Seems like they are further pairing down then? I seem to remember this exact same thread last year.

If Slowtwitch can be used as a barometer for the broader population, the Shiv seems to be hardly ever on anyone’s consideration list. I wonder if they are canceling sponsorships due to poor sales of this model?

That said, I wonder if this is part of a broader trend among manufacturers, looking at Cervelo dropping almost all their sponsored athletes, and the likes of Trek and others only having a handful of athlete sponsorships.

I remember there was a thread like this indeed but have no idea why I couldn’t find it.

I was wondering whether maybe all Bahrain endurance athletes were switching to a team’s sponsor? But I’m not sure Lucy is part of that group. Also it would imply AB moving from Scott. Pure speculation here

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I was going to make a similar thread. Mainly sponsorships changes in general. I don't follow a ton of triathletes but those two were notable changes and also Josh Amberger will no longer be with Felt. I figured it was just coincidence that their contracts ended at this time but I could be wrong. Maybe Blu will move to Giant with Iden?

Definitely intrigued to see if there is a large scale something going on... maybe a company of some varieties looking to make a large move into triathlon and has a great product, maybe companies such as specialized are cutting costs through fear of economic problems related to COVID/post COVID? if you couldn't tell I have no idea and none of my ideas are likely true.... but I'm most certainly interested in what may be happening! Personally hoping I'm going to get to see a bunch of awesome shiny bikes paraded all over social media!

Vincent Luis and Hayden Wilde have not posted anything so I guess it is on an individual basis.
Justus Nieschlag, german ITU athlete, also has a smiliar post about ending his time with Specialized.

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Strava

Maybe it's as simple as bike companies sponsor athletes to help sell bikes. Bike are pretty much sold out right now, so why bother spending sponsorship money on pro athletes when your product is already selling out.

As for Lucy Charles, I imagine it costs Specialized a pretty penny to sponsor her, and tri is such a niche bike sport. Plus, purely anecdotal, but out of all the tri folks in my area, I've only seen one of the newer Shivs among our riders. Cervelo and QR seem to be the top tri bikes in my area.

if they were to keep anyone i would have thought Lucy would be it. i saw on instagram the announcement this morning. i was pretty shocked.

i wonder also if the athletes just dont like the bike that much and WANT to go to something else.

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COVID has been a boon for bike sales and service. Don't know about sponsorships though.

It all boils down to money. Either for the athlete or for the company. I wouldn’t be surprised if specialized offered both of them contracts and both turned it down because they could get more from somewhere else.

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I guess I was thinking along the lines of although sales have gone well so far if people who might have been future customers feel the squeeze due to adverse financial impacts on them they may not purchase as they may not be able to, particularly with prices rising due to production and supply chain difficulties? However I may be very wrong...

Not specific to Specialized, but Paula Findlay mentioned in this week's YouTube video that she's still working on her bike sponsorship for next year. So, throw Trek in there as well (and you'd think Findlay is a very attractive athlete to sponsor at the moment). So Charles-Barkley moving away from Specialized, Amberger moving away from Felt, Findlay considering switching from Trek. Perhaps a coincidence or perhaps three legacy bike manufacturers--Specialized, Felt, and Trek--that haven't been innovating all that much in the tri space have just decided that the tri market is no longer where it's at for them.

I'll bet its Canyon.

One of the problems for buying a Shiv is that it's an uber pricey superbike, or northing. No mid rang offerings. Whereas Canyon and Cervelo have an range of models and prices.

In the UK a Shiv frame is £6k. That's ludicrous. Who's spending £6k on a meh frame ?
The cheapest bike £8.5k. With a ultegra di2 and 38mm deep Royal wheels. It doesn't even come with tubeless tyres at that price point either so you have to chuck another £130 to get a decent tubeless set up (if the Roval wheels are Tubeless compatible?).
A below average offering at boutique pricing. Not many going to buy that.

I think the other issue is that you have to be someone that really wants a huge water tank on the back of your bike. If that kind of hydration system isn't of interest to you, you likely aren't going to buy this bike.

Also I was thinking that Specialized needs to keep up with their other athletes’ expectations. For instance Vincent Luis. And if they had to choose between VL and Lucy/Kristian, I would not be surprised they went all in for the former. When you think in terms of wins and titles VL is the horse to put money on before an Olympic year

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Perhaps. They could also be totally unrelated. I don't think these bike sponsorship contracts are annual. Lucy/Kristians' contracts might be up this year while VL's is not.

