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Official FIT ASSISTANCE for the Quintana Roo PR Tri Bikes
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Hello Slowtwitch Family,

My name is Ian Murray. I’m a bike fitter, and a bike fit instructor at both the Fit Institute Slowtwitch school and the Guru Academy.

I’ve launched this thread in a QR endorsed capacity to help you select the right size Quintana Roo PR tri bike. Not just the right size but also the proper stem length, spacers, arm pad pedestal, pad position – all the details to make it right for you. My mission is specific and narrow: I’m not empowered to handle all aspects of customer service, or warranty, or grip tape wrap direction, or what-have-you…..but I’m willing, eager, and enthused about YOUR BEST FIT on a QR.

I have some strong opinions about how one should go about buying a bike and look out, 'cause here they come:
  1. PRESCRIPTIVE FIT...The best way to buy a QR PR Six, Five, Four, or Three is to go to an educated, experience bike fitter who has a dynamic fit bike. That "prescriptive fit" process will yield your Pad Y and Pad X (Pad Stack and Pad Reach if you must), and all the fit coordinates you need to make your QR an extension of your body. If that's the path for you let me know on this thread where you live (or are traveling to) and I'll consult my list of amazing fitters.
  2. REFERENCE AN OLD BIKE…..If you’ve got an old tri bike now and you like your position then let me know here on this thread and I’ll detail how you can measure the Pad Y and Pad X of that bike at home. I can use those numbers to prescribe all the details of the right QR for you.
  3. FORMULA….If all you have to offer is your overall height, your inseam, and your saddle height – great, I’ll take it! With that I can get pretty darn close to your Pad Y and Pad X and prescribe the details from there.


If you haven’t yet seen the amazing colors, build options, and all the details of the new line of Quintana Roo Tri Bike then click HERE to see these amazing bikes.


Ian

Ian Murray
http://www.TriathlonTrainingSeries.com
I like the pursuit of mastery
Twitter - @TriCoachIan
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Re: Official FIT ASSISTANCE for the Quintana Roo PR Tri Bikes [ianpeace] [ In reply to ]
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Hey, measurements from my recent bike fit below for you, interested in which size I would need; I'm also based in the UK so can only buy the frameset from what I can find. Would you recommend buying the same PD handlebars to pair with the frame?

Pad stack 680
Pad reach 455
Saddle Height 840
Saddle Setback 70
Saddle to Pad Drop 145
Saddle to Pad Reach 550


Cheers

@the.lazy.triathlete

https://www.strava.com/athletes/18691068
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Re: Official FIT ASSISTANCE for the Quintana Roo PR Tri Bikes [TLT] [ In reply to ]
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Quote:
Hey, measurements from my recent bike fit below for you, interested in which size I would need; I'm also based in the UK so can only buy the frameset from what I can find. Would you recommend buying the same PD handlebars to pair with the frame?

Pad stack 680
Pad reach 455
Saddle Height 840
Saddle Setback 70
Saddle to Pad Drop 145
Saddle to Pad Reach 550

TLT,
Based on your Pad Stack of 680 and Pad Reach 455...

If you go after the QR PRSix (and you should, that bike is so sweet!) the best fit for you is the 54cm bike with the 110mm stem, bracket set rearward, and armrest bolted in front hole. This will give you the Pad X to rear of pad of 455. To get the Pad Y of 680 place the stem bar clamp in the middle, and add 50mm of arm pad pedestal. You can also get this position almost exactly on the size 56 too - if you end up going that way, get back to me here and I'll work out the details (you can get it done on the 52 as well but requires 70mm of arm pad pedestal and while it works perfectly I don't consider it optimal).

The Profile-Design bar that come spec'd on the PRSix is the Aeria Ultimate and I simply cannot speak highly enough about that bar. I like how the junction box of Di2 can be hidden inside the stem, how all the wires are routed internally, and how stable and sound that bar feels.

If you were considering the PR5, PR4 or PR3 get back to me as that bike is a different spec. Also, are you going rim brake or disc?

