JoelO, I think it was you, so youre getting the credit:) You were saying that you felt you were kicking the best when you could feel the water between your toes. I've been focusing on that during the kick sets and it seems that I have to almost completely relax my feet but finally am feeling what you described and it definitely has made my kick stronger and me faster

Thanks, but I think it was tallswimmer that talked about that...it's a great tip!

I might have said something along the lines of having loose ankles. If you're interested, Gary Hall Sr. shows some drills in this swimisode to work on ankle flexibility.

http://theraceclub.com/tag/backstroke-kick/

Dan,


Please would you post the workouts of week 8 as soon as possible.

I plan to do the first workout tomorrow, Monday morning 6 o´clock and I am UTC +1.

Thank you!!!


Bastri

Hi

Very much enjoying the Guppy Workouts again.

I'm feeling very good about my improvements in the Horizontal & Vertical planes.

I am though struggling with the EVF drills - i guess its highlighting a weakness because when I really focus on it, my arms feel dead after only 100-200M. Guess they're working harder than they ever have....

Is there anything outside the pool I can do to get stronger so this improves quickly. or is it just a case of tough it out?

Dan's busy in LV. Here's last year's workout which, if he follows pattern, will be the same this year: http://www.slowtwitch.com/...nge_Week_8_6179.html

Google's your friend. If you need the next two use the following search (no quotes): "site:slowtwitch.com guppy challenge 9" Replace 9 with 10 for the last workout.

davidwilcock and bearlyfinish,

I too struggle with improving time. I've come to the conclusion that if you can't make it faster, try to make it easier. And always use the excuse that "I swim slow to take time to enjoy the underwater scenery" and "my physique is more of a barge than a fish" :-p

Just started triathlon and "learning" to freestyle three years ago. Each year was something gained to make it "easier" and more enjoyable. Year one was just going from near exhaustion for one lap, to exhausted after 1500 m. Year two was picking up how important body rotation was - the TechTock swim tool and "swimming on your side" drills helped. That's when swimming started to feel easier - funner.

This year is finally breaking into three stroke breathing and feeling comfortable with it. One suggestion would be to keep doing three stroke until you're tired enough that you feel you need that extra breath, drop into two stroke for one or two, and then go back to three stroke. Another instance is when you feel like your legs are sinking, or you feel your form deteriorating. I think of it as "resetting the stroke" until you can relax your breathing again, and go back at it with three stroke.

More big lessons learned were from here on Guppy Challenge. This week's statement of "swim downhill" - get that head down in the water looking down. It "feels" like less effort is being needed to move. And another is just how important that kick is. A coach has suggested limit the distance between your feet to 6 inches. I'm starting to feel some gains from this and just need to get the right "rythym" of 2 - 6 kicks per stroke. Yesterday's kick session tried using this for the kick drill and sped the feet up - like a propeller. It seemed faster - well at least too fast to be able to count the tiles on the bottom of the pool :-p.

Also, try your kick drills w/o fins using a center snorkel instead of a kick board. You get more of a "feel" of what kick should really be like while freestyle swimming.

These are just things I'm learning - but the coaches can give you even better direction.

I'm just hoping the lessons learned this year can allow a comfortable 2.4 mile swim taking on some underwater scenery @ #IMLOU :-)

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#OldMenTriHarder
#SwimBikeRunLikeABadger
#SwimBikeRunLikeAngels

All I can say is this shit works. Did my long swim for time this morning and swam 1750 yds in 26:29:00 which knocked a minute & 16sec off my p.r.and the kicker was I had gas left in the tank. I'm thinking my gains are coming from using the snorkel in the drills which allows me to concentrate on body position. Feels like I'm swimming faster with less effort.

Last week - Thanks for the last nine. And thanks for the post this week. It has given a little glimmer of hope after drills yesterday. Simultaneously starting the Guppy Challenge was to also develop the ability to bilateral breath. And while doing both, I have seen my splits get slower.
Your post on hypoxic breathing shed some light on maybe "why"?
The first 25 yds of any set go smoothly. After that, I can feel the exhaustion set in, and form fall apart, forcing a slow down. Shifting to a 3-3-2-2-3-3 breathing to catch breath and get back focused on form.
The only drill that this doesn't happen, is the bound feet - it seems like flying through the water even with bilateral breathing, to the point of feeling like having more gas to go even faster.
Once kicking is added to the equation, exhaustion quickly sets in.
Like yourself, I'm "older" - mid 50's, and have a resting HR in the low 50's. Maybe faster swimming at this age just is not going to be in the cards.

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#OldMenTriHarder
#SwimBikeRunLikeABadger
#SwimBikeRunLikeAngels

i don't know why you'd want to bilateral breathe. oxygen is your friend. breathing on both sides? yes. very helpful. bilateral breathing as a pattern, tho, no.

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Dan Empfield
aka Slowman

Thanks Dan. Your the first coach to say this. Everyone else was saying "You have to do bilateral".

Workout 2 this week is a 1000 yd TT. For the sake of curiosity, I will do this one bilateral to compare it to the TT earlier in the year. And then do another 1000 TT next week breathing every two strokes.

