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Re: Manafort pleads guilty [slowguy] [ In reply to ]
Quote | Reply
JSA
Sep 15, 18 20:35
Post #51 of 58 (636 views)
slowguy wrote:
JSA wrote:
slowguy wrote:

I don't think Mr. Mueller or his team have ever made claims about collusion, nor can I see how any end to this investigation is characterized as a "win" or a "loss" for the investigating team. Their job is to investigate and determine if crimes were committed, not to beat one side or the other.


Sure they did. It was specified in the order appointing Mueller as special counsel. In fact, it is core purpose of his investigation.

In his order appointing former FBI Director Robert S. Mueller III as special counsel, Rosenstein limited Mueller’s role to leading “the investigation confirmed by then-FBI Director James B. Comey in testimony before the House Permanent Select Committee on Intelligence on March 20, 2017, including …. any links and/or coordination between the Russian government and individuals associated with the campaign of President Donald Trump; and any matters that arose or may arise directly from the investigation; and any other matters within the scope of 28 C.F.R. § 600.4(a).” That last bit refers to a part of the federal code that says that the jurisdiction of a special counsel is to include “the authority to investigate and prosecute federal crimes committed in the course of, and with intent to interfere with, the Special Counsel’s investigation, such as perjury, obstruction of justice, destruction of evidence, and intimidation of witnesses.”


The order itself says: "... to ensure a full and thorough investigation of the Russian government's efforts to interfere in the 2016 presidential election ..."

https://www.justice.gov/...file/967231/download


Only in the LR would I fully expect for a licensed attorney to try to make the argument that the letter appointing Mr. Mueller as special counsel would constitute a claim made by the Mueller team.

Ridiculous.

You are fucking kidding me, right? The entire purpose of his appointment was to investigate collusion. From the get go, Mueller's team said they would investigate collusion. That was their mandate. That's what they said they were investigating. That's what they said they would find.

They found a lot of other stuff, but, no collusion.

You are absolutely beyond ridiculous. Seriously, you are out of depth on this one. Unreal.
If there are no dogs in Heaven, then when I die I want to go where they went. - Will Rogers

Emery's Third Coast Triathlon | Tri Wisconsin Triathlon Team | Push Endurance | GLWR
Quote Reply
Re: Manafort pleads guilty [JSA] [ In reply to ]
Quote | Reply
slowguy
Sep 15, 18 20:57
Post #52 of 58 (625 views)
JSA wrote:
slowguy wrote:
JSA wrote:
slowguy wrote:

I don't think Mr. Mueller or his team have ever made claims about collusion, nor can I see how any end to this investigation is characterized as a "win" or a "loss" for the investigating team. Their job is to investigate and determine if crimes were committed, not to beat one side or the other.


Sure they did. It was specified in the order appointing Mueller as special counsel. In fact, it is core purpose of his investigation.

In his order appointing former FBI Director Robert S. Mueller III as special counsel, Rosenstein limited Mueller’s role to leading “the investigation confirmed by then-FBI Director James B. Comey in testimony before the House Permanent Select Committee on Intelligence on March 20, 2017, including …. any links and/or coordination between the Russian government and individuals associated with the campaign of President Donald Trump; and any matters that arose or may arise directly from the investigation; and any other matters within the scope of 28 C.F.R. § 600.4(a).” That last bit refers to a part of the federal code that says that the jurisdiction of a special counsel is to include “the authority to investigate and prosecute federal crimes committed in the course of, and with intent to interfere with, the Special Counsel’s investigation, such as perjury, obstruction of justice, destruction of evidence, and intimidation of witnesses.”


The order itself says: "... to ensure a full and thorough investigation of the Russian government's efforts to interfere in the 2016 presidential election ..."

https://www.justice.gov/...file/967231/download


Only in the LR would I fully expect for a licensed attorney to try to make the argument that the letter appointing Mr. Mueller as special counsel would constitute a claim made by the Mueller team.

Ridiculous.


You are fucking kidding me, right? The entire purpose of his appointment was to investigate collusion. From the get go, Mueller's team said they would investigate collusion. That was their mandate. That's what they said they were investigating. That's what they said they would find.

They found a lot of other stuff, but, no collusion.

You are absolutely beyond ridiculous. Seriously, you are out of depth on this one. Unreal.

