I withdrew from IM Lake Placid very early this year when I decided to do IM Japan instead. I believe the refund was US$250, not $150. I thought that was almost fair.

I do wish they would allow transfers or at least give spots to people on a waiting list. Hey, they could charge those people the full fare and make even more money.

All this talk of IMC makes me want to head back there again ASAP. Think I'll have a friend sign me up. Well, maybe not.

--David in Taipei

The reason you don't get a full refund or the ability to sell your spot is because USAT is "owned" by the race directors. Since almost no one votes for board members, few of us can complain about USAT policies that benefit a very few corporate interests.

I can think of no reason, other than sheer greed, why a race should cost more than $100. But, as long as IMNA knows it has plenty of people willing to pay too much, the fees will simply keep increasing each year.

-Robert

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"How wonderful it is that nobody need wait a single moment before starting to improve the world." ~Anne Frank

"I can think of no reason, other than sheer greed, why a race should cost more than $100. "

why is profit greed?

"But, as long as IMNA knows it has plenty of people willing to pay too much, the fees will simply keep increasing each year. "

yep capitalism is beautiful!!!!

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customerjon @gmail.com is where information happens.

Tricia,

I suggest that you contact Graham Fraser directly. The man is very reasonable and does listen to what participants have to say about his events. That's how he makes them better. That's why he is the best Race Director/Manager/Producer in the business - because he does look at each race through a participants eyes.

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Steve Fleck @stevefleck | Blog

That is true 100%..

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What if the Hokey Pokey is what it is all about?

There's an inteview with Graham on the xtri.com site that may enlighten you as to why it costs over $100. There are a great many expenses and if Graham and the other IMNA staffers weren't making any money then there would be no incentive for them to keep putting on such good races. When an event that costs $400 is sold out 363 days in advance you definitely know that the cost of entry is not too high based on what the market will accept.

Some people think it's too high some don't. Everybody has a different limit, there is even a guy that paid thousands of $ to buy a kona slot on ebay.

But the fact that this discussion is coming up again and again is prove that something is changing. We didn't have that discussion 10 years ago. From a capitalistic point of view, I would advise Mr. Fraser to make as much money as he possibly can in the next couple of years, because I bet it won't last!

I admit, I love to see that.

Well, I know there is more involved in a triathlon than a foot race, but if I'm not reaching too far, let's compare triathlons to road races. I can enter almost any road race at any time, and from 5K to marathon, it's $20-$25. Boston is $100, but it's little enough money, and enough of an achievement that people will pay for it.

My local RD, FIRM, who runs most of the tri's around the Boston area(if there's anyone else, let me know) does a pretty good job, and most sprint-int'l distance races are $50, with half-Iron distance races costing $100. They do a pretty good job, run fun races, and are good people. They don't always bury you in goodies after a race, but the post race food and T-Shirts at the last FIRM race I did(in June) were better than what I got at Tupper Lake this year.

I think that Ironman, and the dream of Kona, is enough of a draw with people seeking a new experience in life(when everything else has been done) and hard core tri-junkies that for now, people will pay the price. But we don't have to like it. And we don't have to be quiet about it either.

If we really wanted to, we could just go swim 2.4 miles, then ride our bikes 112 miles, then run 26.2 miles. On any Saturday we wanted to. We could even compare our times to the results of a recent IM race. But we don't. We go to the races. Why is that?

Answer that question and you'll understand why IMNA can get whatever they want for their races.

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People do it for two reasons, to get to Kona or to hear the anouncer say "You're an Ironman" rather than "You're a completer of a race the same distance as an Ironman(tm) but are unable to call yourself one because it's a registered trade mark." By the time he finished, you would be on your second IV.

Bob Sigerson

The devil is in the details. Show me the books, Graham.

:),

Fat chance because he's making obscene profits.

This may be capitalism, but it's monopoly capitalism at best. There's a reason for the Sherman Antitrust Act....

