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tapering vs almost stopping
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So I have been reading about how long it takes to make gains from training. It looks like gains from endurance type workouts take weeks like 2-4 and speed type workouts take one to two. So I have a olympic race in two weeks and an IM in five. Yesterday I did my last workout that had any speedwork in it. In the last few months I did as much as I could without injuring myself. I have a few tendon strains that would benefit from some rest. I have got alot of stuff going on in the next month and not much time to train. Swim got neglected a bit in the last three weeks since a 5 k swim race. So I'd rather just mainly swim at noon outside in the sunshine. If major loss of fitness after the IM isn't a worry what is the harm of doing very little? I am figuring on mainly just working out when I feel like it and having fun for a while. I figure on the olympic being my A race for the season and it being a good hard workout prior to the IM.

this leads to the question if you are not looking beyond your last race of the season and it takes weeks to see the results of workouts and about three weeks to experience significant fitness loss what harm is there to doing very little for up to three weeks before the last race of the season?

They constantly try to escape from the darkness outside and within
Dreaming of systems so perfect that no one will need to be good T.S. Eliot

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Re: tapering vs almost stopping [len] [ In reply to ]
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I think it's safer to stick with a standard taper: reduction in volume but not intensity. Mild reduction in volume this week and larger reduction next week. Leave a little intensity in there (what you are calling speed work). Just do half as much as you would normally do. I always do a little the day before the race as well. The point is not to build more speed. It's to keep your body ready to go. You should feel like a god after that. I think it's risky to go to almost nothing for two weeks.
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Re: tapering vs almost stopping [len] [ In reply to ]
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Be interested in your sources of information. My understanding is that you get most of the fitness benefits from a workout in 1 week, not 2-4, and that you start losing fitness pretty much as soon as you stop training, not after 3 weeks. It can take up to 3 weeks to fully recover from a hard workout like a 20 mile run, which is why IM tapers are commonly 3 weeks, but that's not the same as saying you don't lose fitness if you don't train for 3 weeks. The purpose of the taper is to reduce the volume enough to make sure you're fresh on race day, while still doing enough to maintain the fitness you've gained.

If life and/or injury limits what you can do in the next 5 weeks, then I'm sure you'll have enough residual fitness to get through. But it's certainly not an optimal approach. Also, you shouldn't be dropping speed work this far out. It's the volume of training that needs to drop, not the intensity. E.g. if you halve your weekly running mileage during taper, you should also halve the amount of speed work you do, but still include it. As you say, fitness benefits from speed work kick in quicker, speed work is also great for maintaining good form/technique. You can include short bursts of speed work pretty much right up to race day.

Other thing to be wary of if you stop almost completely is that it's very easy to pile the pounds on.

I've gone into races where through circumstances not choice I've done very little training for 2-3 weeks beforehand, and it really didn't work well. Noticeable loss of fitness, and felt very sluggish. Certainly wouldn't want to do it for 5 weeks if there was a way to avoid it. Assuming the tendon strains are running related, maybe just cut the running down but still do some intensity on the bike to maintain fitness? Could do some cross trainer work instead of running if that is easier on the tendons. If you're time restricted then substitute some shorter sessions with more intensity instead.
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Re: tapering vs almost stopping [len] [ In reply to ]
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I wouldn't do it.
I have raced before after an almost complete halt in training for a few weeks due to necessity (work crisis in month prior to IM which eliminated virtually all of my training time). The race was not pleasant or fast. My bike split in particular was very, very slow. Maybe I was just having a bad day or stress (as opposed to training) had me fatigued but I think you need to keep training at a reduced level to maintain fitness and even to just maintain your feel for pacing and technique.
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Re: tapering vs almost stopping [Ai_1] [ In reply to ]
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Another for don't do it. I raced the Savannah marathon at the beginning of November in 2015. My daughter was born Oct 13. Suffice it to say, I did almost no running or anything for the last 2+ weeks and I felt horrible for the race. Actually was very close to turning off at the split and just doing the half (probably should have). Was a miserable day.
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Re: tapering vs almost stopping [len] [ In reply to ]
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I feel like you will get hurt doing that. Like the others have said, reduce your volume but keep some short intensity to stay primed. You're going to go into that A race expecting to be able to hammer it and I bet your body will say otherwise. But I'm not coach or physiologist so this is my objective observation.

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Re: tapering vs almost stopping [len] [ In reply to ]
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len wrote:
So I have been reading about how long it takes to make gains from training. It looks like gains from endurance type workouts take weeks like 2-4 and speed type workouts take one to two. So I have a olympic race in two weeks and an IM in five. Yesterday I did my last workout that had any speedwork in it. In the last few months I did as much as I could without injuring myself. I have a few tendon strains that would benefit from some rest. I have got alot of stuff going on in the next month and not much time to train. Swim got neglected a bit in the last three weeks since a 5 k swim race. So I'd rather just mainly swim at noon outside in the sunshine. If major loss of fitness after the IM isn't a worry what is the harm of doing very little? I am figuring on mainly just working out when I feel like it and having fun for a while. I figure on the olympic being my A race for the season and it being a good hard workout prior to the IM.

this leads to the question if you are not looking beyond your last race of the season and it takes weeks to see the results of workouts and about three weeks to experience significant fitness loss what harm is there to doing very little for up to three weeks before the last race of the season?

