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Re: IRONCowboy 50 Ironmans in 50 Consecutive Days Starting June 6, 2015 - Prediction Thread [RunFatboyRun] [ In reply to ]
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RunFatboyRun wrote:
I don't understand why you insist on comparing ludicrous speed comparisons to an endurance challenge. How it is clearly impossible? I get why doing a 3 second 100m is "clearly impossible" but it's not like he is attempting to do a 140.6 in 2 hours. That would be a fair comparison. He's pushing the edge of how many times a person can get up the next day and do the same thing they did the day before at a reasonable pace. How is that at all like a super speed record? The challenge is not speed, it is endurance and will. And in that vein, I am always behind the believers. Physiology may limit the speed records, but in the realm that nearly every great endurance athlete says is mostly mental, the limits are unknown. Some people refuse to have limits. Dean Karnazes comes to mind.

I'm not asking you to be a blind fanboy like you seem to assume some of us are, what with our heads up our asses and all. But don't make a comparison that makes no sense at all like it is some kind of brilliant insight. It's not like a Usain Bolt 3 sec 100m. It's Rocky getting beaten and still standing, still coming back. Except it's not fiction, he's making it a reality right now. And if he fails, I will feel bad for him, but I sure as hell don't want to join the sideline monday morning quarterbacks waiting for their chance to say "see, told you he couldn't do it."



Dave Luscan wrote:
It's gimmicks that I hate. And this is clearly a gimmick. Meaning, it's clearly not possible to anyone that doesnt have their head up their ass.

I am all for people attempting amazing athletic feats that carry a large risk of failure. I am not for Usain Bolt selling tickets, t-shirts and pay per view subscriptions so we can watch him attempt to run 8.5 for the 100m. Or Michaels Phelps doing the same regarding swimming a 3:45 / 500 yard freeestyle. Or a :16 / 50 Free.

The issue I have with this 50/50/50 thing is it is not quite so obviously impossible to a lot of folks, so they get on board, drink the kool aid, buy the t-shirts and hope, hope, hope. Meanwhile, back here in reality, it is roughly as imposible as Usain's hypothetical 8.5 / 100 meters. Hence, it's a gimmick.

I find it more similar to attempting an :08.5 or :03 if you prefer / 100m than I do some of the more realistic ultra endurance feats that we have seen so far. So if you want to think of these sorts of events on a sliding scale from COMPLETE GIMMICK ---------------------------------------->ENTIRELY REALISTIC I simply find this way too far over towards the complete gimmick end.
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Re: IRONCowboy 50 Ironmans in 50 Consecutive Days Starting June 6, 2015 - Prediction Thread [kathy_caribe] [ In reply to ]
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Well last night I ran with the Iron Cowboy and I saw the light...the one we needed to run with in the colorless dark New Mexico sky.

I tried most of the day to find the location and ETA of the 5K Charity run; info on their FB pages was vague at best. However, thru postings from locals and sleuthing the web sights by you Kathy I found the intended location and ETA of 7PM.

They had got off to slow swim start in the AM and that kind of snowballed their timing and with his bike pit stop to IV hydrate and take a nap it was 9 before I got the heads up on FB that the start location changed and the run was underway.

Got to the caravan and there were maybe 20 people milling about. I was informed that his plan was for the Cowboy to do 5K repeats on the Bosque multi-use trail. Ideal for night running as it is straight and flat. James came trotting into camp and the place came alive. Fluids, strategies(they decided to go to 1 mile repeats), nutrition and vest with light projectors. A fresh entourage assembled and off we went. In our group was a mother and her 9 year old daughter, a guy who came down from Moab, UT and my wife and I.

The entourage kind of ran interference with hand held lights to point out puddles from the rain squalls and scare of critters crossing the path. The support guys had different fluid choices and nutrition for James to select; he was very intense and definitely runs the show.

The pace was plodding at best-maybe 14 min pace and any incline was walked. As we shuffled along I just sat back and as the group took positions James opened up. He started talking with the mother and her child in a very sincere and kind of touching way being truly interested in their story. He asked their names and fully engaged them in the conversation. As the mom and daughter turned and left due to the late hour he hugged them both and encouraged them to follow their athletic dreams; really quite touching.

As I ended up in the default position next to James he did the same with me just as sincere asking me what was my name and what was my story and we talked at length of my races and stories. He discussed my wife's story of finishing 3 in AG at IM Brazil and he asked if she got the Kona ticket and was disappointed for her that she didn't.

