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Re: “Wokeness & cancel culture” vs “Excuse me, I’m speaking” [CallMeMaybe] [ In reply to ]
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CallMeMaybe wrote:
It’s from the best paragraph in the article. It reads,

“That is not the only reason this story matters. These schools are called prep schools because they prepare America’s princelings to take their place in what we’re told is our meritocracy. Nothing happens at a top prep school that is not a mirror of what happens at an elite college.”

This paragraph is a delight to read. Everyone should care about these princelings who are being prepared to “take their place” in “what we’re told is our meritocracy.” That’s a hilarious and uber-entitled view of America. The icing on the cake is the idea that woke-ness is invading elite colleges as well. Ooo! 👀

This is a little bit like the bbq-gun picture. It’s so ridiculous that I wonder if it’s a joke?

Wait, does she think that these expensive prep schools DO NOT undermine the claim that America is a meritocracy? Or does she have no idea what meritocracy is? Is it the latter isn't it? How does a meritocracy have princelings? She herself says these top prep schools are a mirror of the elite colleges! That kinda undermines the whole meritocracy thing.

Seriously, why is anyone taking Barri Weiss seriously? That paragraph should be enough to laugh at her.
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Re: “Wokeness & cancel culture” vs “Excuse me, I’m speaking” [Nutella] [ In reply to ]
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Nutella wrote:
alex_korr wrote:
Nutella wrote:
alex_korr wrote:
Nutella wrote:
You know who went to Harvard Westlake? Nixon's Chief of staff. He also went to prison. The editor in Chief of Breibart went to Harvard Westlake as did Trump's White Nationalist Deputy communication director.

So much for the "kriegsphilosophie of wokeness "


It's a fairly recent phenomenon there. My daughter applied in 2018, and so we toured 5 or 6 local prep school. Most of them with the exception of one were either transitioning to wokeness or were just a few years into it. HV was not the wokest of them to be honest - the worst one was Oakwood but they are smaller and have less of a cache I suppose. The weird thing was that HV is crazy opulent, but also has one of highest rates of suicidal ideation.

Don't forget that such blatant indoctrination is bound to produce some blowback in at least some of the pupils.


Wokeness drives kids to suicide?


No. But your mom's substandard blowjobs do.

HV is known to be incredibly high pressure academically.

Thanks for confirming yet again you are a pathetic, childish, troll.

If you feel that your pathetic needling warrants any other response - think again.

Next races on the schedule: Arizona 70.3 2021, Indian Wells 70.3 2021, Arizona RnR marathon 2022
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Re: “Wokeness & cancel culture” vs “Excuse me, I’m speaking” [alex_korr] [ In reply to ]
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alex_korr wrote:
Nutella wrote:
alex_korr wrote:
Nutella wrote:
alex_korr wrote:
Nutella wrote:
You know who went to Harvard Westlake? Nixon's Chief of staff. He also went to prison. The editor in Chief of Breibart went to Harvard Westlake as did Trump's White Nationalist Deputy communication director.

So much for the "kriegsphilosophie of wokeness "


It's a fairly recent phenomenon there. My daughter applied in 2018, and so we toured 5 or 6 local prep school. Most of them with the exception of one were either transitioning to wokeness or were just a few years into it. HV was not the wokest of them to be honest - the worst one was Oakwood but they are smaller and have less of a cache I suppose. The weird thing was that HV is crazy opulent, but also has one of highest rates of suicidal ideation.

Don't forget that such blatant indoctrination is bound to produce some blowback in at least some of the pupils.


Wokeness drives kids to suicide?


No. But your mom's substandard blowjobs do.

HV is known to be incredibly high pressure academically.


Thanks for confirming yet again you are a pathetic, childish, troll.


If you feel that your pathetic needling warrants any other response - think again.

Pathetic needling? what are you babbling about?
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Re: “Wokeness & cancel culture” vs “Excuse me, I’m speaking” [slowguy] [ In reply to ]
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slowguy wrote:
TimeIsUp wrote:
I think there is some gray area between having compassion for others and shedding tears for the 1% because their world is so confined. Having the means to send kids to $50k/year schools is most certainly not upper middle class.