Ian

Ian Murray
http://www.TriathlonTrainingSeries.com
I like the pursuit of mastery
Twitter - @TriCoachIan
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Re: Official FIT ASSISTANCE for the Quintana Roo PR Tri Bikes [TLT] [ In reply to ]
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I'm just going to add that it's really helpful to know whether pad x is to rear or centre.
And - given that QR generally come with PD bars (which all tilt) the angle of your pads/extensions is quite important as it can change the xy markedly.

Speedtheory
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Re: Official FIT ASSISTANCE for the Quintana Roo PR Tri Bikes [ianpeace] [ In reply to ]
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Thanks for taking the time to respond, sorry I didn’t realise the PR6-4 had different geometries. I’m looking at both the 6 and 5 (which I would put di2 on) and it would be the disc brake version.

I’m basically weighing up a couple of options with this being my disc brake option and most likely the Ribble Ultra Tri as a rim brake option. The weather is grim most of the year around over here and I’m a heavier rider, so having disc braking is appealing to me.

Cyclenutznz - I asked my fitter and the coords are to the centre of the pad. I don’t have the tilt angle on my report, but using a picture they are set angled up around 20 degrees.

I imagine these numbers are a higher/shorter position than most around here so just for context; I’m 6ft 2, with relatively long legs and long forearms, and too much weight around the midsection! It was my first Tri Bike Fit and I don’t think it would take me too long to get into a longer/lower position as I adapt to it. So a frame that could accommodate that position growth would be ideal.
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Re: Official FIT ASSISTANCE for the Quintana Roo PR Tri Bikes [TLT] [ In reply to ]
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I've taken 40mm from pad x to get the measurement to the rear.

This is what we get if we use the standard way of calculating (not accounting for tilt) with a PD Aeria Ultimate bar


But you'll see that a lot more stack is required on the bars once we account for how much they move when tilted


The max tilt of the AU is 15 Deg - not many integrated bars go to 20.
The impact of tilt is magnified in your case because you need a big frame for the Pad Y and a lot of offset in order to hit X. The higher the pad offset the great the impact of tilting.

Actually, we can take this a step further.


If you have any thought of using the HSF Aeria bottle - it's much easier to fit on the 100mm stem. But you can see that the required increase in pad offset further increases the stack required.

With that brief delve into aerobar trigonometry done, which of these is the best size for you?

I'd go with the 56 (which is the same as a Cervelo 58 for context) - it has room to go up if needed, but more importantly there is plenty of room to stretch out and go lower over time, without compromising handling. Your position at this point is very conservative - you wouldn't have any issue adapting over time with the above setup.

Speedtheory
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Re: Official FIT ASSISTANCE for the Quintana Roo PR Tri Bikes [cyclenutnz] [ In reply to ]
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Well that’s awesome! Thanks for showing how the tilt effects things and for going the extra mile on the HSF Aeria bottle, which I will be going with, really helpful for me! Cheers


Edit - sorry to be an utter PITA, but if I also consider the PRfive rim brake option also, do you know if the HSF Aeria bottle fits the bike or if the front brake gets in the way? I’d be looking to change the front brake to a TriRig omega x, if that changes it further.

@the.lazy.triathlete

https://www.strava.com/athletes/18691068
Last edited by: TLT: Aug 20, 19 6:17
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Re: Official FIT ASSISTANCE for the Quintana Roo PR Tri Bikes [ianpeace] [ In reply to ]
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Hi Ian

Height 186cm
Inseam 87cm
Saddle height 779mm

Looking for best bang for buck option

Thanks
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Re: Official FIT ASSISTANCE for the Quintana Roo PR Tri Bikes [TLT] [ In reply to ]
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TLT wrote:
do you know if the HSF Aeria bottle fits the bike or if the front brake gets in the way? I’d be looking to change the front brake to a TriRig omega x, if that changes it further.

No problem to do that, especially if you use Omega X. You might find this post helpful https://forum.slowtwitch.com/...ost=6532151#p6532151
I haven't had a chance to test, but it's quite likely that a PR5 with AU and HSF Aeria is the fastest QR option. The PR6 can't take the bottle.

Speedtheory
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Re: Official FIT ASSISTANCE for the Quintana Roo PR Tri Bikes [cyclenutnz] [ In reply to ]
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cyclenutnz wrote:
TLT wrote:
do you know if the HSF Aeria bottle fits the bike or if the front brake gets in the way? I’d be looking to change the front brake to a TriRig omega x, if that changes it further.


