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Re: Cost of tri (let's start over) [davejustdave] [ In reply to ]
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davejustdave wrote:
I keep seeing people write "75 dollar entries, 60 dollar entries"

WHERE THE HELL ARE ALL THESE 60 DOLLAR RACES?!?!?!?!?

Even an indoor reverse sprint in socal is over a hundred these days.

Cornwall, Ontario
$75CDN for Olympic distance. Equal to about $50 USD. These are inclusive of online reg fees and insurances.

$2200 Prize money to boot!

No we don't sell out 144 spots we reserve (reserved racks) for the Olympic distance. Our Sprint distance does sell out ($700 prize money).

#racelocal
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Re: Cost of tri (let's start over) [davejustdave] [ In reply to ]
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davejustdave wrote:
Warbird wrote:
davejustdave wrote:
I keep seeing people write "75 dollar entries, 60 dollar entries"

WHERE THE HELL ARE ALL THESE 60 DOLLAR RACES?!?!?!?!?

Even an indoor reverse sprint in socal is over a hundred these days.


I can think of at least half a dozen $75 sprints and reverse sprints within a 1-2 hour drive of my home in the San Gabriel Valley, and a few more that are less than $100. Tinsel Tri in Hemet, Tinman at CSUSB, Possabilities at Loma Linda, Castaic, etc. Someone just getting into the sport in the LA area could easily put together an entire season of races that are $65-100, and don't even require a USAT fee...


You listed 4. I'd found the college ones, but beyond that? How much are the bonelli ones these days?

Yeah, we have a few that are 90 if you sign up 9-10 months out, but how many people do that?

Castaic is a 2 race series. There's also Race on the Base in Los Alamitos which is currently $85 but was $75 earlier, Apple Valley (currently $40 for 2017!), Laguna Niguel is currently $85 but was as low as $65

Bonelli Series until the end of December is $265 for the Express distance, and $295 for the Championship for all 3 races.

So there's 10 races within 1-2 hours of LA that are $40-$100 if you register early, and most are still under $100 right up to race day. And except for Bonelli, I don't think any of these require USAT fees. I'm sure if I dig around, I could find even more, but these are just the ones I already knew about...

"I'm thinking of a number between 1 and 10, and I don't know why!"
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Re: Cost of tri (let's start over) [B_Doughtie] [ In reply to ]
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B_Doughtie wrote:
5 years ago I'd wonder if you had even 1 youth event put on within 4 hour drive.

What part of country do you live in? Almost every major city has some type of youth tri programming these days.

ETA: currently there are 52 registered junior teams that race junior races in US.


I live in Cleveland.

I'm talking about races my child can participate to determine if it's something he would like to pursue more without getting too serious right now. I looked at several of those junior race teams and many seemed to be geared towards teenager/high school kids. A couple of those geared for kids under 11 showed pictures of the kids in nicer kits than I have, which I think gets back into the whole cost/perception equation.

Edit: Just looked at your youth training program and that seems more in line with what I think would help engage young kids. Make triathlon part of a fun & healthy lifestyle.
Last edited by: andrewnova: Dec 6, 16 12:32
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Re: Cost of tri (let's start over) [andrewnova] [ In reply to ]
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Contact Tim Edwards there in Cleveland. He has more of an older group but he may know of other youth specific programs.

Brooks Doughtie, M.S.
Exercise Physiology
-USAT Level II
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Re: Cost of tri (let's start over) [Slowman] [ In reply to ]
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My two cents as a millennial.

I think Slowtwitch is going to give skewed results.

This is my first year in the sport. I'm 29, a graduate student and have 3 kids all under the age of 10. The guys I train with are all over 45 and well-established.

I am probably different than most of my peers in that I don't mind waking up at 4am and putting in 2hours of training before the family wakes up.

Cost. But the added $15/race or $50/year seems disconnected (to me) from the racing. $75-$150 of race entry fees is tough each month--so I only did 3 this past year (edit: 3 sprint distances about $80 each), one of which was paid for by a non-profit I am affiliated.