There’s definitely room in there. Where would you say calling the kids dismissive nicknames and telling their parents to shut up and go somewhere else if they have complaints lies in that spectrum? I’m pretty sure it’s actually nowhere between the two options you provided.

You have no doubt noted that the dismissive nickname was coined by the author and she didn’t intend it to be a pejorative. As for the remainder I think that falls squarely in that spectrum. Most people don’t want to listen to the Uber privileged bitch and moan about things they have the ability and power to change.

It’ rubs me wrong the same way someone complaining that the A/C in their Ferrari sucks would.
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Re: “Wokeness & cancel culture” vs “Excuse me, I’m speaking” [chriskal] [ In reply to ]
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chriskal wrote:
You have no doubt noted that the dismissive nickname was coined by the author and she didn’t intend it to be a pejorative.

I did note that, and if I were her, I wouldn't have used it in her article either. Nevertheless, I don't think the people using it in this thread were using it in the same spirit as the author, since they've generally expressed disdain for the author.

Quote:
As for the remainder I think that falls squarely in that spectrum. Most people don’t want to listen to the Uber privileged bitch and moan about things they have the ability and power to change.

The point of the article, whether you believe it or not, is that these parents don't believe they can speak up to change the issue they're concerned about. Part of the point is that they feel like, if they speak up, their kids will be dismissed from their schools, and they'll be unable to get them into comparable schools, and their kids will be negatively impacted.

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It’ rubs me wrong the same way someone complaining that the A/C in their Ferrari sucks would.

I feel pretty sure that if someone compared your kids' education (assuming you have kids) to your car's a/c, you'd take some offense to that. I'm generally not a defender of the uber wealthy either, but my point is simply that there are a number of people who feel like having some money means you just get to suck it up, and your kids get to suck up poor treatment at school, and fuck you, you've got some money. It's a shame.

If people think the complaint is untrue, that's one thing. If people think the article is fabricated, or overblown, that's fine. But if people just decide that it doesn't matter because the parents have money, that's kind of shitty.

Slowguy

(insert pithy phrase here...)
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Re: “Wokeness & cancel culture” vs “Excuse me, I’m speaking” [chaparral] [ In reply to ]
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chaparral wrote:


Sure, they could complain to the school. But that is not what we are talking about.

If you don't like the coffee at your Rolls Royce dealership, complain to the dealership, but I am going to laugh at you if you whine to some opinion writer. If the dealership doesn't listen to you, take your business elsewhere. They must living in some crazy bubble if they think anyone outside that school give a flying fuck about what these people are spending their money on.

Can we apply this logic to everyone else who has a grievance with some private business and takes to social media to blast them and get them black listed?

And instead of them taking to social media they should just, take their business elsewhere?
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Re: “Wokeness & cancel culture” vs “Excuse me, I’m speaking” [Yeeper] [ In reply to ]
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Yeeper wrote:
chaparral wrote:


Sure, they could complain to the school. But that is not what we are talking about.

If you don't like the coffee at your Rolls Royce dealership, complain to the dealership, but I am going to laugh at you if you whine to some opinion writer. If the dealership doesn't listen to you, take your business elsewhere. They must living in some crazy bubble if they think anyone outside that school give a flying fuck about what these people are spending their money on.


Can we apply this logic to everyone else who has a grievance with some private business and takes to social media to blast them and get them black listed?

And instead of them taking to social media they should just, take their business elsewhere?


Fortunately Twitter's King of Cancel culture has been booted off the platform

https://finance.yahoo.com/news/61-businesses-trump-has-attacked-on-twitter-181623705.html
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Re: “Wokeness & cancel culture” vs “Excuse me, I’m speaking” [Yeeper] [ In reply to ]
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Yeeper wrote:

Can we apply this logic to everyone else who has a grievance with some private business and takes to social media to blast them and get them black listed?

And instead of them taking to social media they should just, take their business elsewhere?

Can we apply your logic to you?

Doesn’t your post here take other people to task for doing what you don’t like?

