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Re: Legacy Program: I will race in Kona in 2025! [sportstats] [ In reply to ]
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sportstats wrote:
kny wrote:
So, you are eligible for 2025, but you have to "validate" with an IM per year between 2020 and 2025, or 6 more total? That's pretty cheeky move by WTC.


Actually just read and email from a friend, 1 x 140.6 in 2020, then you can do a 5150, 70.3 or 140.6 per year from 2021 to 2025. That is pretty flexible to me!

Ok, to allow choice of races may be "flexible" to you, but to me it is just bad form to delay someone from their earned reward for 6 years and then add new purchase requirements in order for them to cash in their earned reward.

What is the real point? Let's look at the big picture. A VIP customer has earned an award for his dedication to your company. But you push back the redemption of this reward 6 years and force him to buy more of your product every year in the meantime. Why? It just seems so tacky. And it can't be about the money because the money is nothing (we're talking a few hundred people forced to race one race a year, most of whom probably would do the race anyway). So why do it? If you can't fulfill your end of the Kona Legacy agreement without putting someone on a wait for 6 years, why also force them to race once a year. Just waitlist them and be done. It's just bad corporate form. Maybe you're hoping you can disqualify on a technicality some of these dedicated customers of yours. But even that desire just seems tacky.

Again, it makes no sense. The whole validation requirement for legacy winners is just bad form.

Thanks for getting your sandwich card stamped 12 times. You can come back in 3 weeks to get your free sandwich, but only if you buy a coffee every morning also for the next 3 weeks. Oh, didn't know that when you bought your 12 sandwiches with us? Too bad.

Bad form.
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Re: Legacy Program: I will race in Kona in 2025! [kny] [ In reply to ]
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I don't think that they can anything about the wait. There are only so many bike spaces on that pier, the demand is high, so people have to queue up. They could cut down on the celebs, the charity and various bullshit human interest stories slots they give out, but I doubt that it would make that much of a difference. Plus they kind of have to do it because the tri pros suck at promoting the sport and themselves.

The requirement to be registered is kinda poor form. But then again they can may want to make sure that the person they are allocating the slot to is still in the game.

Next races on the schedule: none at the moment
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Re: Legacy Program: I will race in Kona in 2025! [Greyhound] [ In reply to ]
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Greyhound wrote:
I did Kona through legacy about 5 yrs ago. Finished in top 30%. I thoroughly enjoyed running by a guy in my age group who qualified the same year that we both raced CDA. Just because you qualified doesn't mean the conditions in Kona will meet your strengths.

Everyone loves to put down "Legacy" participants.

This was the case for me in 2019. I had a 9:45 PR but was usually a spot or two off KQ. Went as a legacy athlete and finished top 30%. The only bummer was starting in the last wave, so every pass I made wasn't a pass in position and I didn't get to pace with my AG.
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Re: Legacy Program: I will race in Kona in 2025! [BigBoyND] [ In reply to ]
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Seems like a possible solution to this should be a second Kona IM on a different weekend. One Kona for legacy, foundation, celebrities, etc. and one day for pros and those amateurs that meet the qualification standards.
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Re: Legacy Program: I will race in Kona in 2025! [taldesigns] [ In reply to ]
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They all meet qualification standards. Just different ones.

Also, how many people do you think would be interested in going on a separate weekend? I sure wouldn't be. If the "experience" was just the course itself then I could do it on my own on any weekend.
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Re: Legacy Program: I will race in Kona in 2025! [taldesigns] [ In reply to ]
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taldesigns wrote:
Seems like a possible solution to this should be a second Kona IM on a different weekend. One Kona for legacy, foundation, celebrities, etc. and one day for pros and those amateurs that meet the qualification standards.

Yeah that would definitely take care of the legacy issue, cause no one would want to go!! Its all about the big day, not the course itself.
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Re: Legacy Program: I will race in Kona in 2025! [kny] [ In reply to ]
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kny wrote:
sportstats wrote:
kny wrote:
So, you are eligible for 2025, but you have to "validate" with an IM per year between 2020 and 2025, or 6 more total? That's pretty cheeky move by WTC.


Actually just read and email from a friend, 1 x 140.6 in 2020, then you can do a 5150, 70.3 or 140.6 per year from 2021 to 2025. That is pretty flexible to me!


