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Re: Why so many Posers in triathlons??? [triathlete36] [ In reply to ]
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Couple of things. One, the defensiveness of some of these replies (the ‘what’s it to you?’ attitude) is perhaps telling. It does not get us very far in terms of discussion as it could apply to at least half the posts on this forum.

Two, I, too, have been in the sport for several years, I race an ‘entry-level’ bike with training wheels, and receive a boost of motivation as I place (in my AG) in the bike routinely and beat many of the guys with the expensive machines. For me at least this motivation is not a matter of jealousy (I could afford the expensive bike if I chose to put my money there rather than elsewhere) but taste, style, and priorities.
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Re: Why so many Posers in triathlons??? [triathlete36] [ In reply to ]
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These people might be making a lot more money than you, and to them spending $3000.00 on a bike isn't really that big of a deal.
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Re: Why so many Posers in triathlons??? [triathlete36] [ In reply to ]
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Because they want to.
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Re: Why so many Posers in triathlons??? [triathlete36] [ In reply to ]
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There are many reasons that people get into triathlon. The fact that they are a gifted athlete is rarely the reason they got into triathlon. There are gifted athletes that get into triathlon for other reasons but they are not near a majority. The end result is that triathlon has evolved into a “competitive” sport in which the majority of participants are “non-competitive” with respect to winning awards. After the race is over and the awards are being passed out, it really doesn’t matter who these people are, what they do outside of triathlon, how they train, how much they train, and what equipment they buy. Those things do really matter when looking at the health of triathlon. For better or worse, the popularity that triathlon experiences today exists due to the level of participation by those that are never going to win an award.

I think a better question is why would these people continue to participate year after year, but you want to know why they would spend large sums money on equipment. I am sure that the reasons that people buy the equipment that they do is as varied as the reasons they got into the sport. “Because some pro uses this” or “because I can” or “because it looks good” may perfectly valid for some and totally ridiculous to others. For each person, their reasons are valid to them.

The equipment is the most visible part of triathlon. It is what everybody notices from 20+ year veterans to first timers. What goes into the preparation for the race and why someone shows up is invisible. All that is visible is the equipment and the finishing time.

I have found out two things about categorizing people based on what is visible. 1) It very easy to do and hard to avoid. 2) If you do it, you are doing a great disservice to both yourself and the person you categorize. Based on your definition of a Poser, my finish times, and the equipment I own, you would categorize me as a Poser. If you do categorize me as such, you make me one dimensional and in this case, negative. Triathlon to me is a sport that is so multi-dimensional and positive. The diversity is what keeps triathlon fresh and new. I think you are missing out if all you think is important is the finishing time.

Why do so many of us spend over our abilities? You will have to get to know us to find out.
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Re: Why so many Posers in triathlons??? [mulligan.30] [ In reply to ]
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"One, the defensiveness of some of these replies (the ‘what’s it to you?’ attitude) is perhaps telling. It does not get us very far in terms of discussion as it could apply to at least half the posts on this forum. "

What is wrong with the fact something is none of you buisness? Sure it is very simple and brings a discussion to an end but that does not make it incorrect. If I buy a bike that is more expensive then yours and you beat me it doesn't matter. Is it a penis extension? Was it a gift? Is the person doing heavy and training and training the race so placing is not important? There is no reason for you knowing why someone else owns an expensive bike that is any of your buisness. What is telling not someone telling you to worry about yourself what is telling is why you care what someone else does.

customerjon @gmail.com is where information happens.
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Re: Why so many Posers in triathlons??? [WebSwim] [ In reply to ]
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“Great story, I like it. I especially like the following line:

"My purchasing research led me to the Cervelo P2k. My wife (of all of two years) talked me into the P3."

You is one lucky man!

Swim On, Donncha



Boy, Donncha, you don’t even know the half of it. Sorry, Tom, close your eyes for the next part. She’s a leggy blonde that does killer Ashtanga yoga, which really shows, and she is extremely smart. I have no clue what she sees in me, but she keeps reminding me I am stuck with her. Did I mention she is 13 years my junior?



Friday morning quarterbacking – some other points in the light of day.

