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Fit Bike Shenanigans (or Am I Doing it Wrong?)
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I've been using a fit bike for many years - a Retul Muve and now a Guru DFU. I get fits sent to me from time to time and also see other fits that shops post, and TWICE now I've seen this exact setup in different shops - 30 mm spacers and an adjustable stem pitched way, way, way up. That seems, to me, like a completely incorrect use of a fit bike. But I want to try and be diplomatic, so can someone explain why two shops (with no interaction with each other) would do this on their fit bike?



Trent Nix
Tri Shop - Plano, Texas
http://www.trishop.com
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F.I.S.T. Advanced Certified Fitter | Retul Master Certified Fitter - Fit Portfolio
Last edited by: trentnix: Nov 18, 17 6:13
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Re: Fit Bike Shenanigans (or Am I Doing it Wrong?) [trentnix] [ In reply to ]
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Wow, I have never seen it used on a fit bike like this but it do makes you wonder if they set up their fit bike like this how they set up their sold bikes. We do have a shop here in the netherlands that send people out the door with 8 or 9 cm towers of spacers under the stem. On road or tri. They do this on their housebrand bikes and tell the customers that the fork is built for this purpose.
I have seen in mutiple occasions.

But, yes, why would do it on your fit bike. I can’t really think of any reason

We should continue like we do ;-)

Best regards

Jeroen

Owner at TRIPRO, The Netherlands
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Re: Fit Bike Shenanigans (or Am I Doing it Wrong?) [trentnix] [ In reply to ]
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Trent when I am using the Retul Muve SL with the Angul fit stem i will vary the spacers depending on the fit the client is after. After I have completed a fit I will Zin the fit bike and look at whatever the handlebar stack or pad stack is at and then make the adjustments on the clients bike. Same thing as to what angle the fit stem is at this can be adjusted using spacers on the clients bike or by changing the stem angle also.

Happy fitting

Robert Driskell
Certified Master BodyGeometry Fit Technician since 2009
Bayou Bicycles New Orleans,LA
(Retailer of Specialized Bicycles)
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Re: Fit Bike Shenanigans (or Am I Doing it Wrong?) [Robert Driskell] [ In reply to ]
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When you say “what kind of fit the client is after” what do you mean? For your average fit (Triathlon), how many spacers and what stem pitch do you use?

Trent Nix
Tri Shop - Plano, Texas
http://www.trishop.com
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F.I.S.T. Advanced Certified Fitter | Retul Master Certified Fitter - Fit Portfolio
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Re: Fit Bike Shenanigans (or Am I Doing it Wrong?) [trentnix] [ In reply to ]
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When I refer to what kind of fit, I am talking about cycling discipline. As to an average amount of spacers that too is not something of reference as everybody is different with their body and ability. I use the Muve for Tri,TT,Road, Mountain, Cross, and fitness bike fits. But i usually leave a 10mm spacer on my Muve when I fit . Fit bikes are great especially when doing an athlete that does not yet have a bike.

Robert Driskell
Certified Master BodyGeometry Fit Technician since 2009
Bayou Bicycles New Orleans,LA
(Retailer of Specialized Bicycles)
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Re: Fit Bike Shenanigans (or Am I Doing it Wrong?) [tri-run] [ In reply to ]
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I try to always set the stem slammed down and then use pad or bar spacers to achieve the desired pad stack. Again this all depends on what is going on with the riders body.

Robert Driskell
Certified Master BodyGeometry Fit Technician since 2009
Bayou Bicycles New Orleans,LA
(Retailer of Specialized Bicycles)
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Re: Fit Bike Shenanigans (or Am I Doing it Wrong?) [Robert Driskell] [ In reply to ]
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Robert Driskell wrote:
Trent when I am using the Retul Muve SL with the Angul fit stem i will vary the spacers depending on the fit the client is after. After I have completed a fit I will Zin the fit bike and look at whatever the handlebar stack or pad stack is at and then make the adjustments on the clients bike. Same thing as to what angle the fit stem is at this can be adjusted using spacers on the clients bike or by changing the stem angle also.

Happy fitting

But i think there is a difference in what you are referring to of using and the set up of the fitbike in the picture Trent put up. That pic shows something like 30 -35 mm od spacers with an pretty high angled up stem. That really makes no sense i think.

