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Is there ever a place for "convenience" nutrition for a workout?
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For quite a while I didn't eat great. Pretty much what I wanted. It must have been barely less than my riding output, as the weight slowly but surely went down.

Now, I've tried to eat better. Fewer trips to the local greasy taco joint for lunch, no Wendy's for lunch, not downing 4 beers a couple times a week, etc... Instead salads, leftovers, a little red wine here/there, better choices. Still a splurge when appropriate.

However, as the power has gone up and the weight gone down, some of the workouts seem to really deplete me now.

I started doing 2x20 workouts to prep for TT racing. It's creating a deficit.

It's convenient for me to do these workouts at a time before lunch time. I could maybe eat a bigger breakfast.

But, is it ever a consideration for "convenience" nutrition for harder workouts? I'm talking taking a gel for a 60-90min workout. I'm starting to get close to 900 calories in an hour on the bike for some of these workouts. I know there's people here doing much more than that for longer. It's just that this is what I'm experiencing now.

I don't want to increase my overall diet necessarily to cover that just to have to cut it out again. I don't want to "yo-yo" eat to cover this stuff. I'm just a lowly am-bike racer guy.

It seems I could take one SiS at almost 400KJ for one of those workouts.

When eating a little better, 900 calories isn't a trivial amount to make up for.

I admit ignorance on this one. I've read some things violently opposing alternative nutrition for anything under 60 to 90 minutes and advocating whole foods, etc. I'm just not used to having to replace that much energy this often. People eat heavy before 1/2 marathons or something, I feel I'm going to have to for workouts on the bike.

Thanks.
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Re: Is there ever a place for "convenience" nutrition for a workout? [burnthesheep] [ In reply to ]
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Are you saying that you ingest 900 calories while riding your bike for an hour?
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Re: Is there ever a place for "convenience" nutrition for a workout? [burnthesheep] [ In reply to ]
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When trying to lose weight it's a good idea to not ingest calories on 60-90 minute rides. But if you're doing intervals it's better to ingest calories and get a high quality workout, after all no one in the history of cycling or triathlon has ever had a high enough FTP. EVER.

At some point if your training volume is high enough it's hard to maintain weight. At other points you may have to scale back eating to maintain weight.

It may be a good idea to have some caffeine (coffee/tea black no calories) prior to working out in the morning on your aerobic stuff then knock that out. Keep it aerobic though. Has been shown to burn a higher % fat as a substrate for that workout. On the other hand if you're biting the heads off your riding partners, maybe something before heading out the door is a good idea.

I'm of the mind that if ~ 80-85% of your diet is solid and you need some calories junk calories aren't necessarily a bad thing. You come in from a 3400 kJ ride where you've ingested 700 calories a coke > a beet. Have the coke walking in the door and the beet when you sit down to refuel. Quick calories now, real food after a shower.

Brian Stover USAT LII
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Last edited by: desert dude: Mar 14, 18 13:10
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Re: Is there ever a place for "convenience" nutrition for a workout? [jimatbeyond] [ In reply to ]
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jimatbeyond wrote:
Are you saying that you ingest 900 calories while riding your bike for an hour?

Lol! No. That sounds like a fun challenge though.

Good to hear on the most recent response there.

I’m happy on weight now and would prefer it to hold on or reduce the rate it is going down.
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Re: Is there ever a place for "convenience" nutrition for a workout? [burnthesheep] [ In reply to ]
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Eat a banana it's a better option
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Re: Is there ever a place for "convenience" nutrition for a workout? [burnthesheep] [ In reply to ]
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burnthesheep wrote:
jimatbeyond wrote:
Are you saying that you ingest 900 calories while riding your bike for an hour?


Lol! No. That sounds like a fun challenge though.

Good to hear on the most recent response there.

I’m happy on weight now and would prefer it to hold on or reduce the rate it is going down.


that's what I understood too from what you said - what does this mean?
burnthesheep wrote:
"I'm starting to get close to 900 calories in an hour on the bike for some of these workouts"

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Are you ready to do an Ultraman? | How I calculate Ironman race fueling | Strength Training for Athletes |
Last edited by: robgray: Mar 14, 18 16:02
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Re: Is there ever a place for "convenience" nutrition for a workout? [robgray] [ In reply to ]
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The kj on the power meter per hour equates to about that many calories an hour burned. I was at about 800kj/hr today. Nothing stellar, but as the kj/hr has gone up I’ve run into this nutrition thing.

