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Home made fuel, is this correct?
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Hi All, I have spent the last few weeks looking at what fuel I am going to be using this season for my 70.3 and IM this summer so I can start training with it. After doing some research it all seems really expensive (especially in Canada), and I know in the past I end up not fueling properly in training because I am always worried about 'wasting it'.

I want to start making my own, but I am always second guessing myself and worried about making something with a molarity that is to high that will bomb my guts. Can you guys just double check that this thought process is correct?


Proportions:
  • 1:1 GLU-FRU ratio (can also do 1:0.8 GLU/FRU to make it a bit cheaper)
  • Roughly 500-1500mg sodium per liter. Closer to 1500mg if sweating a lot. Closer to 500-1000mg if barely sweating. (tsp of sodium citrate = 1000mg of sodium)
  • 600ml - 1L of fluids per hour
  • No more than 120g of carbs per 1L of fluid
  • High concentrations are ok as long as you are drinking enough fluids
  • Are other electrolytes besides sodium required?

Ingredients:

500ml Home Made Mix:
  • 500ml water
  • 30g Maltodextrin
  • 30g Fructose
  • 0.5tsp of sodium citrate
  • 1 drop of mio

Thanks for the double check!
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Re: Home made fuel, is this correct? [Truant19] [ In reply to ]
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Can’t you just use regular sugar

Isnt it already the 1:1 ratio and super cheap?
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Re: Home made fuel, is this correct? [MrTri123] [ In reply to ]
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Yes I think so, but from what I understand maltodextrin is less sweet tasting, allows you to adjust the GLU:FRU ratio, and possibly absorbed easier in the gut?
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Re: Home made fuel, is this correct? [Truant19] [ In reply to ]
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Truant19 wrote:
Yes I think so, but from what I understand maltodextrin is less sweet tasting, allows you to adjust the GLU:FRU ratio, and possibly absorbed easier in the gut?

I thought 1:1 was the best ratio for absorption but maybe not

I tried it recently for the first time for HIM bike. Worked great. 1000 calories in 28 ounces of water with a dash of regular gaterade for flavor
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Re: Home made fuel, is this correct? [Truant19] [ In reply to ]
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this horse has been beaten to death in another thread... See what Dr. Alex Harrisonsays in the thread
https://forum.slowtwitch.com/...ing=maurten#p7417228
he explains what you need to understand when making a high carb drink and why you use maltodextrin.
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Re: Home made fuel, is this correct? [s5100e] [ In reply to ]
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s5100e wrote:
this horse has been beaten to death in another thread... See what Dr. Alex Harrisonsays in the thread
https://forum.slowtwitch.com/...ing=maurten#p7417228
he explains what you need to understand when making a high carb drink and why you use maltodextrin.



Where does he say to use maltodextrin?


Last edited by: MrTri123: Mar 18, 22 14:25
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Re: Home made fuel, is this correct? [Truant19] [ In reply to ]
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I'm keeping it really simple.

24oz bottle
1/2 cup sugar - 400 cal
tsp sodium citrate - approx 1000mg?
scoop of bcaas - flavor, plus there's some research with bcaas helping with muscle breakdown I believe (don't have it - not going to look haha)
caffeine pill if desired.

That's it - sweetness takes some getting used to but handling it in the gut without issue. I've been playing with up to 500 cal an hour, and I won't go back with using this mix. Pretty solid. Cheap. Easy.

There are a few threads about this as well. Dr Alex has a ton of info and supporting material.

DFRU - Detta Family Racing Unit...the kids like it and we all get out and after it...gotta keep the fam involved!
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Re: Home made fuel, is this correct? [dfru] [ In reply to ]
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I've copied this from http://www.scienceinsport.com (I have no affiliation with them), just thought this was a nice simple explanation
Simple sugars such as glucose and fructose have a higher osmolality than longer chain molecules such as maltodextrin. A higher quantity of water is needed with a simple sugar to make it isotonic. This means simple sugars have a higher risk of stomach upset as they empty much more slowly from the stomach and water is retained with it there. The bacteria in the gut also feed off simple sugars and this can lead to gas and bloating.
However the maltodextrin in an isotonic formulation means that gastric emptying is maximised, to deliver energy quickly with minimal risk of causing gastric distress
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Re: Home made fuel, is this correct? [Truant19] [ In reply to ]
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Truant19 wrote:
Hi All, I have spent the last few weeks looking at what fuel I am going to be using this season for my 70.3 and IM this summer so I can start training with it. After doing some research it all seems really expensive (especially in Canada), and I know in the past I end up not fueling properly in training because I am always worried about 'wasting it'.

I want to start making my own, but I am always second guessing myself and worried about making something with a molarity that is to high that will bomb my guts. Can you guys just double check that this thought process is correct?

