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nutrition brand choise
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Had some problems during two long courses, with my nutrition brand, sponser.ch


Nutrition plan seems to be ok, works perfect for 70.3, but with long distances have issuies, like gut problem, nausea, on the run. During 4th and 5th hours bike is always hard to push yourself to drink gels from the bottle.Bars doesn't change much.


Think that I need to change nutrition brand. That nutrition brand do you prefer and why? Than brands use most of the PRO's and why? Thanks in advance
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Re: nutrition brand choise [Evgen] [ In reply to ]
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It's more likely its the composition of what you're eating and drinking, rather than the brand.

Experiment when training as to what upsets you or doesn't.
Personally i find after a certain point that "real food" is better than gels, bars, energy drinks etc.

Last 100 mile TT i did, i filled 2 of my 3 bottles with nuun electrolyte tablets. My body didn't like it in 80 odd degree heat. I ended up grabbing a bottle of plain old water from a spectator (thanks!!) , which is what i've generally used before (with just a gel at each bottle swap), and that calmed my guts down.
Lessons learned :)
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Re: nutrition brand choise [philg] [ In reply to ]
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philg wrote:
It's more likely its the composition of what you're eating and drinking, rather than the brand.

Experiment when training as to what upsets you or doesn't.
Personally i find after a certain point that "real food" is better than gels, bars, energy drinks etc.

Last 100 mile TT i did, i filled 2 of my 3 bottles with nuun electrolyte tablets. My body didn't like it in 80 odd degree heat. I ended up grabbing a bottle of plain old water from a spectator (thanks!!) , which is what i've generally used before (with just a gel at each bottle swap), and that calmed my guts down.
Lessons learned :)
Good mention. I usually used two bottles of ISO, plus plain water, later on course. The combination of gels + ISO may have some troubles in it.
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Re: nutrition brand choise [Evgen] [ In reply to ]
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I use e-Fuel by Cranks Sports... I like that it's a water, gel, electrolyte thing all in one. I race mostly Olympic distance but I've got a crazy high sweat rate (~4.5lbs/hr) and it keeps me from crashing so hard when I get off the bike and hammer out the 10K.

I've had two previous things I used because they were "sponsors"... both gave me gut issues among other things. I gladly PAY for e-Fuel and recommend them without a poker in the fire so to speak.
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Re: nutrition brand choise [Evgen] [ In reply to ]
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Personally I take the view that there's not much to choose between the brands, and I go with whatever the on-course nutrition is. Figure the benefit of not having to plan and carry all my nutrition outweighs any benefit that one brand offers over another.

The key is getting the mix of solids, liquids and concentrations right. And that varies a lot depending on distance, weather and individual. On a hot day I need a lot more fluid than on a cool day, so either I need a more diluted concentration, or I need to drink bottles of straight water alongside the energy drink. On hot days I also find I have less tolerance for solids so prefer to get all my calories from liquid. Distance impacts me as well. 70.3 I don't need a lot of extra calories to get through the day, so can play it pretty safe and get through on 200-250/hour which is unlikely to cause GI issues. For IM I need to push the envelope and get the calories in at a higher rate, which leaves less room for error if I don't get the right amount of hydration in. I don't run well if I've taken solids within ~2 hours of running, so on 70.3 I tend not to eat anything solid. But IM is too long a day to go liquid only, so I'll use the first half of the bike to get some solids in.

I think the key things to figure out and practice are:
- Your calorie burn rate, which you can estimate reasonably accurately from a HRM/power meter that knows your zones, weight, etc
- Expected finish time for your distance/fitness
- Above 2 factors will enable you to estimate how many calories you need to take on during the race. As a starter for 10 assume you have 1500 cals of glycogen stores when you start the race, and you get 50% of your calories from fat. E.g. if you're burning 800 cals/hour and your expected finish time is 6 hours, then you need 4800 calories to get through the race, of which 2400 will come from fat and 1500 will come from pre-existing glycogen stores, leaving you 900 calories to take on. That's 150 cals/hour. There's some estimates in there and you don't want to finish with the tank completely empty, so up that to 250 cals/hour and you should be in the right ballpark. Do your own calculation, then practice and refine as necessary
- On top of the above, you need to get a good feel for how your sweat rate varies in different conditions, as that determines how much fluid you need to take on along with those calories. You can weigh yourself before and after training, pee colour and how much fluid it takes to fully rehydrate after training will also inform this. The more you're sweating, the more you need to think about replacing lost minerals either via drinks with electrolytes and/or salt stick
- Everything after that is personal preference - whether you prefer gels, liquids, solids, what flavours, etc
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Re: nutrition brand choise [Evgen] [ In reply to ]
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I use Infinit and Skratch Labs for drink mixes. Clif Bar Bloks and Skratch Energy chews for solid foods.

