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Second Confirmed Hidden Motor Used in a Bike Race
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A 53 year old amateur Italian ride was caught with a hidden seat tube motor in his Argon 18 road bike that he used to cheat to a 3rd place finish in a race. He was caught and confessed after the race organizers were tipped off by someone else and they used a thermal camera to catch the cheater red handed.

This is the second confirmed case of a hidden electric motor being used to cheat at a bike race with there being many more used that have gone undetected.

http://www.cyclingnews.com/...tor-at-italian-race/

The UCI has been using the magnetic compass on a regular iPad Mini to try to detect the hidden motors but Gadget Blues on YouTube has a VERY detailed breakdown on what that method simply doesn't work. It is extremely easy to shield a motor from emitting external magnetic fields with a thin sheet of a certain metal foil used commonly for this purpose.



I bet you there are many triathletes that have cheated with hidden electric motors and got away with it because no tri even attempts to catch motorized dopers. Tri's are so pathetic that they don't even use the flawed iPad Mini method let alone a thermal camera.

I think since the motorized doping problem is so widespread, thermal cameras need to be made standard in all races and that all competitors must remove their cranksets or seatposts before a race to allow race officials to check for hidden motors.
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Re: Second Confirmed Hidden Motor Used in a Bike Race [Hybridlete] [ In reply to ]
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Shame on him (or anyone else) for doing something like this, however,

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Tri's are so pathetic that they don't even use the flawed iPad Mini method let alone a thermal camera.
You're wrong.

http://www.slowtwitch.com/...ike_Motors_5752.html
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Re: Second Confirmed Hidden Motor Used in a Bike Race [logella] [ In reply to ]
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Surprised if Ironman is actually doing those checks. But even then, they look to be using the fatally flawed iPad Mini magnetometer method which Gadget Blues on YouTube shows in extreme detail why it doesn't work with just a thin sheet of metal shielding. Not to mention that the iPad Mini method ends up giving a higher reading for SRAM eTap components than for a hidden motor.
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Re: Second Confirmed Hidden Motor Used in a Bike Race [Hybridlete] [ In reply to ]
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Hybridlete wrote:
Surprised if Ironman is actually doing those checks.


I would be surprised if cheating is as rampant as you believe it is, so each to their own.
Last edited by: Durhamskier: Jul 30, 17 11:08
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Re: Second Confirmed Hidden Motor Used in a Bike Race [Hybridlete] [ In reply to ]
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To sum up the 28 minute video:

1. Use the free iPad app

2. Have a bike expert weigh the bike and look for exotic modifications

3. Pull the crank if you still have suspicion

I can see how this would work; I could also see where the Wide World of Mechanical Failures is going to increase with the complexity of the equipment being used.

DFL > DNF > DNS
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Re: Second Confirmed Hidden Motor Used in a Bike Race [Hybridlete] [ In reply to ]
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The vast majority of people are, obviously, going to be against mechanical doping. But I don't see it being practical to test or inspect all bikes. Afaik someone checks my helmet strap isn't too loose and that is it. Heat cameras are expensive things let alone the people needed to do it. Surely that level of inspection is only really needed if someone is getting something out of the race - say a top three or a qualification for something. They could also do some random testing given more time and resources.

One thing I'd like to see is some sort of automated crunching of splits. If we have enough check points on a course then it should be possible to apply very simple logic to the times and spot people cutting the course. Surely that is more common than motors and is pretty easy to do with almost no more investment. I once finished a sprint tri, looked at the results and it was obvious that 3 bike splits above me were way too fast. It was a very low key race so I think they are more likely to of taken a wrong turn. But the point was the race officials didn't even look until I pointed out that these times were faster than world record time trials. A computer should be highlighting this automatically.

But I think it would also be possible to apply a bit more sophisticated logic to that data and spot potential motor doping. I think you could potentially spot a pattern of motor use of an individual against all the other unassisted splits. Of course no-one would be guilty based on that but it could flag the need for an investigation of that bike. You'd then inspect the most suspicious bikes based on splits and the top finishers rather than everyone. I just think that is more practical.

The other thing is fixed point cameras on the bike course. A computer could highlight cyclists riding close together for long stretches. Then you could inspect the camera footage and make a pretty good judgement as to whether they were drafting. You might need more timing mats and you might choose a specific part of the course to concentrate them and the cameras. But I think, again, that isn't too hard to setup or prohibitively expensive. I fact a third party could do it independently and report/name and shame.
Last edited by: OddSlug: Jul 30, 17 11:14
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Re: Second Confirmed Hidden Motor Used in a Bike Race [OddSlug] [ In reply to ]
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OddSlug wrote:
The vast majority of people are, obviously, going to be against mechanical doping. But I don't see it being practical to test or inspect all bikes. Afaik someone checks my helmet strap isn't too loose and that is it. Heat cameras are expensive things let alone the people needed to do it. Surely that level of inspection is only really needed if someone is getting something out of the race - say a top three or a qualification for something. They could also do some random testing given more time and resources.