None of these costs include my pool membership.

This problem isn't only for students. That's a good chunk of disposable income for a lot of people my age, or with 3 kids and college debt.

I generally hate running races, but I did more of those last year because the prices are much cheaper, lower fees and no added costs. Plus I go with people I know.

just your average age grouper . no one special . no scientific knowledge . just having fun.
Last edited by: way2sloow: Dec 6, 16 15:27
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Re: Cost of tri (let's start over) [way2sloow] [ In reply to ]
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way2sloow wrote:
My two cents as a millennial.

I think Slowtwitch is going to give skewed results.

This is my first year in the sport. I'm 29, a graduate student and have 3 kids all under the age of 10. The guys I train with are all over 45 and well-established.

I am probably different than most of my peers in that I don't mind waking up at 4am and putting in 2hours of training before the family wakes up.

Cost. But the added $15/race or $50/year seems disconnected (to me) from the racing. $75-$150 of race entry fees is tough each month--so I only did 3 this past year (edit: 3 sprint distances about $80 each), one of which was paid for by a non-profit I am affiliated.

None of these costs include my pool membership.

This problem isn't only for students. That's a good chunk of disposable income for a lot of people my age, or with 3 kids and college debt.

I generally hate running races, but I did more of those last year because the prices are much cheaper, lower fees and no added costs. Plus I go with people I know.

You are absolutely right. You are very different than most (not good or bad). Unless you are a trust fund baby, you are not the target market for most people selling things.
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Re: Cost of tri (let's start over) [Slowman] [ In reply to ]
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I have a reasonable income and can afford to participate in triathlon in the mid market range. I no longer have to look in the couch cushions to be able to buy new tubes.

Even for me, and I'm reasonably sensible with my money, I budget $5k for an IM race as a minimum. No, the race isn't $5k, but if I don't do an IM race, I have an extra $5k in the chequeing account at the end of the year. There's squad memberships, coaching, tires an tubes, gels etc for training, kit, travel, accommodation, food while away, etc. For the X months I build up for an IM, I spend more than enough according to TriSpouse.

People complain about race fees, but I don't care. It it's $500 for an IM or $1000, the difference is only 10% of the overall cost. I can cover +/- 10% and that's not going to stop me doing an IM race. The other 90% is the hard part. Every season there's new kit, a new wetsuit, or a new bike every few years. Amortized over several seasons, that gets included in the $5k to do a race.

If you're a lawyer or fund manager, your budget is probably higher, but the entry fee isn't what keeps you away.

For me, as a retired triathlete, part of the issue was boredom. Even here in NZ it got boring. IMNZ always took the easy option of that awful ride to Reparoa. It would be harder to organize, but going around Lake Taupo would have stirred the pot and made it more interesting. IMNZ was why I started doing Challenge Wanaka. Wanaka is way more interesting. And it's why I did Rotorua 1/2 IM so many times. Hooksie moved from Taupo to Rotorua. Every year the course is a little bit different. He knows to mix it up to keep people interested.

Sure tri now fits into the outdoor sport bubble that's going on but lotsa people have got bored with tri on it's own. They might still be predominantly triatletes, but they are doing fewer tri's and mixing it up with bike races, open water swims and off road events. They still spend the same money on their hobby each year, but spread it around a bit more, to be more interesting and fun.

I'm turned away by the Event organizers. I remember doing IMNZ 98. It was like a family. The organizers made you feel special and part of a group and they treated us like hero's. In 2009 IMNZ (my last IMNZ) felt like WTC was just reaching into my wallet and making a pig of themselves. That turned me off. That helped push me to Challenge.

I've never been able to do short distance stuff. I kept going back to Rotorua half because Hooksie the RD always makes you feel special, loved and while he punishes with his course layouts, he loves the racers. THAT keeps you coming back, but boring annually repetitive cash grabs masquerading as races pushes people away from the sport.

