At least there are no white shorts with a red middle panel.

Really? Are you so willfully obtuse as to not acknowledge that his genetic makeup is that of a male? No amount of surgery, hormone therapy, or trans talking points make him a her. This Dr. McKinnon, in a quick read of his tweets, is clearly a very confused individual. A member of the all-alphabet lexicon team. Sorry to put in in such vulgar terminology, but we cannot allow sporting society to devolve into an environment where getting one's junk removed and taking some pills means men get to compete against women. From a crowd that wants everything to be "fair", talk about the height of unfairness.

What do you mean by genetic makeup?

I'm asking the question about how would a rule in the UCI rulebook be written. Does some like 5-person panel just "look" at the person and decide how male they look?

There are XX "males" who look just like males complete with full testosterone production and masculine musculature.

There are XY "females" who look just like women with no testosterone production.

Do you just test for testosterone and ignore all the other factors of male/female presentation?

The non-binary gender isn't just a recently-created social construct. It's actual biology.

My point is that I don't think it's a good approach to go case-by-case. That's not how governing bodies should operate. I'm genuinely seeking some clear criteria.

I can't help but think that this dude who won is trolling folks to prove a point.

That said: Oh well. The women athletes now doomed to be also-rans and asterisks in their own sports can console themselves that their lower bone and muscle density is all just a Social Construct that exists in their little female brains. ;-)

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"Politics is just show business for ugly people."

Yea,, I originally saw it via FB and google brought me to the link I posted... Didnt realize the cycling world article was old.

You start trying to define "fully female" based physiology and you get on a slippery slope and pretty soon the female basketball players, volleyball players, and high jumpers have to be under 6' tall (because being tall is a male characteristic).

I think there is a difference between being a female athlete being genetically endowed with physcial attributes that are advantageous for a particular sport (eg height in those cases, but also lung capacity, muscular development, etc), as opposed to m-f transgender athlete being genetically endowed with the same attribute by virtue of being born male.

 
It pretty amazing that people would think after in utero development. ( " Boys in the womb are little testosterone machines. In fact, says Margaret M. McCarthy, a professor of physiology at the University of Maryland who studies early brain development, male babies are born with as much testosterone as a 25-year-old man!" )

Then the secondary surge at puberty through full maturation that somehow one could exogenously manipulate the male hormones to female standards and now it's all good and equal, no difference.... move along nothing to shake your head about here.

Well it's a slippery slope....what do you mean by being "born male". Danger Will Robinson!

There is cross-over in almost all the characteristics you could use to define male or female. If you try to define "fully female" then eventually you should look at all male-typical attributes, such as height, how hairy they are, how deep the voice is, preference for talking vs watching TV, etc. A person is transgender by definition if their identity is different from their assigned sex, but sexual assignment is not always correct or done with all the information needed to determine the most correct sexual assignment.

This is what happens when science deniers take control.

Hahaha! Truly no words! Hahahahahahahahahaha!!!

I remember when Title IX first started putting girls on the boys team when there wasn't an equivalent, and then some boys decided to play field hockey, etc, and were crushing the girls. Who'd have thunk?

I love the part in the 60 minutes interview where he/she is asked if he likes girls or boys. He is very adamant about still liking girls. Does this mean he's (dang it...."she's) a lesbian now???

straight out of south park.

"You start trying to define "fully female" based physiology and you get on a slippery slope and pretty soon the female basketball players, volleyball players, and high jumpers have to be under 6' tall (because being tall is a male characteristic). "


You make a very good point. I could take all the hormone therapy in the world, and that won't make me not 6' 3". But what if I was born "the wrong gender" (however you define that). Like you said, height is a male characteristic. But then again, my cousin is a 6' 3" woman (her brothers are 6'8"). Maybe I'm just a tall woman who was born with a penis. (of course I'm not)

But as a tall woman, I could dunk a women's basketball when I was younger, something that only 4 pros have ever done in a game. Jumping ability is also a male characteristic, but I'm not better than the best. Maybe I'm just a tall, very gifted jumping woman who was born with a penis. (of course I'm not)


I think the biggest issue we have is that with women's sports we are trying to define a category that is, effectively, a less competitive division of sports. You must be a "woman" covers 99+% of all cases, and the remaining fraction of a percent are not generally athletic enough to be worth arguing over. Its those that are left that are difficult to categorize fairly.

The trans MMA fighter who's mauling women is an issue.
The trans rugby player mauling women is an issue.
The trans high school wrestler under hormone therapy who wants to wrestle with the boys but is being forced to wrestle with the girls (and getting booed as a result) is an issue.


FWIW, I don't think male to female transitions should be able to qualify for awards. That still leaves a small % of issues with other competitors.

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-----------------------------Baron Von Speedypants
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nope , Canada wants to legislate pronouns now so they won't be a he or she (google jordan peterson)