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Re: Zwift Racing: 1 minute and 15 second power [Pyrenean Wolf] [ In reply to ]
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Those intervals are great for simulating race demands in something like a crit, or even a zwift rate, where you have lots of speed fluctuations, and moments where it's balls out, and then lulls, but agreed, those will not help your top end sprinting...

The only way you can truly simulate emptying the tank on a proper sprint, is by doing sprints, with lots of rest... Sprinting workouts tend to be incredibly easy for 90% of the workout, and incredibly hard for the remainder... You can get more fitness value from the workouts with adding in progressive wind-ups (which reduces the pure rest a bit, and also simulates the dynamics of a road race leading into the sprint)... On the road, the best ways to work on this is big gear sprinting uphill, or motorpacing... My favorite road sprint workout was with a group of 8-10 people and a moto, on a 1mile loop we'd do progressive laps at 40km/h. 45, 50, 55, 60, 65, and then take a break (you'd also be rotating through the paceline, realizing you're working hardest at the back, and getting the best draft right behind the moto... also great for cornering skills, because if you touch the breaks at some of those speeds, you get yourself and everyone on your wheel dropped, and probably a waterbottle thrown at you...), we'd usually do two to three sets like that... Then we would do a series of wind up sprints, where we'd do a couple of laps progressively building speed, and with 400m to go at the end of the second lap, the moto would have the speed lifted to around 70km/h and then pull off to the side and then it would be a bunch sprint, followed by a 5-6min super easy, and then repeating... we'd build our way up to 5 or 6 of those sprints...

You can simulate those types of workouts on the trainer, but should never be doing the top end sprinting in ERG mode... If you design your own workouts on something like Zwift, you need to make sure you're free riding for those top end efforts, because the resistance lag pooches the intervals otherwise...
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Re: Zwift Racing: 1 minute and 15 second power [Trauma] [ In reply to ]
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Hello

you probably answered to my post before I edit it (we probably were writing at the same time).

Yes, I agree, lactate resistance is useful for racing hard, dealing with high lactate level.
But improving the top power / top speed / 1mn power require training with much longer active recovery.

Personally, never do that on a machine. I did it on track, or road.
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Re: Zwift Racing: 1 minute and 15 second power [Pyrenean Wolf] [ In reply to ]
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Thanks to everyone for the very helpful responses. Using some of the workouts suggested (and racing zwift 3x a week) I have made some decent progress, setting new PRs for 1 minute and 15 second power, such that I can now usually hang to the end of most of the B races that I do and sometimes even podium. So for future viewers of this thread, these workouts work!

That said, while I have improved 15 second power by almost 50 watts it’s still pretty low and I won’t have a shot to win a B race until I improve it at least another 100-150 watts. Also, one thing I have noticed is that I do better relative to others on 1 minute or less hard efforts at the end of the race, particularly if the pace of the race stays high throughout. When everyone is fresh and the A and B groups are still together and hit that first climb I really, really have trouble hanging on to guys who I will later beat (if I hang on). I am guessing when we are fresh that’s when you can see everyone true top end, which I am still lacking.

Anyway, thanks again.
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Re: Zwift Racing: 1 minute and 15 second power [jsmith] [ In reply to ]
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turns out there's actually such a thing as 'being good at zwift' somewhat separate from 'real world' ability, I see plenty of lightweight guys winning sprints because they a) time it well (quite often the first to go ends up winning, there's not a lot of lag on Zwift but certainly some) b) use powerups effectively (basically bank an aero power up if you can, and know how far out you can use it) c) wind up really high cadence (I'm a very middle of the road sprinter IRL but am often at the pointy end of sprints on Zwift, I find 'sprinting' with my hands on the hoods and using v. high cadence to be way more effective than trying to turn massive watts in the drops).

YMMV, also there will always be people with iffy numbers because humans :)
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Re: Zwift Racing: 1 minute and 15 second power [triathlete37] [ In reply to ]
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triathlete37 wrote:
Remember most people cheat, their trainers are not calibrated, their Internet is a different speeds but besides that racing is fair and accurate.

I doubt it.

Certainly there are some people on there with dubious weights, and many who enter events in a category lower than they should, but to say "most people cheat" is ignorant. There is no way you can know that and so to claim it as a fact is dishonest.
Neither myself nor the two guys I train with outdoors who also use Zwift, cheat.
System inaccuracy, latency, or instrument error do not constitute cheating unless you're trying to intentionally manipulate them.
I update my weight when it shifts more than a kg either way. I follow the categories for races, according to my best previous performances per Zwiftpower stats. I use my PM for power data (and my trainer, a Tacx Neo, provides comparable figures were I to use that). I'm sure plenty others do likewise. But to be honest, whether they do or not is somewhat irrelevant. I race who I see around me, but mostly I'm racing myself. That's the whole point.

The constant drone of "everyone cheats on Zwift" with the implication that the whole topic is irrelevant, whenever someone talks about racing on Zwift is just silly. It's equivalent to responding to any other thread about triathlon, running, cycling, or swimming, by saying that everyone's doping and thinking that meas we shouldn't try to improve our own performances.

Sure, there's the possibility of cheating. I don't really care very much so long as I'm not cheating myself.
Last edited by: Ai_1: Jan 27, 20 3:39
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Re: Zwift Racing: 1 minute and 15 second power [jsmith] [ In reply to ]
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Get to the gym, do squats and leg press in the lower rep range, ie 6 reps. Oct-Feb

That will help the 15sec but less so with the 1min which is really not a sprint. Anything much over 20s is not really a sprint.

Its easier for a sprinter to move toward endurance than a pure endurance athlete becoming a sprinter. Just the luck of the draw.
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Re: Zwift Racing: 1 minute and 15 second power [jsmith] [ In reply to ]
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It's much more glamorous to try and make a break and drop everyone or get a small break going, but that's coming from someone who also sprints slowly.
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Re: Zwift Racing: 1 minute and 15 second power [jsmith] [ In reply to ]
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jsmith wrote:
Really enjoying racing on zwift a couple times a week but I get crushed in the sprints, particularly if they are uphill. While I have improved some, my 1 minute and 15 second power are much lower than I’d like. Other than just racing more, do folks have recommendations on good workouts to improve here, both inside and out in the real world? Relatedly, to improve this end-of-the-race power is is better to try work on this when fresh and not fatigued or more helpful to simulate end of race conditions sprinting when you are already pretty fatigued? Thanks in advance.

I'm late to the party, but, segment hunt outdoors.

Find some 1min and less segments and do a route where you pedal easy po peasy in between each KOM attempt.

This is what I do.

I target about 4 segments per such ride if doing 1min efforts. I've usually got about 4 solid 1min efforts in me.

I say outside because I can wring out a LOT more power outdoors without fear of breaking my bike on the trainer.

That gets the "snap". Now, using it late in a ride? You gotta pay to play, I'd recommend either just racing more on Zwift OR doing weeknight worlds in your local town. One solid strategy most people forget, if the group is small enough (10 or so riders) you can toss in enough longer attacks earlier that you tire people out to the point they won't contest you for the sprint. Unfortunately, only our weeknight worlds is like that. All the road races are way to straight and not hilly enough to pull that off.
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