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Scientific Triathlon Training Plans?
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Hello,

I've been listening to That Triathlon Show podcast, from Scientific Triathlon and I really enjoy the content and the interviews with high level coaches and endurance specialists. The guy seems pretty knowledgeable and his philosophy aligns with very respected coaches. For this reason, I started looking at their training plans. The one I'm interested is the 16-week Half Distance for Intermediate Level Athletes.

Has anybody tried the Scientific Triathlon plans before? Or should I go with a Joe Friel or Matt Fitzgerald's plans on TP?

Just some context: 3rd consecutive year doing 70.3, mid of the pack athlete, male, 34 yo, 160lbs, 10/12h week of training, current PR 5:20 and wanting to go to 4:59.

Thank you all!

G
Last edited by: gguerini: Jun 11, 19 15:18
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Re: Scientific Triathlon Training Plans? [gguerini] [ In reply to ]
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I updated the post (removing some fluff / too much personal info). I'd love to get some suggestions on a proper structured plan for a faster 70.3 race.
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Re: Scientific Triathlon Training Plans? [gguerini] [ In reply to ]
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At 46 Euros, the value for money seems very good.


From what they reveal of their plan, looks like that are trying to squeeze quality into a small amount of available training time. They only advertise 'Intermediate' training plans. Therefore assuming 'Advanced' athletes are encouraged to take out a 'Customised' plan.


You mention 10/12h per week of training. What is revealed of the above plan ranges from 6 to 11 hours (probably up to 12 hours in later weeks). Depends how well this matches your requirements. If you can average 10/12h per week and increase above that for big weeks closer to the race, then you may do better with a more advanced plan.
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Re: Scientific Triathlon Training Plans? [RobInOz] [ In reply to ]
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RobInOz wrote:
You mention 10/12h per week of training. What is revealed of the above plan ranges from 6 to 11 hours (probably up to 12 hours in later weeks). Depends how well this matches your requirements. If you can average 10/12h per week and increase above that for big weeks closer to the race, then you may do better with a more advanced plan.

I wonder if the 80/20 Triathlon: IRONMAN 70.3® Level 3 (Pace and Power, 7 to 15 Hours per Week) by Matt Fitzgerald and David Warden would be a better fit for me. 7 to 15 Hours per Week (I can probably manage that.. just need to be very organized) and the duration is 21 weeks.. so it will definitely create a good base as well. Considering my last race of 2019 is in August and my first one in 2020 is likely to be in February, the timing is perfect.
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Re: Scientific Triathlon Training Plans? [gguerini] [ In reply to ]
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Jim Vance's "today's plan" is a step above all listed. And he has results.. Ben kanute
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Re: Scientific Triathlon Training Plans? [gguerini] [ In reply to ]
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Whether one of the plans you listed will benefit you, I would say it depends how structured your training was before. I don’t personally think an off-the-shelf plan is likely to get you where you want to go. What are your weaknesses? Where are you likely to pick up the most/easiest time? What’s your coaching budget?
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Re: Scientific Triathlon Training Plans? [synthetic] [ In reply to ]
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synthetic wrote:
Jim Vance's "today's plan" is a step above all listed. And he has results.. Ben kanute

Do you have personal experience with Today's plan? I'm curious about his run structure.
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Re: Scientific Triathlon Training Plans? [gguerini] [ In reply to ]
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I get a bit dubious about these one size fits all plans.
With 10-12 hours per week of QUALITY training focused on addressing your limiters then you should be able to smash your PR.
My advice if you really want to reach your potential is to invest in a coach who can tailor a plan to your specific circumstances. I always look at it as an investment that reaps massive returns when you consider the huge number of hours we tend to put into the sport each week and all the other associated costs.
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Re: Scientific Triathlon Training Plans? [gguerini] [ In reply to ]
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Get in a swim lane with faster people. Refuse to leave. Work very hard (3x/week). This will allow you to eat more. This is fun. You can have an extra beer - even "funner!" Sleep.