I mentioned to him his presence on Slowtwitch and 13 pages at the time and you could feel him roll his eyes " I bet their roasting me!" he said. I told him I felt from what I read that he had a lot of support-though skeptical-but support none the less. I mentioned a lot of people thought his logistics needed some work and he responded that he purposely sought bigger venues over ease to better get exposure for his project. I asked his biggest logistical surprises and he said he didn't expect the amount of moisture(he rode 30 miles that day in a heavy rain) and it played havoc on his feet giving him what sounds like a form of trenchfoot. Another unexpected issue was the motorhome not being able to keep pace as they intended. And then there was hitting the deer coming out of Flagstaff.

I asked what message he'd like me to pass on to Slowtwitchers and he didn't hesitate; he said "tell 'em that it is going great, I feel really strong and I am totally excited to keep going"...and there was no doubt to me he was sincere.

In review I see this as a seat of the pants operation with a certain fluidity to change and adapt as things come up, and with the enthusiasm I saw I really think they're going to make it. Go Iron Cowboy!!
Last edited by: vguy2001: Jun 14, 15 15:42
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Re: IRONCowboy 50 Ironmans in 50 Consecutive Days Starting June 6, 2015 - Prediction Thread [badgertri] [ In reply to ]
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badgertri wrote:
That's a good question...he hasn't eclipsed 17 hours yet so it hasn't been discussed. I honestly would be very surprised to see him eclipse 17 hours unless he picks up an injury...then it's probably over anyways.


I think last night he went over 17hrs total.

He took a hour nap, and posted somewhere that the run was not going to start until around 7pm. Not sure exactly when he started the swim but with him calling yesterday an "active recovery day" with naps and IV stops he certainly went past 12midnight.

He is to start the run today around 5pm, which based on the past few runs will push him close to 12midnight, but more importantly and critical in that, he has a 7hr-8hr drive to Wichita, KS for tomorrow
Last edited by: SayHey Kid: Jun 14, 15 15:47
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Re: IRONCowboy 50 Ironmans in 50 Consecutive Days Starting June 6, 2015 - Prediction Thread [SayHey Kid] [ In reply to ]
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SayHey Kid wrote:
I think last night he went over 17hrs total.

He took a hour nap, and posted somewhere that the run was not going to start until around 7pm. Not sure exactly when he started the swim but with him calling yesterday an "active recovery day" with naps and IV stops he certainly went past 12midnight.

He is to start the run today around 5pm, which based on the past few runs will push him close to 12midnight, but more importantly and critical in that, he has a 7hr-8hr drive to Wichita, KS for tomorrow

I was thinking more pure S/B/R like you have been posting. He has been taking some long breaks within disciplines and between.
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Re: IRONCowboy 50 Ironmans in 50 Consecutive Days Starting June 6, 2015 - Prediction Thread [vguy2001] [ In reply to ]
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Thank you for this.
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Re: IRONCowboy 50 Ironmans in 50 Consecutive Days Starting June 6, 2015 - Prediction Thread [SayHey Kid] [ In reply to ]
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SayHey Kid wrote:
badgertri wrote:
That's a good question...he hasn't eclipsed 17 hours yet so it hasn't been discussed. I honestly would be very surprised to see him eclipse 17 hours unless he picks up an injury...then it's probably over anyways.


I think last night he went over 17hrs total.

He took a hour nap, and posted somewhere that the run was not going to start until around 7pm. Not sure exactly when he started the swim but with him calling yesterday an "active recovery day" with naps and IV stops he certainly went past 12midnight.

He is to start the run today around 5pm, which based on the past few runs will push him close to 12midnight, but more importantly and critical in that, he has a 7hr-8hr drive to Wichita, KS for tomorrow


Yeah... saw that Pueblo to Wichita drive on schedule and thought to myself...that can be a long drive if you are tight on time. Hope he can keep it going...
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Re: IRONCowboy 50 Ironmans in 50 Consecutive Days Starting June 6, 2015 - Prediction Thread [vguy2001] [ In reply to ]
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vguy2001 wrote:
Well last night I ran with the Iron Cowboy and I saw the light...the one we needed to run with in the colorless dark New Mexico sky.

I tried most of the day to find the location and ETA of the 5K Charity run; info on their FB pages was vague at best. However, thru postings from locals and sleuthing the web sights by you Kathy I found the intended location and ETA of 7PM.

They had got off to slow swim start in the AM and that kind of snowballed their timing and with his bike pit stop to IV hydrate and take a nap it was 9 before I got the heads up on FB that the start location changed and the run was underway.

