Re: How about no power meters in tri? [cujo] [ In reply to ]

Oct 29, 18 7:30

Post #76 of 93 (940 views)

cujo wrote:

> Triathlons are not a bike race alone. You still have to run. Powermeters help you pace.

This is exactly my point. Unaided racing would be more variable, and hence, more fun in my opinion.

More fun for you, but not everyone approaches this stuff the same way. I'm more on the cycling side of things, but I know very talented racers who race and train by feel and also those who hyper-analyze their power numbers in training and to some extent in races (particularly hilly sections and TT's). Tri and cycling (racing) are already fringe sports and with poor participation. If they banned the use of power meters, HRM's, etc., you are going to alienate a decent percentage of the OCD/analytical population (which I'd argue is a decent percent at the pointy end).

For the people who don't like the technology, I can't imaging there are that many who are turned off from racing because others use technology. If someone isn't having fun because other racers are on more expensive bikes with a power meters, they would probably find other reasons for not having fun even if all the technology was banned.

Re: How about no power meters in tri? [bluto] [ In reply to ]

Oct 29, 18 7:47

Post #77 of 93 (927 views)

The forward momentum is irreversible in the rules and what is the norm, but I think it's ludicrous you can have such weak riders able to cruise to 20+ mph average speeds in the bike leg.

The tri bike tech and position stuff allowable is pretty much into UFO spaceship stuff by now.

It's a bit silly anyway since the bike leg isn't last. It's always about being quick and conserving energy, not actually pushing the limit like in a bike-only time trial. I'd change my tune if the bike leg was last and you saw people ruining themselves pushing watts to utilize the crazy aero and expensive setups.

It's a bit why if I were to attempt a tri, I'd most likely pick one with a gravel bike leg. Make the legs and skills talk, not the wallet.

You can buy speed in time trial also, but at least in time trial you also have to totally waste yourself on the bike to get new PR's. Not hold back for the run.

Re: How about no power meters in tri? [bluto] [ In reply to ]

Oct 29, 18 7:51

Post #78 of 93 (924 views)

>More fun for you,

Yes, exactly. I know not everyone feels this way. That's fine.

I'm sure some people would drop out because they can't use their fancy toy in a race. I doubt it would be that many if said power meters could store data to be downloaded later. I'm also fairly sure that about 1 year after this imaginary rule went into effect no one would give a crap any more, especially if pro cycling does away with it.

> If they banned the use of power meters, HRM's, etc., you are going to alienate a decent percentage of the OCD/analytical population (which I'd argue is a decent percent at the pointy end.

I have a hard time believing that the best racers are going to quit racing because they can't stare at a power meter and get alerts from their headset during a race. They're not in it to stare at a headset. They're in it to compete.

On the other hand, I think some of those people might find some adjustment pains when they had to race sans headset, because they'd have to learn how to race without their electronic coach.

To be clear on my opinion, it's not that my fun is suffering because of all this tech, but I do think the sport would be better without it. Athletes' attachment to this stuff is a turn off to a lot of newcomers, and I think it's better served as a training tool than a racing assistance device.

Racing shouldn't be overly dependent on tech, in my opinion. And right now, I think that the cycling leg of tri is overly dependent on tech.

Re: How about no power meters in tri? [burnthesheep] [ In reply to ]

Oct 29, 18 7:53

Post #79 of 93 (921 views)

The manufacturers would flip their lids, but ban aerobars and go to road geometry. Do it in the name of safety /jk.. kinda. Keep all the tech-meters you want. But the budget gap shrinks with road setups.

Re: How about no power meters in tri? [cujo] [ In reply to ]

Oct 29, 18 8:01

Post #80 of 93 (914 views)

cujo wrote:

>More fun for you,

Yes, exactly. I know not everyone feels this way. That's fine.

I'm sure some people would drop out because they can't use their fancy toy in a race. I doubt it would be that many if said power meters could store data to be downloaded later. I'm also fairly sure that about 1 year after this imaginary rule went into effect no one would give a crap any more, especially if pro cycling does away with it.

> If they banned the use of power meters, HRM's, etc., you are going to alienate a decent percentage of the OCD/analytical population (which I'd argue is a decent percent at the pointy end.

I have a hard time believing that the best racers are going to quit racing because they can't stare at a power meter and get alerts from their headset during a race. They're not in it to stare at a headset. They're in it to compete.

On the other hand, I think some of those people might find some adjustment pains when they had to race sans headset, because they'd have to learn how to race without their electronic coach.

To be clear on my opinion, it's not that my fun is suffering because of all this tech, but I do think the sport would be better without it. Athletes' attachment to this stuff is a turn off to a lot of newcomers, and I think it's better served as a training tool than a racing assistance device.

Racing shouldn't be overly dependent on tech, in my opinion. And right now, I think that the cycling leg of tri is overly dependent on tech.

Yeah, I think we'll have to agree to disagree. I think a lot of new participants are turned off because they see riders on fancy bikes doing 25mph when they are averaging 19 and they think the speed is a result of the tech. You get rid of the tech and they would still be discouraged when those strong riders are still averaging 24.8. The tech is fun for many, but it's not making a significant performance difference for newer riders.

Re: How about no power meters in tri? [cujo] [ In reply to ]

Oct 29, 18 8:02

Post #81 of 93 (912 views)

Holding your prescribed power, whether you judge it by a PM or by HR or RPE, IS racing against your competition

Re: How about no power meters in tri? [ripple] [ In reply to ]

Oct 29, 18 8:03

Post #82 of 93 (911 views)

> The manufacturers would flip their lids, but ban aerobars and go to road geometry

That could be interesting. Definitely easier to feed off cycling culture that way.