Ok, to allow choice of races may be "flexible" to you, but to me it is just bad form to delay someone from their earned reward for 6 years and then add new purchase requirements in order for them to cash in their earned reward.

What is the real point? Let's look at the big picture. A VIP customer has earned an award for his dedication to your company. But you push back the redemption of this reward 6 years and force him to buy more of your product every year in the meantime. Why? It just seems so tacky. And it can't be about the money because the money is nothing (we're talking a few hundred people forced to race one race a year, most of whom probably would do the race anyway). So why do it? If you can't fulfill your end of the Kona Legacy agreement without putting someone on a wait for 6 years, why also force them to race once a year. Just waitlist them and be done. It's just bad corporate form. Maybe you're hoping you can disqualify on a technicality some of these dedicated customers of yours. But even that desire just seems tacky.

Again, it makes no sense. The whole validation requirement for legacy winners is just bad form.

Thanks for getting your sandwich card stamped 12 times. You can come back in 3 weeks to get your free sandwich, but only if you buy a coffee every morning also for the next 3 weeks. Oh, didn't know that when you bought your 12 sandwiches with us? Too bad.

Bad form.

I get what you are saying but I think they have to do something to ensure that you are still active in the sport before they say this is the year you are going to KONA. I would rather they give it to someone who has done 12 IM and then validates it every year with a 5150 (or whatever) than someone who does 12 and then doesn't do another triathlon until their number comes up. Other than increasing the number of legacy spots every year I'm not sure what else they can do.
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Re: Legacy Program: I will race in Kona in 2025! [mattr] [ In reply to ]
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I understand the frustration of trying to qualify in your ? 40's when the fields are so large and feeling why not wait until I'm in my 60's. However as an old guy who is 66 while seeing the fields are so much smaller it is not necessarily any easier. Unfortunately for many of us old guys there are a number of health issues that we now have that we didn't have when we were 40. When I look at old training logs even from even 5 years ago it is a very challenging to reach those paces.
I admire you younger men and women who are so much fitter, stronger and faster balancing training with younger families. I can train with my 40 year old son when he is on a recovery day !
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Re: Legacy Program: I will race in Kona in 2025! [Tri Bread] [ In reply to ]
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Tri Bread wrote:
I get what you are saying but I think they have to do something to ensure that you are still active in the sport before they say this is the year you are going to KONA. I would rather they give it to someone who has done 12 IM and then validates it every year with a 5150 (or whatever) than someone who does 12 and then doesn't do another triathlon until their number comes up. Other than increasing the number of legacy spots every year I'm not sure what else they can do.

I know what else they could do. They could simply honor the agreement without forcing annual "validation". These are "legacy" customers, who by definition are their volume customers. Who cares if they don't do a race between 2020 and 2025. They earned their 2025 ticket by volume, end of story. Why do they have to race more from 2021 to 2025? Who cares if they don't walk a step between 2020 and 2025 and show up unprepared at 2025. That's their right. They earned their legacy ticket already based on their volume of races before 2020. The whole concept of a volume, legacy athlete needing to "validate" is so ridiculous anyway. What purpose does their validation race in 2020 service towards their 2025 entry? And the 2021 one. And the 2022 one? It's just so stupid I can't wrap my head around it.
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Re: Legacy Program: I will race in Kona in 2025! [taldesigns] [ In reply to ]
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taldesigns wrote:
Seems like a possible solution to this should be a second Kona IM on a different weekend. One Kona for legacy, foundation, celebrities, etc. and one day for pros and those amateurs that meet the qualification standards.

Do you seriously believe this would work? It would be like winning Superbowl tickets only to find out that you are going to the same city, same stadium, but a week later, and maybe they'll have a couple high school teams playing instead of the actual contenders. That's not a solution, that would be a bait and switch fraud.
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Re: Legacy Program: I will race in Kona in 2025! [kny] [ In reply to ]
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Yes I was pointing out that you do not have to race 6 more full distance event. The program has been so successful that there is now a backlog of athletes eligible to enter via Legacy program. I am sure they are looking for solution to reduce the waiting period.
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Re: Legacy Program: I will race in Kona in 2025! [taldesigns] [ In reply to ]
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Or they could stick the AGers that likewise no one cares about on the second day. You don’t seem to understand that Other than the top pros at Kona, no one cares about anyone else who is racing other than the racers themselves and maybe, maybe their families.