Thermal cameras are not expensive. You can even get a FLIR thermal camera add on for your phone for only a couple hundred dollars. There is no excuse for any tri to not have at least 1 or more thermal cameras, the cost is so low.

http://www.flir.com/store/
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Re: Second Confirmed Hidden Motor Used in a Bike Race [Durhamskier] [ In reply to ]
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Durhamskier wrote:
I would be surprised if cheating is as rampant as you believe it is, so each to their own.

With how widespread PED use in triathlons, are you seriously questioning the widespread use of hidden motors? Someone using PEDs would have no problems cheating with a hidden motor.
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Re: Second Confirmed Hidden Motor Used in a Bike Race [Hybridlete] [ In reply to ]
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If you can get a camera that cheap and you think it is that wide spread then do it. Get one, get a race organiser interested and let you stand at bike check in with the magnetic app as well. I don't mean that in a confrontational way, I'd genuinely be interested if you found any. I might even do it myself.
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Re: Second Confirmed Hidden Motor Used in a Bike Race [OddSlug] [ In reply to ]
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OddSlug wrote:
If you can get a camera that cheap and you think it is that wide spread then do it. Get one, get a race organiser interested and let you stand at bike check in with the magnetic app as well. I don't mean that in a confrontational way, I'd genuinely be interested if you found any. I might even do it myself.


I don't think it's wide-spread, only that like other forms of cheating, that it's out there. And I would not recommend just blithely imagining that somebody else is going to catch the cheaters. If they put that much effort into course-cutting the run, hiding their fins while they swim, or secret motors in the bike, it's all part of the same behavior that should be addressed and not condoned.

DFL > DNF > DNS
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Re: Second Confirmed Hidden Motor Used in a Bike Race [Hybridlete] [ In reply to ]
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Hybridlete wrote:

With how widespread PED use in triathlons, are you seriously questioning the widespread use of hidden motors?

Yup.

Define "widespread", please. Don't use other vague words like "rampant" to do it, either.
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Re: Second Confirmed Hidden Motor Used in a Bike Race [SallyShortyPnts] [ In reply to ]
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I think you misread me, I'm sold on the idea. I'm saying any of us could decide to test ourselves, given a races agreement. I genuinely hope someone takes up the challenge. As I say, I might myself.

I think it would be easiest at a race with day before racking. Then agree with the race to walk the bikes in the evening, with an escort. I think there are people on the forum involved in race organisation. If a race did a few things that other races didn't in regards to catching cheats then you'd think that would be a selling point.
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Re: Second Confirmed Hidden Motor Used in a Bike Race [Durhamskier] [ In reply to ]
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Durhamskier wrote:
Hybridlete wrote:

With how widespread PED use in triathlons, are you seriously questioning the widespread use of hidden motors?

Yup.

Define "widespread", please. Don't use other vague words like "rampant" to do it, either.

It's of Lance Armstrong levels. I think that is a pretty accurate descriptor.
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Re: Second Confirmed Hidden Motor Used in a Bike Race [Hybridlete] [ In reply to ]
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Hybridlete wrote:
It's of Lance Armstrong levels. I think that is a pretty accurate descriptor.

OK. Thanks for playing.
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Re: Second Confirmed Hidden Motor Used in a Bike Race [Hybridlete] [ In reply to ]
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Hybridlete wrote:
This is the second confirmed case of a hidden electric motor being used to cheat at a bike race with there being many more used that have gone undetected.

And you know this, how?

Or rather, this is just a bit of conjecture and hyperbole to bolster your strained assertions and thread topic?
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Re: Second Confirmed Hidden Motor Used in a Bike Race [rubik] [ In reply to ]
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Really, it is not a stretch to see there are a lot more cases of motor doping that haven't been caught, such as the infamous Fabian Cancellara seated accelerations in the classics. Cheating techniques trickle from the top down, not the other way around.
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Re: Second Confirmed Hidden Motor Used in a Bike Race [Hybridlete] [ In reply to ]
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Hybridlete wrote:
Really, it is not a stretch to see there are a lot more cases of motor doping that haven't been caught, such as the infamous Fabian Cancellara seated accelerations in the classics. Cheating techniques trickle from the top down, not the other way around.

Your imagination is strong.

Good on ya for that.
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Re: Second Confirmed Hidden Motor Used in a Bike Race [Durhamskier] [ In reply to ]
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I would be surprised if cheating is as rampant as you believe it is, so each to their own.

So you don't think a lot of triathletes draft or would draft if there were no marshalls?

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Re: Second Confirmed Hidden Motor Used in a Bike Race [rubik] [ In reply to ]
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rubik wrote:
Hybridlete wrote:
Really, it is not a stretch to see there are a lot more cases of motor doping that haven't been caught, such as the infamous Fabian Cancellara seated accelerations in the classics. Cheating techniques trickle from the top down, not the other way around.