Everyone in the LR knows to avoid you when you get in one of these moods. It's not worth engaging with a jackass who makes ludicrous statements, and then ignores reality as he tries to paint everyone else as the idiot. By definition, the letter written by Mr. Rosenstein appointing Mr. meuller as special counsel can not be considered to be a a claim made by the Mueller investigative team, since that team DID NOT EXIST when the letter was written. There is no logical or reasonable way to argue otherwise, but I'm sure you'll snap back as you try to backpedal or defend the indefensible. I'm not going to waste my weekend with your nonsense. Have fun.
Slowguy

(insert pithy phrase here...)
Quote Reply
Re: Manafort pleads guilty [slowguy] [ In reply to ]
Quote | Reply
JSA
Sep 15, 18 21:20
Post #53 of 58 (618 views)
slowguy wrote:
JSA wrote:
slowguy wrote:
JSA wrote:
slowguy wrote:

I don't think Mr. Mueller or his team have ever made claims about collusion, nor can I see how any end to this investigation is characterized as a "win" or a "loss" for the investigating team. Their job is to investigate and determine if crimes were committed, not to beat one side or the other.


Sure they did. It was specified in the order appointing Mueller as special counsel. In fact, it is core purpose of his investigation.

In his order appointing former FBI Director Robert S. Mueller III as special counsel, Rosenstein limited Mueller’s role to leading “the investigation confirmed by then-FBI Director James B. Comey in testimony before the House Permanent Select Committee on Intelligence on March 20, 2017, including …. any links and/or coordination between the Russian government and individuals associated with the campaign of President Donald Trump; and any matters that arose or may arise directly from the investigation; and any other matters within the scope of 28 C.F.R. § 600.4(a).” That last bit refers to a part of the federal code that says that the jurisdiction of a special counsel is to include “the authority to investigate and prosecute federal crimes committed in the course of, and with intent to interfere with, the Special Counsel’s investigation, such as perjury, obstruction of justice, destruction of evidence, and intimidation of witnesses.”


The order itself says: "... to ensure a full and thorough investigation of the Russian government's efforts to interfere in the 2016 presidential election ..."

https://www.justice.gov/...file/967231/download


Only in the LR would I fully expect for a licensed attorney to try to make the argument that the letter appointing Mr. Mueller as special counsel would constitute a claim made by the Mueller team.

Ridiculous.


You are fucking kidding me, right? The entire purpose of his appointment was to investigate collusion. From the get go, Mueller's team said they would investigate collusion. That was their mandate. That's what they said they were investigating. That's what they said they would find.

They found a lot of other stuff, but, no collusion.

You are absolutely beyond ridiculous. Seriously, you are out of depth on this one. Unreal.

Everyone in the LR knows to avoid you when you get in one of these moods. It's not worth engaging with a jackass who makes ludicrous statements, and then ignores reality as he tries to paint everyone else as the idiot. By definition, the letter written by Mr. Rosenstein appointing Mr. meuller as special counsel can not be considered to be a a claim made by the Mueller investigative team, since that team DID NOT EXIST when the letter was written. There is no logical or reasonable way to argue otherwise, but I'm sure you'll snap back as you try to backpedal or defend the indefensible. I'm not going to waste my weekend with your nonsense. Have fun.

What the fuck crawled up your ass? It is undisputed Mueller’s team was created to investigate collusion. I don’t think you know that and I think you are embarrassed having been confronted by this fact. I also posted an article citing the position Mueller and his team took after starting their investigation. They did not start from scratch. They had plenty of information and unsubstantiated claims supporting collusion. Given their mandate was to investigate collusion, it would be asinine for them to take any other position. Or do you think they started from scratch? Maybe that’s the problem - you don’t understand this process. That would explain your confusion and, perhaps, your embarrassment. Finally, the investigation is not yet complete and the team very well may still find collusion, you know, considering that’s what they were appointed to investigate and having spent in excess of $26M so far to do so.
If there are no dogs in Heaven, then when I die I want to go where they went. - Will Rogers

Emery's Third Coast Triathlon | Tri Wisconsin Triathlon Team | Push Endurance | GLWR
Quote Reply
Re: Manafort pleads guilty [slowguy] [ In reply to ]
Quote | Reply
JSA
Sep 15, 18 21:44
Post #54 of 58 (613 views)
Here you go:

On Monday morning, shortly after special counsel Robert Mueller announced the indictments of former Trump campaign officials Paul Manafort and Rick Gates, President Donald Trump tweeted, “There is NO COLLUSION!” But soon after that, Mueller’s office released a “statement of offense” outlining one major instance of when the Trump campaign tried to collude with Russia as the Kremlin was mounting a covert operation against the 2016 election to benefit Trump.

https://www.motherjones.com/...collude-with-russia/


Mueller and his team of prosecutors and investigators have an eye toward producing conclusions -- and possible indictments -- related to collusion by fall, said the person, who asked not to be identified. He’ll be able to turn his full attention to the issue as he resolves other questions, including deciding soon whether to find that Trump sought to obstruct justice.

https://www.bloomberg.com/...ollusion-allegations


Prosecutors say in their court filing that given their mandate to investigate links between Trump associates and Russia, it was appropriate to investigate Manafort for ties to Russia-backed politicians and oligarchs.

https://www.theguardian.com/...-investigation-scope


Then there is the Statement of Offense, which outlines the allegations of and investigation into collusion.

https://www.justice.gov/file/1007346/download
If there are no dogs in Heaven, then when I die I want to go where they went. - Will Rogers

Emery's Third Coast Triathlon | Tri Wisconsin Triathlon Team | Push Endurance | GLWR
Quote Reply
Re: Manafort pleads guilty [JSA] [ In reply to ]
Quote | Reply
eb
Sep 15, 18 22:00
Post #55 of 58 (607 views)
JSA wrote:


https://www.motherjones.com/...collude-with-russia/

JSA citing Mother Jones as a source of authority!