Got to the caravan and there were maybe 20 people milling about. I was informed that his plan was for the Cowboy to do 5K repeats on the Bosque multi-use trail. Ideal for night running as it is straight and flat. James came trotting into camp and the place came alive. Fluids, strategies(they decided to go to 1 mile repeats), nutrition and vest with light projectors. A fresh entourage assembled and off we went. In our group was a mother and her 9 year old daughter, a guy who came down from Moab, UT and my wife and I.


this is as far as i got without chills. I can't even wait to read the rest to say SQUUEEEEEEEE! SO excited for you! I'm so glad you were able to! i just (literally) got back from a 60km ride through lots of wind destruction from a storm that will likely be a hurricane soon. thinking of James the whole way! now off to read the rest of your post. THANK YOU for coming back and posting!!! SMOOCHES to you and your wife!

ok, finished. wow! i know NOTHING about this guy. i got bored one day with slow work and started reading this thread and became a cautious fangirl but JHC, what a guy! thanks so much for getting out there and making him real to us - giving us a feel for the guy and how it is going.

i really wish i lived in the USA so i could go out and cheer him on and I'm SO GLAD i could have a tiny part in helping you achieve running with him (and how bad ass is your wife??!!?!)

http://harvestmoon6.blogspot.com
https://www.caringbridge.org/visit/katasmit


Last edited by: kathy_caribe: Jun 14, 15 16:22
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Re: IRONCowboy 50 Ironmans in 50 Consecutive Days Starting June 6, 2015 - Prediction Thread [vguy2001] [ In reply to ]
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Thanks for the first-hand update. This has been interesting to watch. I find the logistics fascinating and wish we had more details.
I am signed up for the deca next year (www.decamanusa.com), which, in light of this, seems a lot more do-able now.
Last edited by: NMGal: Jun 14, 15 16:18
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Re: IRONCowboy 50 Ironmans in 50 Consecutive Days Starting June 6, 2015 - Prediction Thread [NMGal] [ In reply to ]
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NMGal wrote:
Thanks for the first-hand update. This has been interesting to watch. I find the logistics fascinating and wish we had more details.
I am signed up for the deca next year (www.decamanusa.com), which, in light of this, seems a lot more do-able now.

wow! you are amazing! please keep us in the loop!

http://harvestmoon6.blogspot.com
https://www.caringbridge.org/visit/katasmit


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Re: IRONCowboy 50 Ironmans in 50 Consecutive Days Starting June 6, 2015 - Prediction Thread [Dan Funk] [ In reply to ]
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The geography of this is what is really going to make or break it. We know a triple-deca is physically possible and that this guy is capable of that. It's also well established that the limiting factor for endurance events is not physical strength, but mental (look at the guy who was trying to do a triple deca and fractured his femur early in the attempt, and did at least one more full IM before being forced to stop). I have little doubt that baring physical injury the Cowboy can complete the plan. It's going to come down to whether or not the schedule, travel, and logistics create a situation where he is mentally incapable of continuing. The sleep issue is key, if he is unable to get enough sleep, not just rest, his chances go down the crapper. If you've ever been chronically sleep deprived you understand what I mean, it is physically exhausting and seriously hampers judgement to be operating on only a few hours of sleep a night.

As he moves further across the US into the eastern states I expect the travel and logistics to get slightly easier, simply in terms of distance and time between days. If they capitalize on this I don't see any issues with the completion of the 50/50/50. If they continue to have difficulties, or suffer some time of mechanical breakdown or other logistical calamity I think the effort may fall on its face.

I really hope he pulls this off, but I can see so many things they could have done to make this 'easier' and go smoother than it seems to be going.
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Re: IRONCowboy 50 Ironmans in 50 Consecutive Days Starting June 6, 2015 - Prediction Thread [Dan Funk] [ In reply to ]
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Dan Funk wrote:

Yeah... saw that Pueblo to Wichita drive on schedule and thought to myself...that can be a long drive if you are tight on time. Hope he can keep it going...


The good part is that Oka City is only about 2 hours from Wichita, so even a assumed late start tomorrow can be made up.

Then a few 3 hrs commutes between Oka City to Dallas and Dallas to Shreveport, LA
Last edited by: SayHey Kid: Jun 14, 15 16:30
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Re: IRONCowboy 50 Ironmans in 50 Consecutive Days Starting June 6, 2015 - Prediction Thread [kathy_caribe] [ In reply to ]
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We have a saying in mountaineering that goes like this:

"It's not the fear of death.....it's the fear of actually not living"

"Sir George Mallory said it another way: "'What is the use of climbing Mount Everest?'...Because it's there... If you cannot understand that there is something in man which responds to the challenge of this mountain and goes out to meet it, that the struggle is the struggle of life itself upward and forever upward, then you won't see why we go. What we get from this adventure is just sheer joy. And joy is, after all, the end of life. We do not live to eat and make money. We eat and make money to be able to live. That is what life means and what life is for.”


