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Tri in Mexico
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Only $70 USD last minute sign up for an Olympic!

2 lap clean ocean swim (i mention this, as 1 hour to north in USA swim portion of tri cancelled), fast bike course with no glass on roads, and same for the run.

Took a hotel stay there (similar price to US) and ate local food to support economy (real cheap but good quality and fresh)

Drafting is legal in Mexico tri. Tri bikes get an extra 1 min penalty. Anyways,
https://scontent-lax3-1.xx.fbcdn.net/...d6e5&oe=5DCA8276
This guy was a leach on my back the entire race! If he would have put some work in... We both could have gotten faster bike times. Well looks like someone got a free ride from me.. still smoked him on the run. On the final lap, I also ended pulling a pack in for the last 10k. So its a nice perspective... I think US should allow this since courses are so packed, but definitely a penalty should be given if you put no work in
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Re: Tri in Mexico [synthetic] [ In reply to ]
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Seems like a bad idea to allow drafting with TT bikes. Though it would be good to see more draft legal races for age groupers

instagram.com/42pointtwo
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Re: Tri in Mexico [synthetic] [ In reply to ]
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Was it for money?

I personally would have also drafted off you if it was allowed and NEVER have taken a turn. thats racing

Rhymenocerus wrote:
I think everyone should consult ST before they do anything.
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Re: Tri in Mexico [synthetic] [ In reply to ]
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You have the wrong viewpoint on people "sitting in". Don't want to make him sit in, then force him to do work or change your and his viewpoint on it. Because there's going to be so many different strategies/fitness/strengths with people. Some will want to pull, some wont, some can't pull, some can.

It's why I love draft legal...there's no artifical rules, it's simply a race from point A to B anything goes. You can draft, you can not draft, you can pull, you can sit in. It's your job to put the hurt on people who wont pull or make them realize they should work.

Brooks Doughtie, M.S.
Exercise Physiology
-USAT Level II
Last edited by: B_Doughtie: Aug 27, 19 4:51
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Re: Tri in Mexico [PJC] [ In reply to ]
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In the instance where it's very few people, your losing time by not aiding in work load. While yes your getting a "free ride" your also likely not going fast enough to justify simply sitting in. And no your not going to run faster than the time you could save by "saving your legs".

But that's racing and that's understanding the dynamics of the races.

30 person "pack" sure, sit in because most of the time your going to have people around you willing to do the work.

1-3 people (the OP's instance had 2 total people), your actually likely losing time by not contributing to the work. Even though your "saving the legs", by making 1 person do all the work, you aren't going any faster vs aiding in the work. There are ways to "fake" pulls, etc, and contribute vs doing no work.

But again, there's no way in hell a race should "make" you work.

Brooks Doughtie, M.S.
Exercise Physiology
-USAT Level II
Last edited by: B_Doughtie: Aug 27, 19 4:56
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Re: Tri in Mexico [42point2] [ In reply to ]
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42point2 wrote:
Seems like a bad idea to allow drafting with TT bikes.

Watch out, the group ride TT/tri bike apologists will invade the topic.
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Re: Tri in Mexico [synthetic] [ In reply to ]
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From the sounds of it, he rode a really smart race. He locked onto a guy that doesn't get the whole drafting thing and pulled him up to the pack in front, without ever taking a pull. He shouldn't get a penalty, he should become a coach...
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Re: Tri in Mexico [monty] [ In reply to ]
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monty wrote:
From the sounds of it, he rode a really smart race. He locked onto a guy that doesn't get the whole drafting thing and pulled him up to the pack in front, without ever taking a pull. He shouldn't get a penalty, he should become a coach...

Well. He was a chunkier person.. so that extra work could have benefited him. There was no prize money on the line for this race, unlike Mexican running races where there is for every race. I understand the frustration of brownies brothers when they said before of people not putting the work in.

The last pack I pulled also no one came up front to help out. So perhaps this sit back mentality is among all racers in the country and this why they don't do well in ITU? This tri was pit on by the national federation.

Next time I'm gonna have a water bottle on back with reverse valve to spray leaches ha ha
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Re: Tri in Mexico [synthetic] [ In reply to ]
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Nah just "sit up" next time. You won't ruin your race anymore than hurting it by doing a pull at the front of the whole time. Because either everyone sits up and you all yell at each other, or they get the point. But if your going to be "hard headed" and just sit on the front, ppl will always sit on that person.




The Brownlees' bitching (really only AB) imo was a lot of hot air most of the time (AB likes to call out pretty much every one else in his group most races), because most of the time, it's not that they don't want to pull....it's that they can't pull at the paces the brothers wanted. At that level for some, just "sitting in" was on the rivets for a few (you'll notice they'll be the 1st to get popped the moment the brothers put in any dig).

Brooks Doughtie, M.S.
Exercise Physiology
-USAT Level II
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Re: Tri in Mexico [synthetic] [ In reply to ]
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synthetic wrote:
monty wrote:
From the sounds of it, he rode a really smart race. He locked onto a guy that doesn't get the whole drafting thing and pulled him up to the pack in front, without ever taking a pull. He shouldn't get a penalty, he should become a coach...


Well. He was a chunkier person.. so that extra work could have benefited him. There was no prize money on the line for this race, unlike Mexican running races where there is for every race. I understand the frustration of brownies brothers when they said before of people not putting the work in.

The last pack I pulled also no one came up front to help out. So perhaps this sit back mentality is among all racers in the country and this why they don't do well in ITU? This tri was pit on by the national federation.