Proportions:
  • 1:1 GLU-FRU ratio (can also do 1:0.8 GLU/FRU to make it a bit cheaper)
  • Roughly 500-1500mg sodium per liter. Closer to 1500mg if sweating a lot. Closer to 500-1000mg if barely sweating. (tsp of sodium citrate = 1000mg of sodium)
  • 600ml - 1L of fluids per hour
  • No more than 120g of carbs per 1L of fluid
  • High concentrations are ok as long as you are drinking enough fluids
  • Are other electrolytes besides sodium required?
Ingredients:
500ml Home Made Mix:
  • 500ml water
  • 30g Maltodextrin
  • 30g Fructose
  • 0.5tsp of sodium citrate
  • 1 drop of mio
Thanks for the double check!
Looks great!

On fluid:
Some folks can handle more than 1L per hour. Sometimes by a lot. Just don't let sodium concentration dip towards the bottom end of that 500-1500mg range while simultaneously pushing 1.5L of fluid per hour. Hyponatremia is not performance enhancing. :)

On concentration:
What you've said is a good safe bet. Higher concentrations, like 130g/L or 140g/L, and sometimes 150-180g/L can be handled in a well-hydrated state and when exercise intensity is that of a 70.3 or 140.6. But, that doesn't mean it's optimal. 120g/L is a great place to land on the bike, especially if you're able to intake ≥1 L/hr anyway!

It's when folks aren't sweating much that sometimes it's optimal to push for a slightly higher concentration. No need to onboard so much fluid when you're not losing it, but still very much optimal to target ideal carb intakes of 90-140g/hr, if it's a long event and you're well-practiced at doing so. Yes gut training matters, but practice fueling matters more (ie. don't be inconsistent, and practice listening to gut).

On potassium (and chloride, for fun):
I'm not absolutely certain that potassium isn't necessary. But I'm getting very close. If it is helpful or useful, it's only helpful in tiny amounts, and is only very very slightly useful. Read: I can't tease out performance benefits or any mechanism by which it would be directly performance enhancing.

Same statement could be made for chloride.

What I am sure of, is that the amount of potassium and the amount of chloride, in most products, is more harmful than useful. It's inclusion in beverages, in any amount seems at least as likely to be harmful as useful, in most cases. Just more for your gut to deal with.

On maltodextrin + fructose, vs. sucrose, ratios, sweetness, & osmolarity:
Reasons why some folks might want to use maltodextrin to drive a slightly higher glucose intake than 1:1:
  1. Reduced sweetness
  2. Reduced osmolarity

But, if targeting a 1:1 ratio of glucose:fructose, sugar actually has very slightly lower osmolarity than average maltodextrin products which average about 10 glucose molecules per chain, unless stated otherwise. And, about the same sweetness.

If ever targeting a ratio of glucose:fructose that is anything greater than 1:1 (ie. 1:0.9, 1:0.8, 2:1, etc), then maltodextrin is the optimal choice for providing that added glucose.

On flavor intensity and sweetness:
Generally, unless you're my wife, most folks prefer lower flavor intensity and sweetness during exercise. She likes her drink to kick her in the teeth. I'm quite the opposite.

If you were making my beverage, I'd say: add the tiniest drop of mio possible. For me, just enough flavor to mask the flavor inherent to the sugars is optimal.

Salt &/or sodium citrate can always be used to combat any sweetness overload, and probably should be. I find this to be one of the best reasons to include a very small amount of table salt (NaCl) in the beverage, along with the sodium citrate.

Keep in mind that flavor preferences tend to change towards less sweet, less intense flavors, and greater salt flavor the longer the training session or race goes.

The "kitchen taste test" will sometimes be misleading.

PS. You're going to love the app my team and I are building, but you may not even need it by the time we get it released. ;) It takes all this into account + your feedback, settings, and qualitative inputs about sweat rates, and makes it all brainless for every activity you do, every day. Shoot, maybe you can help beta test it when we release in public beta. Just a thought. Private beta starts next week. Public in a couple months. FWIW, neither potassium, nor chloride, are prescribed in the present app version and I have no formal plans for their inclusion.

Dr. Alex Harrison | Founder & CEO | Sport Physiology & Performance PhD
-------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------
📱 Check out our app → Saturday: Pro Fuel & Hydration, a performance nutrition coach in your pocket.
Join us on YouTube → Saturday Morning | Ride & Run Faster and our growing Saturday User Hub
Last edited by: DrAlexHarrison: Mar 19, 22 5:06
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Re: Home made fuel, is this correct? [DrAlexHarrison] [ In reply to ]
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I have been doing this for a few years now.