Get involved with riders who want to pound you into cycling mush. Refuse to get dropped (2x/week). Ride socially long, or solo long (1x/week). Eat more healthful food, and some not so healthful food. Sleep.

Run with faster people on a track (1x/week). Run hard solo (1x/week). Run social, long, EZ (1x/week). Eat more healthy food. Add two extra beers for every 5 mile increase in weekly mileage. Fun Fun Fun. Sleep

Do as many push-ups as possible (1x/week). Do as many pull-ups or jumping pull-ups as possible (1x/week).

Repeat next week. :)




"Crush your enemies. See them driven before you, and hear the lamentations of the women!" ~ Conan
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Re: Scientific Triathlon Training Plans? [jaretj] [ In reply to ]
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jaretj wrote:
synthetic wrote:
Jim Vance's "today's plan" is a step above all listed. And he has results.. Ben kanute

Do you have personal experience with Today's plan? I'm curious about his run structure.

Personally no, my wife will be using it for 5-21k specifity. You doing tri will have different structure
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Re: Scientific Triathlon Training Plans? [jaretj] [ In reply to ]
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jaretj wrote:
synthetic wrote:
Jim Vance's "today's plan" is a step above all listed. And he has results.. Ben kanute


Do you have personal experience with Today's plan? I'm curious about his run structure.

Today's Plan isn't a "training plan", or any specific type of training approach in a can. It's an athlete management system, for monitoring training and training response/load. It's a system which allows a coach to account for all the things outside of training, that an athlete goes through in their day, with alerts about how they're feeling, how the workouts went, (positive or negative), all customized to the athlete and the coach's choosing. This is systemized, and allows coaches to monitor many factors that contribute to or effect performance, mental, emotional and physical.

There's a lot more to it than that, but from a training perspective, that is the key difference. If an athlete trains 25-30 hours per week on average, that still leaves 20+ hours each day outside of training, that other platforms have never really tried to account for. It's the biggest reason I made the move, and why many Tour de France teams use the platform. So you can see why coaches, especially those with many athletes, would want a platform which helps them address training at the time when the athletes need it most. I believe it has made a huge difference in training and racing for Ben Kanute, and I am sure he would say the same thing.

That said, there are training plans available on the platform, which I authored. They require a subscription to the platform to access them, but they are free with a subscription.

Hope this helps clarify what Today's Plan is and does.

Jim Vance
http://TodaysPlan.com.au (Disclosure: I am contracted with Today's Plan)
http://www.CoachVance.com/
Twitter @jimvance
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Re: Scientific Triathlon Training Plans? [Amnesia] [ In reply to ]
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Amnesia wrote:
I get a bit dubious about these one size fits all plans.
With 10-12 hours per week of QUALITY training focused on addressing your limiters then you should be able to smash your PR.
My advice if you really want to reach your potential is to invest in a coach who can tailor a plan to your specific circumstances. I always look at it as an investment that reaps massive returns when you consider the huge number of hours we tend to put into the sport each week and all the other associated costs.

That's the problem I'm trying to solve. Since I've started doing triathlons two/three years ago, I've never followed a training plan. My training evolved to something like this:
- 2x swim per week / not a lot of yardage (1800/2000 yards each time) / only during triathlon season / going from 2min/100y to low 1:40min/100y (plateaued there!)
- TrainerRoad's Half Ironman plans (Base, Build Specialty), but not super consistently / also, only during triathlon season
- run 20 to 30mi per week - 1 long run easy, 1 track/speed workout (but no structure/no purpose) and lots of easy and short runs

On top of that, I sleep very well around 8h30 every night and I wake up without an alarm. I eat very healthy too! And a lot.

I can certainly improve on all three sports. I'd be happy going down to 1:35mi/100y, keep the bike training year round and get faster on the run.