Make Inside Out Sports your next online tri shop! http://www.insideoutsports.com/
Last edited by: BryanD: Aug 21, 18 7:19
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Re: nutrition brand choise [Evgen] [ In reply to ]
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These posts are always a shot in the dark. You never knowcwhat intensity people are racing at.

Me - I’m a liquid-only person at 70.3 and 140.6 (5:30s and <13 @ 53/190+#). I use the same stuff (infinit) in training that I use on race day. I know what I can get across my system at (_____ HR). I hate all this crap (tri ‘nutrition’). Liquid is most palatable for Me.
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Re: nutrition brand choise [Evgen] [ In reply to ]
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If you live in the States, I work at Skratch Labs and could send you some samples to try. Just shoot an email to info@skratchlabs.com ATTN: Joy slowtwitch
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Re: nutrition brand choise [Evgen] [ In reply to ]
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For regular racing and training, however, I've switched to bars and gels. I'm always trying new brands and combos for solid food, but for gel I stick with Hammer. Just works for me. My reasoning for the switch is I just enjoy something solid to chew on for a long time in the saddle. Lately I'm using Rx bars, and they seem to work ok. The gels come out for the interval days and races.
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Re: nutrition brand choise [SkratchLabs] [ In reply to ]
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SkratchLabs wrote:
If you live in the States, I work at Skratch Labs and could send you some samples to try. Just shoot an email to info@skratchlabs.com ATTN: Joy slowtwitch
Thanks, but I am from Eastern Europe
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Re: nutrition brand choise [cartsman] [ In reply to ]
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cartsman wrote:
Personally I take the view that there's not much to choose between the brands, and I go with whatever the on-course nutrition is. Figure the benefit of not having to plan and carry all my nutrition outweighs any benefit that one brand offers over another.

The key is getting the mix of solids, liquids and concentrations right. And that varies a lot depending on distance, weather and individual. On a hot day I need a lot more fluid than on a cool day, so either I need a more diluted concentration, or I need to drink bottles of straight water alongside the energy drink. On hot days I also find I have less tolerance for solids so prefer to get all my calories from liquid. Distance impacts me as well. 70.3 I don't need a lot of extra calories to get through the day, so can play it pretty safe and get through on 200-250/hour which is unlikely to cause GI issues. For IM I need to push the envelope and get the calories in at a higher rate, which leaves less room for error if I don't get the right amount of hydration in. I don't run well if I've taken solids within ~2 hours of running, so on 70.3 I tend not to eat anything solid. But IM is too long a day to go liquid only, so I'll use the first half of the bike to get some solids in.

I think the key things to figure out and practice are:
- Your calorie burn rate, which you can estimate reasonably accurately from a HRM/power meter that knows your zones, weight, etc
- Expected finish time for your distance/fitness
- Above 2 factors will enable you to estimate how many calories you need to take on during the race. As a starter for 10 assume you have 1500 cals of glycogen stores when you start the race, and you get 50% of your calories from fat. E.g. if you're burning 800 cals/hour and your expected finish time is 6 hours, then you need 4800 calories to get through the race, of which 2400 will come from fat and 1500 will come from pre-existing glycogen stores, leaving you 900 calories to take on. That's 150 cals/hour. There's some estimates in there and you don't want to finish with the tank completely empty, so up that to 250 cals/hour and you should be in the right ballpark. Do your own calculation, then practice and refine as necessary
- On top of the above, you need to get a good feel for how your sweat rate varies in different conditions, as that determines how much fluid you need to take on along with those calories. You can weigh yourself before and after training, pee colour and how much fluid it takes to fully rehydrate after training will also inform this. The more you're sweating, the more you need to think about replacing lost minerals either via drinks with electrolytes and/or salt stick
- Everything after that is personal preference - whether you prefer gels, liquids, solids, what flavours, etc