Yes, I have a very nice race bike. On the other hand, I still drive my 1981 BMW 320i. I really like that car. It has held up well, but I will probably have to replace it in a few years. So, yes, my race bike is probably worth three times the car that I use to drive to a lot of my races. I spend money on what is important to me. Not spending mega bucks for a new car every few years gives me that option. (But, to be totally honest, I also don’t buy a car more than once every ten years ‘cause I am just not fond of dealing with car sales people.)

Last year, I bought a T1 DeSoto wet suit. Again, yes, it was expensive, but, two points to mention. First, it was a goal and a reward, loose a certain amount of weight, get a wetsuit. Second, I was/am the antithesis of the ideal triathlete. When I bought the suit, I was 5’4” and 158 lbs. I don’t think there is a single piece wetsuit in the world that would adequately fit those dimensions. The T1 gave me options that worked. Amazingly, at 142 lbs, it still fits well. Again, my wife also pushed me to get a wetsuit. Of course, this was after she saw me do an early season event in May last year with 59 degree water, sans suit. I do have to say, though, that with 25-30% body fat, it really wasn’t that bad. But, I did earn a few points with my wife. ;-). Bottom line – you have no idea why some people have the equipment they have just by looking at them.

Tatakh has a good point about training. My contribution is the memory of a run this past January. Air temp was 14 degrees, zero degrees with wind chill due to 20 mph winds, 17 mile 3 hr run. The ice inside my outer layers was from perspiration that froze, never reaching the outermost layer. To me, people who do these kinds of workouts like that that here in the winter, or like Desert Dude or the Texas guys in 100 degree weather in the summer are serious triathletes (a response I made to another recent thread). You may not be competitive, so what. Not everyone is born a great athlete. I'm not Kareem Abdul Jabbar. Does that mean I can't own a basketball? So, whether it takes you 2 hrs or 4 hrs to finish an International distance race, if you put in those kinds of efforts, or you are willing and able to suffer a 16 hour day in an IM a) you are a triathlete and b) you are not a poser.

I still worry about the steep entry price for new people and especially young people. I have another hobby, flying sailplanes. You don’t even want to think about how much money can go down that hole, equipment-wise. However, there is a serious problem with that sport here in the U.S. and around the world, it’s dying. One clear trend is that fewer young people are getting into the sport. Not so clear, but a factor, is the expense of new sailplanes. There are only an estimated 15,000 to 20,000 soaring pilots in the U.S., and this does not appear to be sufficient for long term health of the sport. Are triathlete numbers in the U.S. all that much larger?


Behold the turtle! He makes progess only when he sticks his neck out. (James Bryant Conant)
GET OFF THE F*%KING WALL!!!!!!! (Doug Stern)
Brevity is the soul of wit. (William Shakespeare)
Last edited by: parkito: Jul 2, 04 6:10
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Re: Why so many Posers in triathlons??? [Wile E.] [ In reply to ]
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"There are many reasons that people get into triathlon"

The easiest explanation is that for 99% of us triathlon is a hobby and people like to spend money on their hobbies.

There is a guy in our roadie group that went thru AA and changed his life around. Recently he bought a new $3500 bike. He told me that he used to spend more than that in a year drinking in bars and had nothing to show for it.

So there are a lot worse things to spend a few grand on than a bike.
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Re: Why so many Posers in triathlons??? [Ashburn] [ In reply to ]
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Ashburn,

It's obvious, triathlete36 was not breast fed.
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Re: Why so many Posers in triathlons??? [triathlete36] [ In reply to ]
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Here's some of my background as to why I "insist on buying a $3000 bike": I am contemplating a move that will make me the biggest posuer in my little corner of the world, ie a Titanflex. I am researching the heck out of them, and am working up the nerve to do it. Only been triing 1 year (cycling 20), and am ok swimmer (when I practice), good on the bike, and the world's crappiest runner. Overall bomop last year. All this = POSEUR

So...my history: I have had 8 whiplashes in my 36 years, and three deranged discs, one in my middle back when I was a teen, and two more in my lumbar spine this winter when I was a pedestrian run down by a car. My aluminum Specialized is absolute hell on my back and neck, to the point that I don't ride it outside anymore. I dread outdoor rides. Thankfully with the TdF starting, I have a great excuse to keep it planted in the trainer in front of the tv, and still ride it 2 hours a day.

A good, expensive bike that minimizes my back injuries, and keeps me riding, fit, and mentally and physically healthy justifies the chunk of change that I am thinking about. It will last me the rest of my life, and I anticipate never buying another bike again.