TriDork

"Happiness is a myth. All you can hope for is to get laid once in a while, drunk once in a while and to eat chocolate every day"
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Re: Cost of tri (let's start over) [B.McMaster] [ In reply to ]
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Yea. I know we're not necessarily marketed to, but I was referring to the declining population in my age group and that ST polls will probably not be indicative of my AG.

just your average age grouper . no one special . no scientific knowledge . just having fun.
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Re: Cost of tri (let's start over) [way2sloow] [ In reply to ]
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way2sloow wrote:
Yea. I know we're not necessarily marketed to, but I was referring to the declining population in my age group and that ST polls will probably not be indicative of my AG.

I think you nailed it.

The problem.the industry is missing is that they NEED to be marketing to you, not for your money today, but for your money 5 years from now.

Right now they market to the one and done crowd, which self limits.

If I scaled what I made when I started tris to todays dollars, I couldn't afford to try the sport. Simple as that.

Look at the differential between a starter and top of the line bike in 1996 and a now.

I mean, seventeen thousand for a bike? Really?
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Re: Cost of tri (let's start over) [Slowman] [ In reply to ]
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" the cost of equipment is high,"

It is, but not if you're not buying new stuff.

I haven't done a tri for five years and haven't bought any new equipment since then. In fact I sold most of my stuff on ebay. Now all I have is an 8 yr old Kestrel Talon and a pair of clip on aero bars that sit on the shelf in case I ever decide to do another tri. When I was doing tris, I was buying/selling equipment all the time. But that was part of the hobby. Like Diabolo, I still swim, bike and run (although not much running) but don't feel the need to rush out and purchase the latest gizmo since I'm not racing any more. The cost of entry fees for local races were never much of a problem but we spent $17,000 when my wife did ITU long course in Australia (albeit we spent a month touring OZ and five nights on a scuba live aboard) and going to Kona when she won the lottery wasn't cheap either. Bottom line is that we spent a lot of money on tri. Ironically, my wife is still racing, but only a couple of local sprints a year and now complains about the $80. entry fees. She's also still racing on her old P2K that took her to Oz and Kona and her only purchases might be running shoes or a new tri suit. .

I became a bit of a gear head when doing tris, but for me, that was part of the fun although I spent more money than I had to. Now my mad money is all going into restoring an old Triumph sports car vintage racer.
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Re: Cost of tri (let's start over) [cerveloguy] [ In reply to ]
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Life costs money.

Racing tri's IMO is priced right....it's the time comment is what drives people away.

The cost is just a easy excuse.
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Re: Cost of tri (let's start over) [Beachboy] [ In reply to ]
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"Racing tri's IMO is priced right.....The cost is just an easy excuse"

That's not true at all. Lots of people can't afford even the basic equipment to get started, let alone other associated costs. That's why running will always be the great equalizer, whereas triathlon will remain the domain only for those that can afford it. Worldwide, that's actually a small percentage. As I posted earlier, when was the last time you heard of a third world person winning a marathon. Now ask the same thing about an IM.

But I agree the time commitment is also a major reason why people stay away.
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Re: Cost of tri (let's start over) [trytri3] [ In reply to ]
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trytri3 wrote:
It seems to me that we are all focused on "cost" versus "value" which is wholly subjective. This whole forum throws up their hands whenever they think something is expensive based on their personal ruler. I swear, if it were up to ST, we would only have restaurants that serve chipped beef and drive Honda Accords because, darn it, they get the job done. I happen to believe, every once in a while, paying for a great filet is the reason why I work my ass off. And I pair it with a nice bottle of cab. Guess what? I think that was the best "value" because of the experience I just had. Do I do that a lot? No. Was it expensive? Yup. Did I enjoy it? You're damn right I did.

So I paid a shit-ton of money to participate in IMAZ, including entry fee and new wetsuit (which did nothing more than make me feel more secure in the water), new helmet, plane ticket, AirBnB, and bike transport. Guess what? Best use of my money as I had a blast. My wife gets a healthy husband. My kids see that they can succeed even with all of the setbacks. I fulfilled a lifelong dream that I didn't think was possible. Once again, it costs money but the value I got from it was worth every penny.


