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power to the pedal
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I did a cleat fitting on a pair of Look Keo.

the pedals were worn badly with a deep groove on the outside, meaning that the cyclist was pushing a lot diagonally to the outside.

base on some basic posture assessment, the client had a neutral alignement (hip, knee, foot) and high arch.

On the bike, his foot was inside the alignment, so I pushed the cleat in to get his foot out (to the outside) and get a better alignment overall.

I also gave more arch support (E-sole) to distribute pressure evently inside the shoes, with a footwedge (1.5 varus) as well: to take care of the big diagonal forces.

any thought about what I did? how would you have solved such a case?

any input is well appreciated!
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Re: power to the pedal [ElBenito] [ In reply to ]
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Keo pedals typically show the uneven wear when a foot needs tilt correction…so basically that means most of the time. Sometimes stance width can also be part of the cause. Many people cannot get the foot out wide enough on Keos so the tilt (angle at the connection) is actually increased at the foot.

Even pressure inside the shoe is one thing but the connection of the outside of the shoe (cleat) to the pedal must also be considered. Often we are not able to get enough correction inside the shoe even with all the things you mentioned.

Seems like you did all the things in the right direction. I would consider a cleat wedge or two first and then go inside the shoe. Of course some may disagree but having presented both options – inside or outside to hundreds of cyclists over and over the outside correction is preferred at least 90 percent of the time.

Swifty

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Re: power to the pedal [Swifty] [ In reply to ]
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this is a bit left field but worth a try....

I myself am a bit of a fitter... i have a pysiotherapy/sports medicine/orthopedic surgery background. I also have a complex fit on a road bike, with both assymmetrical feet and leg lengths. I have very high arches, and could not get a stable platform with my look keos. I always fellt like i was sliding off the outside of the pedal. I then developed severe ITBFS on my shorter, albeit uncorrected leg during a 260km race with 6000m of vertical climbing.

I used leg lenth correction and varus wedging without any great improvement. What made significant difference to my ITBFS and my platform stability was using the wedges in a valgus orientation. This over a period of 2 months has settled the ITBFS significantly. It has also made climbing possible again. My power has improved immensely with the feelings of greater stabilty on the pedal. One further change I made was to change to speedplays zeros (adjusted for minimal float). I dont think the pedal change has really made any difference, and the main improvement has been due to the valgus wedging and stability factor. Worth a thought and maybe a try at your next fitting....
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Re: power to the pedal [Dr_mutley] [ In reply to ]
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I think it is good to share this idea but based on my experience I feel it is also my obligation to respond. I like to try and exhaust my efforts improving stance width first. Considering that AT LEAST HALF (probably WELL over 50 percent) of the population of cyclists do not fit on standard “width” pedals it is no wonder people sometimes try the wedges the wrong way. Keo pedals, of all pedals offer perhaps the most limiting amount of stance width adjustment amongst pedals that actually offer stance width adjustment.

Yes some people will initially feel better with a valgus correction (over correction to be more specific) but I send caution due to the significantly increased misalignment this causes.

When you walk or run you choose your own stance width. When you get on a bike the stance width is chosen for you. However, most people never even get close to proper stance width on a bike and therefor prematurely go for other options.

There are some prolific abusers of incorrect valgus wedges use. Unfortunately I can also rattle off the names of cyclists that once used wedges this way but no longer do for many reasons.

In your case I hope you are OK even in the long run but I caution the misalignment may catch up to you.

I felt it necessary to share our experience with this. Please do not take this the wrong way. Considering the lack of stance width options available today the valgus wedges from one perspective may seem to make sense and I understand that. I once thought that way myself but after a lot of trial and error that has changed.



