You're going to run an event that's longer and harder than a marathon 2 weeks before an Ironman,

I don't see any downsides. Have at 'er.

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Swimming Workout of the Day:

Favourite Swim Sets:

2020 National Masters Champion - M50-54 - 50m Butterfly

Yep. That's what I thought too...lol...

I need a pint of what you have been drinking today!! :-)

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Graham Wilson
USAT Level III Elite Coach
http://www.thewilsongroup.biz

Just high-octane stress, brother. I tend to a 1:1 exercise to stress ratio...hah!

What's your goal for FL, finish or KQ? If you just want to have a good time and finish, go for it, knowing that it will affect your IM. Life is too short to follow all of the rules and guidelines, sometimes we have to do stuff because it's fun, reckless and stupid!

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Terrible Tuesday’s Triathlon

Oscaro- I agree with the occasional joyful recklessness approach. This'll be IM #10, so I've got a pretty good gage as to training, pre-race prep, recovery, and how it all fits together for IM results. I'm at the top of my age group this year, so a KQ is unlikely, especially given the speedsters that frequently show up at IMFL. And this is the 20th anniversary, so it could be a IMFL Hall of Fame race, who knows? I'm one of those guys that long tapers don't really work for-I've done better with higher (relative ) volume up to 2 weeks out, then a 50% (2 wks out) and 25% (1 week out) reduction in volume and increase in speed the last 2 weeks. And I've found that doing the Galloway dramatically reduces the stress and recovery for distance running. Still, most of what I know about training suggests this might not be the best idea...

Oh it is definitely not the best idea, the question is how much that matters. I have a full distance race in august and am planning a 5 day 2000km ride a week before. While it will obviously make me slower during the tri, I will also have a bunch of fun and do what I love which is training, racing and being out in nature.
I guess you will have to weigh your options, having the best IM you can, or just have 2 awesome races.

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Terrible Tuesday’s Triathlon

I gotta admit, I like that kind of thinking! Next year, I age up, be the kid in the new AG, and it'll all be directed to KQ and doing very very well on the day. This year, I'm just digging getting back into distance training after deploying last year, and I'm thinking of just indulging myself with pushing limits again....

Paraphrasing Oscar Wilde: "Anything less than more simply isn't enough." Great quote, potentially explosively bad idea. :-)

Good luck on your ride and race brother!

For me it'd depend on how your training has gone, especially the run. I'm pushing 70 miles a week (but no bike/swim) and could go out and do a 50k (especially if it's a relatively tame course) on a moments notice without suffering too many ill effects beyond a few days. On the other hand, when I was doing IM training my long run weeks were barely 40 miles and a 50k would have been a disaster.

No one on this planet cares about your finish times other than YOU. When you die, your kids will throw all your finisher crap in the garbage when they clean your house out. Seriously if you want to do the double, then why not. Your IM time will be 10, 15, 30, 60 min slower, but who cares. I had done two IM's 3, 4 and 5 weeks apart multiple times. I have also done "A" half IM's 2 weeks after an IM or A IM's 2 weeks after a full gas half IM and honestly it never really made a difference for ME because that's what I WANTED TO DO. The number on the results sheet is kind of meaningless. You can't quantify a race experience or a season long experience by what is printed beside your name (even though others may judge you by that). You gotta enjoy it. It's like two people having MBA beside there name or MSc. Once guy may have hated his MBA program and just likes having letters beside his name. The other guy did the program to learn and have a fun life experience. A recruiter picks up both resumes and judges both the same way just by the letters beside the name, but to the person taking the journey they mean totally different things. You have to decide which person you are and then roll with what YOU value, not what others value.

I THINK you value doing the double, so just go and do because that is WHAT YOU WANT TO DO....don't live by the measuring stick of others.

It's only a 31 miles. Go for it, what do you have to lose?

Lot of good advice, much appreciated from all. Gotta give full weight to training considerations, as that will affect injury tendencies. But the really interesting part of the feedback was how STers were getting down to something that I think the push for times in tri has obscured a bit- that is, that we do this for fun, for personal exploration, to see what we can do....those same impulses that led most of us to do this stuff in the first place.

Thanks for helping with the clarity!

Yeah, what will give you personal achievement: IM fast time only, or the double with the 50K trail run + IM (perhaps 15-60 min slower but maybe not). Maybe that "going into the unknown" of the last 13 miles of the IM have 31 miles of trail run + 13 miles of IM first half in your legs is that "unknown" challenge that will make you tick, just like the first IM where you really don't know what the last 2-3 hours will be like.

In between races, just do a lot of short rides and runs and add 4x15-20 min jogging between Fri after the trail race and Thu of IM week, just so your legs don't get detrained for eccentric loading. Who knows.....maybe by running only 31 miles + 1 hour (so let's call it 38 miles) in the last 2 weeks before an IM ends up being a better taper than running 45 miles in those last 2 weeks that are more loaded closer to race day. I'm not saying by any means that this is the perfect taper, but you just never know how close you get to your perfect IM time. My guess is that you end up only 15 min off provided that your aggregate mileage from 20-17 weeks out was in the 6-8 hour per week range. If you're a 3- hour per week runner, then OK, you're likely playing with fire, but that's still OK if that is what you want.

And if you are looking at the 50k as a "just finish," do more walking than maybe you would normally do so your legs don't get as trashed. Use it as a long day on your feet fine tuning your nutrition. Either way, I'm in the camp of enjoying YOUR journey. Best of luck

Do it. I agree with others that say do it. Ironman is not the be all end all. Two weeks ago, on my birthday, I felt like running a 50k on my birthday, (actually tried running my age but didn't make it). My average milage was around 25 miles a week, low. My only real distance was the 70.3 race I did 4 days earlier. I also have a mental block running 26.2 miles so 31.1 was ridiculous. Nothing made sense about it but that made it more exciting. I left work at 1130 and was running by noon. I kept it in zone 2 and walked a little the last couple miles. I was recovered within a week. It was a great experience and I highly recommend you do it if it's something you want to do.

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http://www.sfuelsgolonger.com

If you are going to do I would run half and walk half. It would be good mental prep for what is going to happen in the IM 2 weeks later. But seriously the biggest downside I think would be the pounding the legs take from running that far so best to walk at least half.

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They constantly try to escape from the darkness outside and within
Dreaming of systems so perfect that no one will need to be good T.S. Eliot