Zipp 1080 tubular tyre choice

Jul 1, 18 16:00

Post #1 of 16 (4202 views)

Hi Guys,

It's my first post on this forum. I'm a Dutch road cyclist specialized in time-trialling (top-20 Dutch TT elite nationals, planning on beating Dumoulin in the future, hehe)

I have had the chance to lay my hands on a very decent, 250$ second-hand Zipp 1080 tubular wheel, which I think, based on numerous hours spent studying aero data is the fastest front wheel out there (at low yaw/high speed) - even faster than the clincher. However, the wrong tyre can screw things up big time, I already experienced the huge importance of rim-tyre interactions.

Therefore, at the moment, I am faced with a very hard dilemma (which I seem not be able to answer by just googling):

- What is widest tub tyre that can be mounted on a Zipp 1080 rim without compromising its aerodynamics? I know that Zipp recommends 21 mm tyres, others say that the Zipp 1080 rim is quite 'forgiving'. If a 22c or 23c might not compromise its aerodynamics, tyre choice would be greatly expanded.
- Considering the fact that this wheel will be run at >30 MPH most of the time, would you choose a rather low-drag or low-Crr front tyre? I know that aerodynamics are very important for a front wheel, but I doubt that there is any low-drag tyre capable of keeping up with the low Crr values of a Vittoria Corsa Speed, which appears to be not that bad in terms of aerodynamics at all.

At the moment, I am leaning towards a choice between these tubulars:
23c Vittoria CS vs. 22c Conti GP4000S vs. 21c Zipp Tangente Speed in that order.

Which one would you pick? Any alternatives? And why? Any experiences?

Any input would be greatly appreciated. Thanks folks.

Re: Zipp 1080 tubular tyre choice [Pierre92] [ In reply to ]

Jul 1, 18 19:42

Post #2 of 16 (4162 views)

Did you get the hub recall done on that wheel? I bought a 900 Zipp disc and 808 dimpled tubular set, grumbly bearings. But with the recall got the hub, spokes re-done, tuned up at n/c & man it's a sweet wheel now.

I would not run anything but the tire (ebay link) on that wheel. I am currently using a 22 mm tire, but this 21 is cheap. All other tires ie those you listed, would be barbaric.

<https://www.ebay.com/...2:g:0CIAAOSwqfZabjqY

Training Tweets: https://twitter.com/Jagersport_com
FM Sports: http://fluidmotionsports.com

Re: Zipp 1080 tubular tyre choice [Pierre92] [ In reply to ]

Jul 1, 18 19:52

Post #3 of 16 (4155 views)

I've been running the 23c Vittoria CS tubular for asphalt-surface track racing (very often > 30MPH) , and it's been great. Prior to that I ran the 23c Tangente Speed. And with no particular evidence other than some vague feeling of preference, I like the Vittorias. But maybe that's just because I'm having a better year this year than last year.

Re: Zipp 1080 tubular tyre choice [SharkFM] [ In reply to ]

Jul 1, 18 22:07

Post #4 of 16 (4124 views)

SharkFM wrote:

Did you get the hub recall done on that wheel? I bought a 900 Zipp disc and 808 dimpled tubular set, grumbly bearings. But with the recall got the hub, spokes re-done, tuned up at n/c & man it's a sweet wheel now.

I would not run anything but the tire (ebay link) on that wheel. I am currently using a 22 mm tire, but this 21 is cheap. All other tires ie those you listed, would be barbaric.

<https://www.ebay.com/...2:g:0CIAAOSwqfZabjqY

The Vittoria Triathlon tubulars have butyl tubes, I would not ride anything other than a latex tube for racing. Can't advise which tyre would be best for the 1080 but it wouldn't be butyl.