How does Fred Sommer manage to put on an iron distance race for a mere $325? And give a very nice shirt and the largest bag of goodies in the industry? Fred is also doing very well at his rates. The math is not hard, even for triathletes who think nothing of dropping $400 on 3 sq. feet of rubber or 2 square feet of carbon. :)

Anyway, I'm amused that so many people feel so sanguine about having their wallets lightened for no good reason. I wonder if Graham thinks the average IQ of triathletes is a negative number....

-Robert

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"How wonderful it is that nobody need wait a single moment before starting to improve the world." ~Anne Frank

So I'm working in my office and almost s**t my pants when I saw the entry fee was $400. That would be hard to explain to my customers that I'm seeing this afternoon.
I've never done an IM and have no plans to do one. Actually I'm having a hard time figuring out what is so great about doing one anyway.

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Brian Stover USAT LII
Accelerate3 Coaching
Insta

<<<<I also think that IMNA needs to go the route of IM Australia, and have qualifying events for the big show(s). >>>>

The problem there is by requiring an addiional race, you effectively up the entry cost to the Ironman event somewhere between $200-$800 depending on entry fees, and any additional travel and lodging expenses. And some of us couldn't swing that much extra lucre out of the financial pot.

I've got no great opinion either way on whether the current entry fee is too much. A business is certainly entitled to make a profit, and I wish Graham Frasier the best. If there is an IMFL in Panama City Beach in 2004, I'm thinking it would be neat to make it to the start line. But I'm a local about an hour outside of PCB. I don't have much in the way of travel expenses for that race outside gassing up the Passat, so it ends up being the cheap Iron distance option for me.

If there is no IMFL in PCB in 2004, then I wish IMNA the best of luck, and figure plan B is Great Floridian. Still within a day's drive, and plenty of cheap hotels in Orlando.

i agree with you. if they can sell race entries for the prices they charge, who's to say they are wrong for doing so? would you keep doing your job for less money? things just don't work that way. what was the mark-up on that beatiful new $2500 bike you just bought, or those $1200 race wheels? do you think it cost those people anywhere near those amounts to manufacture those items? with all that's involved in organizing a race the size of an IM, i wouldn't want to do it for pocket change either. besides, i haven't heard bmw saying they're going to lower their car prices because the markup is just too high. fact is, if you have a good product, be it bicycles, cars, race wheels, or races themselves, people are going to pay a premium for them. that's just the way it is.

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____________________________________________________________
"I'm happy when life's good,
and when it's bad I cry.
I've got values but I don't know how or why."
- The Who

My significant other and I both became Ironmen at LP this past weekend. We were very relieved that we registered from the Lake Placid library Tuesday afternoon. We did not drive home until late Wednesday and would have been disappointed to find the race full. Next year, I'll bet we will all have to be there in person Monday to get in

Speaking of Canada, is there any practical way to register for that race without attending the prior year's race? From somewhere I had the impression you had to wait in line Monday morning or you could forget about it. Everyone I've heard who has attended Canada certainly seems to think it is great locale. I just wish it was driving distance from New Hampshire like Lake Placid.

As for the $$$'s. When I look back over our tri expenses for the past year, the entry fee is probably smaller than our training power/cliff/luna/gatorade/etc-bar and GU expenses for the year! I sure didn't blink at $400. It is such a small percentage of my total race costs.

--Bill Voss

Yes my wife also became and ironman this past sunday. I'm glad the first thing we did when we got back after the 9 hour drive Tuesday was register. I'm sorry to hear that you missed it by staying in LP on tuesday. If I where you I'd go fro IM Wisconsin.

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I was, now I will tri again!
...
Any time is a good time.
God Bless you my friend.

Sorry if I was not clear. We used the Lake Placid library's internet connection to register for IM USA on Tuesday right before lunch. We booked a house for the event on Wednesday. We definitely plan to be in LP next year!

I'm just relieved we did not wait until we got home to do those things.

Perhaps we will see you there next year!

good job on using the library!

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**********************
I was, now I will tri again!
...
Any time is a good time.
God Bless you my friend.