If you don't think you are getting value for your money then stop doing it. Simple.

I totally agree. If you are into Nascar or F-1 racing, you cannot buy a car anything like what the pros drive. (Well, almost nobody) If you are into aviation, most of the coolest aircraft are not for sale at any price.

But if you are into triathlon or bike racing, you don't have to be a multi-millionaire to ride something exactly like the very best in the world ride. That is pretty cool. Sure, you don't NEED that P-5X, you can be competitive without it. But for those of use who love the racing AND the gear it is awesome that it is as least possible to buy the best bike in the world.

I can't personally justify spending that much, but I still want to upgrade my 2008 P3C sometime soon. You only live once.
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Re: Cost of tri (let's start over) [cerveloguy] [ In reply to ]
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Lots of people can't afford food/housing but they have money for pot, cigs and beer......

But for the middle class (world wide) Tri racing in very affordable. It just where the direct their expendable income....Tri, golf, bike racing, horseback riding, scuba diving, etc. All activities for those with expendable income. It has always been that and will continue.
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Re: Cost of tri (let's start over) [Beachboy] [ In reply to ]
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"But for the middle class (world wide) Tri racing in very affordable."

Much of the world doesn't even have a middle class, just lots of poor and a few rich in many societies. Most third world people can not afford what it would cost to purchase equipment. They likely make less than that in a year. I don't know why you're arguing the fact that lots of people can't afford triathlon, even in 1st world countries many people can't afford it. Were you brought up in a bubble?
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Re: Cost of tri (let's start over) [RobAllen] [ In reply to ]
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RobAllen wrote:
davejustdave wrote:
I keep seeing people write "75 dollar entries, 60 dollar entries"

WHERE THE HELL ARE ALL THESE 60 DOLLAR RACES?!?!?!?!?

Even an indoor reverse sprint in socal is over a hundred these days.


Cornwall, Ontario
$75CDN for Olympic distance. Equal to about $50 USD. These are inclusive of online reg fees and insurances.

$2200 Prize money to boot!

No we don't sell out 144 spots we reserve (reserved racks) for the Olympic distance. Our Sprint distance does sell out ($700 prize money).

#racelocal

Perfect example of a super value local event that caters to all levels of athletes and huge bang for the $$$ and attention to detail in many cases better than a WTC event and you really feel like a 'GUEST' of the local community. Thank You Rob and team. I'll eventually get back there! A race run by a community of athletes for the community. It puts the soul back in sport.

Dev
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Re: Cost of tri (let's start over) [Slowman] [ In reply to ]
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In 2007 I paid $35 for an Olympic triathlon. In 2015 same race was over $100. Ironman in 2009 $400. In 2015 I paid over $700. The cost of goods has not gone up that percent. The cost of other entertainment has not gone up that much nor has the price of a good meal after that entertainment, nor cars, gas, plane tickets, hotels, etc. I used to do several races in a year and use some as training races. It was fun and a good way to keep fluid on transitions and pacing. I could continue this but I would have to fork over three times as much, if not more. No thanks. I'd rather spend that difference on a trip to someplace warm in winter...so I can train and then park my behind on the beach. Easy decision. Now it is one or two key races in summer and maybe one, or this winter, a 5k series that was a good deal, to use as part of my training.

What I notice is that communities or cities are making it more difficult to run a race because goodness, people nearby might be inconvenienced for a few hours. So maybe they are upping their fees. While I realize there may also be cost for police and medical support, the price increases are beyond inflation.
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Re: Cost of tri (let's start over) [Beachboy] [ In reply to ]
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Beachboy wrote:
Life costs money.

Racing tri's IMO is priced right....it's the time comment is what drives people away.

The cost is just a easy excuse.

Lololol. BULLSHOT.

