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Re: I drove a Tesla for the 1st time... [fierceSun] [ In reply to ]
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fierceSun wrote:
BLeP wrote:
But we all know that many people are brand loyal. They will defend a shitty product because it’s “their brand”.

Now, I am not saying that Tesla’s are shit. I never said that. I just don’t care what the Tesla people have to say about Tesla. They are extremely brand loyal.


How does a new car company build that brand loyalty? For most Tesla owners, their new car is their first Tesla and hence have switched brands.

How did Jim Jones get all of those people to drink the cool aid?
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Re: I drove a Tesla for the 1st time... [tri_yoda] [ In reply to ]
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tri_yoda wrote:

About 70% of Utah's electricity comes from burning coal.
https://www.eia.gov/.../analysis.php?sid=UT

So it is a little myopic to believe that driving electric cars in Utah defacto leads to overall improved air quality. Until our electricity infrastructure shifts to more renewable energy, EVs are just moving the pollution around, not reducing it.

Even if you burn mostly coal, EVs are still more efficient.

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Re: I drove a Tesla for the 1st time... [FishyJoe] [ In reply to ]
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FishyJoe wrote:


Even if you burn mostly coal, EVs are still more efficient.


I'd say the jury is still out on that. A recent German study says that CO2 emissions are worse for e-vehicles than for diesels with Germany's current energy source mix.

Popular (English) article about the study here:

https://notrickszone.com/...s-up-to-25-more-co2/

EDIT: and the actual study (German) here:

https://www.ifo.de/...toren-2019-04-25.pdf


"100% of the people who confuse correlation and causation end up dying."
Last edited by: MOP_Mike: Nov 17, 19 17:57
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Re: I drove a Tesla for the 1st time... [FishyJoe] [ In reply to ]
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By your logic, if we converted to 100% coal electricity production, but switched to 100% EVs we would have better overall air quality. I haven't run the specific numbers on this, but I find it very hard to believe this would be true.

What I am going to guess, is that this forecast you provided assumes a large reduction in coal electricity generation. At least in the US, coal powered plants are rapidly closing. So, what you are interpreting as an emission reduction due to EVs is actually an emissions reduction due to assumed closing of coal power plants; if the number of coal power plants were assumed to be increasing then this forecast would be different. Overall, the US electricity infrastructure is becoming more environmentally friendly, but it is still majority fossil fuel based and will be that way indefinitely based on current economics, without major legislative action.
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Re: I drove a Tesla for the 1st time... [MOP_Mike] [ In reply to ]
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MOP_Mike wrote:
FishyJoe wrote:


Even if you burn mostly coal, EVs are still more efficient.


I'd say the jury is still out on that. A recent German study says that CO2 emissions are worse for e-vehicles than for diesels with Germany's current energy source mix.

Popular (English) article about the study here:

https://notrickszone.com/...s-up-to-25-more-co2/

EDIT: and the actual study (German) here:

https://www.ifo.de/...toren-2019-04-25.pdf



I don't know if I would trust the Germans on anything diesel at this point. And it's completely laughable they would tout hydrogen considering how inefficient it is to produce and utilize. Pretty much wrecks any credibility of their analysis if they are actually advocating hydrogen, because you need an insane amount of electricity to produce hydrogen plus there is a lot of thermal loss using it as a fuel in a combustion engine.

Not to mention that diesel produces a lot of other bad emissions besides CO2. Diesels are pretty much the worst for air quality because of these waste products. And they are hard to eliminate, hence the cheating by the Germans.
Last edited by: FishyJoe: Nov 17, 19 18:58
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Re: I drove a Tesla for the 1st time... [FishyJoe] [ In reply to ]
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FishyJoe wrote:
MOP_Mike wrote:
FishyJoe wrote:


Even if you burn mostly coal, EVs are still more efficient.


I'd say the jury is still out on that. A recent German study says that CO2 emissions are worse for e-vehicles than for diesels with Germany's current energy source mix.

Popular (English) article about the study here:

https://notrickszone.com/...s-up-to-25-more-co2/

EDIT: and the actual study (German) here:

https://www.ifo.de/...toren-2019-04-25.pdf



I don't know if I would trust the Germans on anything diesel at this point. And it's completely laughable they would tout hydrogen considering how inefficient it is to produce and utilize. Pretty much wrecks any credibility of their analysis if they are actually advocating hydrogen, because you need an insane amount of electricity to produce hydrogen plus there is a lot of thermal loss using it as a fuel in a combustion engine.

Not to mention that diesel produces a lot of other bad emissions besides CO2. Diesels are pretty much the worst for air quality because of these waste products. And they are hard to eliminate, hence the cheating by the Germans.

I don't think it's fair to sweepingly mistrust "ze Germans" in all matters Diesel, but it should be noted that the IFO institute that conducted this study is a think tank of very conservative-leaning economists, so no experts in engineering, physics or the like.
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Re: I drove a Tesla for the 1st time... [J-No] [ In reply to ]
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I have had my Tesla S 75 AWD for one year now here in Norway.
I have been driving that car on snow, wet roads and even dry summer roads.
Thanks to all the Tesla Superchargers here in Norway I have had no problem with long trips.
All my charging is done in the garage with a home charger. We har 240v here in Norway.
And I can hardly see the cost on my electrical bill.

If you like muscle cars, nothing beats an EV.
I think mine goes 0-60 in 4.4.

Also. The Tesla is good on snow covered roads.
I have the air suspension so even if it is a lot of snow, I have no problems.

Norway is an EV country and Tesla is one of the top selling brands.
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Re: I drove a Tesla for the 1st time... [Halvard] [ In reply to ]
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How much does using the heater effect your range?
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Re: I drove a Tesla for the 1st time... [knewbike] [ In reply to ]
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knewbike wrote:
How much does using the heater effect your range?

I can tell that cold weather is using more of the battery. But to be honest. I have had no problem with range during this year.

Most people are not driving 200 miles a day. So, with one of the modern EVs you will always be fine.
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