No problem to do that, especially if you use Omega X. You might find this post helpful https://forum.slowtwitch.com/...ost=6532151#p6532151
I haven't had a chance to test, but it's quite likely that a PR5 with AU and HSF Aeria is the fastest QR option. The PR6 can't take the bottle.


That's bloody brilliant, again thank you very much!

@the.lazy.triathlete

https://www.strava.com/athletes/18691068
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Re: Official FIT ASSISTANCE for the Quintana Roo PR Tri Bikes [ianpeace] [ In reply to ]
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Greetings and thank you in advance. I currently ride a 2012 Cervelo P2, and am SERIOUSLY considering getting the QR PR4 with Reynolds race wheels. Before pulling the trigger, I'd like to know if my fit specs (Retul) could be matched or improved on the PR4.

I'm 5'10" and 175 lbs (165 race weight). Experience-wise, I have three 70.3s and one full IM (Santa Rosa) under my belt. Fully honest, my IMSR bike time was embarrassingly slow, which I attribute to my fitness, poor previous bike fit, the climbs and the head/cross winds.

The following are my specs from the Retul fit performed recently in Sacramento:

Arm Pad Stack: 625
Arm Pad Reach: 406 (tip of saddle to back of pad)
Arm Pad Drop: -92
Arm Pad Reach BB: 423 (BB horiz. to back of pad)
Saddle Height: 726
Saddle Setback: 17
Grip Reach: 674 (tip of saddle to front end of grip)
Arm Pad to Grip Reach: 268
Grip Width: 420
Arm Pad Width: 261
Handlebar Stack: 571

I'm not sure how I feel about my fit right now. I'm much more comfortable than before it was done, however I still have significant fatigue and stiffness in neck and shoulders while in aero bars.

I'm now 12 weeks from Ironman Arizona, so even if I do buy the PR4, I think it wise to ride the Cervelo P2 for the race.

Your thoughts on the info provided and my question?

Poor Swimmer. Weak Cyclist. Slow Runner.
Na Koa Lina Polu Racing Team
Blue Line Warriors
Last edited by: weakandpuny: Aug 30, 19 14:23
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Re: Official FIT ASSISTANCE for the Quintana Roo PR Tri Bikes [weakandpuny] [ In reply to ]
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Quote:
Greetings and thank you in advance. I currently ride a 2012 Cervelo P2, and am SERIOUSLY considering getting the QR PR4 with Reynolds race wheels. Before pulling the trigger, I'd like to know if my fit specs (Retul) could be matched or improved on the PR4.

I'm 5'10" and 175 lbs (165 race weight). Experience-wise, I have three 70.3s and one full IM (Santa Rosa) under my belt. Fully honest, my IMSR bike time was embarrassingly slow, which I attribute to my fitness, poor previous bike fit, the climbs and the head/cross winds.

The following are my specs from the Retul fit performed recently in Sacramento:

Arm Pad Stack: 625
Arm Pad Reach: 406 (tip of saddle to back of pad)
Arm Pad Drop: -92
Arm Pad Reach BB: 423 (BB horiz. to back of pad)
Saddle Height: 726
Saddle Setback: 17
Grip Reach: 674 (tip of saddle to front end of grip)
Arm Pad to Grip Reach: 268
Grip Width: 420
Arm Pad Width: 261
Handlebar Stack: 571

I'm not sure how I feel about my fit right now. I'm much more comfortable than before it was done, however I still have significant fatigue and stiffness in neck and shoulders while in aero bars.

I'm now 12 weeks from Ironman Arizona, so even if I do buy the PR4, I think it wise to ride the Cervelo P2 for the race.

Your thoughts on the info provided and my question?

weakandpuny,
Let me start with just my fitter's hat on....Pad Y of 625 - I love it, I know that number and the QR PR4 can get there. "Pad Reach" Let's not allow ourselves to get confused. Your Pad X is 423 and that's the nubmer we need to prescribe a bike.