Your imagination is strong.

Good on ya for that.

Given that some PEDs can be unintentionally ingested, I tend to favor the existing structure of penalties (namely, that first offenses do not yield lifetime bans).

You can't unwittingly have a motor in your bike. So, I would support that if a triathlete is caught with a motor, he/she should be banned for life.

What say all of you? Too draconian?
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Re: Second Confirmed Hidden Motor Used in a Bike Race [Sanuk] [ In reply to ]
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Sanuk wrote:
I would be surprised if cheating is as rampant as you believe it is, so each to their own.

So you don't think a lot of triathletes draft or would draft if there were no marshalls?

In this context of this thread we're talking motors and PED's. Drafting is another topic entirely, and it gets beaten to death here. I'll stay on topic, and leave that for anyone else that wants to throw around more baseless speculation as fact as OP has done.
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Re: Second Confirmed Hidden Motor Used in a Bike Race [DieselPete] [ In reply to ]
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DieselPete wrote:
You can't unwittingly have a motor in your bike.


'Course you can. You have a family friend who is attending the same race and has the exact same model and size of bike. You probably talk before the race. Bikes get left leaning somewhere together and you walk off with the wrong one. It's a completely creditable defense. I'm not sure how she explained activating the motor during the race, probably the button is easily pressed by accident at the bottom of a climb.

http://www.cyclingnews.com/...world-championships/
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Re: Second Confirmed Hidden Motor Used in a Bike Race [OddSlug] [ In reply to ]
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OddSlug wrote:
DieselPete wrote:
You can't unwittingly have a motor in your bike.


'Course you can. You have a family friend who is attending the same race and has the exact same model and size of bike. You probably talk before the race. Bikes get left leaning somewhere together and you walk off with the wrong one. It's a completely creditable defense. I'm not sure how she explained activating the motor during the race, probably the button is easily pressed by accident at the bottom of a climb.

http://www.cyclingnews.com/...world-championships/

You got me there!

Or it would be like Sammy Sosa's corked bat. "Oops, that was my trainer and I accidentally brought it into the game."

Too bad. Gone for life.
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Re: Second Confirmed Hidden Motor Used in a Bike Race [Hybridlete] [ In reply to ]
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Hybridlete wrote:
Durhamskier wrote:
Hybridlete wrote:


With how widespread PED use in triathlons, are you seriously questioning the widespread use of hidden motors?


Yup.

Define "widespread", please. Don't use other vague words like "rampant" to do it, either.


It's of Lance Armstrong levels. I think that is a pretty accurate descriptor.

So - a LOT of triathetes are much faster than you, so therefore they must be taking PEDs and/or mechanical doping?
that checks out.
/pink.


float , hammer , and jog

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Re: Second Confirmed Hidden Motor Used in a Bike Race [DieselPete] [ In reply to ]
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DieselPete wrote:
OddSlug wrote:
DieselPete wrote:
You can't unwittingly have a motor in your bike.


'Course you can. You have a family friend who is attending the same race and has the exact same model and size of bike. You probably talk before the race. Bikes get left leaning somewhere together and you walk off with the wrong one. It's a completely creditable defense. I'm not sure how she explained activating the motor during the race, probably the button is easily pressed by accident at the bottom of a climb.

http://www.cyclingnews.com/...world-championships/


You got me there!

Or it would be like Sammy Sosa's corked bat. "Oops, that was my trainer and I accidentally brought it into the game."

Too bad. Gone for life.


Well, the difference is the corked bat does not involve pressing an additional button to activate. The "virtually spring loaded bike" (as in the motor having pre loaded energy stored in electrical form to be converted to mechanical), you have to press a button to activate the '"virtual springs" to unleash all that stored potential energy.



PS. Whenever there is something messed up in the world, a quick google search on looney tunes and you pretty well get a graphic that covers the scenario. Those guys were brilliant.

Last edited by: devashish_paul: Jul 30, 17 20:21
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Re: Second Confirmed Hidden Motor Used in a Bike Race [Murphy'sLaw] [ In reply to ]
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Murphy'sLaw wrote:
So - a LOT of triathetes are much faster than you, so therefore they must be taking PEDs and/or mechanical doping?
that checks out.
/pink.

Pink?
Come on, that's lame. At least man up.

On some group rides I attended, people used motors. And had no problem admitting to it.

Given the sales demographic of electrically enhanced bikes I hear from an e-bike retailer (hint: it is not the old ladies who need the extra push to shop for groceries), I have no doubt that the same guys look for disguised enhancement to show off.

Same as pimping STRAVA, claiming to have ridden mountainous 20 miles in one hour, but not able to produce the data from their GPS if you ask nicely.

Well, Type A's are mostly holes.
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