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Re: Atrial fibrillation as a athlete. [synthetic] [ In reply to ]
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Hi , I want to first say I am not a doctor nor do I play one on TV. I am not seeking medical advice or giving medical advice ,I am just wanting to hear peoples events of A-fib too see if there is some correlation to mine. I am waiting for the medical doctors to run the tests I’ve been scheduled for and they will make my medical diagnosis. The triggers I have found are coming thru the podcasts I’ve listened too and the things I’ve read thru Pub-Med. Sorry but i don't want anybody to be misled by this thread.

"Be your best cheerleader , not your worst critic.”
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Re: Atrial fibrillation as a athlete. [Kirch] [ In reply to ]
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After having my Aortic valve replaced I became a member of the Afib club four years ago. Most common symptom was irregular pulse and fatigue. My doctors put me on the pill in pocket plan with Fecaloid, and warned me that I was likely to need an ablation sooner than later. After quitting caffeine, and alcohol I experience little to no change in the frequency of mu Afib episodes.

That was all over a year ago. That's when I started insuring myself that I would get no less that 8 hours of sleep every night. Since then, I've been Afib free, and am nordic skiing and cycling as much as any 66 year old guy deserves to.

This just one persons experience, and while your results may vary, a little extra sleep is always a good thing.
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Re: Atrial fibrillation as a athlete. [MrB] [ In reply to ]
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Thanks I as well have started to try and get more sleep. I only work part time from 5-9 but I always seem to stay up to 11pm and wake up at 5am. this past weekend after reading about how good sleep aids the reduction of A-fib I am committed to gettting to bed by 10 and up at 6. More sleep never hurt anyone. Thanks

"Be your best cheerleader , not your worst critic.”
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Re: Atrial fibrillation as a athlete. [Kirch] [ In reply to ]
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What has helped me sleep and even rest my eyes as much as possible is looking at the body battery on my watch

If you have a Garmin it may help you
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Re: Atrial fibrillation as a athlete. [Kirch] [ In reply to ]
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Hello,

I was recently diagnosed with a-fib. About three months ago while increasing the distance of my long runs I started having a tightening of the chest, dramatically increased pulse (210+), light headed. I felt better if I stopped and walked a few seconds then I could start running again. Sometime just one episode, sometime several. Outside of these episodes I could feel my pulse quicken periodically. If you look at one of my earlier posts here on Slowtwitch regarding my power on the Tacx Flux 2 you can see my heartrate at 213. I have found that using a chest strap heartrate monitor vs a wrist monitor, the wrist is much less sensitive to the a fib.

I had an appointment with my internist who is even older than me (I am 62). He said I was a-fib and referred me to a cardiologist while starting me on Eliquis, a blood thinner. I had the echo-cardiogram, chemical stress test and a consultation. She stated that 1) I had a prolapsed valve. It seems that this is hereditary and mostly likely have had it since birth. 2) One of the chambers of my heart was enlarged. She feels that this is because I have been in a fib for a long while and the heart has adapted by enlarging the chamber. we discussed options from nothing, staying on Eliquis ($500 a month, not cover by insurance), chemical cardio-conversion, etc. She seemed much more concerned about blood clots over the a-fib. They assign a risk number and she placed me at 0-1 (low). She also said she feels that Ironman is okay for me with my condition.

Back to my internist who stated he feels that I should not do Ironman anymore. He also seems much more concerned with the clotting over the a fib. I am still on the Eliquis as his office gave me a six month supply:) and now considering my future in triathlon.

Sucks as with the changes to the Ironman Legacy policy I am only a few races away from qualifying for Hawaii!

We will be seeking a third opinion soon.



.

Once, I was fast. But I got over it.
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Re: Atrial fibrillation as a athlete. [hblake] [ In reply to ]
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HI thanks for your response. I am going to be set up with a Holter monitor on March 14th to track me for 24hrs to see how the heart rhythm is then they will see what the next step will be. The take home i get with all the stories is this is a marathon not a sprint. Question have you stopped training ? And how cautious are you to start.