Best go to bed, bro - it's getting late.
Quote Reply
Re: Manafort pleads guilty [slowguy] [ In reply to ]
Quote | Reply
chaparral
Sep 15, 18 23:02
Post #56 of 58 (593 views)
slowguy wrote:
JSA wrote:
slowguy wrote:
JSA wrote:
slowguy wrote:

I don't think Mr. Mueller or his team have ever made claims about collusion, nor can I see how any end to this investigation is characterized as a "win" or a "loss" for the investigating team. Their job is to investigate and determine if crimes were committed, not to beat one side or the other.


Sure they did. It was specified in the order appointing Mueller as special counsel. In fact, it is core purpose of his investigation.

In his order appointing former FBI Director Robert S. Mueller III as special counsel, Rosenstein limited Mueller’s role to leading “the investigation confirmed by then-FBI Director James B. Comey in testimony before the House Permanent Select Committee on Intelligence on March 20, 2017, including …. any links and/or coordination between the Russian government and individuals associated with the campaign of President Donald Trump; and any matters that arose or may arise directly from the investigation; and any other matters within the scope of 28 C.F.R. § 600.4(a).” That last bit refers to a part of the federal code that says that the jurisdiction of a special counsel is to include “the authority to investigate and prosecute federal crimes committed in the course of, and with intent to interfere with, the Special Counsel’s investigation, such as perjury, obstruction of justice, destruction of evidence, and intimidation of witnesses.”


The order itself says: "... to ensure a full and thorough investigation of the Russian government's efforts to interfere in the 2016 presidential election ..."

https://www.justice.gov/...file/967231/download


Only in the LR would I fully expect for a licensed attorney to try to make the argument that the letter appointing Mr. Mueller as special counsel would constitute a claim made by the Mueller team.

Ridiculous.


You are fucking kidding me, right? The entire purpose of his appointment was to investigate collusion. From the get go, Mueller's team said they would investigate collusion. That was their mandate. That's what they said they were investigating. That's what they said they would find.

They found a lot of other stuff, but, no collusion.

You are absolutely beyond ridiculous. Seriously, you are out of depth on this one. Unreal.


Everyone in the LR knows to avoid you when you get in one of these moods. It's not worth engaging with a jackass who makes ludicrous statements, and then ignores reality as he tries to paint everyone else as the idiot. By definition, the letter written by Mr. Rosenstein appointing Mr. meuller as special counsel can not be considered to be a a claim made by the Mueller investigative team, since that team DID NOT EXIST when the letter was written. There is no logical or reasonable way to argue otherwise, but I'm sure you'll snap back as you try to backpedal or defend the indefensible. I'm not going to waste my weekend with your nonsense. Have fun.

Maybe JSA believes that Rosenstein is Mueller wearing a mask, because that would make his argument make sense.

I still can't decide if he does not understand why he is so wrong or if he made a mistake and just can't admit that he made a mistake.
Quote Reply
Re: Manafort pleads guilty [JSA] [ In reply to ]
Quote | Reply
jmh
Sep 16, 18 9:28
Post #57 of 58 (515 views)
Quote:
Finally, the investigation is not yet complete and the team very well may still find collusion, you know, considering that’s what they were appointed to investigate and having spent in excess of $26M so far to do so.

$26M spent. $46M forfeited by Manafort.

Seems as if Mueller is making the government money not spending it!
Suffer Well.
Quote Reply
Re: Manafort pleads guilty [jmh] [ In reply to ]
Quote | Reply
JSA
Sep 16, 18 9:29
Post #58 of 58 (511 views)
jmh wrote:
Quote:

Finally, the investigation is not yet complete and the team very well may still find collusion, you know, considering that’s what they were appointed to investigate and having spent in excess of $26M so far to do so.


$26M spent. $46M forfeited by Manafort.

Seems as if Mueller is making the government money not spending it!

WINNING! ;-p
If there are no dogs in Heaven, then when I die I want to go where they went. - Will Rogers

Emery's Third Coast Triathlon | Tri Wisconsin Triathlon Team | Push Endurance | GLWR
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