls doing it.

I don't know that I can assume anyone was actually knocking on his door as a prank. It sounds more like random noise pissed him off. And his comments don't really seem to be claiming he was at all justified. There is more to this story.

I find it interesting that everyone is assuming these two girls were banging on his door to make him mad and that he just couldn't take it any more and made a last ditch effort to defend his room against the barbarian invaders.

That just doesn't make sense.

It’s been reported from both sides that the girls were playing the knock and run prank.
What’s a bit murky is how many times it happened.
It happened at least once clearly, but whether it happened prior to that or it was general noise his partner asked them to tone down could be open to interpretation.
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Re: The MVDP hotel incident "today" vs. "when I was a kid" [Amnesia] [ In reply to ]
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Amnesia wrote:
j p o wrote:
ThisIsIt wrote:
Amnesia wrote:
ThisIsIt wrote:
Amnesia wrote:
ThisIsIt wrote:
Amnesia wrote:
Is anyone else finding the whole saga a little bizarre?
I am keeping in mind there are two sides to every story, and the truth is somewhere amongst that.
I have read some nasty stuff on twitter about this, which is hard to know whether what we are hearing from MvDP is the most accurate representation of the events, or it’s just a troll making stuff up. I won’t repeat it on here but it did make me question the events as they unfolded.
My kids would be severely punished if I found out they were doing something like this. Seems like an absolutely feral thing to be doing at that time of night in a hotel. They were guests. Where were the parents?
Was a great week of racing. A shame it’s stories like this that get more coverage.


Yes bizarre, I haven't even read a proper story on it since cyclingnews puts most things behind a paywall now.


There was a thread on twitter, with a new user chiming in saying they were there, have it on film etc. Hard to know if it was just a troll etc or for real. There has been a reasonable amount of coverage over here about it, non paywall stuff.


Why were the girls knocking on his door?

And what's going on over there, 14 year old boys are often enough shitheads, but girls doing this?


Honestly just seems like a prank taken too far, kids being annoying. Knocking/ringing the bell then running. He said they did it 3 times, they said once. Not sure if its a thing elsewhere, but is a pretty "common" stupid prank. Happened to us at our house for a while until we found the little shi$t head doing it and told his parents.


Yes, common enough, just seems like it would be far more likely to be boys than girls doing it.


I don't know that I can assume anyone was actually knocking on his door as a prank. It sounds more like random noise pissed him off. And his comments don't really seem to be claiming he was at all justified. There is more to this story.

I find it interesting that everyone is assuming these two girls were banging on his door to make him mad and that he just couldn't take it any more and made a last ditch effort to defend his room against the barbarian invaders.

That just doesn't make sense.


It’s been reported from both sides that the girls were playing the knock and run prank.
What’s a bit murky is how many times it happened.
It happened at least once clearly, but whether it happened prior to that or it was general noise his partner asked them to tone down could be open to interpretation.

It happened enough that he was at the door one of the times and came running out after them, right?

That would be a pretty weird way to act the first time someone knocked on your door.
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Re: The MVDP hotel incident "today" vs. "when I was a kid" [ThisIsIt] [ In reply to ]
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I dearly hope this becomes the new neo-pro hazing ritual at Alpecin-Fenix. Just at some low-grade warmup race.

"Ok dude, you want to be one of us, you've got to knock-and-run Mathieu at 2AM."

"But..."

[Makes knocking gesture]
Last edited by: trail: Oct 4, 22 6:38
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Re: The MVDP hotel incident "today" vs. "when I was a kid" [trail] [ In reply to ]
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I am not one to ask for a like button, but dammit if this isn't the time for one...

Pactimo brand ambassador, ask me about promo codes
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