More and more companies are trying to move to one-year contracts. For obvious reasons. Multi-year contracts are great until they aren't. I think you'll see fewer multi-year contracts post-COVID. While, ultimately, COVID has proved to be a boon to the bike industry overall, it was pretty tough early on. I imagine that many of these companies are rethinking their overall investment strategy. In particular, *race* bikes - and elite sport (both triathlon and cycling) more generally - were shown to be relatively fragile this year. Put more simply, I'd definitely bet on interest in fitness - swim, bike, and run - continuing to grow. Would I bet on pro triathlon returning in a meaningful way? I'm a whole lot less confident of that.

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"Non est ad astra mollis e terris via." - Seneca | rappstar.com | FB - Rappstar Racing | IG - @jordanrapp

Lots of good, sensible stuff being said here. could just be the normal carousel of sponsorship changes, or COVID-related issues from Specialized which are changing their focus a little bit. or both. but I keep coming back to these points, which I just see as flaws in the bike/product line itself and I don't think sponsorship can fix them. There have been multiple documented instances of sponsored pros not even using the hydration system as designed (lucy, tim don, probably others). if I was spending uberbike money, I wouldn't have the shiv on my list, no matter who they sponsored. maybe they realize this.

I work in Sport Marketing and sponsorship, not in Triathlon but in football.
Don´t start thinking that it was because of the look or functions of the new Shiv.
The athletes don´t ride the bikes for the looks or the difference of 2 or 3 Watt it is for the money.
It is their work and we all would follow the money to make a living.
Covid actually helped the bike companies and you can´t get your hands on a new Shiv, Scott or similar before April as they are sold out.

Each year Specialized seems to end some contracts and sign some new ones. We all remember last year when Ben Hoffman left Specialized, people were also thinking that there must be some secret stuff going on in the background. But it wasn´t.

There is such little investment return from pro triathletes in general. Only the true fans really follow it anyway. I've always said the best way to grow a business is to focus on true high-quality anchor tenants (ie. Super noisy triathletes and coaches, tri-club presidents etc). You need a couple of pros to validate the brand. As an aside, I watched Cobb go from 25 athletes to 15 to 10 to 5 to just 1 athlete! Didn't seem to hurt their brand and the company eventually sold for top-dollar. Interesting that Cobb and Alex just seemed to seemed to have good insight to which athletes were adding value, not so much on absolute basis, but relative to their cost. Big athletes may produce value but relative to their cost it just isn't a good return.

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Will be interesting to see if The same is happening to Tim Don.

Pretty sure they will hang onto their Olympic athletes.

Also this comes down to just a lot more ways of reaching people with todays means.
I am not sure what any of these bike deals are worth in Triathlon, but I know that specialized sponsors a TON of motocross athletes, and the combined following of 10 top motocross racers is probably greater and costs less than 1 pro triathlete. Now I think LCB is probably one of the most sought after triathletes in terms of brand size (she is a top performer, large social following, ETC) but that also means she probably commands a premium paycheck, and maybe Specialized decided that was not worth it.
There is also a lot of teams shifts in the mountain bike world. The womens world champion is leaving Canyon, the mens world champion is leaving BMC, Emily Batty is leaving Trek, and Specialized shifted 2 of their big US MTB prospects from their factory team to the Trinity Racing team.

Not a shock that ITU athletes are changing bike after the 2020 season.
2020 was the end of the olympic cycle.
Of course due to corona, the olympics will (maybe) happen in 2021.

I think in Findlay's case, she has created a market for herself after the year she just had. Spent all year making great content (well, being in great content largely created by Eric) when no racing was happening then capped it off with the performance of her career in the one race that mattered. Think she has options she is exploring, rather than Trek perhaps giving her the boot.

That's pure speculation, but think Findlay is in the driver seat more than many of her peers.

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"It's good enough for who it's for" - Grandpa Wayne

I was a little surprised by this too - they lost Kate Courtney a couple of years ago and I was shocked by that one as mountain biking is exploding.

I get that they would want to invest less in tri given the participation trajectory of the sport currently. Even having highly marketable person like Lucy Charles did not make Specialized desirable to people like us given how the brand polled on the last iteration of "what bike are you most likely to buy?" poll here on Slowtwitch.

I also wonder what will happen to Sarah True.

It could be that Canyon has stupid money to spend because of their recent new private equity rounds, or maybe Specialized thinks they are going to sell every bike they make in the next two years anyway because of current industry shortages, although that would certainly be short term thinking.