52cm QR PR4 with the stem configured in the -17 degree position, and 10mm of arm rest riser would get you to 626. Then, if the arm cups are bolted three holes forward of all-the-way-back you get 421 - and plenty of range to move fore-aft of that.

I know what you might be thinking...."I'm 5'10" what you doing putting me on a 52cm bike? Would that be for somebody 5'4"?" The answer is no. Don't be deceived by the sizing - you'd also fit on a 50, but not on a 54cm.

No I'm gonna slice that fitter's hat and sew it to half of my coach's hat.... You MUST find comfort in aero for Arizona. Your fastest bike split there will come from lots of time in the aerobars and very little time up on the bullhorns stretching and recovering. There are three places I'd check: 1) 92mm of drop is ~13% of seat height. If you came up 5mm first and then maybe 10mm I bet you'd find relief. 2) 261 pad width is fine if you have narrow shoulders or are super flexible, take 'em a bit wider and try that. Tweak #1 first, if you need more comfort try slightly wider pad. Lastly, consider tilting your aerobars up a hair - this will drop the arm pad so consider lifting the front end it 5mm first and then rotate them a bit.

Lastly, your coordinates are your coordinates. It doesn't matter if you're on a Cervelo, QR, or bamboo tri bike - when you're in the right spot you can ride for days in complete joy. This means you could buy the QR 3 days before Arizona and as long as it set to the right spot it'll be perfect. That said, the Cervelo isn't in the right spot 'cause you get pain. Order the bike, tinker with the position and find your happy place.

Get back to me with questions, Ian

Ian Murray
http://www.TriathlonTrainingSeries.com
I like the pursuit of mastery
Twitter - @TriCoachIan
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Re: Official FIT ASSISTANCE for the Quintana Roo PR Tri Bikes [weakandpuny] [ In reply to ]
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Couple of questions:
- Which saddle are you on?
- Are your elbows on the armrests? Aerobar length is very short

Backing up Ian - you need to get a good position sorted as the priority for IM, getting a new bike won't fix your discomfort and may be frustrating as a result (instead of exciting as it should be).

Speedtheory
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Re: Official FIT ASSISTANCE for the Quintana Roo PR Tri Bikes [ianpeace] [ In reply to ]
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I'm the same size roughly (5'10" 155) and ride a 56 Cervelo P3 circa 2011 at home. I rented a 52 Quintana Roo for age group nationals. The 52 QR fit me perfectly. What a nice bike. It was so hard to turn it back in after the race! But we will always have Cleveland.
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Re: Official FIT ASSISTANCE for the Quintana Roo PR Tri Bikes [Jon] [ In reply to ]
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Quote:
I'm the same size roughly (5'10" 155) I rented a 52 Quintana Roo for age group nationals. The 52 QR fit me perfectly. What a nice bike. It was so hard to turn it back in after the race! But we will always have Cleveland.

Jon, So glad you had a good experience on that bike. They are so fine!!!

Ian

Ian Murray
http://www.TriathlonTrainingSeries.com
I like the pursuit of mastery
Twitter - @TriCoachIan
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Re: Official FIT ASSISTANCE for the Quintana Roo PR Tri Bikes [cyclenutnz] [ In reply to ]
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My saddles is an ISM Adamo Attack (which I think is called the PN2 or something now). My forearms are on the pads, with the elbow just at the back of the pad. What I thought was a good fit in the studio, for a few minutes at a time in the aero position, turns out to be quite the strain on my neck on the road. The only thing remotely comfortable is to look just a few feet in front of my tire, and look forward frequently to check for hazards, then look back down again.

Poor Swimmer. Weak Cyclist. Slow Runner.
Na Koa Lina Polu Racing Team
Blue Line Warriors
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Re: Official FIT ASSISTANCE for the Quintana Roo PR Tri Bikes [ianpeace] [ In reply to ]
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Thank you Ian. I plan to take your advice and move my Cervelo’s pads up 5-10mm and set them wider. I have fairly broad shoulders and a wide back (I used to lift a lot of weight...I got over it), and have always felt the aero bars were just way to narrow for my build. If I find my neck and shoulder pain is resolved, I’ Just consider these to be my new fit specs on the Quintana Roo PRFour I JUST ORDERED! BOOYA! Pulled the trigger. I’m gonna be the coolest looking BOP’er at IMAZ. LOL. Thanks for your advice. I’ll update you later on the results.