Re: Zipp 1080 tubular tyre choice [Pierre92] [ In reply to ]

Jul 1, 18 23:51

Post #5 of 16 (4105 views)

To confuse you even more....the width labeled is not always measured. The safest bet is get some and try (unglued) what blends best by sight.
Like others have said....i always go the latex route, so I know there are 24/26 only but I’ll throw Specialized sworks Turbo allround in the ring. I use veloflex (the carbon matched perfect the fc404 in 23), although I know they didn’t test fastest.
Other than that.....check if the wheel got the recall done.

-shoki

Last edited by: shoki: Jul 1, 18 23:52

Re: Zipp 1080 tubular tyre choice [SharkFM] [ In reply to ]

Jul 2, 18 2:37

Post #6 of 16 (4077 views)

What exactly do you mean by 'barbaric'?

Re: Zipp 1080 tubular tyre choice [trail] [ In reply to ]

Jul 2, 18 2:40

Post #7 of 16 (4077 views)

trail wrote:

I've been running the 23c Vittoria CS tubular for asphalt-surface track racing (very often > 30MPH) , and it's been great. Prior to that I ran the 23c Tangente Speed. And with no particular evidence other than some vague feeling of preference, I like the Vittorias. But maybe that's just because I'm having a better year this year than last year.

Will a 23c CS exceed the rim width at the brake track? Would you mind sending me some close-up pictures of this set-up, from the side and front? Would be very, very much appreciated.

Thanks anyways for your response.

Re: Zipp 1080 tubular tyre choice [Pierre92] [ In reply to ]

Jul 2, 18 10:11

Post #8 of 16 (4039 views)

I call these wheels carbon frisbees. They are light, hollow and certainly feel fragile although they are probably tougher than I think.

So pairing them with a supple race-day type tyre makes sense.

To address the butyl comment, a tire/tube combo is a sum of its parts. If the tire is thin adding a little material by way of a butyl tube still will be less total bulk than a Corsa or Zipp T tyre. I use those for the rear wheel, where I can't feel it so much.

The butyl tube makes them very reliable and hell they hold pressure, which is nice because I'm lazy. And nobody knows what (great) tires these are, so the price is really low!

There is an overhang with the 22 mm tire for sure. A thinner tire would be more flush but I Iike 22's and 23 on the rear.

Training Tweets: https://twitter.com/Jagersport_com
FM Sports: http://fluidmotionsports.com

Re: Zipp 1080 tubular tyre choice [Pierre92] [ In reply to ]

Jul 2, 18 12:18

Post #9 of 16 (4014 views)

Pierre92 wrote:

Will a 23c CS exceed the rim width at the brake track? Would you mind sending me some close-up pictures of this set-up, from the side and front? Would be very, very much appreciated.

To be clear, I'm running them on a Firecrest 808. And they're slightly bulbous in profile on that rim, so I imagine that on a 1080 they'd almost certainly exceed the brake track width.

I can send the Firecrest pictures tonight.

Re: Zipp 1080 tubular tyre choice [trail] [ In reply to ]

Jul 2, 18 12:46

Post #10 of 16 (4003 views)

trail wrote:

Pierre92 wrote:

Will a 23c CS exceed the rim width at the brake track? Would you mind sending me some close-up pictures of this set-up, from the side and front? Would be very, very much appreciated.

To be clear, I'm running them on a Firecrest 808. And they're slightly bulbous in profile on that rim, so I imagine that on a 1080 they'd almost certainly exceed the brake track width.

I can send the Firecrest pictures tonight.

Thanks a lot.

Re: Zipp 1080 tubular tyre choice [Pierre92] [ In reply to ]

Jul 2, 18 14:04

Post #11 of 16 (3985 views)

Elite national podium level performance?

These...

https://www.vittoria.com/us/pista-evo-cs-track.html

the previous best tire for those wheels (and the HED 3) was the Vittoria corsa TT, which was basically a re-labeled version of the track tire.

Probably goes without saying in this application, these are race day only tires, and you probably want to have something else glued up for when you get to the event and find out there's a kilometer long section of gravel in the middle of the course.