Yeah, more pure speculation: I wonder if Argon 18 made a pitch to her and Eric. They’d sponsor their videos. Have both of them on the same bike. Argon has a new high-end bike coming out, and they’d probably love the advertising...

I recall that it was Courtney's decision to go to Scott. And speaking of their MTB team, Simon Andreassen just announced his parting ways with Specialized too.

Specialized also dealt their other MTB athletes (Chris Blevins and Haley Batten) to a Specialized sponsored team- Trinity Racing.

What makes you think specialized is ending the relationship?

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Most importantly: what about Stanley Lemieux-Jorgensen???

More and more companies are trying to move to one-year contracts. For obvious reasons. Multi-year contracts are great until they aren't. I think you'll see fewer multi-year contracts post-COVID. While, ultimately, COVID has proved to be a boon to the bike industry overall, it was pretty tough early on. I imagine that many of these companies are rethinking their overall investment strategy. In particular, *race* bikes - and elite sport (both triathlon and cycling) more generally - were shown to be relatively fragile this year.


THIS!

I agree 100% with Jordan.

Bike brands had there BEST year ever for general bike sales with NO extraordinary spending on marketing or promotion.

I think the whole "Win on Sunday, sell on Monday" premise of Sponsorship for the brands in the bike business, is more or less done now - accelerated along by COVID19 - there were NO races (almost) so no wins to tout anyway. Content Marketing and Social Media engagement is now firmly routed as the key driver to a brands marketing efforts.

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Steve Fleck @stevefleck | Blog

I agree, but why then would Specialized allow these two racers to leave the fold - Lucy Charles I assume to be the #1 most followed triathlete on Instagram (338K followers) and the #1 most followed mountain biker (Kate Courtney- 475K). Are you suggestigng that the bike industry would be better served by sponsoring other non sport related bicycle influencers? People who appeal to a much broader audience than just the lung crowd?

Well, Mark Wahlberg recently posted a pic of himself and the new Specialized Epic (he even tagged Specialized so it was clearly arranged). I think Jason Mamoa (Aquaman) also did the same thing earlier in the year. Both struck me as super random putting aside the marketing aspect. I mean, who looks at Aquaman and thinks of bikes? Specialized may have made more off those two posts than from Lucy Charles entire tenure with Specialized.

If you read into Lucy’s insta post, I think you can infer that she signed a less than lucrative deal with specialized in 2017 before she was triathlon household name. Her contract is now up where she can finally capitalize on her success. A pro like Lucy should be getting a salary near 6 figures (maybe more) from a major sponsor. She likely had multiple offers to choose from and my money is on specialized didn’t offer the most money.

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Vincent Luis just announced that he’s staying with Specialized for a few more years

Most sponsors probably overpaid in 2020. When they were setting up those deals, it was an olympic year, so guys like KB and VL could probably command an extra premium. What they ended up with was: a year of almost no racing, zero visibility for athletes who lacked a big social media presence (ex. Ryf), and brisk sales that had nothing to do with sponsorship. All of that probably has many of the brands rethinking their overall marketing strategies, so lots of flux is to be expected.

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ECMGN Therapy Silicon Valley:
Depression, Neurocognitive problems, Dementias (Testing and Evaluation), Trauma and PTSD, Traumatic Brain Injury (TBI)

Generally speaking seeing Lucy and Josh Amberger move onto other bikes is interesting. More with Amberger. Josh has been on a Felt for the majority of his professional, so the length of the relationship and then the move away is just interesting.

But for Lucy to move away from Specialized, I don't get why they'd move away from her. If anything she's done enough on her "prove it" side of the relationship that she NEEDs to be the face of their brand.

The Blummenfelt one is also interesting for me as he's done a lot more long course stuff. I don't see the ITU racers that Specialized sponsors really moving the needle for bike sales more than supplying/sponsoring a grand tour team would. Generally road bike is a road bike here.

But going back to Lucy, as far as a face is concerned and how much of a great ambassador she's been I don't get the move at all.

For Paula, I don't think it's a Trek moving away from her as much as her contract was up and she has other offers on the table with her Daytona win. She may well remain with Trek.

Rappstar saying bike companies wanting to move to year to year deals will be the norm, perhaps, but that also creates issues on its own.

Really weird time in the triathlon world when it comes to partnerships.

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Washed up footy player turned Triathlete.

 A pro like Lucy should be getting a salary near 6 figures (maybe more) from a major sponsor. She likely had multiple offers to choose from and my money is on specialized didn’t offer the most money.