Aren’t you doing what you think people shouldn’t do?
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Re: “Wokeness & cancel culture” vs “Excuse me, I’m speaking” [slowguy] [ In reply to ]
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slowguy wrote:
Well the opposite is true as well. They're paying $50k to send their kids somewhere, they should get a say in how those schools are run. They're the customer. They have every right to complain about the product they're paying for, and to try to get it the way they want it.


Here's the way I see it:

1.) Going to a prep school affords the student a better chance of getting into a great college than they would otherwise achieve with the same performance in a public school.
2.) Part of the "cost" of #1 is that the elite universities do more ideological gatekeeping wrt those prep schools.
3.) This LA private school is only reacting to the biases of elite college admissions. Private prep schools don't sell education as much as they sell entry into elite universities.
4.) Based on #3, I'd say parents arguing against ostentatious displays of wokeness don't understand the forces they are up against.
Last edited by: SH: Mar 14, 21 10:45
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Re: “Wokeness & cancel culture” vs “Excuse me, I’m speaking” [CallMeMaybe] [ In reply to ]
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CallMeMaybe wrote:
Yeeper wrote:


Can we apply this logic to everyone else who has a grievance with some private business and takes to social media to blast them and get them black listed?

And instead of them taking to social media they should just, take their business elsewhere?


Can we apply your logic to you?

Doesn’t your post here take other people to task for doing what you don’t like?

Aren’t you doing what you think people shouldn’t do?

First, its not "my" logic. Its was Chappy's post and I asked a question about it.

Second, I've no idea what the rest of your post means. What exactly am I "doing?" I asked two questions in my post. And they were to clarify a poster's logic. It has nothing to do with what Yeeper likes or dislikes.
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Re: “Wokeness & cancel culture” vs “Excuse me, I’m speaking” [Nutella] [ In reply to ]
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Nutella wrote:
Yeeper wrote:
chaparral wrote:


Sure, they could complain to the school. But that is not what we are talking about.

If you don't like the coffee at your Rolls Royce dealership, complain to the dealership, but I am going to laugh at you if you whine to some opinion writer. If the dealership doesn't listen to you, take your business elsewhere. They must living in some crazy bubble if they think anyone outside that school give a flying fuck about what these people are spending their money on.


Can we apply this logic to everyone else who has a grievance with some private business and takes to social media to blast them and get them black listed?

And instead of them taking to social media they should just, take their business elsewhere?


Fortunately Twitter's King of Cancel culture has been booted off the platform

https://finance.yahoo.com/news/61-businesses-trump-has-attacked-on-twitter-181623705.html

OK. Can you help me understand how that pertains to my post?
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Re: “Wokeness & cancel culture” vs “Excuse me, I’m speaking” [SH] [ In reply to ]
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SH wrote:
slowguy wrote:
Well the opposite is true as well. They're paying $50k to send their kids somewhere, they should get a say in how those schools are run. They're the customer. They have every right to complain about the product they're paying for, and to try to get it the way they want it.


Here's the way I see it:

1.) Going to a prep school affords the student a better chance of getting into a great college than they would otherwise achieve with the same performance in a public school.
2.) Part of the "cost" of #1 is that the elite universities do more ideological gatekeeping wrt those prep schools.
3.) This LA private school is only reacting to the biases of elite college admissions. Private prep schools don't sell education as much as they sell entry into elite universities.
4.) Based on #3, I'd say parents arguing against ostentatious displays of wokeness don't understand the forces they are up against.

I'm not well-versed in prep schools. But I have been a product private schools. I know the difference in the level or education and preparation (rigors of the programs etc).

Isn't #3 pretty much predicated on a better education? Its the reputation of how well those students are prepared coming from that institution. Thats generally what I understand. Of course there will always be outliers and exceptions (those who ride the coattails of their last name etc.)

And yes, anyone who invests any money as a client of anything has a right to have opinions on that investment. Thats the best part about logic, it transcends all things such as cost and class etc. I could easily make an argument that people who are upset about their starbucks order have a right because they are paying through the nose for what I think is mediocre coffee. Meanwhile, there are plenty of people who can't afford starbucks. So do we say they (starbucks clients) are not allowed to have gripes because there are others who can't afford overpriced coffee that can be gotten for much, much less, or made at home?