I understand and appreciate how qualifying for Kona based on race time is a big deal for the athlete, and it should be......as it is a big deal for the legacy program athlete too. But, no one cares about those athletes. I couldn’t name a single AGer winner is the history of the race.
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Re: Legacy Program: I will race in Kona in 2025! [laughable] [ In reply to ]
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Can you really complain about how long it takes when you’re not really supposed to be at Kona anyway?
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Re: Legacy Program: I will race in Kona in 2025! [triguy86] [ In reply to ]
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triguy86 wrote:
Can you really complain about how long it takes when you’re not really supposed to be at Kona anyway?

I don't think you understand who decides who's, "supposed to be at Kona"?
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Re: Legacy Program: I will race in Kona in 2025! [ In reply to ]
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I really have no skin in this game but:

Why don't they just run a "B" race the next week, charge $2000 for 2500 spots, charge sponsors for another week of advertising and take home another 5 million in entries for a race that's already set up?

Plus all the extra fees from the hotels and merchandise?
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Re: Legacy Program: I will race in Kona in 2025! [jaretj] [ In reply to ]
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jaretj wrote:
I really have no skin in this game but:

Why don't they just run a "B" race the next week, charge $2000 for 2500 spots, charge sponsors for another week of advertising and take home another 5 million in entries for a race that's already set up?

Plus all the extra fees from the hotels and merchandise?

Same as was mentioned when someone asked why not run a 'B' race the next day for legacy.......because no one would be interested. Its all about being there on THAT day. Lots of folks have stated in the past that there is really nothing special about the course itself, you go bake in a lava field. Its all about being part of the frenzy of the world championships on that one day.
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Re: Legacy Program: I will race in Kona in 2025! [triguy86] [ In reply to ]
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triguy86 wrote:
Can you really complain about how long it takes when you’re not really supposed to be at Kona anyway?
. Is it a prerequisite you have to be a dick to post on this forum?
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Re: Legacy Program: I will race in Kona in 2025! [SBRcanuck] [ In reply to ]
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SBRcanuck wrote:
jaretj wrote:
I really have no skin in this game but:

Why don't they just run a "B" race the next week, charge $2000 for 2500 spots, charge sponsors for another week of advertising and take home another 5 million in entries for a race that's already set up?

Plus all the extra fees from the hotels and merchandise?

Same as was mentioned when someone asked why not run a 'B' race the next day for legacy.......because no one would be interested. Its all about being there on THAT day. Lots of folks have stated in the past that there is really nothing special about the course itself, you go bake in a lava field. Its all about being part of the frenzy of the world championships on that one day.


OK, I've been on vacation for the last week and must have missed that post.
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Re: Legacy Program: I will race in Kona in 2025! [davetri1] [ In reply to ]
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davetri1 wrote:
triguy86 wrote:
Can you really complain about how long it takes when you’re not really supposed to be at Kona anyway?
. Is it a prerequisite you have to be a dick to post on this forum?

Yes
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Re: Legacy Program: I will race in Kona in 2025! [Thom] [ In reply to ]
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It’s actually very easy. Those who qualify are supposed to be racing Kona. Which I will never do. They added legacy to throw a bone to the “rest of us” as a favor.
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Re: Legacy Program: I will race in Kona in 2025! [enricobraglia] [ In reply to ]
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Ignore the naysayers Enrico.

I went to Kona in 2019 as part of the Legacy program and had one of the best experiences of my life. I did everything the Path run, Hula swim, parade of nations, undies run, Legacy presentation and awards night. It is an awesome experience.

Many Legacy athletes, including myself, are offered a slot a year earlier than the original email that we received. You may get the opportunity to race in 2024.

FYI I did my first IM at age 40, raced Kona as a 56 year old and plan on racing an IM a year as long as I am able.
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Re: Legacy Program: I will race in Kona in 2025! [enricobraglia] [ In reply to ]
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So... who's interested in the recent email offering the possibility of moving up 2020 Kona?

Swim. Overbike. Walk.
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Re: Legacy Program: I will race in Kona in 2025! [GrimOopNorth] [ In reply to ]
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GrimOopNorth wrote:
So... who's interested in the recent email offering the possibility of moving up 2020 Kona?
. I declined; it just wouldn’t work for me this year. Maybe I will get moved up a year with the additional legacy spots.
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