"Be your best cheerleader , not your worst critic.”
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Re: Atrial fibrillation as a athlete. [Kirch] [ In reply to ]
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About 8 years ago, going into my mid-50s, I started slowing down and feeling a bit more fatigued all the time. My doctor just attributed it to getting older. I started having minor episodes at the beginning of 2017. I’d be out riding, and suddenly feel like the wind got knocked out of me, and if I looked down at my Garmin I’d see that my heart rate had jumped 50-80bpm higher. This would last for 10-30 seconds, then go back to normal. This started happening once every week or two. The night before I had a stress echo scheduled, I went into a persistent state, so the diagnosis the next day was a no-brainer. I was put on Eliquis, along with a few other drugs to slow my HR and steady the rhythm, but those were only partially effective. During that time, my cardiologist told me that I could continue to exercise as much as I felt comfortable doing. Which wasn’t too hard since the medications limited my HR to about a maximum 115bpm. After 9 months, my insurance finally approved an ablation, and I got that at the end of 2017. Since then, I’ve had no issues and have felt better than I did in the last few years leading up to 2017. At 60, I'm consistently matching or beating Strava PRs that I set back in 2013...

"I'm thinking of a number between 1 and 10, and I don't know why!"
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Re: Atrial fibrillation as a athlete. [Warbird] [ In reply to ]
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I had an episode (idk if this was AFIB) early this morning where my heart beat seems to pause, pound and then rapidly beat for several seconds. This actually occurs often but I have never been concerned about it- I never feel uncomfortable but I can feel when it is about to happen. Now I seem concerned.

USAT Level II- Ironman U Certified Coach
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Re: Atrial fibrillation as a athlete. [Once-a-miler] [ In reply to ]
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Once-a-miler wrote:
I had an episode (idk if this was AFIB) early this morning where my heart beat seems to pause, pound and then rapidly beat for several seconds. This actually occurs often but I have never been concerned about it- I never feel uncomfortable but I can feel when it is about to happen. Now I seem concerned.

Totally benign.
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Re: Atrial fibrillation as a athlete. [Kirch] [ In reply to ]
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Yes, still running (agreed to run only with my wife) and stationary cycling only.

One of the posts above mentions the book: Restart Your Heart by Aseem Desai.

This review of the book is very critical of it: https://a-fib.com/...b-by-dr-aseem-desai/

I have not yet read the book but it is at the local library.

There are a few threads regarding a-fib here on Slowtwitch, use the search.

Lemme know if I can help you with anything.


.

Once, I was fast. But I got over it.
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Re: Atrial fibrillation as a athlete. [hblake] [ In reply to ]
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hblake wrote:


Yes, still running (agreed to run only with my wife) and stationary cycling only.

One of the posts above mentions the book: Restart Your Heart by Aseem Desai.

This review of the book is very critical of it: https://a-fib.com/...b-by-dr-aseem-desai/


Bizarre review. "Doctor" (PhD in communications) Steve claims "By advocating living with A-Fib and by not telling patients of the dangers of living in A-Fib, Dr. Desai may be doing lasting harm to many A-Fib patients."

In fact, my cardiologist wanted me to live with afib and it was Dr. (real MD, cardiac EP) Desai who convinced me that it was really serious and I should get it fixed.

Steve says "Dr. Desai’s description of A-Fib as “electrical cancer” is unfortunate and not really relevant or helpful to patients." Yes, he calls it 'cancer' to get your attention and emphasize it's really bad and needs to be treated or it will get worse.

Dr. Desai does ablations, that's his job. The take that he's not serious enough about it is bizarre. Unlike Steve, Dr. Desai has actual medical qualifications and responsibilities and has to deal with real patients.

Don't want to be so defensive. I'd have my own criticisms of the book but I disagree with Steve's take. I suspect he sees Desai as a competitor.