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For some fun context. I was speaking with an non industry sponsor a few years back that approached an american female itu athlete to sponsor her. Let's just say the bottom line and suggested value went something like "low 6 figure sponsorship money won't get your logo on the racing kit". Taking a look at all things social media savy + results, it made sense.

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Brooks Doughtie, M.S.
Exercise Physiology
-USAT Level II

Braden Currie appears to be still sponsored by Specialized for long course.

It’s funny to hear Lagerstrom make jokes about the Trek compared to his bike. Argon18 makes sense for Findlay, especially with their recurring guest star on their videos, Heather Jackson.
Tim Don and Sarah True may not cost as much as a Lucy Charles and have the security of the Zwift Academy tie-ins.
Why wouldn’t Ventum offer Charles big money as a presence in Europe?

Please no. I hope she rides something faster and cooler!

I dunno, I doubt they’re going to sell less bikes or gear without her as a sponsored athlete. Take the six figure salary (as others have suggested) that it would have taken to keep her and put that towards a growing arm of the cycling market such as ebikes or gravel instead. Probably a better ROI.

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Matt

The brand's that can and will pay Lucy has to be very few! Canyon are extremely strong in the men's side, but a Lucy could be great on the women's side, but hey just sponser so many already.

Scott has kienle, maybe Lucy on the women's side.

Or Cervelo making s real comeback?

I just really hope it is not some niche brand, splashing all their cash on her and maybe can't give her windtunnel etc.

Not any more! Check Specialized's instagram...

Was just about to say, now Currie gone too!

Look like Tim Don is staying based on his Instagram story today.

Well if they’re keeping Tim Don and Sara True, they may actually have resources to sign new contracts for athletes changing sponsors. We’ve been focusing on athletes leaving Spesh but maybe some will join?

And idk who commented about this being normal turnover post Olympic year (post 2020 at least) but I think this is right. For instance Leo Bergère (French ITU guy) also left his 5-year sponsor - French boutique brand Leon Cycles.

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Jordan I was actually wondering: what would IM/ITU look like without sponsorships from bike companies?

The reason brands are sponsoring athletes is mainly to increase their visual presence and thus trigger consumer sales. At least that’s how I see it. Do you believe athletes would all ride the “best possible gear” in a no-sponsorship world? Would that affect general sales for tri bikes or the break-up between brands would remain similar for AGers?

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Certainly for the UK, I'd argue Tim Don is a far bigger 'ambassador' than LC. Whilst unquestionably LC is an amazing athlete at the top of her game, i just see Tim Don as being (even) more loved in the UK scene - the combination of his huge time at the top level first in ITU and then long course. And also his overall persona. His recovery from being nearly killed in Kona has elevated his standing too over here further too (not that you'd ever wish that on anyone of course).

But again I say that Specialized has no TT product for most amateur completer types to buy, as I'm not dropping $11.5k (£8500) on the base model Shiv, even though I AM in the market for a new TT bike, and bought an SL6 Tarmac 12 months ago so certainly have no problem with Specialized as a bike maker (and have a Stumpjumper in the garage too for mtb).

Every year - "so and so is leaving such and such"

Yeah, they want to negotiate the most amount of money possible from their sponsors. It's that simple.

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"The person on top of the mountain didn't fall there." - unkown

also rule 5

This reminds of when frodeno left specialized.

https://forum.slowtwitch.com/...cialized%20#p5385431

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I can take a wild guess who that was.

I find this whole thread and the Instagram comments very interesting. It’s apparent that many don’t understand the business side of being a pro (and some pros don’t understand it either). Us AG’ers take for granted our jobs/income and typically have some sort brand loyalty. And there’s an expectation that pro’s and sponsors have loyalty to brands or the athlete. Those days (if they ever existed) have been dwindling down for many years and I’d say there is very minimal loyalty in our sport (and there isn’t anything necessarily wrong with that). It’s all about the money and more pro’s need to be willing to turn down deals in order to help monetize off of their brand (whether it’s immediate or 1-2 years down the road). I see this all as a good thing as pro’s need to be more business savvy.

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I’ve never liked those comments by Eric as I felt they were unprofessional and unfounded.

But then again Eric has never been one that shys away from complaining.

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from what i hear, braden is moving, and already has a new deal. but that's 2nd hand.