Jeroen

Owner at TRIPRO, The Netherlands
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Re: Fit Bike Shenanigans (or Am I Doing it Wrong?) [tri-run] [ In reply to ]
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Makes a lot of sense if the clients body dictates the use of these spacers. The great thing about fit bikes is the ability to adapt the tool to whatever is presented

Robert Driskell
Certified Master BodyGeometry Fit Technician since 2009
Bayou Bicycles New Orleans,LA
(Retailer of Specialized Bicycles)
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Re: Fit Bike Shenanigans (or Am I Doing it Wrong?) [Robert Driskell] [ In reply to ]
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But why just not turn the fit bike to a higher stack position since it would not be wise to set up a real bike with 40 mm of spacers and a very angled up stem? At least in case of the pic of trent there is more then enough room on that muve to just stack up the front of the bike instead of using that amount of spacers and that angled stem.

Jeroen

Owner at TRIPRO, The Netherlands
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Re: Fit Bike Shenanigans (or Am I Doing it Wrong?) [trentnix] [ In reply to ]
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I've found myself doing this is when I have had a customer looking to be fit to an existing bike that needs way more stack than is natively reasonable. I mock up the shenanigans necessary to make it work on the fit bike. Has proven a worthwhile exercise to demonstrate to the client "we can make it work but..."

Custom Studio Manager for Diamondback Bikes.
Coaching and bike fit - http://source-e.net/ Cyclocross blog - https://crosssports.net/
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Re: Fit Bike Shenanigans (or Am I Doing it Wrong?) [fredly] [ In reply to ]
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fredly wrote:
I've found myself doing this is when I have had a customer looking to be fit to an existing bike that needs way more stack than is natively reasonable. I mock up the shenanigans necessary to make it work on the fit bike. Has proven a worthwhile exercise to demonstrate to the client "we can make it work but..."
You're braver than me, because that's expressly why we do fits on their existing bike. Doing the fit and then transferring the coordinates is a road fraught with peril and disappointment. When we do it using the customer's bike, we're guaranteed to avoid exceeding the limitations of their equipment.

Trent Nix
Tri Shop - Plano, Texas
http://www.trishop.com
Facebook | Twitter | Instagram | Youtube
F.I.S.T. Advanced Certified Fitter | Retul Master Certified Fitter - Fit Portfolio
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Re: Fit Bike Shenanigans (or Am I Doing it Wrong?) [tri-run] [ In reply to ]
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tri-run wrote:
But why just not turn the fit bike to a higher stack position since it would not be wise to set up a real bike with 40 mm of spacers and a very angled up stem? At least in case of the pic of trent there is more then enough room on that muve to just stack up the front of the bike instead of using that amount of spacers and that angled stem.

Jeroen
Bingo.

Trent Nix
Tri Shop - Plano, Texas
http://www.trishop.com
Facebook | Twitter | Instagram | Youtube
F.I.S.T. Advanced Certified Fitter | Retul Master Certified Fitter - Fit Portfolio
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Re: Fit Bike Shenanigans (or Am I Doing it Wrong?) [trentnix] [ In reply to ]
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trentnix wrote:
tri-run wrote:
But why just not turn the fit bike to a higher stack position since it would not be wise to set up a real bike with 40 mm of spacers and a very angled up stem? At least in case of the pic of trent there is more then enough room on that muve to just stack up the front of the bike instead of using that amount of spacers and that angled stem.

Jeroen
Bingo.

seems like spacers will be a part of every fit solution out of that particular fitter. Which is backwards... find pad X and Y and then compute the frame needed for that fit assuming a slammed stem

Eric Reid
AeroFit | Instagram Portfolio
Chapel Hill, NC
Aerodynamic Optimized Bike Fitting, Retul Pre-Purchase Bike Fitting, USAT Level 1 Triathlon Coaching, Nutrition
Ask me: Scody Optimized Speed Suits | CeramicSpeed Oversized Pulley Systems | HUUB Skinsuits and Wetsuits | Ventum Bicycles and Frames
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Re: Fit Bike Shenanigans (or Am I Doing it Wrong?) [ericMPro] [ In reply to ]
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Agreed. If you're building in spacers but using your judgement and/or math to remove them, the same can be done to put them back in.

Only logic I can see is that they used frame geometry only and got burned, selling bikes that were too big once or twice. And this is how they make sure that never happens again.

Trent Nix
Tri Shop - Plano, Texas
http://www.trishop.com
Facebook | Twitter | Instagram | Youtube
F.I.S.T. Advanced Certified Fitter | Retul Master Certified Fitter - Fit Portfolio
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Re: Fit Bike Shenanigans (or Am I Doing it Wrong?) [trentnix] [ In reply to ]
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trentnix wrote:
Agreed. If you're building in spacers but using your judgement and/or math to remove them, the same can be done to put them back in.

Only logic I can see is that they used frame geometry only and got burned, selling bikes that were too big once or twice. And this is how they make sure that never happens again.

haha... I haven't had a client with a too-big bike ever!