I've run into Steve's website before. Even though he has no medical background or anything, he has some good stuff there, as well as a fair amount of nonsense. My wife told me BCAAs immediately cure afib because she saw it on Steve's site. But again, there's good information there as well.
Last edited by: HardlyTrying: Mar 2, 22 6:39
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Re: Atrial fibrillation as a athlete. [hblake] [ In reply to ]
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hblake wrote:
He also seems much more concerned with the clotting over the a fib.

afib by itself won't kill you, but a blood clot caused by afib leading to a stroke can.
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Re: Atrial fibrillation as a athlete. [Warbird] [ In reply to ]
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This sort of the post I needed to read. I had a mild tachy event a few weeks ago, but have been having what now seem to be some Afib symptoms (occasional dizziness), irregular heart rate, along with my Apple Watch telling me I had had two sets of 5 events of AFib symptoms. One of these sets came after an "easy" ride that I felt really short of breath and HR sat at 160+ for the best part of an hour for low, low speed.

Before all this, I'd had a consistent decrease in form and some feeling of heart beating out of my chest (which I though was normal), but looking back, it might not be so much.

ECG booked in, and thence to the cardiologist. Family history of tachycardia (father, brother, uncle all have had ablation of a dual AV nerve) and aFib (all the family have had electroversion).

It had to hit at some point, training seems to have held it off.
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Re: Atrial fibrillation as a athlete. [altayloraus] [ In reply to ]
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altayloraus wrote:
This sort of the post I needed to read. I had a mild tachy event a few weeks ago, but have been having what now seem to be some Afib symptoms (occasional dizziness), irregular heart rate, along with my Apple Watch telling me I had had two sets of 5 events of AFib symptoms. One of these sets came after an "easy" ride that I felt really short of breath and HR sat at 160+ for the best part of an hour for low, low speed.

Before all this, I'd had a consistent decrease in form and some feeling of heart beating out of my chest (which I though was normal), but looking back, it might not be so much.

ECG booked in, and thence to the cardiologist. Family history of tachycardia (father, brother, uncle all have had ablation of a dual AV nerve) and aFib (all the family have had electroversion).

It had to hit at some point, training seems to have held it off.

Same here, the majority of people on my mom's side of the family have had afib or svt (I actually had both)

I hit peak fitness in 2013/early 2014, then started noticeably sliding back. But no other symptoms or indications of anything being wrong. My doctor just said it was because I was hitting my mid-50s, and that's just what happens. It wasn't until early 2017 that I actually had any real indication that anything was wrong, with periodic episodes of shortness of breath/elevated HR. But on my first easy ride 2 weeks after my ablation, without trying I knocked off a few PRs on one of my regular routes, even though I had only ridden a few hundred miles at Z1 effort over the previous 9 months. So it looks like there was something else besides simply "getting older" going on during the previous 3 years...

"I'm thinking of a number between 1 and 10, and I don't know why!"
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Re: Atrial fibrillation as a athlete. [Warbird] [ In reply to ]
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Warbird wrote:
altayloraus wrote:
This sort of the post I needed to read. I had a mild tachy event a few weeks ago, but have been having what now seem to be some Afib symptoms (occasional dizziness), irregular heart rate, along with my Apple Watch telling me I had had two sets of 5 events of AFib symptoms. One of these sets came after an "easy" ride that I felt really short of breath and HR sat at 160+ for the best part of an hour for low, low speed.

Before all this, I'd had a consistent decrease in form and some feeling of heart beating out of my chest (which I though was normal), but looking back, it might not be so much.

ECG booked in, and thence to the cardiologist. Family history of tachycardia (father, brother, uncle all have had ablation of a dual AV nerve) and aFib (all the family have had electroversion).

It had to hit at some point, training seems to have held it off.

Same here, the majority of people on my mom's side of the family have had afib or svt (I actually had both)

I hit peak fitness in 2013/early 2014, then started noticeably sliding back. But no other symptoms or indications of anything being wrong. My doctor just said it was because I was hitting my mid-50s, and that's just what happens. It wasn't until early 2017 that I actually had any real indication that anything was wrong, with periodic episodes of shortness of breath/elevated HR. But on my first easy ride 2 weeks after my ablation, without trying I knocked off a few PRs on one of my regular routes, even though I had only ridden a few hundred miles at Z1 effort over the previous 9 months. So it looks like there was something else besides simply "getting older" going on during the previous 3 years...