When I was around 600 kj an hour it wasn’t an issue.

Sounds like a minor adjustment like a banana even may get it. Or waking up on time to eat a solid breakfast instead of a smaller out the door one.

I only asked now because it’s never happened till now.
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Re: Is there ever a place for "convenience" nutrition for a workout? [burnthesheep] [ In reply to ]
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Ah got it. That's how much you're burning, not eating. Otherwise we'd recommend you for competitive eating competitions!

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Are you ready to do an Ultraman? | How I calculate Ironman race fueling | Strength Training for Athletes |
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Re: Is there ever a place for "convenience" nutrition for a workout? [burnthesheep] [ In reply to ]
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I used to do a lot of five to six hour bike rides with a banana, peanut butter and jelly sandwich, and two bottles of water.
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Re: Is there ever a place for "convenience" nutrition for a workout? [jimatbeyond] [ In reply to ]
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These workouts aren’t burning fuel in that power zone. These are 2x20’s at hour power or 3x12 under overs.

Maybe not enough carbs for this kind of work.

I feel totally fine just cruising for a few hours on the road.
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Re: Is there ever a place for "convenience" nutrition for a workout? [burnthesheep] [ In reply to ]
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I used to average around 23 to 24 miles per hour on those rides. Definitely not cruising.
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Re: Is there ever a place for "convenience" nutrition for a workout? [burnthesheep] [ In reply to ]
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burnthesheep wrote:
These workouts aren’t burning fuel in that power zone. These are 2x20’s at hour power or 3x12 under overs.

Maybe not enough carbs for this kind of work.

I feel totally fine just cruising for a few hours on the road.

As my training load increases I need more food.

Generally I’ll grab a scone/muffin on the days I need it until I’m needing it pretty much every day. At that point I’ll drop the scone/muffin and make breakfast/lunch a bit bigger.

I’ll go through that loop a few times in each build.

High intensity days tend to be the first to need extra fuel.
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Re: Is there ever a place for "convenience" nutrition for a workout? [burnthesheep] [ In reply to ]
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There's 2 aspects to consider.

First is fuelling a workout and this basically means having enough carbs to get through the workout without bonking. Broadly speaking the higher the intensity, the greater the percentage of the calories you're burning come from carbs. A gentle run is fuelled mostly from fat reserves and so you don't need a lot of carbs - I can do a 90 minute run at easy pace first thing in the morning on an empty stomach, no problem. Cycling at sweet spot or FTP intensity is burning a good amount of carbs - for a 1 hour effort I can do quite a bit of work around 90-100% of FTP on an empty stomach, but if I'm going longer than that I'd likely get some extra calories in either before or during the workout. Intervals where you're going above FTP burn through the carbs pretty quickly. I wouldn't normally do any meaningful high intensity intervals without having fuelled before or during the workout.
Second is your overall calorie deficit and your ability to recover. It's generally advised if you're trying to lose weight to run a calorie deficit of 500-1000 calories per day, which equates to 1-2 pounds of weight loss per week. If you're running a deficit bigger than this then your energy levels throughout the day, and particularly in workouts, are likely to suffer, and your body may well not be getting the nutrients it needs to recover properly and get stronger.

If you're struggling on longer and more intense workouts but otherwise your energy levels are OK, then you probably just need some extra workout fuel either before or during. Gels are fine, though personally I'd rather snack on something cheaper and less sweet, like a banana or some trail mix. If I'm going for the sugary route then a bag of Haribo or similar gives more calories for the $ than a gel, and tastes better to boot!
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Re: Is there ever a place for "convenience" nutrition for a workout? [burnthesheep] [ In reply to ]
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The advice on this has all been good. As someone who doesn't eat as well as I should I'll also add that removing the processed food from your diet creates a short-term craving for the fats and sugar density they use so much of.

I'm not much of a fast-food guy, but holiday photos of me often have a cookie in one hand and a beer in the other. Super Bowl is my mile marker to clean up my diet and that first month is tough to cut the cord on the sweets and mid-week beers, but once I'm past the initial cravings I do much better to avoid the treats and sweets. I've also found that a high-carb breakfast ( bagels are the worst) leaves me feeling hungry by mid-morning. Even a fairly light protein focused breakfast can keep me going past noon however, even if I hit the gym early.

" I take my gear out of my car and put my bike together. Tourists and locals are watching from sidewalk cafes. Non-racers. The emptiness of of their lives shocks me. "
(opening lines from Tim Krabbe's The Rider , 1978
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