I must say I completely understand and greatly admire what the Iron Cowboy is doing. He's doing it because it's hard to do. He's doing it because it's there. He's doing it because what a great adventure! He's doing it because for these 50 days--and I do think, or at least hope, he can do it--he's really living. Not many people on this planet can make as strong a claim to that statement during this 50 day time.

One of the great things about triathlon/mountaineering/endurance sports is the noble pursuit that seemingly makes the impossible, possible. This message board is filled with so many extraordinary stories. Heck, in my own way, I've written a few of them myself. It's this pursuit (not the results, but the pursuit) that attacks that fear of "actually not living". Triathlon is such a positive, life-living thing--when done with humility and honesty and a genuine sense of child-life wonderment.

What strikes me in reading this thread is the periodic negativity. Not, the judging that he may not do it because it's hard--anyone who has done an Ironman knows what he is trying to do is outrageous. But, how people who regularly try to push the boundaries and really live life can respond to the Iron Cowboy with such negativity. Calling it a gimmick (by this definition all of triathlon is a gimmick--it's all contrived, all made up, it's all a gimmick) and so many other things....

I think we can do better than that. I think we should rejoice in this attempt and support it in anyway we can! If he does achieve it then surely it must remind us that the greatest fear is not of failure, but of not trying. If he fails, then I for one will praise the effort and hope that he tries again. With all the negativity in the world (Isis for example) let's celebrate this man's quest--he is truly living!

Randy Christofferson(http://www.rcmioga.blogspot.com

Insert Doubt. Erase Hope. Crush Dreams.
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Re: IRONCowboy 50 Ironmans in 50 Consecutive Days Starting June 6, 2015 - Prediction Thread [rcmioga] [ In reply to ]
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Well said.
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Re: IRONCowboy 50 Ironmans in 50 Consecutive Days Starting June 6, 2015 - Prediction Thread [rcmioga] [ In reply to ]
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I think it's nuts. Completely. I'd bet he isn't going to do it. Really think there is no chance at all. And I really hope to be proven wrong. As for the picture you can see it as a negative because of the IM tattoo or a really cute pic with the kiddos. I choose the latter. Hope he does it.
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Re: IRONCowboy 50 Ironmans in 50 Consecutive Days Starting June 6, 2015 - Prediction Thread [badgertri] [ In reply to ]
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im not sure if we can say for sure that he hasn't surpassed 17 hours. He appears to be taking lots of breaks during the ride and in between disciplines. I'm honestly not sure if they are accouting for that time during the breaks or not. My guess would be no. But I'm not really sure if it matters.

What if he finishes the run after midnight?

blog
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Re: IRONCowboy 50 Ironmans in 50 Consecutive Days Starting June 6, 2015 - Prediction Thread [stevej] [ In reply to ]
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stevej wrote:
im not sure if we can say for sure that he hasn't surpassed 17 hours. He appears to be taking lots of breaks during the ride and in between disciplines. I'm honestly not sure if they are accouting for that time during the breaks or not. My guess would be no. But I'm not really sure if it matters.

What if he finishes the run after midnight?

And herein lies one of the issues with this whole thing. Sure, it is an ambitious goal and you can argue whether or not it is doable or not, but there are no defined rules to it. There is no one to say, "Nope, you didn't make it". Other endurance challenges like the one Scott Jurek is doing have a defined finish/goal/whatever you want to call it. If he doesn't make it to the end of the trail in X number of days, he doesn't get the record. What exactly qualifies as a "success" to 505050?

And don't get me started on the "fundraising" side of things. Just where is the donated money going? By the looks of it (no charities listed on the donate page, no 501c3 specification, etc.), he is raising money to fund his trip... not fight childhood obesity like he claims. If that what it is, fine, but it should be made clear that you are not donating to a cause; you are donating so that someone can travel the country racing in every state.

--------------------------
IMWI 2011 - check - 11:54
IMMT 2012 - check - 10:49
Michigan Titanium 2013 - 11:50
http://www.ironmanbythirty.com/
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Re: IRONCowboy 50 Ironmans in 50 Consecutive Days Starting June 6, 2015 - Prediction Thread [Dave Luscan] [ In reply to ]
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I agree with your line of thinking to a point and cannot help but draw a comparison to Diana Nyad. Doing an Ironman or a long distance swim event had specific rules. Some of these rules are being bent by the Iron Cowboy (same as Nyad). We give them a pass on this because the infraction seems ticky tacky but at the same time the reason the endeavor has merit in the first place is because of these very rules. In the case of Nyad - I don't think IC is at this point yet - whatever it is that is accomplished isn't actually what is being purported yet the accomplishment is trading on the merit of the actual thing.
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Re: IRONCowboy 50 Ironmans in 50 Consecutive Days Starting June 6, 2015 - Prediction Thread [stevej] [ In reply to ]
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It's not wtc. Doesn't logic say that he gets 24 hours to do each one, not a rule that WTC uses for some of their races??
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Re: IRONCowboy 50 Ironmans in 50 Consecutive Days Starting June 6, 2015 - Prediction Thread [SayHey Kid] [ In reply to ]
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Even the 1978 Ironman was an actual race. You had 15 competitors, a set course, and rules. Ironman might be different today if the first event was some guy raising "awareness", no real rules, and no real way to duplicate or improve upon the feat.