So happy for you

Glad you had it taken care of
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Re: Atrial fibrillation as a athlete. [Warbird] [ In reply to ]
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Wow Warbird great to read your story...as it closely resembles mine...was in peak condition in my mid 50's in 2014 and started noticing slight decline in performance...and also when I am honest with myself the first signs of HR/arrythmias which I kind of ignored as I never was out of breath or dizzy...just HR spikes..and at times my heartbeat feeling disorganized while recovering on the sofa after a long ride/run....this continued on and off so much so that I moved away from Ironman level training after disapponting Lake Placid in 2017...continued uninspired "training" with only minimal HR disruption or at least that impacted me daily...until November of last year..when I went into Afib, Aflutters off & on continuously for a week ...kept me up at night,,,felt panicky during the day...I was supposed go on a business trip and my wife made me see the doctor before going...EKG picked up irregularity..put me into the hospital...Stress Test (with Dye infusion to rule out blockages)...and the Afib/Flutter was revealed....(thankfully no artery issues)....I also followed that up with heartmonitor for 30 days which showed I was in Afib for more often than I realized....lastly a sleep study to rule out any apnea as a trigger (negative)...and I chose right away for an Ablation...I didn't want rate control meds for life....I had the ablation on Wednesday this week...and recovering at home...tired, a little sore...but I love the sound of my heart in normal sinus rythm...I'm hoping for the same return to fitness you experienced...fingers crossed.
Last edited by: Soarfeet: Mar 11, 22 9:15
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Re: Atrial fibrillation as a athlete. [Kirch] [ In reply to ]
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I had bouts of afib back in the late 90's primarily at high end training or racing. It sucked. and had to drop out of a few races or stop for a bit to get back to normal sinus rythm. Once doing a 20 mile run from hotel to US Capitol in DC I went into afib running up the stairs to the capitol and had to run 10 miles back in afib which really was not pleasant. Long story short, meds sucked and didn't work. Ablation procedures were only practiced in a couple locations in the US at the time, Primarily Duke University Hospital and UCSF Medical Center. Traveled from the DFW area to Duke to have RF ablation and it took nearly 10 hours. Pretty fast recovery and no afib for about 10 years which my EP indicated was pretty good for an RF procedure since the scar can leave gaps. Sporadic bouts returned and in 2014 had a cryo catheter ablation which is supposedly better than the RF long term since it makes a more complete scar around the pulmonary veins. Procedure only took about an hour or so. Recovery a bit tougher than previous. it felt like an elephant was sitting on my chest for a couple weeks but was back at it in a week though. Since then no afib.

I did find that dark chocolate, red pasta sauce, and red wine were triggers. That seemed to be a common thread on message boards. Bouts of indigestion also triggered since apparently the vagus nerve has connections to both. I think this is know well known but back in the day EP's would look at you funny when you told them others experience the same issue.

I tried taking Taurine, Asparagine, Magnesium, and Prilosec prior to activity which seemed to help a little. Never

Good luck with whatever course you decide.

Jim

Jim Lukanich
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Re: Atrial fibrillation as a athlete. [Soarfeet] [ In reply to ]
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Soarfeet wrote:
Wow Warbird great to read your story...as it closely resembles mine...was in peak condition in my mid 50's in 2014 and started noticing slight decline in performance...and also when I am honest with myself the first signs of HR/arrythmias which I kind of ignored as I never was out of breath or dizzy...just HR spikes..and at times my heartbeat feeling disorganized while recovering on the sofa after a long ride/run....this continued on and off so much so that I moved away from Ironman level training after disapponting Lake Placid in 2017...continued uninspired "training" with only minimal HR disruption or at least that impacted me daily...until November of last year..when I went into Afib, Aflutters off & on continuously for a week ...kept me up at night,,,felt panicky during the day...I was supposed go on a business trip and my wife made me see the doctor before going...EKG picked up irregularity..put me into the hospital...Stress Test (with Dye infusion to rule out blockages)...and the Afib/Flutter was revealed....(thankfully no artery issues)....I also followed that up with heartmonitor for 30 days which showed I was in Afib for more often than I realized....lastly a sleep study to rule out any apnea as a trigger (negative)...and I chose right away for an Ablation...I didn't want rate control meds for life....I had the ablation on Wednesday this week...and recovering at home...tired, a little sore...but I love the sound of my heart in normal sinus rythm...I'm hoping for the same return to fitness you experienced...fingers crossed.