The reason why I'd like to follow a training plan, even if it's not tailor to my needs, is so I can have a purpose behind each session and a good progression. I keep doing the same things over and over again and we know it's hard to improve this way.
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Re: Scientific Triathlon Training Plans? [gguerini] [ In reply to ]
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Im short on time but Im late 40s have lil/no experience in swim, bike or run and did my first Tri (a 70.3) last year. I doing another 70.3 in just over a week. I got Mikael's plan and really like it. He's clearly super knowledgeable and seems to be very well thought-out for all three disciplines and integrated. Theres short videos for each weeks training and the workouts themselves have detailed descriptions and pacing/power keyed off the zones you're supposed to be hitting and the results from your most recent CSS/FTP/Threshold test. For someone who is new to tri and doesn't have the $ for a coach I think it well worthwhile. Would a coach be better? Yes. So would a tri bike vs the steel framed road bike Im using, however......
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Re: Scientific Triathlon Training Plans? [gguerini] [ In reply to ]
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gguerini wrote:
Hello,

I've been listening to That Triathlon Show podcast, from Scientific Triathlon and I really enjoy the content and the interviews with high level coaches and endurance specialists. The guy seems pretty knowledgeable and his philosophy aligns with very respected coaches. For this reason, I started looking at their training plans. The one I'm interested is the 16-week Half Distance for Intermediate Level Athletes.

Has anybody tried the Scientific Triathlon plans before? Or should I go with a Joe Friel or Matt Fitzgerald's plans on TP?

Just some context: 3rd consecutive year doing 70.3, mid of the pack athlete, male, 34 yo, 160lbs, 10/12h week of training, current PR 5:20 and wanting to go to 4:59.

Thank you all!

G

Hi G -

We have a few plans that will help you. Although we do believe in 1 to 1 coaching, the training plans are a less expensive alternative. The plans all have structured workouts - that you can download to your Garmin, Trainer Road or Zwift. It couldn't be easier to follow a workout. Our plans are progressive and will push you without breaking you. We also have Sport Focus plans that address weakness over an 8 week period - and we have these for swim, bike and run.

The plans download into Training Peaks so you can follow your PMC , TSB and CTL as well.

Link to D3 70.3 training plans

If you have any questions, please let me know or send me an email at mike at d3 multisport dot com. Good luck this season!

Mike Ricci
2017 USAT World Team Coach
USAT National Coach of the Year
Coaching Triathletes since 1992.
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Re: Scientific Triathlon Training Plans? [JimVance] [ In reply to ]
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Yes it does, thank you for taking time to explain it to me.

jaretj
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Re: Scientific Triathlon Training Plans? [jaretj] [ In reply to ]
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This thread is slowly turning into a everyone advertise your plans/coaching thread.
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Re: Scientific Triathlon Training Plans? [TRobTri] [ In reply to ]
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Isnt' that what the OP was phishing for?

He did say this:
"Has anybody tried the Scientific Triathlon plans before? Or should I go with a Joe Friel or Matt Fitzgerald's plans on TP? "
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Re: Scientific Triathlon Training Plans? [gguerini] [ In reply to ]
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I purchased the Ironman intermediate training plan for the same reasons. I listen to the podcast and enjoy the content. So, if the plan is built on the same principles he discusses on the podcast, then I believe it should be a good plan.

I started the plan this week, although it officially starts in 4 more weeks. I'm going to repeat the first few weeks because I don't know what else to do with my training. I haven't looked a ton into the plan, but I'm just going to go all in and follow it almost to a T. I think that I will benefit from doing that because my training has never been very consistent. I tend to always want to stack on more training, not giving enough respect to the work I do outside of training (real job, taking care of house, playing with kids, etc...). Because of that, I get burned out and my training drops off. Then, I feel like I'm behind in my fitness, train even more the next week, burn out even more, and keep repeating the cycle. As it progresses, I might modify the plan some based on "life" and to focus more on my weaknesses if the workouts aren't addressing them.

I am using it for my first Ironman race. I have done several half Ironman races. I don't see any reason why this plan couldn't get me to finish in 10 to 10.5 hours.

When it comes to 1 on 1 coaching, I can't afford it. So, I am hoping that this pre-built plan can give me a good skeleton that I can use for the next few years and just modify slightly to my needs.
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