Re: How about no power meters in tri? [cujo] [ In reply to ]

Oct 29, 18 8:18

Post #83 of 93 (899 views)

cujo wrote:

> The manufacturers would flip their lids, but ban aerobars and go to road geometry

That could be interesting. Definitely easier to feed off cycling culture that way.

I live somewhere with rubbish roads, rubbish weather, inconsiderate motorists and hills. I sold my tri bikes because it's too much effort to ride them round here. Actually, I've just sold my road bike too and concentrating on running for the same reasons. If I buy another bike next year it'll be an alloy framed 105 equipped road bike I could do a draft legal race on or the odd non-draft sprint race and if I crash it there will be no tears as cheap to replace components.

Re: How about no power meters in tri? [Mudge] [ In reply to ]

Oct 29, 18 8:43

Post #84 of 93 (883 views)

I agree...I don’t see a huge difference. There are days when, if I stuck to my proposed PM numbers, I would be too slow or too fast so I have to adjust with HR or perceived exertion. The notion that a PM is some form of cheating device is pretty ridiculous. You still have to ride and figure out how fast to ride (and then run).

Re: How about no power meters in tri? [trail] [ In reply to ]

Oct 29, 18 8:51

Post #85 of 93 (877 views)

trail wrote:

bufordt wrote:

jaretj wrote:

I think all bikes used in triathlon should be under $1000

Original Sale Price or current value? Could I resell my bike to myself to get a lower price?

Post-race, while all the bikes are still in T2, if someone asks to buy your bike for $1000, you have to sell it to them.

Only if they can supply you with another brand new bike that fits. Nobody's getting my 650 bikes.

Re: How about no power meters in tri? [DFW_Tri] [ In reply to ]

Oct 29, 18 9:31

Post #86 of 93 (866 views)

Yeah I barely look at my power numbers in a tri. There is too much day to day variability. But I have a very good idea if I go over a certain HR number It won’t be long before I go boom.

Re: How about no power meters in tri? [cujo] [ In reply to ]

Oct 29, 18 9:42

Post #87 of 93 (863 views)

Well some of this is from the no drafting rules. Allow drafting and you’ll see a drastically more exciting race. And much less consistent power numbers.

Re: How about no power meters in tri? [cujo] [ In reply to ]

Oct 29, 18 12:06

Post #88 of 93 (847 views)

cujo wrote:

> Triathlons are not a bike race alone. You still have to run. Powermeters help you pace.

This is exactly my point. Unaided racing would be more variable, and hence, more fun in my opinion.

Ok then don't use one. If you can go without it or anything else for that matter you be happy and save money.

Re: How about no power meters in tri? [cujo] [ In reply to ]

Oct 29, 18 12:10

Post #89 of 93 (843 views)

cujo wrote:

> The manufacturers would flip their lids, but ban aerobars and go to road geometry

That could be interesting. Definitely easier to feed off cycling culture that way.

Cycling culture? We are talking about triathlons....different culture. I doubt not using a powermeter will tempt a cyclist to swim and run.

Re: How about no power meters in tri? [JasoninHalifax] [ In reply to ]

Oct 29, 18 17:31

Post #90 of 93 (809 views)

Jason, that looks a lot like at *least* the red wheels (and the red bike), that was always hanging in "Dave's Bike Shop" right on the corner of Palani & Ali'i in Kona. He was an Aussie guy & his shop was off the street on the backside of the building at the Hawaii IM finish line. This is the second time I've seen a bike like that--have you been to his shop while he was alive? Good guy, always willing to help no matter what...

Re: How about no power meters in tri? [Rocky M] [ In reply to ]

Oct 29, 18 17:43

Post #91 of 93 (807 views)

Rocky M wrote:

Jason, that looks a lot like at *least* the red wheels (and the red bike), that was always hanging in "Dave's Bike Shop" right on the corner of Palani & Ali'i in Kona. He was an Aussie guy & his shop was off the street on the backside of the building at the Hawaii IM finish line. This is the second time I've seen a bike like that--have you been to his shop while he was alive? Good guy, always willing to help no matter what...

Nope, I’ve never been to Hawaii. The one I saw was at Winners Edge in Bermuda, I believe it was a special order for a customer. The guys built it up and had it on display for a couple of weeks before they delivered it.

Swimming Workout of the Day:

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Re: How about no power meters in tri? [Scottxs] [ In reply to ]

Oct 30, 18 14:56

Post #92 of 93 (773 views)

Scottxs wrote:

cujo wrote:

> Triathlons are not a bike race alone. You still have to run. Powermeters help you pace.

This is exactly my point. Unaided racing would be more variable, and hence, more fun in my opinion.

Ok then don't use one. If you can go without it or anything else for that matter you be happy and save money.

I don't know what it is about triathlon that makes people want to ban quite typical equipment, be it wetsuits, power meters, or apparently GPS.

Especially since we all know the only thing that needs banning is aerobars.

The point is, ladies and gentleman, that speed, for lack of a better word, is good. Speed is right, Speed works. Speed clarifies, cuts through, and captures the essence of the evolutionary spirit.

Re: How about no power meters in tri? [ In reply to ]

Nov 1, 18 11:40

Post #93 of 93 (742 views)

So, what's the rationale behind banning PM, aerobars, and everything else? I just don't get it. Triathlon is inherently individual. As long as you comply to the rules live and let live.

Or is it something else? If you are not enjoying your competitions maybe it's time to try something else.

You have Xterra, Swimrun, CX, gravel, non-endurance sports, etc. We're living in the age of abundance! Stop complaining. You deserve better ;-)

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