Taking into consideration that I fuel off the course during a race, I simply looked up the salt and calorie content of a 24oz Gatorade bottle provided on the course. I make my bottles up to match the content. I throw a Kool Aid packet in for flavor.
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Re: Home made fuel, is this correct? [DrAlexHarrison] [ In reply to ]
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DrAlexHarrison wrote:
Truant19 wrote:
Hi All, I have spent the last few weeks looking at what fuel I am going to be using this season for my 70.3 and IM this summer so I can start training with it. After doing some research it all seems really expensive (especially in Canada), and I know in the past I end up not fueling properly in training because I am always worried about 'wasting it'.

I want to start making my own, but I am always second guessing myself and worried about making something with a molarity that is to high that will bomb my guts. Can you guys just double check that this thought process is correct?

Proportions:
  • 1:1 GLU-FRU ratio (can also do 1:0.8 GLU/FRU to make it a bit cheaper)
  • Roughly 500-1500mg sodium per liter. Closer to 1500mg if sweating a lot. Closer to 500-1000mg if barely sweating. (tsp of sodium citrate = 1000mg of sodium)
  • 600ml - 1L of fluids per hour
  • No more than 120g of carbs per 1L of fluid
  • High concentrations are ok as long as you are drinking enough fluids
  • Are other electrolytes besides sodium required?
Ingredients:
500ml Home Made Mix:
  • 500ml water
  • 30g Maltodextrin
  • 30g Fructose
  • 0.5tsp of sodium citrate
  • 1 drop of mio
Thanks for the double check!
Looks great!

On fluid:
Some folks can handle more than 1L per hour. Sometimes by a lot. Just don't let sodium concentration dip towards the bottom end of that 500-1500mg range while simultaneously pushing 1.5L of fluid per hour. Hyponatremia is not performance enhancing. :)

On concentration:
What you've said is a good safe bet. Higher concentrations, like 130g/L or 140g/L, and sometimes 150-180g/L can be handled in a well-hydrated state and when exercise intensity is that of a 70.3 or 140.6. But, that doesn't mean it's optimal. 120g/L is a great place to land on the bike, especially if you're able to intake ≥1 L/hr anyway!

It's when folks aren't sweating much that sometimes it's optimal to push for a slightly higher concentration. No need to onboard so much fluid when you're not losing it, but still very much optimal to target ideal carb intakes of 90-140g/hr, if it's a long event and you're well-practiced at doing so. Yes gut training matters, but practice fueling matters more (ie. don't be inconsistent, and practice listening to gut).

On potassium (and chloride, for fun):
I'm not absolutely certain that potassium isn't necessary. But I'm getting very close. If it is helpful or useful, it's only helpful in tiny amounts, and is only very very slightly useful. Read: I can't tease out performance benefits or any mechanism by which it would be directly performance enhancing.

Same statement could be made for chloride.

What I am sure of, is that the amount of potassium and the amount of chloride, in most products, is more harmful than useful. It's inclusion in beverages, in any amount seems at least as likely to be harmful as useful, in most cases. Just more for your gut to deal with.

On maltodextrin + fructose, vs. sucrose, ratios, sweetness, & osmolarity:
Reasons why some folks might want to use maltodextrin to drive a slightly higher glucose intake than 1:1:
  1. Reduced sweetness
  2. Reduced osmolarity

But, if targeting a 1:1 ratio of glucose:fructose, sugar actually has very slightly lower osmolarity than average maltodextrin products which average about 10 glucose molecules per chain, unless stated otherwise. And, about the same sweetness.

If ever targeting a ratio of glucose:fructose that is anything greater than 1:1 (ie. 1:0.9, 1:0.8, 2:1, etc), then maltodextrin is the optimal choice for providing that added glucose.

On flavor intensity and sweetness:
Generally, unless you're my wife, most folks prefer lower flavor intensity and sweetness during exercise. She likes her drink to kick her in the teeth. I'm quite the opposite.

If you were making my beverage, I'd say: add the tiniest drop of mio possible. For me, just enough flavor to mask the flavor inherent to the sugars is optimal.

Salt &/or sodium citrate can always be used to combat any sweetness overload, and probably should be. I find this to be one of the best reasons to include a very small amount of table salt (NaCl) in the beverage, along with the sodium citrate.

Keep in mind that flavor preferences tend to change towards less sweet, less intense flavors, and greater salt flavor the longer the training session or race goes.

The "kitchen taste test" will sometimes be misleading.

PS. You're going to love the app my team and I are building, but you may not even need it by the time we get it released. ;) It takes all this into account + your feedback, settings, and qualitative inputs about sweat rates, and makes it all brainless for every activity you do, every day. Shoot, maybe you can help beta test it when we release in public beta. Just a thought. Private beta starts next week. Public in a couple months. FWIW, neither potassium, nor chloride, are prescribed in the present app version and I have no formal plans for their inclusion.


App sounds great!

I used your recipe. Worked great

Thank you for all of your posts
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