Swifty

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Re: power to the pedal [Swifty] [ In reply to ]
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Swifty wrote:

I think it is good to share this idea but based on my experience I feel it is also my obligation to respond. I like to try and exhaust my efforts improving stance width first. Considering that AT LEAST HALF (probably WELL over 50 percent) of the population of cyclists do not fit on standard “width” pedals it is no wonder people sometimes try the wedges the wrong way. Keo pedals, of all pedals offer perhaps the most limiting amount of stance width adjustment amongst pedals that actually offer stance width adjustment.


Yes some people will initially feel better with a valgus correction (over correction to be more specific) but I send caution due to the significantly increased misalignment this causes.

When you walk or run you choose your own stance width. When you get on a bike the stance width is chosen for you. However, most people never even get close to proper stance width on a bike and therefor prematurely go for other options.

There are some prolific abusers of incorrect valgus wedges use. Unfortunately I can also rattle off the names of cyclists that once used wedges this way but no longer do for many reasons.

In your case I hope you are OK even in the long run but I caution the misalignment may catch up to you.

I felt it necessary to share our experience with this. Please do not take this the wrong way. Considering the lack of stance width options available today the valgus wedges from one perspective may seem to make sense and I understand that. I once thought that way myself but after a lot of trial and error that has changed.


Thanks Swifty for the great reply... I agree 100% with your response regarding stance width, keos and misalignment.
Anyone using valgus wedging needs to exercise great caution, and needs to have every other fundamental of their fit right before adding these.
The brevity of my above suggestion probably neglected to emphasise the care needed to attend to the appropriate fundamentals before adding valgus correction to improve stance stability.

One advantage of the speedplays over keos i also failed to mention, which has helped me significantly was changing spindle length to correct my stance width accurately. This was easily done with speedplay zeros. I ended up using the 1/4 longer spindles on my zeros which then allowed my cleats to remain centred within the horizontal axis of the shoe. Following this correction the subtle valgus forefoot correction i have employed has been the final correction that has finished off the fit.
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Re: power to the pedal [Swifty] [ In reply to ]
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Swifty wrote:

Considering that AT LEAST HALF (probably WELL over 50 percent) of the population of cyclists do not fit on standard “width” pedals..... Keo pedals, of all pedals offer perhaps the most limiting amount of stance width adjustment amongst pedals that actually offer stance width adjustment.

Where did you obtain these facts?
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Re: power to the pedal [vimbike] [ In reply to ]
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This is basic bike fitting 101. Unfortunately most people blow by the basics. If you were to build a house you would spend considerable time and effort on the foundation. However most bike fits do not spend much time on the foundation. That is like setting a nice house on the dirt.

We see this every day and we will glad to show you. We self-select stance width when we stand or walk. However, for some reason many people this it is OK for the bike to select the stance width for us.

To be honest 50 percent is a conservative number. Perhaps I should apologies for that. It is AT LEAST 60 percent.

Again it is EASY to see. Most people just don’t look at it.

Send us your e-mail and we will glad to send you some bike fit tips.

Happy Pedals...if interested

Swifty

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Re: power to the pedal [Swifty] [ In reply to ]
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Swifty wrote:
This is basic bike fitting 101. Unfortunately most people blow by the basics. If you were to build a house you would spend considerable time and effort on the foundation. However most bike fits do not spend much time on the foundation. That is like setting a nice house on the dirt.

We see this every day and we will glad to show you. We self-select stance width when we stand or walk. However, for some reason many people this it is OK for the bike to select the stance width for us.

To be honest 50 percent is a conservative number. Perhaps I should apologies for that. It is AT LEAST 60 percent.


Send us your e-mail and we will glad to send you some bike fit tips.



You have my e-mail and I am familiar with your tips. I must say I think you are confusing science with marketing....why not 100% of riders need BikeFit pedal spacers?
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Re: power to the pedal [vimbike] [ In reply to ]
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Not sure how to take that but I will say even for the cyclists that fit within the limited medial/lateral range provided by a standard cleat and pedal are most often not assessed very well. Or in many cases stance width is not considered at all. Considering that for some people just a few millimeters can really make a BIG difference.

Swifty

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