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Maximizing Use of Systm (uncoached)
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I was new to Sufferfest last year and am using Systm again this year.
Last year was the first time I ever rode consistently indoors over the winter and it made an enormous difference come spring.

I could just pick random and varied workouts and be glad that I am riding consistently, but I feel like I should do it in a way that makes sense.

I'll probably ride 2-4 times per week. It doesn't seem to make sense to follow one of the tri plans as I'll run/swim/lift otherwise and not interested in a structured tri plan this time of year.

I suppose I could just follow one of the cycling plans and just not do all of the listed workouts.

Should I just filter rides by my identified 4DP weakness and do those most rides?

I feel like no matter what I do it will help but I am trying to get the most bang for my time and I'm not exactly sure what/how to do that.

Thanks for any insights.
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Re: Maximizing Use of Systm (uncoached) [curdog16] [ In reply to ]
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Rather than worrying about the results of your test and improving your weakness, you might be better served to think about the demands of whatever kind of racing you plan to do in the spring will look like.

A lot of the sufferfest videos have fairly high intensity so maybe look at doing once a week where you are hitting that VO2 part of your energy system at a bit over your functional threshold and doing some longer blocks at lower output like two times 20 kind of stuff. Getting outside for over distance even if it's on a pair of cross-country skis or snowshoes is a lot more refreshing mentally than grinding out 2 hour rides on the trainer for many people myself included.
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Re: Maximizing Use of Systm (uncoached) [curdog16] [ In reply to ]
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If you're just picking random / interesting workouts, then your training is going to skew heavily towards the intensity side of the spectrum, especially with a platform such as SYSTM. Even at 4x per week, you'll get more results if you're following an 80:20 type distribution.

If you're riding 2-4 times per week, then make one intensity (Z3 and up). If you want to optimize, then pick rides which mirror an event you're training for, or work on a particular focus that you're interested in improving. The others should be all Z2 and below - so basically the inspiration and the odd recovery workout. You'll burn through the inspiration library quicker than intended, but otherwise you're getting too much intensity.

The other thing I'll add is to add a strength regime, and follow that plan. They're only 2x per week and they'll go a long way towards improving your ability to keep proper form.
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Re: Maximizing Use of Systm (uncoached) [curdog16] [ In reply to ]
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Remember you can adjust the intensity level down with your computer. A nice way to get kind of a spunky workout that isn't too hard is to do some of those real life races, they are generally longer and if you ride them at 80 or 85%, it's a nice endurance workout.

Some of the workouts are kind of kitchen sink too, I just finished one called shovel that used a bunch of different energy systems
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Re: Maximizing Use of Systm (uncoached) [timbasile] [ In reply to ]
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Thats kind of the idea that I had. Even if I decided to largely pursue workouts that target my identified weakness, I'd still need to balance that with some easy rides/workouts.

I lift weights 2-3 times per week, so I figured the Systm strength stuff would be overkill, but I'll take a look and maybe my 3rd workout would be one of these instead of gym/weights day.

My limit for indoor trainer time is 2 hours per pop. I will certainly override outside, but not inside given my A race distance this year is 70.3.
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Re: Maximizing Use of Systm (uncoached) [curdog16] [ In reply to ]
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I like the building block plans, which allow you to focus on a particular energy system for 3 or 4 week blocks (e.g., threshold or VO2). But I only do the ~2 intensity sessions through Sufferfest/SYSTM and then ride outdoors for longer endurance rides.

More generally, I wish all of the indoor training platforms would realize that many users only want to use their product for 1-2 higher intensity sessions per week. I want a plan that says, for each week: do these workouts plus X hours of endurance riding below Y HR/%FTP.
Last edited by: mjp202: Dec 8, 21 8:49
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Re: Maximizing Use of Systm (uncoached) [curdog16] [ In reply to ]
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Some of the shorter high-end stuff like neuromuscular is really more for bike racers than someone interested in improving at the time trial. It's fine to hit those systems sometimes but it probably would not be a good use of your time to deliberately train your five or 10 second power.
Last edited by: jroden: Dec 8, 21 8:56
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Re: Maximizing Use of Systm (uncoached) [curdog16] [ In reply to ]
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I'm a fan of giving a training methodology a fair shot before giving up and hand-rolling it. SYSTM has some thought behind their training methology, knowledgeable people in Neal Henderson, et al. I'd try to use what they've devised rather than picking workouts a-la-carte.

