I belong to a forum that is centered around Pensacola, so there was a bit of discussion on this. One of the guys said that his brother was driving in about 8:30 and was waiting to go through the gate at Eglin AFB which is about 50 miles away from Pensacola. He said that the line was backed up for a bit when he saw the police drag an Arab looking guy out of his car and handcuff him. It seems to be a bit more than a coincidence.

A saud attack on the homeland? First time for everything. Wait, not first time? I am sure this was a personal thing. Ought be interesting how this one sorts out.

T&P

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Remember - It's important to be comfortable in your own skin... because it turns out society frowns on wearing other people's

6 Saudis detained....makes you go hmmm

Yup. Hey weren’t all the guys involved in 9/11 Saudi?

Hey, remember when people from a whole bunch of countries were banned entry into the US but not people from the country that’s actually attacking Americans?

Good times.

My Iranian friend who is now Canadian thanks Trump for forcing him to stop Procrastinating and get his Canadian citizenship so he can travel to the US on business (although he’s questioned for about an hour every time).

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How does Danny Hart sit down with balls that big?

These happen so rarely. But each time they do the usual discussion about Mil bases being ‘gun free’ zones comes up. I’ve seen discussion of having officers and NCOs being allowed to carry weapons but nothing ever come of it.

I’ve spent years in various combat zones with me and all around me carrying loaded weapons. I can recall an occasional ND but for the most part we did so safely so I know it can be done. Don’t know if we really want to go down this road here in CONUS tho.

Didn’t realized a foreign national could buy a firearm. Wonder how the Saudi pilot trainee got his hands on the weapon?

Sad.

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Steve

We should retaliate against Iraq for this.

I've seen BDE XO meetings or senior NCO arguments devolve nearly into fisticuffs, everyone fully loaded with pistol and M4 and never once did anyone ever get shot. We can do it.

That said, I guess we *are* doing it, thru the MPs.

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Eric Reid AeroFit | Instagram Portfolio
Aerodynamic Retul Bike Fitting

“You are experiencing the criminal coverup of a foreign backed fascist hostile takeover of a mafia shakedown of an authoritarian religious slow motion coup. Persuade people to vote for Democracy.”

On the Pearl Harbor side, I've been surprised in my work at Marine and Navy bases how many angry and disgruntled guys there are. I've never been worried enough to report anyway, and my concern is more about morale and health than safety, but it's just been surprising.

The common thread in the anger, mostly seems to be related to ending up in what's considered low-value, worthless positions. Say a Marine who ends up in a position where he's never going to see "action."

Of course complaining about stuff is a pastime in the military, but these guys say absolutely savage things about their leadership and their service in general. When you call your officer staff, "Pussy pieces of shit," I have to wonder about morale.

I don't know enough to say whether to dismiss these guys as "snowflake" complainers who just weren't competent enough to get where they wanted, and the military is sending them the proper signal. Or if maybe the military doesn't do a good job of making non-tip-of-the-spear jobs appropriately recognized as valuable.

it is a leadership issue without a doubt.

this is just a personal opinion--and I certainly don't mean any disrespect. But the Navy and the Air Force are equipment centric forces and leadership focuses on the equipment and fighting it. The USMC and the Army are people centric forces and the leadership--on the whole--focuses on the people/warfighter.

this theory is certainly not without significantly detracting blips as you've that fuckwad Nadal killing people at the Ft Hood deployment center and another shit stain tossing grenades into tents before the Gulf War 1.

On the whole tho--I think the Army and the Marines do a much better job leadership wise in terms of taking care of Soldiers/Marines than does the Navy or the AF.


I'm sure some retired senior chief will be along shortly to tell me how F'd up my opinion is. Roger that Senior.

/r

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Steve

Nope. 15 of the 19 were Saudis. 2 were from the UAE, one was from Lebanon, and one from Egypt. The one from Egypt, Mohammed Atta, was the leader of the group. Interestingly, 3 of the 4 pilots were non-Saudis, so the Saudis were there mainly to provide the “muscle.” There is some question as to how much the non-pilots really knew about the plot.

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Taco cat spelled backwards is....taco cat.