Poor Swimmer. Weak Cyclist. Slow Runner.
Na Koa Lina Polu Racing Team
Blue Line Warriors
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Re: Official FIT ASSISTANCE for the Quintana Roo PR Tri Bikes [ianpeace] [ In reply to ]
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An additional question, Ian. So the 10mm arm rest riser would get me to where my current fit is, but you're recommending 5-10mm higher, for a total of 631-636? I wanna make sure I understand and have it correct in my (weakandpuny) brain before I go monkeying around with things.

Thanks again.

Poor Swimmer. Weak Cyclist. Slow Runner.
Na Koa Lina Polu Racing Team
Blue Line Warriors
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Re: Official FIT ASSISTANCE for the Quintana Roo PR Tri Bikes [weakandpuny] [ In reply to ]
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Quote:
I’ Just consider these to be my new fit specs on the Quintana Roo PRFour I JUST ORDERED! BOOYA! Pulled the trigger. I’m gonna be the coolest looking BOP’er at IMAZ. LOL. Thanks for your advice. I’ll update you later on the results.

So the 10mm arm rest riser would get me to where my current fit is, but you're recommending 5-10mm higher, for a total of 631-636? I wanna make sure I understand and have it correct in my (weakandpuny) brain before I go monkeying around with things.

weakandpuny,

Congratulations!!!

When your new bike arrives you'll be pleasantly surprised at home much of the assembly is already done. Get the seat height and setback of that saddle where you like it (based on fit and old bike). Then set up the front end the same but - lift the bars 10mm (636 or a hair more) with spacers and widen the arm pads to give yourself some relief. Remember it's FAR more aero to be in on comfy aerobars for extended periods of time than super uncomfortable aerobars for a few minutes then the bull horns to stretch and recover.

Don't hesitate to post pics/vids, I'll gladly weigh in.

Ian

Ian Murray
http://www.TriathlonTrainingSeries.com
I like the pursuit of mastery
Twitter - @TriCoachIan
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Re: Official FIT ASSISTANCE for the Quintana Roo PR Tri Bikes [ianpeace] [ In reply to ]
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I'll happily post pics when I can. Hell, I was even considering raising 20-40mm just to relieve the neck pain / discomfort.

Thanks,
Craig

Poor Swimmer. Weak Cyclist. Slow Runner.
Na Koa Lina Polu Racing Team
Blue Line Warriors
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Re: Official FIT ASSISTANCE for the Quintana Roo PR Tri Bikes [ianpeace] [ In reply to ]
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An additional question, Ian. What are the negative repercussions should I choose to raise my pads higher than what you recommend, i.e. 30, 40, or 50mm? I understand it would make me slightly less aero, but I appreciate the importance of maximizing my time in the aero position, especially for IMAZ. I just don't want to go too high and have it affect my hips, knees, or something else. I'm still a rookie with regards to fit stuff.

Thanks

Poor Swimmer. Weak Cyclist. Slow Runner.
Na Koa Lina Polu Racing Team
Blue Line Warriors
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Re: Official FIT ASSISTANCE for the Quintana Roo PR Tri Bikes [ianpeace] [ In reply to ]
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Hi Ian, Thanks for doing this. I currently ride a 2014 Speed Concept, and am looking at getting the QR PR4 with Reynolds race wheels.

I'm 5'10" and 160 lbs.

The following are my specs from the Retul fit performed about a 2 years ago.

Arm Pad Stack: 693
Arm Pad Reach: 382
Arm Pad Drop: -67
Arm Pad Reach BB: 693
Saddle Height: 772
Saddle Setback: -17
Grip Reach: 748
Grip Drop: -37
Arm Pad to Grip Reach: 366
Grip Width: 105
Arm Pad Width: 214
Handlebar Stack: 638

I like my current fit. I have the flexibility to get lower (at least I use too) but I can't stay there due to lower back issues. So my Retul settings really feel good.
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Re: Official FIT ASSISTANCE for the Quintana Roo PR Tri Bikes [ianpeace] [ In reply to ]
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Pad Stack 640
Pad Reach 440 to back of pad
Saddle Height 819