Workout 3 this week is a 50's party. We'll try to get some SWOLF trials from these for comparison to earlier this year, as well.

And report out.

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#OldMenTriHarder
#SwimBikeRunLikeABadger
#SwimBikeRunLikeAngels

This is my first year for the challenge. I've only missed one swim, due to the flu, but hit all other Tuna workouts. I'm not sure my overall swim times dropped, maybe a wee bit. However, I have noticed three things improved significantly.

-1 I've cut my recovery times between sets & intervals significantly. I used to use a :15 per 100 model, now pretty much :05 per 100. Maybe sneak a little longer if I'm really gassed

-2 I've gotten far better at pacing, for example this morning's 10 x 200 I held a 1:31-1:32 100 pace for all 10 intervals; whereas, in the past I'd start off the first few intervals < 1:30 and end up at or over 1:35 for the final couple intervals and really sucking wind.

-3 I never worked on my kick with any regularity until now. Having dedicated kicks sets in each workout has made my back feel better. I injured my back almost two years ago and have had a long slow recovery. I honestly think the introduction of kick sets has made a difference.

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The secret of a long life is you try not to shorten it.
-Nobody

I agree with you there.

I am 55+ and I just finished the third 1000y time trial. My time dropped from 23:16->22:57->22:42. Some improvement ( approx. 2% by my math) but 30 seconds over 1000y it is measurement noise. I wasn't expecting miracles with this experiment but I am disappointed with the results. I don't swim measurably faster. My 100 splits are still around 2:15-2:20 for any interval > 150y. I still need 1:15-1:20 to kick two lengths (50y) with zoomers (I still can't make it across the pool without fins). I can still feel my body wiggling, my legs sinking and my head rising, no matter how hard I focus.

Thank goodness for the few duathlons available.

ETA: On today's TT, I wasn't as tired as the first TT. I suspect that's a side effect of adding a fourth workout to the weekly schedule.

Have you tried using the center snorkel while doing your kick sets?

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#OldMenTriHarder
#SwimBikeRunLikeABadger
#SwimBikeRunLikeAngels

Martin, have you posted a video of your stroke? It would be interesting to see a video of your 50 kick (with zoomers) as well.

You probably have some form issues but I'm curious about your turnover and kick rate. I'm just guessing here, but based on personal experience (I'm 58, btw), your turnover rate is probably a lot slower than what it "feels". You can test this with a Finis Tempo Trainer. Set the Tempo Trainer to 1 second in mode 1 and swim to that cadence. Every time you here a beep one of your hands should be entering the water. That's a 2 second stroke cycle. That's slow. You probably want to work your way down to .75 - .85 per hand strike. You can gradually do this using the Tempo Trainer on sets of 25's or 50's or you could do some descending or "all out" sets of the same. Over time, this kind of practice will lead to faster turnover and cruise paces.

Hi Joel,

I require between 28 and 32 strokes to complete 25y and, based on all the 50 intervals in the program, I average between 62 and 64 seconds per 50 (so, say around 31-32 per 25y). Sometimes faster; sometimes slower.

I have no idea what my kick rate is. I've tried counting but I get lost. I'm constantly kicking so a six-beat per stroke cycle is probably close.

My big fear, and it is a fear (I have nightmares about it), is lack of air. This goes back 50 years to when my mother first brought me to Gath Pool in Newton to learn to swim (or try to learn). I am also a strong runner and I breath between 40 and 45 times per minute when running a tempo pace and above. With almost 30k miles under my feet, I suspect my body is used to this breathing pattern.

I don't have a video. I swim in a private (employer owned) pool so getting other people in is a challenge. I can try to find a co-worker who may be able to take a video.

I'm at the end of the Guppy Challenge - 1 more workout to complete. I've done 3 workouts per week for the past 10 weeks (actually, I had to start pre-Guppy workouts in Oct so that I could do the Guppy workouts). I can swim a little faster (5 seconds off 1000 yds), but that's not the biggest improvement. Now 1) I have better endurance and don't slow down at the end of workouts, 2) I have a much better idea about what I need to do to continue to improve, and 3) this is the big one... I actually look forward to swim workouts!

What's next? I signed up today with U.S. Masters Swimming, and I contacted a local masters club to join next week. I now have the confidence that I can at least keep up in the slow lane. I'm also going to get a swim video/critique done.

Nothing earth shattering accomplished, but I'm on my way to better swimming. Last summer, I just got tired of swimming slow and decided to do something about it this winter and beyond.

will we have a Guppy Challenge this year?

I have lost sooooooo many "water feel" with this corona problem, that I would need the extra motivation of this challenge to recover!

No need to wait for the official challenge.
The past few years I have used the Guppy challenge workouts that you can find in the Training/Swimming dropdown in the banner at the top of the page to kickstart my swimming after a winter layoff. These days I use the tarpon or tuna yardage and find having the set workouts makes swimming more engaging and enjoyable.
A silver lining from Covid for me has been that since I don't have to get my daughter to school at 7:00am we have time to swim in the mornings together before I go to work.