Its seems inconsequential to us, but if someone is paying $X for their coffee and razzle dazzle then they should get that, what they expect, every single time. Period. So whether its private education or overpriced java, logic holds steady.
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Re: “Wokeness & cancel culture” vs “Excuse me, I’m speaking” [Yeeper] [ In reply to ]
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Quote:
I'm not well-versed in prep schools. But I have been a product private schools. I know the difference in the level or education and preparation (rigors of the programs etc).


That doesn't change my point. I don't have the data here, but I'm asserting that if we took all the nation's SAT scores over 1500 and got the percentage of kids from public school versus the percentage from private schools we'd find that the those percentages would favor the public schools by more than their Ivy League admissions percentages. Ergo, the private school kids would be found to be getting an advantage for similar performance.


Quote:

And yes, anyone who invests any money as a client of anything has a right to have opinions on that investment. Thats the best part about logic, it transcends all things such as cost and class etc. I could easily make an argument that people who are upset about their starbucks order have a right because they are paying through the nose for what I think is mediocre coffee. Meanwhile, there are plenty of people who can't afford starbucks. So do we say they (starbucks clients) are not allowed to have gripes because there are others who can't afford overpriced coffee that can be gotten for much, much less, or made at home?


This misses the point. Starbucks is a terrible analogy for this situation. Coffee is an end in itself. If it tastes good -- great! Private school, more often than not, is a means to an end. They are selling potential access to status and power. If the private school is reacting to biases from the elite Universities, it is just to maintain its position in the minds of those gatekeepers. The parents are essentially asking the private school to weaken its status in the eyes of the woke Ivy League by removing these programs. That's a tough sell as it is counterproductive to an important aspect of the private school's product.
Last edited by: SH: Mar 14, 21 12:33
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Re: “Wokeness & cancel culture” vs “Excuse me, I’m speaking” [Yeeper] [ In reply to ]
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Yeeper wrote:
chaparral wrote:


Sure, they could complain to the school. But that is not what we are talking about.

If you don't like the coffee at your Rolls Royce dealership, complain to the dealership, but I am going to laugh at you if you whine to some opinion writer. If the dealership doesn't listen to you, take your business elsewhere. They must living in some crazy bubble if they think anyone outside that school give a flying fuck about what these people are spending their money on.


Can we apply this logic to everyone else who has a grievance with some private business and takes to social media to blast them and get them black listed?

And instead of them taking to social media they should just, take their business elsewhere?

But these people did not take to social media, so what exactly are you getting at?
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Re: “Wokeness & cancel culture” vs “Excuse me, I’m speaking” [Yeeper] [ In reply to ]
Quote | Reply
Yeeper wrote:
Nutella wrote:
Yeeper wrote:
chaparral wrote:


Sure, they could complain to the school. But that is not what we are talking about.

If you don't like the coffee at your Rolls Royce dealership, complain to the dealership, but I am going to laugh at you if you whine to some opinion writer. If the dealership doesn't listen to you, take your business elsewhere. They must living in some crazy bubble if they think anyone outside that school give a flying fuck about what these people are spending their money on.


Can we apply this logic to everyone else who has a grievance with some private business and takes to social media to blast them and get them black listed?

And instead of them taking to social media they should just, take their business elsewhere?


Fortunately Twitter's King of Cancel culture has been booted off the platform

https://finance.yahoo.com/news/61-businesses-trump-has-attacked-on-twitter-181623705.html


OK. Can you help me understand how that pertains to my post?

You don't see what that has to do with your complaint about people with "a grievance with some private business and takes to social media to blast them and get them black listed"?
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Re: “Wokeness & cancel culture” vs “Excuse me, I’m speaking” [Nutella] [ In reply to ]
Quote | Reply
Nutella wrote:
Yeeper wrote:
Nutella wrote:
Yeeper wrote:
chaparral wrote:


Sure, they could complain to the school. But that is not what we are talking about.

If you don't like the coffee at your Rolls Royce dealership, complain to the dealership, but I am going to laugh at you if you whine to some opinion writer. If the dealership doesn't listen to you, take your business elsewhere. They must living in some crazy bubble if they think anyone outside that school give a flying fuck about what these people are spending their money on.