Thanks in advance.
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Re: Official FIT ASSISTANCE for the Quintana Roo PR Tri Bikes [ianpeace] [ In reply to ]
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Hi Ian,

Thank you very much for offering assistance! I had my fit in June and purchased a PR4 disc (size 54) based on a recommendation from the fitter. I had been riding a 2015 PR6 (also size 54) for a few years and love it, but was interested in upgrading to disc brakes. I also asked the bike shop to install Di2 on the PR4 to complete the upgrade. While doing some research on Slowtwitch, I became very interested in the AU stem and HSF aeria hydration. I consulted with the bike shop to ensure it would work with my fit, and he thought it would. The bike shop owner was awesome throughout the build process. After getting the bike and riding the PR4 for a few weeks, I did some measurements yesterday and discovered my stack, reach, and drop are each 5cm off. I didn't notice because this is an entirely new fit position for me and more aggressive than my previous position on the PR6. While I love the AU stem, bar, and hydration, I'm not sure my fit can be accomplished with them since I don't think adjustments can make it go any lower than it currently is. Based on my fit coordinates below, my three primary questions are:

1) Can I achieve my fit with the current AU cockpit on my size 54 PR4?
2) If not, can I achieve my fit with a different stem/bar configuration?
3) OR can I achieve my fit on my size 54 PR6 (maybe with some modifications)? It has the original 2015 fork/stem.

Fit Coordinates on QR PR4 Disc (the first number is from the fitting, the second is where the bike is currently set):
  • Pad Reach (BB center to middle of elbow rest): 545 (currently 495)
  • Pad Stack (BB center to middle of elbow rest, pad removed): 600 (currently 650)
  • Aerobar drop (top of saddle to elbow rest, pad removed): 140 (currently 90)
  • Cockpit (saddle tip to extension end): 870 (currently 870)
  • Extension length (back of pad to extension end): 385 (currently 390, which feels good for where my elbows rest)
  • Extension angle: 10 degrees (currently 10 degrees)
  • Setback: saddle tip to BB center (-17). I didn't measure this, but it seems more than 17 when I eyeball it).
  • Seat height: 743 (currently 753 because I started feeling some knee pain, so raised it 1cm which has helped)
  • Seat tube angle: 81 (seat is currently set back at about 77 in order to achieve proper cockpit length)
  • Reach to pad (tip of saddle to center of rear elbow rest): 535 (currently 535)
  • Pad width: 230 (currently at 210, which feels comfortable)
  • Tip Width C-C: 85 (I don't know what this is, so didn't measure it)
  • Crank Length: 160
Equipment
  • Saddle - ISM PN 1.1 (same saddle I've been riding for several years). Also, some of the coordinates above are taken from the tip of this saddle, so they may be incorrect since it's noseless)
  • Stem: Aeria Ultimate 100mm
  • Bar/Pads: Aeria Ultimate
I am planning on selling one of the bikes, and your answer will help determine which one.Thank you for any help you can provide!

Greg
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Re: Official FIT ASSISTANCE for the Quintana Roo PR Tri Bikes [weakandpuny] [ In reply to ]
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Quote:
An additional question, Ian. What are the negative repercussions should I choose to raise my pads higher than what you recommend, i.e. 30, 40, or 50mm? I understand it would make me slightly less aero, but I appreciate the importance of maximizing my time in the aero position, especially for IMAZ. I just don't want to go too high and have it affect my hips, knees, or something else. I'm still a rookie with regards to fit stuff.

weakandpuny, don't go crazy on "the up". There's probably a place...5mm higher, 10mm higher were you'll get all the relief you want/need and you won't creep up into a place that starts to diminish performance. Sure, as you said, you get up in the wind and it just becomes kinda silly. Moreover, if you come up too high you start to loose some ability to produce power glute and hip flexor and you might even rotate yourself into a position where the saddle is no longer comfy. Take it step by step you'll probably be surprised how a little step has a huge gain in comfort.

Ian

Ian Murray
http://www.TriathlonTrainingSeries.com
I like the pursuit of mastery
Twitter - @TriCoachIan
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