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Re: Korean War ending? [SH] [ In reply to ]
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SH wrote:
trail wrote:
oldandslow wrote:


Sorry, not that simple. Look up Nordpolitik and Sunshine Policy. There was enormous potential and progress on reducing tensions, pretty much scuttled by the Iraq War and the "axis of evil" blather, which was supported by an enormous number of people who post here regularly. It's great if we have finally gotten past that unfortunate military and diplomatic cul-de-sac, at least on the Korean Peninsula.


W.r.t "axis of evil" we have to remember that amongst all the rosy photo ops and good press, that Kim Jong Un is an absolute brutal, evil piece of shit. Forget the death camps, etc. He (reportedly) put his uncle and closest aids in a pen with 120 starved dogs, and they were torn to bits and eaten. And of course poisoned his mostly innocuous half-brother to death.

I'm not going to play the "OMG Pompeo shook his hand!" game. But it must be hard to put on the sorority-girl fake-happy face and negotiate with this guy like he's a legitimate leader.

We have to remember that every action of his is purely motivated by self-preservation. I think it's insane to think he'll ever give up his nuclear weapons without having them forcibly removed from his grubby little hands. He saw what happened to Gaddafi when Gaddafi gave up his nukes. He's spent decades building up the strongest negotiating position he's ever had. He's not going to suddenly give it all away for free.

I'm thinking 95/5 odds that Kim Jong Un is purely making a propaganda play. It's 100% show.


Propaganda for what? He owns all the propaganda within his own country that he'll ever need.

I think Mr Jong Un was read the riot act by the Chinese during his trip there (if not before). I would expect attempts at weaseling, but I'd think that there are cards the other side(s) can play in that case as well. If there weren't any such cards, Kim Jong Un wouldn't be glad-handing his goto scapegoats today.

+1
It's not coincidence that this happens a month after Kim visited Jinping. Even DonBoy credits Xi for this: http://www.businessinsider.com/...se-xi-jinping-2018-4
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Re: Korean War ending? [oldandslow] [ In reply to ]
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Whether it's because of him or in spite of him will not matter. If this happened on his watch then he will and should get credit.

oldandslow wrote:
Thanks, Donald!

They had been making real progress toward more normalized relations during the "Sunshine Policy" until the lead-up to Iraq War and "axis of evil" policy helped undercut efforts (along with several other factors). Looks like "Sunshine Policy - Part 2". Even better than "Infinity War"!!
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Re: Korean War ending? [axlsix3] [ In reply to ]
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axlsix3 wrote:
Whether it's because of him or in spite of him will not matter. If this happened on his watch then he will and should get credit.

Happens. Nothing has happened yet except sweet, sweet pillow talk. We'll know in months/years. We'll know when UN/US inspectors are allowed full access anywhere in the NK on the agreed-upon schedule.

Not like they were expelled in 2002.

Or 2008.

Or 2009.

Or 1992.

Etc.

So let's pause the circle-jerk and not start passing out the Nobel Prizes just yet, Obama-style.
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Re: Korean War ending? [trail] [ In reply to ]
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Oh I completely agree with you - let's see how it's going to play out. And I believe the words you're looking for is golden shower, not circle jerk.

trail wrote:
axlsix3 wrote:
Whether it's because of him or in spite of him will not matter. If this happened on his watch then he will and should get credit.


Happens. Nothing has happened yet except sweet, sweet pillow talk. We'll know in months/years. We'll know when UN/US inspectors are allowed full access anywhere in the NK on the agreed-upon schedule.

Not like they were expelled in 2002.

Or 2008.

Or 2009.

Or 1992.

Etc.

So let's pause the circle-jerk and not start passing out the Nobel Prizes just yet, Obama-style.
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Re: Korean War ending? [oldandslow] [ In reply to ]
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Full disclosure, I really can not stand Trump, but he needs to get credit if he really did have an influence on this.

After listening to half of the Fox & Friends interview I just can not understand how this guy can even function. He has the rantings of everybody's crazy old uncle. Sometimes I wonder if that is all just an act and then behind closed doors he pulls it together and is an excellent communicator with well thought out ideas. But after that F&F interview I really do not think that is the case.

So what is really going on here? There's a meeting it the Oval Office where Trump goes on the rambling tirades and then some competent staffer runs off an does the best he/she can to get things moving? Or is this Mike Pence? I thought Trump offered Kasich the VP position and told him he would be the most powerful VP ever; when asked what Trump would be doing the response was "he would be making America Great Again". Admittedly I could have the story a bit wrong.

I guess my big question is how can this guy who seems to have the attention span of a gold fish, the vocabulary of a 3rd grader and the emotional stability of a 2 year old fall ass backwards into being instrumental in ending the Korean War?
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Re: Korean War ending? [axlsix3] [ In reply to ]
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axlsix3 wrote:
Oh I completely agree with you - let's see how it's going to play out. And I believe the words you're looking for is golden shower, not circle jerk.

trail wrote:
axlsix3 wrote:
Whether it's because of him or in spite of him will not matter. If this happened on his watch then he will and should get credit.


Happens. Nothing has happened yet except sweet, sweet pillow talk. We'll know in months/years. We'll know when UN/US inspectors are allowed full access anywhere in the NK on the agreed-upon schedule.

Not like they were expelled in 2002.

Or 2008.

Or 2009.

Or 1992.

Etc.

So let's pause the circle-jerk and not start passing out the Nobel Prizes just yet, Obama-style.


I'm just wondering how long it's going to be before some federal judge in Hawaii orders the Korean War must continue. ;-)


(Disclosure: I lifted that joke from someone else)

"Politics is just show business for ugly people."
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