Eric Reid
AeroFit | Instagram Portfolio
Chapel Hill, NC
Aerodynamic Optimized Bike Fitting, Retul Pre-Purchase Bike Fitting, USAT Level 1 Triathlon Coaching, Nutrition
Ask me: Scody Optimized Speed Suits | CeramicSpeed Oversized Pulley Systems | HUUB Skinsuits and Wetsuits | Ventum Bicycles and Frames
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Re: Fit Bike Shenanigans (or Am I Doing it Wrong?) [trentnix] [ In reply to ]
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The point to having a modern fit bike is to eliminate the need to play with stems and spacers. All you need is to find the X/Y’s, then use math to calculate the stem/spacers needed to accommodate that with different frames.

Doug Baumgarten
Director, Sportfit Lab
IBFI Level 3 Bike Fitter
Marymount U. Triathlon Coach
Exercise Physiologist
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Re: Fit Bike Shenanigans (or Am I Doing it Wrong?) [Sportfitlab] [ In reply to ]
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The point of using a modern fit bike is to determine the riders precise fit parameters. We will always have to use spacers and stems to get this precise. The great thing is that these days there are so many stem options and spacer setups. Just do the math.

Robert Driskell
Certified Master BodyGeometry Fit Technician since 2009
Bayou Bicycles New Orleans,LA
(Retailer of Specialized Bicycles)
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Re: Fit Bike Shenanigans (or Am I Doing it Wrong?) [trentnix] [ In reply to ]
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There is no real reason I can think of unless the fit bike is maxed out in the stack adjustment.
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Re: Fit Bike Shenanigans (or Am I Doing it Wrong?) [S Teelers] [ In reply to ]
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I just finished reading the whole thread. Everybody's trying to be as precise as possible. Were debating how to get there.The problem is the precision is an illusion. our height varies by anywhere from 2 to 4 cm over the course of the day. Have you ever driven home in the evening parked the car went home and went to bed.Next morning you get up sit in the car and reach for the mirror .You are taller than you were when you exited the car. The same holds riding a bike. A long day on the bike will change the length of your torso. try This experiment .Measure someone 1st thing in the morning and after 4 PM. I will guess you get different numbers.The point is weather you use and shims are wedges on a Size bike Is not make a whole heck of a lot of different. If you work with your clients mobile adapters. Ankles hips elbows shoulders and wrists you can accommodate most of the changes to take place over the course of the day. Ever wanted bike race? See the team leader crash. His teammates will give him their bikes. No waiting for the mechanics. No passing of an Allen key. Off they go. The point is what we do is fit for a range of size is the cyclist were fitting will cover a range in one event. Fitting is teaching Where and how to sit on the bicycle. And the position should very climbing and descending sprinting" and cornering.This brings me back to the title . Or am I doing it wrong. Possibly we all are.
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Re: Fit Bike Shenanigans (or Am I Doing it Wrong?) [Happy] [ In reply to ]
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Happy wrote:
Fitting is teaching Where and how to sit on the bicycle. .... Or am I doing it wrong. Possibly we all are.

I would argue we should tell the bike how to hold the rider and not the other way around. Who works for whom?

Eric Reid
AeroFit | Instagram Portfolio
Chapel Hill, NC
Aerodynamic Optimized Bike Fitting, Retul Pre-Purchase Bike Fitting, USAT Level 1 Triathlon Coaching, Nutrition
Ask me: Scody Optimized Speed Suits | CeramicSpeed Oversized Pulley Systems | HUUB Skinsuits and Wetsuits | Ventum Bicycles and Frames
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Re: Fit Bike Shenanigans (or Am I Doing it Wrong?) [ericMPro] [ In reply to ]
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You are 100% correct. This is why I own Bike Cad. That’s the reason I work with custom frame builders and physical therapist. Fix The body. Build the bike around the rest of there needs and wants. We are responsible for figuring out how to make the whole package come together. Comfort and efficiency are the end goal.


Happy Freedman
Orthotic Consultant
Bike Fitting Specialist
Prosthetics and Orthotics/DME
Hospital for Special Surgery
510 East 73rd Street, Suite 201
New York, NY 10021
212.606.1262
646.797.8343 fax
https://www.hss.edu/...f_Freedman-Happy.asp
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Re: Fit Bike Shenanigans (or Am I Doing it Wrong?) [Happy] [ In reply to ]
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While putting 70mm of spacers may make a customer more comfortable, you've also increased the probability of having the steer tube having a catastrophic failure in particular if it's a fork with a carbon steerer. When a client needs that many spacers to ride their bike, they need to be sold a different bike, like an Endurance geo or more likely a flat bar bike.
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