My insurance really pushed for keeping me on the meds, but 9 months showed that they were only partially effective at best. My cardiologist was pushing for an ablation, and told me "You're too young to be on drugs the rest of your life."

The thing that really surprised me going into the hospital for the ablation was that I was not nervous at all. The only thing I was feeling was relief that all this would finally be over...

"I'm thinking of a number between 1 and 10, and I don't know why!"
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Re: Atrial fibrillation as a athlete. [Kirch] [ In reply to ]
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had A-Flutter. "kissing cousin to A-Fib"

in my particular case i had a super cardiac electro guy (at that time) down at HNL Cardio clinic. ran a electrode thing up my thigh and burned the AV node on my heart. Two burns. i could feel them. Every sense then my heart has been in cardiac rythym.


/r

Steve
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Re: Atrial fibrillation as a athlete. [Steve Hawley] [ In reply to ]
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Great thread and lots of good info and thoughts.

My first experience with afib was about a week ago (age 59, a lifetime of endurance sports). I'd done about a one hour moderate nordic (skate) ski workout that day. We were watching a movie that evening on the couch, and I noticed that my heartbeats were irregular. I have a good friend with a similar background who had just been through a couple years of dealing with afib (with episodes lasting weeks at a time) which appears to have finally gone away after a 2nd ablation. So, I immediately suspected that as the cause. I was pretty much asymptomatic other than the irregular heartbeat (which was still in the 60s). I only really noticed because I'm probably somewhat obsessive about checking my pulse at least a couple of times a day just to get a sense of what my resting HR is doing.

The next morning the irregular beats were still happening. I wanted to get an EKG while it was going on, so I went to the nearby urgent care. I ended up with about the perfect doc for my situation. He was an ex ER doc who decided to move to urgent care while he was coasting into retirement; and, he'd had afib which has not recurred after his 2nd ablation. So he was quite familiar with my particular situation and had lots of great things to say. They set up an EKG and it was confirmed. Doc consulted with a cardiologist, and they decided to send me to the ER for a possible cardioversion (if done within 24 hours after onset of afib risk of clots forming in the atria, resulting in possible strokes, is generally considered negligible).

The ER experience was not quite as pleasant. I'm pretty sure they forgot somebody was in my room for a few hours. Eventually the doc wandered back and said it would be best to just send me home because: I was asymptomatic; I couldn't say with 100% certainty when my afib actually started; and, most cases convert back to normal on their own. I really wanted to just be done with it but that all made sense.

Sure enough, that afternoon after I came home from the ER my heart rhythm was back to normal. So my episode lasted probably a bit less that 24 hours.

This all happened on a Friday, and by pure luck I managed to get an appointment with a cardiologist the following Monday due to a cancellation. Another ECG showed everything was normal. She was great, and talked about a lot of things I'd already learned about. One thing she did say is that afib pretty much doesn't happen without arrhythmia, which I didn't realize. Atrial flutter can happen with a regular heartbeat, but that's different than afib. She confirmed that afib unfortunately tends to get progressively worse, but that there is huge individual variation. She believed that if progression seems to point to an ablation, sooner is better than later. With a good electro doc (she really emphasized the 'good doc' part) success rate of 1st ablation (no afib recurrence) is about 75%. She recommended that I just carry on with life as normal, and if this keeps happening we'll reevaluate. She got me scheduled for an echocardiogram in a couple of weeks.

