you should definitely post a pic.

having said that, the relevant metric or parameter for judgement is "speed" in a race and not "power on Zwift".

Generally, comfort and power and aerodynamics go hand in hand so if you're more comfortable that's a good thing.

E

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Eric Reid AeroFit | Instagram Portfolio
Aerodynamic Retul Bike Fitting

“You are experiencing the criminal coverup of a foreign backed fascist hostile takeover of a mafia shakedown of an authoritarian religious slow motion coup. Persuade people to vote for Democracy.”

This is a bit of a loaded question, and my knee-jerk answer is 'no'. My answer(s) to your question(s) are going to ramble a bit so I apologize in advance.

I was often asked whether I did fits with a power meter to find the optimal position for power production. Some fitters advertised that's how they did it and at first glance it seems like a smart way to do things. But it's absolute sophistry.

A rider is almost always more powerful in the position they've trained, so any change in position almost always comes with a need for adaptation. And that's why so many riders - you see it occasionally in the professional world - insist on unorthodox positions. They've been successful in those positions and are extremely skeptical about changes. I've heard several stories of well-known professional triathletes who resisted, despite recommendations from their well-respected fitters, shorter cranks. Only after a poor performance or failure to meet some goal did those athletes open themselves up to change.

That said, there are examples where improvements in fit can immediately improve the ability to produce power. I'd see it most frequently for athletes whose saddle was way too high. Dropping the saddle to a more appropriate height would result in an almost immediately measurable power improvement.

But it's always important to remember that improving performance isn't the same as improving power. They don't give any trophies for "highest normalized power" at the awards ceremony. The give awards for doing things fast. The cheapest gains in fit improvement usually come from aerodynamic improvements. And the more powerful the athlete, the more those aerodynamic improvements are magnified.

So when I was doing a fit, whether I was fitting a pro or fitting a grandma, I was trying to put the athlete in a position that is:

1. sustainable for the duration of the target event
2. aerodynamic
3. powerful

And in that order.

In regards to the pictures you shared - I don't see much difference in position relative to the bottom bracket. Sure, the rider is in a different position relative to the saddle, but not so much relative to the bottom bracket. The biggest benefit from a more forward seating position is that it opens your hip angle - the distance between your leg and the trunk of your body at the top of the pedal stroke. That usually makes a more aerodynamic position easier to sustain.

Bike handling is never really a consideration when I'm doing a triathlon fit. For long-course triathletes, any issues with bike handling are almost certainly an issue of skill, not position or geometry. And it doesn't take much skill to ride in long, straight lines for extended periods of time.

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Trent Nix
Owned and operated Tri Shop
F.I.S.T. Advanced Certified Fitter | Retul Master Certified Fitter (back when those were things)

trentnix had a great reply.

Go with that.

You can look at what the UCI hates to see what would be fast and efficient for TT or triathlon.......It's essentially the fight between TT people and the UCI for ages.........hip angle and the prone recumbent position being the most aero and power efficient. The closer you can legally get to a prone recumbent position on the bike, the faster you'll go. The more open the hip angle would be and more power you could make.

Given that, look at what they regulate.........the things that prevent you from attaining that position. Saddle setback, extensions outward, etc.....

So, that's the clue as to what moving those things does.

I would add that even the idea of measuring "a change in power output" is specious. How is that done? "Go at a PE of 5"... Or "go as hard as you can for 5 minutes"... Or "ride at 200W for 5 minutes and see which one feels better"? The later is probably the most useful, but as you stated, adaptation is necessary.

Great response. I agree with your comments. Thanks. Picture coming soon hopefully.

Agreed. I am not necessarily worried about being a power monster on Zwift (don't even use Zwift). I just noticed that I would have definitely been able to hold power for the workout on my road bike, but was not holding it on the tri bike. I agree with later poster about needing time to adapt to a new position-especially as I have only been on the bike 3 times for simple outdoor rides-not pushing anything, just trying to figure out fit and comfort etc.

Added a picture. Would appreciate your thoughts.

Thinking I should drop saddle a touch. Go even more forward on saddle? Bring pads back? Or keep them where they are?

A video would help with saddle height.

wow, you just gave away all my secrets, the epiphany I had 6 years ago.

E

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Eric Reid AeroFit | Instagram Portfolio
Aerodynamic Retul Bike Fitting

“You are experiencing the criminal coverup of a foreign backed fascist hostile takeover of a mafia shakedown of an authoritarian religious slow motion coup. Persuade people to vote for Democracy.”

I could see you getting longer and lower with shorter cranks and more engaged glutes to be more comfortable, more powerful, more aerodynamic.

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Eric Reid AeroFit | Instagram Portfolio
Aerodynamic Retul Bike Fitting

“You are experiencing the criminal coverup of a foreign backed fascist hostile takeover of a mafia shakedown of an authoritarian religious slow motion coup. Persuade people to vote for Democracy.”

I can get lower. I have a few different spacer options. I'll play around a bit. How do you feel about saddle height?

Lol.

Think like an old-school Nascar race team. Minus any obvious blatant cheating of course.