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Fixing a bad runner
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Hey ST Brains,
I'm thinking a lot about my run recently and debating which type of plan to go with. Let me caveat this by mentioning I've had an in-person coach and it didn't work as I ended up injured (mostly due to my own genetics and stupidity, but being an in-person coach, I wish it had been noticed earlier and I ended up needing 6+ months recovery).

With that out of the way, I'm open to coaching if I find the *right* coach for me, I've been looking and haven't found the person I jive with.

So in the short term I'm self-coaching and thinking a lot about my run. Why the run? Because I'm a slow land beast and need to focus there.

What's a slow land beast? I don't train the swim at all due to my strong swimming background and can easily crank out a '28 on the 70.3 with no fatigue and get sucked into the sub '25 group if I dumb and don't think about the rest of the race. Last race I went a '31 because of the aforementioned injury and wanted to make sure I had no back pain coming out of the water. For the bike I can crank out a sub hour 40km in my training rides with no drafting/group and can lay down a 2:20 90km when I'm just out on a bike day.

But when I run, I suck. Going sub-50 on a 10k is work for me. Like real work. I can easily turn around and go 1:50 on the 20k so its not just endurance. I literally spend my last 70.3 on the run getting passed the entire time. Until the last 1km when I still had a little leg left. The finisher directly above me in the age group beat me by about 30 seconds total and 24 minutes on the run.

So yeah, slow land beast.

And I'm big, but no longer big big. When I signed up for my first full IM I was 120KG, ran it at 97. I got down to 79kg, but generally race at around 83 now cause that's where I'm comfortable.

So as I tackle this conundrum I'm debating if I should start with something like a 3:30 marathon training regiment or a 1:30 half marathon training plan, or something completely different.

For context, as I'm still in PT, I'm only racing 70.3 and below in 2020.

Also, if you can think of a great coach for this type of thing, remote (I'm traveling a bit for work, but based in Latin America), would love to hear it.
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Re: Fixing a bad runner [Foolless] [ In reply to ]
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So those are excellent swim splits without training, and bike splits for pretty much anyone. Nice work!

Having said that, with the kind of engine you need to have in order to hit those times & paces you should be able to crank out a sub 1.30 open half with some half decent run training and technique. I think that it's probably best that you look for either a good run specific coach nearby to fix any potential underlying issues (I only mention this as you noted you had injury issues when trying to run under the eyes of a coach who was perhaps not the best) or find a tri coach who's worth his salt.
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Re: Fixing a bad runner [Foolless] [ In reply to ]
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Are you saying going under 50 for an open 10k is work, or the 10k of about Olympic-distance triathlon?

Aaron Bales
Lansing Triathlon Team
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Re: Fixing a bad runner [Foolless] [ In reply to ]
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Foolless wrote:

So as I tackle this conundrum I'm debating if I should start with something like a 3:30 marathon training regiment or a 1:30 half marathon training plan, or something completely different.

For context, as I'm still in PT, I'm only racing 70.3 and below in 2020.

You'll get a lot of opinions I'm sure. My 2 cents is not to put an arbitrary number/time/mileage on it. Just run such that you're getting consistent, meaning you have whatever mileage and progression you can handle without getting injured. You're obviously very fit so you just have to trust that the running will come good given time. Injuries will set you back more than any hero run effort will improve you. You could have a look at the BarryP approach which is all about consistency.

I think it's been said before that someone with a great swim and/or bike engine can get themselves in trouble with running. I'm sure you have the energy to put in big run training days. But maybe not the run specific muscles and tendons to keep up with that energy.

Do read the BarryP stuff. Basically you work out what you can run regularly and maintain, injury free, for the long term. Then progress slowly. You might find that boring or frustrating because of your general fitness so the challenge might be patience. What you want is to look back in 6 months, or whatever, and feel strong, pain free and confident. At that stage you could look at your running paces and set a more specific goal but at this stage just get run healthy.

You could also chat a bit about the specific injury and see a sports physio so that they can advise about working on the bits that aren't quite flexible or strong enough. Good luck.
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Re: Fixing a bad runner [MI_Mumps] [ In reply to ]
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An open 10k under 50 is work (I've not run a closed course but my day runs say a 0:45-46 would be race day, I'm a bad runner). Olympic runs tend to be a 0:52 off the bike on race day.
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Re: Fixing a bad runner [Foolless] [ In reply to ]
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What kind of mileage were you running when you got injured and when you felt you were underperforming?
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Re: Fixing a bad runner [Parkland] [ In reply to ]
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I was in a month varying 35-39 MPW when I got injured. The plan was targeting getting up to 45-50 over the next two months by cutting swimming completely
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Re: Fixing a bad runner [Foolless] [ In reply to ]
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1st is find a coach or someone who can video your form, slow it down and fully analyze it. Before you can dive into a running program geared around making you faster you have to make sure your body is ready to receive that training. The biggest issue I see in adult runners a lack of running form work and overly tight hips either from sitting for too long, pushing big gears or both. Athletes with extremely jacked up hips will need some professional help to unstick them. For everyone else good form practice is essential. Search TRUWolfpack running form on YouTube. The best basic form drills and explanation. Do that 5 days a week either as a stand alone run (I have athletes warm up 5 minutes, do the entire drill and stride work and then walk home) or incorporated into you run warm up. If you’ve never done this, do it for 1 year straight. If you have done drills in the past, just get back into good practice. The drills set your form the strides put your form to practice. Do the running analysis first.

2nd find a triathlon coach that knows running really well. It’s hard to find a running coach who knows triathlon it’s easier the other way around.

Dave Jewell
Free Run Speed

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