Can we apply this logic to everyone else who has a grievance with some private business and takes to social media to blast them and get them black listed?

And instead of them taking to social media they should just, take their business elsewhere?


Fortunately Twitter's King of Cancel culture has been booted off the platform

https://finance.yahoo.com/news/61-businesses-trump-has-attacked-on-twitter-181623705.html


OK. Can you help me understand how that pertains to my post?


You don't see what that has to do with your complaint about people with "a grievance with some private business and takes to social media to blast them and get them black listed"?

No, I don't, because I didn't have a complaint. I had a question regarding applying logic to something.
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Re: “Wokeness & cancel culture” vs “Excuse me, I’m speaking” [chaparral] [ In reply to ]
Quote | Reply
chaparral wrote:
Yeeper wrote:
chaparral wrote:


Sure, they could complain to the school. But that is not what we are talking about.

If you don't like the coffee at your Rolls Royce dealership, complain to the dealership, but I am going to laugh at you if you whine to some opinion writer. If the dealership doesn't listen to you, take your business elsewhere. They must living in some crazy bubble if they think anyone outside that school give a flying fuck about what these people are spending their money on.


Can we apply this logic to everyone else who has a grievance with some private business and takes to social media to blast them and get them black listed?

And instead of them taking to social media they should just, take their business elsewhere?


But these people did not take to social media, so what exactly are you getting at?

I was alluding to going public in general. Any for of media, not just social media. Going public is going public. And these parents voiced their grievances/concerns in an interview for publication. More clear?
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Re: “Wokeness & cancel culture” vs “Excuse me, I’m speaking” [Yeeper] [ In reply to ]
Quote | Reply
Yeeper wrote:
chaparral wrote:
Yeeper wrote:
chaparral wrote:


Sure, they could complain to the school. But that is not what we are talking about.

If you don't like the coffee at your Rolls Royce dealership, complain to the dealership, but I am going to laugh at you if you whine to some opinion writer. If the dealership doesn't listen to you, take your business elsewhere. They must living in some crazy bubble if they think anyone outside that school give a flying fuck about what these people are spending their money on.


Can we apply this logic to everyone else who has a grievance with some private business and takes to social media to blast them and get them black listed?

And instead of them taking to social media they should just, take their business elsewhere?


But these people did not take to social media, so what exactly are you getting at?


I was alluding to going public in general. Any for of media, not just social media. Going public is going public. And these parents voiced their grievances/concerns in an interview for publication. More clear?

No.
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Re: “Wokeness & cancel culture” vs “Excuse me, I’m speaking” [SH] [ In reply to ]
Quote | Reply
SH wrote:
Quote:
I'm not well-versed in prep schools. But I have been a product private schools. I know the difference in the level or education and preparation (rigors of the programs etc).


That doesn't change my point. I don't have the data here, but I'm asserting that if we took all the nation's SAT scores over 1500 and got the percentage of kids from public school versus the percentage from private schools we'd find that the those percentages would favor the public schools by more than their Ivy League admissions percentages. Ergo, the private school kids would be found to be getting an advantage for similar performance.


Quote:

And yes, anyone who invests any money as a client of anything has a right to have opinions on that investment. Thats the best part about logic, it transcends all things such as cost and class etc. I could easily make an argument that people who are upset about their starbucks order have a right because they are paying through the nose for what I think is mediocre coffee. Meanwhile, there are plenty of people who can't afford starbucks. So do we say they (starbucks clients) are not allowed to have gripes because there are others who can't afford overpriced coffee that can be gotten for much, much less, or made at home?


This misses the point. Starbucks is a terrible analogy for this situation. Coffee is an end in itself. If it tastes good -- great! Private school, more often than not, is a means to an end. They are selling potential access to status and power. If the private school is reacting to biases from the elite Universities, it is just to maintain its position in the minds of those gatekeepers. The parents are essentially asking the private school to weaken its status in the eyes of the woke Ivy League by removing these programs. That's a tough sell as it is counterproductive to an important aspect of the private school's product.