Ok. I stand corrected.

Also UAE, Lebanon, Egypt and Saudi Arabia are all not banned.

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How does Danny Hart sit down with balls that big?

Because those countries apparently cooperate with the US when it comes to anti-terrorism and other security measures. Here's a link if you want to read more: https://www.politico.com/...ision-countries-map/

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Taco cat spelled backwards is....taco cat.

This! Need my oil company stocks to go up.

Given the senior chiefs have not weighed in, I'll offer my take of your comments and of trail's comments.

First, a bitching sailor is a happy sailor. The saying may go back to the days of sail. Among sailors of equal status and within the command it might be said the bitching contributes to his sound mental health. Expressing bitching outside the command or up the command does indicate a poor command climate which is then to be addressed best by and through good leadership.

Your people- or equipment-centric focus difference between the forces has some merit while still being a generalization that can be shot at.

I visit the Pentagon athletic facility routinely and in my conversations with those still wearing the uniform and the retired folks still working in the building, I am left with the impression that moral inside the building is currently not the best. This generalization too could be shot at even more successfully.

I'll close by highlighting your first sentence of "it is leadership without doubt" and expand upon it to state that leadership and example set from the very top has tremendous play and is of importance.
/r
Tom

Well stated

Today we're finding out that these Saudi's had a 'viewing party' a few days ago and watched videos of mass shootings. The one Saudi is videoing the shooting while a couple more watch from across the street?

something is not right here.

waaaaay back in Officers Advanced course--when I was a army captain--I was forced to 'sponsor' a Saudi foreign officer going thru the course with us. We had him over to dinner a time or two. He gifted my wife a very nice heavy gold wrist bracelet. What a worthless piece of shit he was. Slept thru classes, copied off me relentlessly on exams. Final breaking point was some NBC exam we'd had where you had to use nomographs to make down-wind fallout predictions after certain atomic attacks. He failed badly. Upon receiving his failing exam paper--good ol Rashdan Al-Multari says to me: "Once again I have failed Steve. You are NOT a good sponsor." Ohhh man. I went finger into the chest mode and told him what a worthless piece of shit he was and that if i had any care for the Kingdom I'd write them a letter about what a worthless lying cheating dirtbag he was. Friends pulled me away. I was relieved of sponsorship duties shortly thereafter.

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Steve

While waiting for my Infantry Officer Advance Course to start I was put on temporary duty into a couple of slots. The first one was as a action officer for the ASTD (Allied Student Training Detachment). ASTD was where the Army 'warehoused' and farmed out all the allied officers who came to Ft Benning for various training: Basic Course, Advanced Course, Ranger School, Pathfinder, etc etc.

So one FRI I get told "Hey LT Hawley--you're taking all our allied officers to the Talladega 500 this weekend." I got given a giant envelope filled with tickets to the TD500. Very early that morning we form up for accountability and then board two Greyhound Buses bound for Talledaga, Ala. Two giant buses filled with Saudi's, Jordanians, Iraqi's, Hondurans, Germans, etc.

What a shit show.

I think Bill Elliot won that race driving the Coors Light Car that year.

I didn't bring back half my allied officers. They were scattered in whore house, mobile homes, and campers across the SE USA. It took about a week to reestablish accountability of them all.

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Steve

I don't think that this

"But the Navy and the Air Force are equipment centric forces and leadership focuses on the equipment and fighting it. The USMC and the Army are people centric forces and the leadership--on the whole--focuses on the people/warfighter. "

really leads to this:

"On the whole tho--I think the Army and the Marines do a much better job leadership wise in terms of taking care of Soldiers/Marines than does the Navy or the AF."

Yes, the Navy and Air Force are, broadly speaking, more focused on systems. As a result, the leadership techniques are different. Different leadership techniques to effectively get a combat systems watch team to function properly on a ship compared to those required to get a fire team to function properly in combat. Not better or worse, just different. But those Sailors are working and living in close quarters 24/7 out at sea away from their families, and that requires just as much "take care of your people" leadership as the Army or USMC.

How we fight doesn't necessarily lead to more or less "take care of your people" skills or focus.

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Slowguy

(insert pithy phrase here...)