Next time I'm gonna have a water bottle on back with reverse valve to spray leaches ha ha

I'm sorry, but... WHAT?

Also, I want to meet the "brownies brothers", they sound like they make some killer pastries.
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Re: Tri in Mexico [synthetic] [ In reply to ]
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You're looking at this the wrong way.

He actually helped you by taking the drag off of your back and putting it on his. You were probably .25mph faster because of him.
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Re: Tri in Mexico [jaretj] [ In reply to ]
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jaretj wrote:
You're looking at this the wrong way.

He actually helped you by taking the drag off of your back and putting it on his. You were probably .25mph faster because of him.

Pink? I'm glad I did solo work this though, as I chase my personal best times
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Re: Tri in Mexico [synthetic] [ In reply to ]
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Your looking at it completely the wrong way. Anytime an event is DL, PR and records go out the window as tactics and such play far more important role in the race. So it becomes about placing and not what your split is, because bike tactics will play such a huge role in how you do as well as how everyone around you will do.


And if your trying to keep it "individual" effort in an DL format, I'd suggest your missing out on just accepting and embracing a kick ass tactical event.

Brooks Doughtie, M.S.
Exercise Physiology
-USAT Level II
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Re: Tri in Mexico [synthetic] [ In reply to ]
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The leader of a paceline will get a little bit of a benefit because of the low pressure bubble between riders.
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Re: Tri in Mexico [B_Doughtie] [ In reply to ]
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B_Doughtie wrote:
Your looking at it completely the wrong way. Anytime an event is DL, PR and records go out the window as tactics and such play far more important role in the race. So it becomes about placing and not what your split is, because bike tactics will play such a huge role in how you do as well as how everyone around you will do.


And if your trying to keep it "individual" effort in an DL format, I'd suggest your missing out on just accepting and embracing a kick ass tactical event.

I didn't make it out with lead pack, all others riding too slow for me.

I'm wondering if this Jarretj guy is a troll or uninformed
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Re: Tri in Mexico [synthetic] [ In reply to ]
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Excuse me for trying to troll you with misinformation.

https://www.bicycling.com/...026446/how-to-draft/

Second paragraph:

Leader's Bonus
Pulling is not a thankless job. The first cyclist enjoys up to a 3.1 percent reduction in wind resistance courtesy of a low-pressure air bubble between riders, which pushes the leader along, says Bert Blocken, PhD, professor of physics at the Eindhoven University of Technology in the Netherlands, who led some of the research. Keep a steady pace on the front to avoid surging away from the boost—and splintering the group.

https://www.exploratorium.edu/...g/aerodynamics2.html

Suprisingly drafting not only helps the bicyclist following the leader, but the lead cyclist gains an advantage as well. Paul explained, "The interesting thing is by filling in her eddy you improve the front person's performance as well. So two people who are drafting can put out less energy than two individuals (who are not drafting) would covering the same distance in the same time." While the lead cyclist gains some advantage in this situation she still needs to expend much more energy than the cyclist who is following.


https://www.roadbikerider.com/...-drafting-on-a-bike/

It gets even more interesting when you are riding in a bigger group. Even the cyclist in front can also save up to 3 percent in effort, as the cyclists behind them break up the air current, although cyclists near the end of the group can benefit the most. The next to the last rider will see the some of the biggest drafting benefits, as there is still one more bike behind, according to the same principle.
Last edited by: jaretj: Aug 28, 19 9:40
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Re: Tri in Mexico [jaretj] [ In reply to ]
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jaretj wrote:
Excuse me for trying to troll you with misinformation.

https://www.bicycling.com/...026446/how-to-draft/

Second paragraph:

Leader's Bonus
Pulling is not a thankless job. The first cyclist enjoys up to a 3.1 percent reduction in wind resistance courtesy of a low-pressure air bubble between riders, which pushes the leader along, says Bert Blocken, PhD, professor of physics at the Eindhoven University of Technology in the Netherlands, who led some of the research. Keep a steady pace on the front to avoid surging away from the boost—and splintering the group.

https://www.exploratorium.edu/...g/aerodynamics2.html

Suprisingly drafting not only helps the bicyclist following the leader, but the lead cyclist gains an advantage as well. Paul explained, "The interesting thing is by filling in her eddy you improve the front person's performance as well. So two people who are drafting can put out less energy than two individuals (who are not drafting) would covering the same distance in the same time." While the lead cyclist gains some advantage in this situation she still needs to expend much more energy than the cyclist who is following.


https://www.roadbikerider.com/...-drafting-on-a-bike/

It gets even more interesting when you are riding in a bigger group. Even the cyclist in front can also save up to 3 percent in effort, as the cyclists behind them break up the air current, although cyclists near the end of the group can benefit the most. The next to the last rider will see the some of the biggest drafting benefits, as there is still one more bike behind, according to the same principle.


well, even with these postings I had to fact check, and concede.... that you are correct .

Now I do feel a bit cheated on myself :(
Last edited by: synthetic: Aug 29, 19 7:36
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Re: Tri in Mexico [synthetic] [ In reply to ]
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You had a fast and clean race, with a good run (at least from what you posted on reddit), not cheated at all.
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Re: Tri in Mexico [B_Doughtie] [ In reply to ]
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B_Doughtie wrote:
In the instance where it's very few people, your losing time by not aiding in work load. While yes your getting a "free ride" your also likely not going fast enough to justify simply sitting in. And no your not going to run faster than the time you could save by "saving your legs".
This paragraph nearly killed me.
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