Ah ok I see that now, I'm inclined to agree with you. Especially because of the reputations garnered by these institutions. I'd also guess that the percentage of students with higher SATs is higher at these schools compared to public which only strengthens the notion that its a general reputation that pads the resume.

Regarding the analogy, it was more of an attempt to show that there will always be things that some can afford that others cannot, and it may seem frivolous. That does not mean they relinquish the right to have opinions on their perceived value for the money. Take community sports or even additional help. Some parents will always be able to provide additional tutors or private trainers/coaching to improve what everyone else has access to. Again, they have every right to be able to criticize what they are paying for.

I don't believe the parents are asking the schools to weaken their status, unless I missed something.

I'd also argue it can be both a means and an end. The education is the end. It is a product. You're paying for knowledge and access to higher institutions.

Thanks for the replies.
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Re: “Wokeness & cancel culture” vs “Excuse me, I’m speaking” [Nutella] [ In reply to ]
Quote | Reply
Nutella wrote:
Yeeper wrote:
chaparral wrote:
Yeeper wrote:
chaparral wrote:


Sure, they could complain to the school. But that is not what we are talking about.

If you don't like the coffee at your Rolls Royce dealership, complain to the dealership, but I am going to laugh at you if you whine to some opinion writer. If the dealership doesn't listen to you, take your business elsewhere. They must living in some crazy bubble if they think anyone outside that school give a flying fuck about what these people are spending their money on.


Can we apply this logic to everyone else who has a grievance with some private business and takes to social media to blast them and get them black listed?

And instead of them taking to social media they should just, take their business elsewhere?


But these people did not take to social media, so what exactly are you getting at?


I was alluding to going public in general. Any for of media, not just social media. Going public is going public. And these parents voiced their grievances/concerns in an interview for publication. More clear?


No.

Oh well. You assert that I had a complaint when I merely asked Chappy for clarification on something. The fact that you cannot see that there was no complaint and still double down that I did is your problem. And also par for the course.

Cheers
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Re: “Wokeness & cancel culture” vs “Excuse me, I’m speaking” [Yeeper] [ In reply to ]
Quote | Reply
Yeeper wrote:
chaparral wrote:
Yeeper wrote:
Can we apply this logic to everyone else who has a grievance with some private business and takes to social media to blast them and get them black listed?

And instead of them taking to social media they should just, take their business elsewhere?


But these people did not take to social media, so what exactly are you getting at?


I was alluding to going public in general. Any for of media, not just social media. Going public is going public. And these parents voiced their grievances/concerns in an interview for publication. More clear?

But these parents aren't going public, they are specifically NOT going public. So what exactly are you getting at?
Quote Reply
Re: “Wokeness & cancel culture” vs “Excuse me, I’m speaking” [chaparral] [ In reply to ]
Quote | Reply
chaparral wrote:
Yeeper wrote:
chaparral wrote:
Yeeper wrote:

Can we apply this logic to everyone else who has a grievance with some private business and takes to social media to blast them and get them black listed?

And instead of them taking to social media they should just, take their business elsewhere?


But these people did not take to social media, so what exactly are you getting at?


I was alluding to going public in general. Any for of media, not just social media. Going public is going public. And these parents voiced their grievances/concerns in an interview for publication. More clear?


But these parents aren't going public, they are specifically NOT going public. So what exactly are you getting at?

Really? You don't think sitting down with a writer and going on the record is "going public?"

Seriously?

Slowguy

(insert pithy phrase here...)
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Re: “Wokeness & cancel culture” vs “Excuse me, I’m speaking” [chaparral] [ In reply to ]
Quote | Reply
chaparral wrote:
Yeeper wrote:
chaparral wrote:
Yeeper wrote:
Can we apply this logic to everyone else who has a grievance with some private business and takes to social media to blast them and get them black listed?

And instead of them taking to social media they should just, take their business elsewhere?


But these people did not take to social media, so what exactly are you getting at?


I was alluding to going public in general. Any for of media, not just social media. Going public is going public. And these parents voiced their grievances/concerns in an interview for publication. More clear?

But these parents aren't going public, they are specifically NOT going public. So what exactly are you getting at?

They sat down with an interviewer who then wrote a piece about it for the public. How is that “specifically NOT going public?”
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