Try digging ditches at minimum wage.

Triathletes as a group, and slowtwitchers as a specific group, are so soft and out of touch it's hilarious. 99.9% of them couldn't hack it at the average blue collar job.

Saying that people who can't afford triathlon just are not tough enough or lack the ability to commit? Hahhahahhahahahahhahahhha

*politics warning*

That kind of ignorance of the average american is the EXACT stuff that lost Hillary the election.
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Re: Cost of tri (let's start over) [davejustdave] [ In reply to ]
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For an interesting juxtaposition to tri being a relatively middle class sport, check out the viceland doco on the Robertson twins and their lives in Kenya. Check out how poor their accommodation has been.
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Re: Cost of tri (let's start over) [Slowman] [ In reply to ]
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Sorry if it's been already said, but my biggest expense (beyond IM entry and travel) is food.

The massive amounts of food I eat is ridiculous, and so is the price tag. I'm not buying anything super fancy either, I'm not shopping at Whole Foods. But I do try to eat semi healthy, fruits and veggies are crazy expensive. I make a smoothie once a day and I buy any fruit that is in sale for it. If it tastes like shit I put more peanut butter in it haha. Add in protein powder, add in whatever electrolyte mix you like to use. Cliff bars, gels... you get the point!

Eating healthy is very unfriendly to the wallet. IMO
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Re: Cost of tri (let's start over) [madonebug] [ In reply to ]
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madonebug wrote:
In 2015 I paid over $700.

So perhaps do 10+ shorter races for the price instead. That's what I always do.

-------------------
Madison photographer Timothy Hughes | Instagram
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Re: Cost of tri (let's start over) [Slowman] [ In reply to ]
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It also depends on sponsorship. If they've been able to find some good money from elsewhere, they can push it down a little. I don't want to pay insane prices for something slathered in ads though.

One other thing that reduces the cost of participation - no prize money. Only six people benefit directly from prizes; for the rest, it's a diversion from their pocket to someone else's.

'It never gets easier, you just get crazier.'
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Re: Cost of tri (let's start over) [cerveloguy] [ In reply to ]
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I've lived in Indonesia and East Timor. Both have an upper class that can afford to buy new Jeeps and Toyotas, and who are now aspiring to challenge themselves and spend money on recreation.

It's the reason that Dalian bought WTC.

(Yes, it feels wrong that people are hungry while others spend multiples of annual income on these things, but poverty in our own countries doesn't stop us doing the same.)

'It never gets easier, you just get crazier.'
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Re: Cost of tri (let's start over) [tridork] [ In reply to ]
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Hooksie is a legend. I forget what I paid for last year's Rotorua, but it was definitely less than $200. For a very well organised race. (No prize money though - Gomez will have to be happy with a plush toy.)

And that included a nice hoodie.

'It never gets easier, you just get crazier.'
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Re: Cost of tri (let's start over) [devashish_paul] [ In reply to ]
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devashish_paul wrote:
RobAllen wrote:
davejustdave wrote:
I keep seeing people write "75 dollar entries, 60 dollar entries"

WHERE THE HELL ARE ALL THESE 60 DOLLAR RACES?!?!?!?!?

Even an indoor reverse sprint in socal is over a hundred these days.


Cornwall, Ontario
$75CDN for Olympic distance. Equal to about $50 USD. These are inclusive of online reg fees and insurances.

$2200 Prize money to boot!

No we don't sell out 144 spots we reserve (reserved racks) for the Olympic distance. Our Sprint distance does sell out ($700 prize money).

#racelocal

Perfect example of a super value local event that caters to all levels of athletes and huge bang for the $$$ and attention to detail in many cases better than a WTC event and you really feel like a 'GUEST' of the local community. Thank You Rob and team. I'll eventually get back there! A race run by a community of athletes for the community. It puts the soul back in sport.

Dev

I wish we still had races like that in southern Ca.

I think it's the fault of the non triathletes as much of the triathlon community here though
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