Lesson: you never know why a person has made the choices he/she made. We each have our own history: injuries, huge lifestyle changes in process that you know nothing about, etc. Passing judgement (which you did) demeans the other person, and makes you look like an insensitive person, which I am sure you are not.

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Re: Why so many Posers in triathlons??? [triathlete36] [ In reply to ]
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In Reply To:
Well this is my 20th year of doing at least 5 races or more a year (I'm 37). Things have not changed in the last 20 years. Why is it people insist on buying $3000 bikes, wear $100 sunglass, swim in $400 wetsuits but can't place in their age group or even the top half of a race overall?? I'm sure triathlon is not the only sport where this occurs but seems most noticeable here. You see them at every race, riding around before the race like their great or just trying to get noticed.. I'm not saying you have to place so high to buy expensive stuff but it's like playing golf a few times a year and buying a $2000 set of clubs... Rant over...
it's because today's american society doesn't put as much value on what you do, rather on what you HAVE. advertisers have pretty much done this. look at all the ads and billboards everywhere that allude to you only being happy if you buy their crap. buy this fancy fighter-pilot-grade wristwatch and you'll be super cool. buy this diamond ring for your chick and she'll be beautiful, slender, and sophisticated. buy this bmw and you'll be the envy of your neighborhood. how about being the envy of your neighborhood because you raise kids that aren't punks and they see you running 5 times a week instead of sitting in your driveway and drinking beer next to your new $10,000 jet ski? anybody can sign up for a tri. they get all the gear and they DO race, put they do it to show off that they're a triathlete. buy enough of the crap and it sure looks like you are one, right? but it's not the doing that important to them. it's how much they spent on their bike. I do have to say that I don't think this is really very many triathlete's though. they may come and go, but once you start, you either get hooked on the sport for what it really is or you quit.


http://www.barefootrunning.org
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Re: Why so many Posers in triathlons??? [triathlete36] [ In reply to ]
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This is easy to answer.... for I maybe considered a "poser". We "posers" have disposable income and we like spending money.
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Re: Why so many Posers in triathlons??? [Marisol] [ In reply to ]
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Quote:
between the guy that was a coach potato,
I had Coach Potato for seventh grade phys ed.
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Re: Why so many Posers in triathlons??? [triathlete36] [ In reply to ]
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sorry dude, you don't get it. I'll give you the benefit of the doubt and assume you're under 25 years old.
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Re: Why so many Posers in triathlons??? [Mr. Tibbs] [ In reply to ]
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In Reply To:
What is wrong with the fact something is none of you buisness? Sure it is very simple and brings a discussion to an end but that does not make it incorrect.


Perhaps there is a problem with how this question is posed. It has been stated on this forum many times that triathlon is an expensive sport. The question (‘why so many posers’) denigrates anyone who is an MOP or BOP’er and spends a lot. People do it for any number of reasons, as presented.

Perhaps we could avoid the playground response (‘none of your beeswax’) and accusations of mental instability if we were to rephrase and ask why some people spend so much on this sport (‘poser’ being only one such reason). This is a legitimate question insofar as this is a forum that deals broadly with the topic of triathlon.
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Re: Why so many Posers in triathlons??? [Weege] [ In reply to ]
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"assume you're under 25 years old. "

He states that he's been doing tris for 20 yrs. That would mean he started at age five or under!!
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Re: So many Arseholes, so few bullets. [triathlete36] [ In reply to ]
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Tom drives a Lexus?!?!
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Re: Why so many Posers in triathlons??? [triathlete36] [ In reply to ]
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Don't ever come into the gym where I train, that is unless you can bench more than 325 and squat and deadlift 500+. And, if you are going to wear a tank top you are required to have a minimum of 17.5" arms and a 42+" chest. All else makes you a poser.
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Re: Why so many Posers in triathlons??? [triathlete36] [ In reply to ]
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The facts are:

- better equipment will make -anyone- faster. Even if you only average 15mph on the bike, a disc wheel will make you faster. In fact, the slower you are the more absolute time you will gain.

- most that do triathlons want to go as fast as they can given what training background and genetics they have.

- wheter or not you place in your age group is linked to genetics first, years of training and hours of training per week. Some MOP and BOP train real hard, and yet will never place very high. Does that mean that they should not be allowed to go as fast as they can ?