It seems your argument is that it takes weeks to see results. Ok let’s say that is true

Let me ask, how many days/weeks does it take YOU to become slower if you stop your speed work?
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Re: tapering vs almost stopping [len] [ In reply to ]
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I think this is a pretty individual thing. I find that I don't do well with much of a taper. I do better almost just training through with only a slight letup on raceweek. I did better in my B-race last year with only two light days, rather than my A-race with a "full taper". I have seen the same thing in training following a business trip or something where I can't train for a week. The first few days suck, but it comes back quick. Better for me to scale back, but keep it rolling.

So, I'd look at your training history, following similar "breaks" and make a decision from there.

Certainly a little injury recovery might be a good thing---maybe take a few days to a week off running NOW---then resume the week of the Oly just to get the feel back in the legs. Then, if it were me I'd keep the run and swim frequency up and scale back the volume. I'd keep my bike threshold work, and replace the long ride with some tempo riding.
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Re: tapering vs almost stopping [Tom_hampton] [ In reply to ]
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My best half was Puerto Rico. Four weeks before I couldn't run at all because I stubbornly kept running with an injury figuring it would get better during the taper. But up to that point I was training hard. I couldn't run at all until one week before the race. Biked and swam less to because biking and pushing off the pool wall hurt. I guess I am just getting tired of training. the mini break of the last three days has been helpful. I don't have enough history of consistant training to tell how long speedwork takes to wear off. I think I can put in half my usual volume just enjoying myself and not training will start to drive me crazy soon.

They constantly try to escape from the darkness outside and within
Dreaming of systems so perfect that no one will need to be good T.S. Eliot

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Re: tapering vs almost stopping [len] [ In reply to ]
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len wrote:
My best half was Puerto Rico. Four weeks before I couldn't run at all because I stubbornly kept running with an injury figuring it would get better during the taper. But up to that point I was training hard. I couldn't run at all until one week before the race. Biked and swam less to because biking and pushing off the pool wall hurt. I guess I am just getting tired of training. the mini break of the last three days has been helpful. ... I think I can put in half my usual volume just enjoying myself and not training will start to drive me crazy soon.

THAT, I believe, and fits with my own experiences...and it is a different question than the one you originally posed. Sure, cut it by half. When you run, just run...leave the tempo or speed work behind---that would just make your niggles worse. As I said, I'd keep the bike threshold/tempo work---good value per unit of time. Might even just do Tempo whenever I felt like getting on the bike---not as much "suffering" / mental-effort as threshold. And if everything else is cut in half...the residual fatigue shouldn't catch up with you.

You won't "lose" any fitness that way in a few weeks. As you say, you will probably regain some enthusiasm soon enough---long before you truly start to detrain. And a reduction in your injury status, may help with the mental side. Training through even niggling pain always requires a bit more "mental effort" for me.
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Re: tapering vs almost stopping [Tom_hampton] [ In reply to ]
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Tom_hampton wrote:
I'd keep the run and swim frequency up and scale back the volume. I'd keep my bike threshold work, and replace the long ride with some tempo riding.

Yeah, for longer tapers I've found the same, keep the frequency, some intensity but drop the volume.

For a marathon I'll start about 2 weeks out (tried 3 once, didn't go well) & 70.3's are generally one week.

The final lead up for any race I'll take Friday completely off & a have really short run on the Saturday (assuming race on Sunday)

I've come to find that the worse I feel on the Saturday run the better I'll be on the Sunday.
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Re: tapering vs almost stopping [len] [ In reply to ]
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Are you tapering for the Olympic event or for the IM event? I'd continue to train through the Olympic and then taper into the IM using the Oly as your last High Volume + High Intensity day. Then like others have said, reduce volume by 15-25% week over week leading into the IM event. Removing all intensity is never a smart idea and you should hit anaerobic zone at least once every 10 days to keep yourself sharp. Even if those efforts are short they still are helpful for keeping an acute sense of effort and pacing in my opinion. You could be different but you'll have to experiment to find out the particulars.

For me, I race Sprints and for my taper into my A Race I give myself 1 week where I am shedding all unnecessary volume but reducing my intensity by 30-40%. All of my tough Run/Bike intensity is done 4 days out and swim 2 days out as it's my weakest discipline. The day before I may do a few pickups and a few bike 30/30s but nothing over 20 minutes long.

------
"Train so you have no regrets @ the finish line"
Last edited by: PushThePace: Jul 17, 18 13:49
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