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EPAT Shockwave Treatment: Hamstring
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So I've been dealing with Hamstring issues for quite some time (18 Months), seen a few Doctors and have done a bunch of treatments, still dealing with the issue. I'm trying out a new Dr. which recommends EPAT. Looks interesting and seems like people on ST have had good success with it. Has anyone here had or know of anyone who's had EPAT on their hamstrings?

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=2h6JfCj4ORI
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Re: EPAT Shockwave Treatment: Hamstring [MikeM126] [ In reply to ]
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Not hamstrings, but on my Achille's Tendon with very good success - back running in three weeks a few years ago.

I currently have IMLP a week from today and am dealing with a Peroneal Tendon issue that started last weekend and getting EPAT - hoping and praying it gets me to race day so I can run. If it was today I'd only swim and bike.

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Re: EPAT Shockwave Treatment: Hamstring [MikeM126] [ In reply to ]
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Sounds like pseudo-scientific nonsense.

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"Go yell at an M&M"
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Re: EPAT Shockwave Treatment: Hamstring [klehner] [ In reply to ]
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I don't follow why you think that.. If that's the case wouldn't massages, Foam Rolling, etc also be nonsense? Not looking to argue, just want to get your opinion.

If EPAT does help destroy scar tissue, that would help with my flexibility, ROM, healing and eventual strength, so while I'm not an expert, it seems to make sense why it COULD work really well. Others on here have said it works "like magic" for other issues, such as PF.

Plus, at this point (almost 2 years), I'm ok with Pseudo-Science.
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Re: EPAT Shockwave Treatment: Hamstring [MikeM126] [ In reply to ]
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MikeM126 wrote:
I don't follow why you think that.. If that's the case wouldn't massages, Foam Rolling, etc also be nonsense? Not looking to argue, just want to get your opinion.

If EPAT does help destroy scar tissue, that would help with my flexibility, ROM, healing and eventual strength, so while I'm not an expert, it seems to make sense why it COULD work really well. Others on here have said it works "like magic" for other issues, such as PF.

Plus, at this point (almost 2 years), I'm ok with Pseudo-Science.

Is there any science behind this? Science, as in peer-reviewed studies that show effectiveness of this treatment? From what little I saw, there isn't much that is of any quality.

I'd think that, at this point, "others have said" would no longer carry much weight.

----------------------------------
"Go yell at an M&M"
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Re: EPAT Shockwave Treatment: Hamstring [MikeM126] [ In reply to ]
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I don't know if EPAT is pseudo-science, or just too new to have real conclusive studies done proving its effectiveness. I had several rounds of EPAT last year for a case of PTT (posterior tibial tendonitis), and it seemed to help. However, I was doing the EPAT in combination with several other things (new custom orthotics, rest, theraband exercises, to name a few) so I can't say what effect the EPAT had, if any. In the end, I don't really care, as all I cared about was getting past the injury as quickly as possible, not writing a clinical study isolating the effect of EPAT against the other treatments. If the effect of EPAT was purely psychological, that's all good too, as the impact of placebo effect should not be discounted. What I did care about with regard to EPAT was potential negative side-effects, and there didn't appear to be any (for me). Unlike PRP, where there can be significant short-term pain, swelling and downtime for possibly no gain, EPAT had no real side-effects for me (other than making me a little lighter in the wallet).
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Re: EPAT Shockwave Treatment: Hamstring [klehner] [ In reply to ]
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Ok got it. Yes, you're right--I couldn't find a lot of other reviews/studies, which is what led me to post here. There's this study, but, not on the hamstring: https://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pubmed/21406328
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Re: EPAT Shockwave Treatment: Hamstring [el gato] [ In reply to ]
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Thanks! That's encouraging to hear. I'm in the same situation as well, this would be in combination of other treatments/rehab, but, if it helps, it helps.
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Re: EPAT Shockwave Treatment: Hamstring [MikeM126] [ In reply to ]
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Not hamstring, but a combination of EPAT and ART got me past a raging case of plantar fasciitis a few years ago. I'd had it for about a year and I did EPAT as something of a final option, trying to get to the start line of an IM. But given I was trying multiple things in parallel, it's hard to say what role EPAT played.
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Re: EPAT Shockwave Treatment: Hamstring [mbwallis] [ In reply to ]
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I think that this is going to be the biggest challenge with trying to determine if EPAT is effective based on feedback from folks on a forum. By the time most folks get the point of wanting/needing something like EPAT, they're combining it with other treatments modalities in an attempt to get over something ASAP, so anecdotal feedback is going to need to be taken with a HUGE grain of salt.
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Re: EPAT Shockwave Treatment: Hamstring [el gato] [ In reply to ]
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el gato wrote:
...not writing a clinical study isolating the effect of EPAT against the other treatments...

...but that is kind of the point. You are the customer. They are the seller. The onus is on them to prove their product works. If they perform a rigorous clinical trial and get good results, then fantastic! It is a science based treatment. Ideally, other groups would then replicate those results.
On the other hand, if they rely only on anecdotal evidence and a vague mechanism for how it works, then it is pseudo-science. That is not to say it does not work, perhaps exactly how they claim, but that it is at best unproven, at worst a total scam.

There are a couple papers on pubmed about EPAT. Is it the same as ESWT? If so, there are a lot more on that.
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Re: EPAT Shockwave Treatment: Hamstring [natethomas] [ In reply to ]
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I had severe high hamstring tendinopathy after several small tears, years of abuse and imbalances,and failure to rehab properly leading up to the final injury for which MRI confirmed the new tear and severe tendinopathy. After consultation with my doc he prescribed time off and PT but I also did my own research and found out about shockwave therapy. Unfortunately it had only been approved for Achilles injury and I believe tennis elbow if my memory serves me correctly. Fortunately, I knew someone who had one of these in their office and received multiple treatments spanning 8 weeks. I was also in PT 2-3 days a week for 3 months and didn't run for 6 months or bike for 3 months.

I am convinced the EPAT was an integral part of getting my hamstring back to 95%. My PT was also using scraping type tools similar to Graston to stimulate healing. So I think it was the combined therapies that did the job.

I ran with high hamstring pain for 10 years. Couldn't sit in a chair for more than 10 minutes without getting up half of those years and driving was really tough. Yes I kept a tennis ball in the car. :) Now I rarely have anything more than a minor irritation once in a great while.
It was functional imbalance that led to or made worse the injury. Now that I am free of most of it I keep a routine of functional strength training and movement to ensure I do not repeat that cycle of injury.

So my advice would be to get the EPAT but also get the advice of a doc who knows what they are doing and get the MRI to confirm nature and degree of injury and take the guesswork out of the diagnosis.

Good luck to you.

Jim

Jim Lukanich
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Re: EPAT Shockwave Treatment: Hamstring [jlukanich] [ In reply to ]
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First round of EPAT done! This was done in combination with ART/massage and some light Graston during my appointment.

Initial thoughts, WOW... Dr asked me to do a basic stretch to see how it felt immediately afterwards, the hammy felt GREAT. No real pain in the stretch, like it normally would have felt. I've had other treatments done and never felt this good afterwards. The plan is to be aggressive, 2x/week + Stretching for first two weeks to eliminate the scar tissue, then more strengthening. Zero down time, wants me to keep active, running, etc. I'm hopeful this, in combination with others, will help get me back to 100%.
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