Trying to place a bar where people are allowed to buy better equipment is not only stupid, arrogant and foolish, it is plain old discrimination. In spirit, not different than separate bathrooms for coloured people. Extreme example you might think ? No, everytime you are trying to impose different sets of rules to different group of people, you are well on your way down that slippery slope. And as usual, people that promote such rules usually put the bar right behind them.

Can't believe I actually responded to such a thread...

Francois in Montreal
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Re: So many Arseholes, so few bullets. [AmyMI] [ In reply to ]
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"Tom drives a Lexus?!?! "

Only when he gives the chauffeur the day off.
Last edited by: davejakes: Jul 2, 04 7:04
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Re: Why so many Posers in triathlons??? [jaj] [ In reply to ]
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20 years in the sport! It only took me 8 years to go from Geek on a Mtb - Poser - Team USA. Get my butt kicked by my Italian friends who call me "posare". Get up at 4:30AM. Sleep in on the weekends until 5:30AM. Work out 1:30 WD, 3 hrs WE. Work 10 hours a day. Play with the kids and do homework from 6:30 - 9:00. Play w/ the wife 9:00 - 10:00. Weekends hang out with the family. BUY WHAT EVER THE HELL I WANT!!

GOD BLESS AMERICA!
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Re: Why so many Posers in triathlons??? [Kingstontri] [ In reply to ]
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"... great bikes aren't a right, but rather a privilege for the special few who've put in the training to deserve 'em."

That's the most ridiculous and elitest thing I've ever heard. What are you, a Roadie? :)

Why does buying cool stuff, when you're a MOPer or BOPer, make you a poser? What if I buy the cool stuff, but wear a sign that says "filthy, stinkin' rich MOPer" ? Does that alleviate the "poser" issue? I wonder how many of the "posers" out there really care whether someone thinks they "deserve" their $4000 bike or not.

It's this kind of attitude I had hoped to never encounter in triathlon. All those great folks out there who encourage you just to get involved and finish a race are what has made triathlon, in my opinion, the "friendliest" sport I've ever been involved with. I'd hate to see those people replaced with attitides like yours. Worry about yourself, not someone else. IMHO, If you get a charge out of beating the BOPer riding the tricked out P3 while you're on your 20 year old Schwinn, then you're no better than the elitest Roadie who looks down on triathletes, 'cause they aren't "real cyclists."

FWIW, I'll never have the "commensurate skill or ability" to ride a bike like Lance's or Tyler's or Jan's or Peter Reid's or Tim DeBoom's. But I know that if I ever won the lottery, the first thing I'd buy is a REALLY expensive, fast, aero, bad-motherfucker tri-bike. Why? Because I CAN. I have the RIGHT to spend my money however I want. And I say to Hell with anyone who thinks I don't "deserve" to ride the bike of my dreams, regardless of whether I'm good enough to finish in the top 5 of my age group at Kona.


-------------------------------------
Steve Perkins
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Re: Why so many Posers in triathlons??? [triathlete36] [ In reply to ]
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Why so many Posers in triathlons???

Name a better sport for posers to 'hang out' in, and cuz it's easy to get away with.


put the mettle to the pedal
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Re: Why so many Posers in triathlons??? [cerveloguy] [ In reply to ]
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I totally agree with you, Wile E. Most people probably sink their discretionary income into activities that interest them, no matter what the activity or hobby.

As far as appearing to be a poseur, I am such a beginner that I fear I would qualify as one no matter what kind of bike, suit, shoes, or sunglasses I have. I don't believe they make products commensurate with my ability. So, I'll buy what I want; whatever costs the most and is the shiniest, thank you very much.
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Re: Why so many Posers in triathlons??? [triathlete36] [ In reply to ]
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If you had an extra $3000 to blow wouldnt you go out and buy your dream bike? If you can afford why not buy it? I would.


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Re: Why so many Posers in triathlons??? [triathlete36] [ In reply to ]
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Being a "poser" or non-poser is a matter of attitude. I have no problem with anyone having great equipment, regardless of ability. It does irk me when some people act superior to the rest of us solely because they have better gear. The best way of dealing with these "posers" is to soundly beat them and then listen with an amused smile while they make excuses. "the run was long", "the water was dirty", "the Gatorade upset my stomach." Whaa.
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