Tech writer/support on this here site. FIST school instructor and certified bike fitter. Formerly at Diamondback Bikes, LeMond Fitness, FSA, TiCycles, etc.
Coaching and bike fit - http://source-e.net/ Cyclocross blog - https://crosssports.net/ BJJ instruction - https://ballardbjj.com/

Re: Zipp 1080 tubular tyre choice [fredly] [ In reply to ]

Jul 2, 18 15:22

Post #12 of 16 (3970 views)

fredly wrote:

Elite national podium level performance?

These...

https://www.vittoria.com/us/pista-evo-cs-track.html

the previous best tire for those wheels (and the HED 3) was the Vittoria corsa TT, which was basically a re-labeled version of the track tire.

Probably goes without saying in this application, these are race day only tires, and you probably want to have something else glued up for when you get to the event and find out there's a kilometer long section of gravel in the middle of the course.

Top-20, like I said. ;) Next year top-10 might be doable.

Are you serious about running this tyre? I mean, it's a track tub. How does its puncture resistance compare to say, the corsa speed?

Btw, this year, we had a cobbled section in the nationals of about half a mile...

Re: Zipp 1080 tubular tyre choice [Pierre92] [ In reply to ]

Jul 2, 18 16:08

Post #13 of 16 (3950 views)

Corsa speed is no great shakes, puncture resistance wise :)

It all comes down to the course, and one's level of risk aversion. There's an old motorsport maxim, which is that the perfect race car/motorcycle has just enough structural integrity to make it through the event; if it doesn't fall apart immediately upon crossing the finish line, it's over built and could have been faster. Essentially all F1 cars operate right on this tipping point.

If you can find one, the old Corsa TT in 21 is the tire you want. I still have a couple of them (and a couple of 19s for my H3) but I'm not parting with them!

I'd never suggest a tire like this to a Triathlete, but for someone who (even half joking...) talks about beating Dumoulin? Should at least be in the conversation. Fwiw, the real benefit of clincher tires for TTing, IMO is that you can show up to a race with a tire equivalent to this, and then swap it out when you realize it's way too light for the course conditions.

At this level, something you might also consider is re-tubing one of the narrower conti tubulars with a latex tube, if you can't get your hands on one of the pro-only latex tube versions.

Tech writer/support on this here site. FIST school instructor and certified bike fitter. Formerly at Diamondback Bikes, LeMond Fitness, FSA, TiCycles, etc.
Coaching and bike fit - http://source-e.net/ Cyclocross blog - https://crosssports.net/ BJJ instruction - https://ballardbjj.com/

Re: Zipp 1080 tubular tyre choice [Pierre92] [ In reply to ]

Jul 2, 18 21:00

Post #14 of 16 (3904 views)

I swear my tires don't look this dirty in person. The lighting must have made it look worse.

In this case the Firecrest "bulge" is definitely a bit wider than the tire. It works pretty neatly with Firecrest, which, of course was designed for 23mm tires.

Last edited by: trail: Jul 2, 18 21:01

Re: Zipp 1080 tubular tyre choice [fredly] [ In reply to ]

Jul 3, 18 1:59

Post #15 of 16 (3851 views)

Thanks guys for the replies.

So far I've seen multipe suggestions. For now I will consider:

Tangente Speed 21c
GP4000SII 22c
Vittoria Corsa Speed 23c

I will see how the CS looks on the rim. If it is too wide, I will make a choice between the other two. The Vittoria TT and Pista are no options due to low availibility and puncture proneness. At a certain point, a tyre is not a tyre anymore, at least not on the roads. It must have SOME decency.

Re: Zipp 1080 tubular tyre choice [Pierre92] [ In reply to ]

Jul 2, 20 13:30

Post #16 of 16 (2048 views)

What tire did you end up using with the 1080 and which one would you recommend? Cheers

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