My one major criticism of SYSTM is that they make it awkward-at-best to integrate outdoor workouts into a training plan. And I'm simply not going to do all my bike riding indoors. That's why I'm currently using TR, as they've done a better (though far from perfect) job at integrating indoor/outdoor rides together. SYSTM is working on this, though.
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Re: Maximizing Use of Systm (uncoached) [trail] [ In reply to ]
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Living in the midwest, not having the proper outdoor cycling coldgear and being soft, is not a good recipe for me to ride outdoors again until mid March.

There are a few warm (enough) days here and there but if its a weekday, then I'm not getting home early enough to get outside in daylight (and prefer not to ride in december darkness at a busy commute time)

So, I gotta make the most of my indoor training time.
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Re: Maximizing Use of Systm (uncoached) [curdog16] [ In reply to ]
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Oh yeah, forgot that winter exists for some people. :)
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Re: Maximizing Use of Systm (uncoached) [jroden] [ In reply to ]
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Agree.

The funny part is that when I did their full frontal test last year, my weakness was sustained efforts near FTP which is I think what I need to improve in order to improve my 70.3 bike split.
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Re: Maximizing Use of Systm (uncoached) [curdog16] [ In reply to ]
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curdog16 wrote:
Agree.

The funny part is that when I did their full frontal test last year, my weakness was sustained efforts near FTP which is I think what I need to improve in order to improve my 70.3 bike split.


My test claimed that I was mediocre at everything which they then tried to spin in a positive way like I was a regular Swiss army knife of the cycling world.

I think you can make some good gains over the winter riding indoors. The usual paradigm assumes that you can just go out and do those 3-hour rides this time of year and then work on the top end as spring approaches. I guess you could just take those 3-hour rides indoors but that seems like a pretty harsh way to go and I know for me even as a pretty disciplined and motivated person that sort of thing would not be sustainable through a whole winter season. So for me, more running and cross-country skiing and fat biking and then when I get on the trainer it's mostly quality stuff.
Last edited by: jroden: Dec 8, 21 10:15
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Re: Maximizing Use of Systm (uncoached) [curdog16] [ In reply to ]
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Like others have mentioned, I would be cautious about too many rides with intensity above Z2. However, if it makes sense to back off on intensity in swimming and especially running over the winter, there could be room in your schedule for more cycling intensity. This could be a good strategy if you are strong swimming and running and weaker in cycling. I would just keep it to 3 or so days per week with intensity across all disciplines.

For the intensity rides, I would make sure to frequently hit all zones at least a little bit (like over the course of 2 weeks), but the focus of the majority of your intensity could shift in several week blocks. For motivation, it might be fun to train for different abilities (30 second power, 5 minute power, 30 minute power, etc.) for a few weeks each and test yourself before and after to see improvement.

For the easy rides on the trainer, lately I've been mixing up cadence from really low to really high throughout the ride as well as "intervals" for example working in 10 minute segments from low Z2 to high Z2. Keeps it a little more interesting than 88 rpm at 65% FTP for an hour straight.
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Re: Maximizing Use of Systm (uncoached) [jwmott] [ In reply to ]
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I admire you for being in-tune with such intricate training permutations.

However, I think most of us want the SYSTM to do the thinking and planning for us. Take the 4DP test, choose and customize (time per week, ability level) a plan then do what your told.

For me, the Sufferfest (now SYSTM) prepares, trains and improves my cycling fitness - and repeated 4DP testing confirms it. Not only that, my outdoor riding/racing improves dramatically. Again, I just take the test, pick the plan and do what I'm told.
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Re: Maximizing Use of Systm (uncoached) [Pathlete] [ In reply to ]
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Taking Full frontal test on Tuesday. I looked at the different plans they have available this year vs last year and like the offerings and how its laid out.

The only thing is that if I wanted to do 6 weeks of FTP work, the plan only gives 2 or 3 week options and then gives the same exact workouts for the two 3 week periods. They have over 100 FTP based individual workouts when you filter by that category.

At this point, I am leaning tpward doing the 3 week powering through the holidays program, followed by the FTP plan as laid out and then either a few weeks of a la carte mixing in "longer" endurance and recovery rides or one of the other 3 week plans that focuses on my next weakest element.

Plus squeezing in one or two more full frontals to see if there is progress (if they are not a part of the program)
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Re: Maximizing Use of Systm (uncoached) [curdog16] [ In reply to ]
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Sounds like a solid plan. Give yourself time (6 weeks at least) between testing and be sure to taper before the tests. Otherwise, you'll either not see gains or test crappy or both.
Good luck!
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