Honestly, I thought the same thing. Because like you I thought he was talking about experiences with racism. But he was talking about the lack of black culture. Which to me seems reasonable.

  

I don't think that makes it racist.

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-----------------------------Baron Von Speedypants
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Are you saying ignorance to TAs context is a defense or are you saying calling someone “Jackie” because he wants to bring black culture into baseball isn’t racist?

1. Maybe
2. You don’t want to know : )

Yes, though I don't like the way you phrased it because it sounds like it's a "spin to hid the truth." But maybe that's just an issue with my interpretation.


Lets say, for example, that TA didn't like him because he just thinks he's a big pussy, regardless of race. He didn't respect him, and didn't give a crap what he was sensitive about or what his background was. That might make him an asshole, but that doesn't make his comments racist.

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-----------------------------Baron Von Speedypants
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With an incident like this, intent is the determining factor. You can be indifferent or insensitive to the racial component and insult someone with something tangentially related to race without making a “racist comment” and I don’t think it’s splitting too fine a hair saying so.

It’d be no different than if a black MMA fighter likened his political views or plight to Muhammad Ali, and later Connor McGregor jawing at him sayin “OK Ali.” It wouldn’t matter which aspect of Ali’s career the black fighter was referencing, only that he likened himself to an historic great.

I don’t know Donaldson’s intent and I don’t buy his story that he was joking in the traditional sense. It really only matters what he actually said, which we know; the context, which we know; and his intent, which we don’t.

On my definitely racist comment scorecard, that’s going 0/3.

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The devil made me do it the first time, second time I done it on my own - W

I'm not saying that this is AJThomas' position, but in the wokest corner of the left (ie CNN that you referenced), what matters is that there's a victim, and an attacker. it does not matter what the attacker's intent was, he should have known better. If he didn't, then he doesn't appreciate the great privilege that he has to be able to go through life without digging into every specific sensitivity of each individual of each and every marginalized class.

Of course, maybe Donaldson is another John Rocker. What do I know.

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-----------------------------Baron Von Speedypants
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Another perspective

https://defector.com/...-donaldson-fool-you/

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I'm beginning to think that we are much more fucked than I thought.

Excellent piece and exactly how this will be regarded in time.

I thought that piece was full of bad assumptions, false premises, and intentions more imagined than real.

Anderson said something ridiculous, and Donaldson has weaponized it against him. The end.

As mentioned upthread, the situation is no different than if Tim Anderson had compared himself to Babe Ruth, and Donaldson's response was to ride him by sarcastically calling him "Babe".

If you wish to die on a hill defending a known asshole, who hung on to this weapon for 3 years and who lied about his intentions when first confronted about them it is fine with me.

History may make a fool of you.

Wait...........does this mean that I'M a racist, too?!!!

I'd like to point out the irony that the n-word was actually spelled out earlier in the article. Maybe the author is racist. Can we find a POC who was offended by it so that we can be certain.


I'm sorry, but mocking a guy for calling himself the new Jackie Robinson just simply isn't racist. Nothing in that article proves otherwise.

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-----------------------------Baron Von Speedypants
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I do not disagree with that statement on the basic insincere level it is written.

I’m being completely sincere. I’ve seen nothing in this thread that in any way shows that he was being anything other than antagonistic. That’s not racism. It just simply isn’t, and we’ve seen nothing g but wishy washy pseudo connections toward it.

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-----------------------------Baron Von Speedypants
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The critical distinction between asshole and racist seems to elude you.

Point of order: I have never called Donaldson a racist.

Then what are we arguing about? The OP was about him referring to the other player as "Jackie" and getting suspended for "racist comments."

If your point is simply that he's a jerk, I don't think anyone here will come to his defense.

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-----------------------------Baron Von Speedypants
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I thought we were arguing about whether - in consideration of the full context of what transpired - was what Donaldson said racist.

Either way I don’t think that makes Donaldson racist. I don’t know what is in the man’s heart in that regard.

Then I think we are back to where we were. What he said does not make him A racist, nor was the statement itself a racist statement.

As I've asked before, if it was a racist statement, someone needs to articulate exactly what was racist about it. The guy was sensitive about being the only black guy on the team and asked him to stop calling him Jackie? Not good enough.

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-----------------------------Baron Von Speedypants
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Reading through his posts it seems he was just, for whatever reason, highly annoyed by the fact that I called out media for playing loose with the Racist card (I called it ridiculous) and chided me for complaining about it because...no one here had started a thread calling Donaldson a racist. He also took issue with me directly because apparently I should be posting on at least a one-to-one ratio of cry wolf racism to actual racism stories, if I'm to voice an opinion about the harm of media lazily or cynically perpetuating BS racism stories to amplify interest.

He's done a lot of typing to ultimately come back to agreeing with the premise of the OP, if not as strenuously.

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The devil made me do it the first time, second time I done it on my own - W

I am arguing his intent. When asked to explain intent Donaldson lied. He lied both in what he said, that this was a joke. He lied by what he implied, that TA was more or less cool with this. And he lied by what he didn’t say, mainly by omitting that TA had confronted him and asked him to stop making the joke.

These are red flags for me. Donaldson gave an account of his intent. Square it for me with your assertion that he didn’t really do anything worse than the other jerk face things that he has done over the years that he’s never shied away from.

Here are his words:

“ It was just off of an interview what he called himself. We’ve said that before, we’ve joked about it. He laughed, whatever.”

He lied to keep himself from getting into trouble. One doesn't need to be a racist (or say something racist) to do that. Hell, for all we know it's what his PR rep or his agent told him to say.

This is your version of a dunking booth.

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-----------------------------Baron Von Speedypants
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Uh, yeah he was asked this immediately after the game. If you want to invent context for his lies, that is fine. But try and make it consistent with basic facts.

I offered a precise indictment. His own words regarding his intent were lies. What exactly did he think he might be in trouble for? You seem to be implying that he understood his words could be seen as racist. Yeah. No kidding. Glad you finally got there.

If you think he was afraid of getting in trouble for being a jerk…. Yeah right. I’ll fight you in the parking lot guy suddenly found Jesus. Um no. That explanation is completely inconsistent with everything we know.

Tell me why he lied. Square your account with his words not with invented context.

Or I can live with this: yeah I see your point. I don’t agree but that’s cool. That is all I’m trying to get to. And if it helps that is more or less where I’m at.

He has a phone.


A bench clearing altercation on the field. I'm going to assume that's why they interviewed him.



Again, this is your dunking booth. His words could be seen as racist. If he admits that he was being a racist, then he's a racist. If he plays it off like it was no big deal, then he's a lying racist.


And still no one has explained exactly what is racist about what he said. You can't just say, "well he's a liar, so we know it was intended to be racist." Racist HOW? What is the mechanic of the sentence that makes it racist.

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