SayHey Kid wrote:
What in life had not started as a gimmick?

Even in the narrow scope of IM racing, the folklore tales of the bar bet in 1978 was a gimmick. Now nearly 30 years later it is a huge multi-million dollar business.
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Re: IRONCowboy 50 Ironmans in 50 Consecutive Days Starting June 6, 2015 - Prediction Thread [TylerJ] [ In reply to ]
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Totally agree, making it through the first 10 days significantly increases his chances of finishing.


TylerJ wrote:
Both James, his coach, and his crew knew that logistically this first 10 days were going to be the "hardest" They expect everything to even out after tomorrow
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Re: IRONCowboy 50 Ironmans in 50 Consecutive Days Starting June 6, 2015 - Prediction Thread [ajthomas] [ In reply to ]
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Does getting piggy backed through the high water count as a ticky tacky infraction? :) haha

https://www.facebook.com/Ironcowboy/photos/a.223316294399960.56544.221698421228414/928244547240461/?type=1&theater


I'm curious as to what the rules are in the triple deca. I did a little searching but didn't find a good answer as to what the rules are for starting/stopping mid run/bike.


The problem with a lack of rules/guidelines is that if he completes this, then what if someone else does it. Do they do it but not stop at all once they start each day and say they were "faster"?

--------------------------
IMWI 2011 - check - 11:54
IMMT 2012 - check - 10:49
Michigan Titanium 2013 - 11:50
http://www.ironmanbythirty.com/
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Re: IRONCowboy 50 Ironmans in 50 Consecutive Days Starting June 6, 2015 - Prediction Thread [vguy2001] [ In reply to ]
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vguy2001 wrote:
Well last night I ran with the Iron Cowboy and I saw the light...

In review I see this as a seat of the pants operation with a certain fluidity to change and adapt as things come up, and with the enthusiasm I saw I really think they're going to make it. Go Iron Cowboy!!

great report. (I did edit it down from the original)

Rhymenocerus wrote:
I think everyone should consult ST before they do anything.
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Re: IRONCowboy 50 Ironmans in 50 Consecutive Days Starting June 6, 2015 - Prediction Thread [ironmanbythirty] [ In reply to ]
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In a link that was posted to next years DecaMan here in the USA in 2016, you get 24 hours to compete each race.

I am sure that is the rule that James is abiding by. Again, this isn't a WTC race, so the 17 hour cut off is not a valid argument.

Who should be making the rules for this? There isn't an abiding "government" for 50/50/50.

One of the questions I got to ask yesterday when they were broadcasting from periscope.tv was if they had all the Garmin Files for all the swim/bike/run. The gentleman that was doing the talking assured all of us followers that they had it, they were only having trouble with the live tracking, and Garmin was on their way to fix it.

Today is day 10, and yesterday James said he felt better than he did on day 1....I guess we shall see how this goes.
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Re: IRONCowboy 50 Ironmans in 50 Consecutive Days Starting June 6, 2015 - Prediction Thread [kathy_caribe] [ In reply to ]
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kathy_caribe wrote:
...i finally found another part of the FB page i didn't know existed - way over on the left called "posts to page"

The Posts To Page is really good to present a lot more info on what goes on behind the scenes. Which is what I am most interested in with this.

Based on earlier reports/comments, I was concerned that the RV was more or less a pop-up on the back of a pick-up truck and then only had a Subaru as there other vehicles. But recent photos of the RV on the "Posts to Pages" really shows the RV is quite large and first class, they also have a large van (assuming for supplies, bike parts, etc) and at least one more vehicle with the Subaru.
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Re: IRONCowboy 50 Ironmans in 50 Consecutive Days Starting June 6, 2015 - Prediction Thread [SayHey Kid] [ In reply to ]
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The probably they are running into right now, is that the RV just isn't fast enough, I see last night James was in the Van on his way to Kansas.

That being said, after today, logistically things get a lot more simpler.
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