Also got a portable EKG device. The Kardia EKG device seems to be the standard and it what my formerly afib-riddled friend recommended, but I got one from SonoHealth because I liked having the screen. I've tried it out and it seems to work great-pretty amazing device. Like the Kardia you can capture an EKG if you're having issues and mail it to your cardiologist.

It's now Friday a week later, and I've been doing normal workouts. In fact, yesterday I did the exact same nordic ski workout as the day I had the afib, except this time I pushed it a little harder. Have also done a couple runs including a great one today, a surfski paddle, and a bike trainer session. Heart rhythm has been rock solid all week.

Things that were different the day I had the afib were: I had consumed at least 2X my normal amount of caffeine (even though based on studies caffeine does not seem to be a trigger); and, I was quite dehydrated that day (which does appear to have some correlation).

So, that's my story . . .
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Re: Atrial fibrillation as a athlete. [Warbird] [ In reply to ]
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Warbird...Curious about your approach to return to activity/training post ablation. My ablation went really well it seems...(had both for Afib & Aflutter...right and left atriums)...I had little to no soreness or bleeding at the insertion sights...some chest tightness on deep breaths...but no pain....I have had a cough though that seems to be from residual heating from the RF and from the Trach tube for breathing under anesthesia...that is fading now also....Anyway...I'm just over a week out and I took a first walk yesterday...25min...conversational....all good...will probably spin the bike wheels on the trainer today...

My plan was 7-10 little to no activity...then begin back with a couple of weeks easy zone 1 stuff cycling/walk-jog...see how that goes then up-it from there but probably no intensity for a month(?)...

I've read alot of blogs, articles , posts ....that range from ...nothing but zone 1 stuff for 3-6months....to top level triathlete who was told by her cardiologist after the ablation to jump right back in (after a week or two)...that "your heart is the same as everyone elses now"...

So I will continue to be cautious with a steady return...but curious how you approached....or anyone else on this forum who cares to share their thoughts.

FYI...I wasn't nervous about the Ablation either....I was really excited...had a great EP who discussed the procedure as much as I cared too...and he was at least an outdoor person...if not an actual triathlete...so he understood well where I was approaching the procedure.
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Re: Atrial fibrillation as a athlete. [Soarfeet] [ In reply to ]
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I started doing easy walks after a week, and did my first ride after 2 weeks. My cardiologist told me I could go as hard as I felt comfortable with, but with little activity for the previous 9 months and my HR still being regulated by various medications, that wasn’t going to be much. I was told that it takes a few months for everything to completely heal, and until then not to be surprised if I had any episodes.

My first ride was mostly easy on a fairly flat bike path, but about 5 minutes in my HR jumped from 110 to 162 while only putting out 75w, then dropped back down to under 100 after a few minutes, but still continued to be all over the place. The next few rides were similar, but with less HR variation. But there was a tendency for my HR to hit its peak while going easy in the first few minutes and then drop back down.

After a few weeks, I was able to start doing 25-30 mile rides. After 2 months, I was back to riding in the local mountains, and picking up new PRs on Strava on every ride, even with the medication slowing me down.
After 4 months, I had a Linq monitor implanted so they could keep an eye on everything, and except for a few very minor episodes in my sleep, everything was looking like it was back to normal.

After 5 months, I had a stress echo and everything checked out, so I was taken off all the meds, and everything has been OK ever since.

"I'm thinking of a number between 1 and 10, and I don't know why!"
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Re: Atrial fibrillation as a athlete. [Warbird] [ In reply to ]
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Thanks for Sharing. Slow and steady coming back I think makes sense...at least until my 3month follow up...(they will put me on a monitor for 15 days just prior to that)....I recenlty purchased the Kardiamobile ekg device...kinda nice...
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Re: Atrial fibrillation as a athlete. [Warbird] [ In reply to ]
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Just curious, I had my ablation last Wednesday (4/13) and since then my resting HR has been elevated by about 20-25 bpm. My Dr. warned me that might be the case, but I wanted to see if anyone here had a similar "side effect" and if so, for how long? Thanks!
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Re: Atrial fibrillation as a athlete. [LDF] [ In reply to ]
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It takes about a month. No big deal.
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