seems like I need more than 400 cal/h for a 9.5 hours IM. That is the problem))))
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Re: nutrition brand choise [Evgen] [ In reply to ]
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That implies you're burning something north of 1100 calories/hour which seems unlikely unless you're unusually large for somebody that fast.
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Re: nutrition brand choise [cartsman] [ In reply to ]
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lookin to your calculation
800*9.5 = 7600
7600-1500= 6100
6100/2=3050

4.5 hours of bike and 3.2 hours of run = 7.7

3050/7.7 = 396cal/hour
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Re: nutrition brand choise [Evgen] [ In reply to ]
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Not quite - the 1500 glycogen cals you start off withare deducted from the carb total and not the overall total. So:

7600/2 = 3800
3800-1500 = 2300 cals of carbs that you need

Good point that you can't take on any calories while swimming, but if you're aiming for a 9.5 hour finish then swim time is going to be close to an hour, so you should still have >8 hours of time to take on nutrition, which works out at comfortably under 300 cals/hour.

Plus those are all estimates - burn rate varies by individual, as does fat burning rate, as does the amount of calories you can take on per hour, as does the amount of glycogen your body stores. And all are somewhat trainable. So take whatever data points you can (cal reading from your power meter/HRM, etc) to get you in the right ballpark, then practice and refine from there and be ready to adjust on the day if things aren't panning out as planned
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Re: nutrition brand choise [cartsman] [ In reply to ]
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cartsman wrote:
Not quite - the 1500 glycogen cals you start off withare deducted from the carb total and not the overall total. So:

7600/2 = 3800
3800-1500 = 2300 cals of carbs that you need

Good point that you can't take on any calories while swimming, but if you're aiming for a 9.5 hour finish then swim time is going to be close to an hour, so you should still have >8 hours of time to take on nutrition, which works out at comfortably under 300 cals/hour.

Plus those are all estimates - burn rate varies by individual, as does fat burning rate, as does the amount of calories you can take on per hour, as does the amount of glycogen your body stores. And all are somewhat trainable. So take whatever data points you can (cal reading from your power meter/HRM, etc) to get you in the right ballpark, then practice and refine from there and be ready to adjust on the day if things aren't panning out as planned

agree, thank you
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Re: nutrition brand choise [Evgen] [ In reply to ]
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Used sponser endurance cause I thought that extra protein would be benifitial but always left me with an upset gut.
Went to high five and don’t have any probs with that. Combine it with clif bar, powerbar wafers.
Gels which worked for me were high five,32gu,nutrixxion.

-shoki
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Re: nutrition brand choise [Evgen] [ In reply to ]
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I have tried the following:
High 5
32Gi
Gu Energy
Powerbar


High5...just no always had an upset stomach so dumped it....here in DK they have it a lot for on course nutrition (I was doing a lot of running) and I avoid it and bring my own

32gi..I really like Endure line, no stomach issues and the hydration tablets.I have tried NUUN and a few other brands and I always felt that they were a bit too acidic and the 32Gi just worked quite nicely.

Gu Energy...A few people on Slowtwitch recommended Roctane line and I really love it. It tastes good without being too sweet and I have not had any stomach issues. I have also tried the BCCA and Electrolyte tablets and they sit well with me. I like the fact you can buy them in single use (10 tablets if memory servers me right) and you can just stick them somewhere in your pocket or on the bike and you have your race nutrition set.

Powerbar..I have only tried their drink mix (which was pretty good) and there equivalent to GU chews (which I also like by the way) and they seem good too but I haven't used them on long training rides or long runs as of yet so the jury is still out but so far so good.

I hope that helps .

"see the world as it is not as you want it to be"
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