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Dan Empfield
aka Slowman

Following up on Specialized athletes next season and I think it's interesting that they signed someone like Tom Oosterdijk (Dutch AGer turning pro next year). This makes me think that they're still willing to invest in younger talents (who have lower financial expectations).

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I think bike companies realized this year with the bike boom so much sponsorship doesn’t make a major difference with people buying bikes. Companies like Specialized will continue to put money into something like Legion of LA because that’s giving them a different style of marketing.

The cycling team I’m part of, which has close to 300 people on it around a bunch of areas had a “pro” discount attached and we found out a month or so ago that it was “being placed on hold” which I assume means never come back.

I think a lot of these bike companies reached that deals like this cut into their profits and why bother to do it when this has shown people who ride will still purchase the products.

For a triathlete? I just don't see that at all.

Are we talking the likes of Zafares? I guess maybe. However, the majority of sponsorships outside of the handful or even less than a handful of top end sponsorships aren't going there. I'd love to see an audit report from PWC on athlete sponsorship in Individual Sports. PWC puts out a yearly report on the NFL so it would be interesting to see averages on both prize money and sponsorships.

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Washed up footy player turned Triathlete.

This sponsor was a major medical hospital that has a good pulse on the sport because the president's daughter had been doing youth + DL tri's well even before this female athlete's rise in the sport. They 1000% saw the power and presence said athlete had. So when it was told to them that it would take 6 figures+ to be on the logo of said kit....they didn't balk necessarily but they "understood business". It was a little too rich for their investment, but I'm just telling you what the "cost of doing business" was in that transaction.

Knowing the athlete, her career pathway it makes hella sense. My initial reaction was "no way" but after lunch w/ said sponsor it made me realize the "whole package" was worth it for companies to invest...It also made sense because I got so tired of seeing the athlete's daily "schilling" online that I had to unfollow/mute said athlete.


(and no it's not KZ)

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Brooks Doughtie, M.S.
Exercise Physiology
-USAT Level II

It should also be understood that logo placement on ITU kits are very rigid and structured. You really only have about 4 placements because ITU restricts it so much and it has to be certain sizes, etc. It's not like a LC kit where the whole kit can be said sponsor w/ it littered all over the kit. LC kits you can do anything you want with them, splash sponsors anywhere and everywhere.....not so on ITU kit. The logos can't even be bigger than the name/fed you race for. So we are talking about likely 4 sponsors around the name and country.

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Brooks Doughtie, M.S.
Exercise Physiology
-USAT Level II

But in the big scheme of things $100k for a sponsorship isn't all that much especially for companies if your outside of the scope of said sport. Texaco sponsoring Richard Murray I bet pays him a pretty penny and he's always seemed "genuine" with his social media presence. That's the only issue I have with sponsors being attached at your social media presence as well. Sometimes it means said athlete turns into a social media sponsor zombie and it becomes pretty clear they getting more and more "fake". I unfollowed said athlete when a post about "family" came up and in the middle of said picture there was a perfect placed logo'd water bottle (funny enough it was said sponsor water bottle...funny how that works).


$100k to companies inside said niche sport, yeah you aint going to get it, unless your one of the biggest companies. Gu or sport beans ain't shelling out $100k to athletes. Specialized is one of the biggest bikes in the world. They ain't hurting by giving out 6 figure sponsorships. Raleigh bikes- nah couldn't do it.

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Brooks Doughtie, M.S.
Exercise Physiology
-USAT Level II

At the tip of the spear, companies like Breitling are willing to throw cash around, same with Mercedes. This is to say, I don't know what TV for long course looks like in Europe. But we know what it's like here. Outside of Ironman produced lives there's nothing on TV for the most part. So what are companies paying for etc? Maybe it's to be associated with winning, which I get. One of the reasons AIG held the most expensive sponsor deals with the All Blacks for a decade because they sponsored a winning team of two Men's Rugby World Cups, and the winner of a Women's World Cup in the Black Ferns.

I'm just looking at exposure and engagement etc. I do think the grind that Lagerstrom has put in on youtube this year with high quality content has made him extremely more valuable to his partners. One thing is for certain, activation of sponsorships is becoming more key to partnerships with both individual athletes and sports teams.

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Washed up footy player turned Triathlete.

So what are companies paying for etc?

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Likeability and connection with people. That was the #1 thing that said sponsor said why they were so big on approaching this particular athlete....who also won a lot (of course that's the reason you are liked and can connect). So you first have to win and then you build your brand. Then companies will come to you. That's what this athlete did and it has worked very very well for said athlete.

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Brooks Doughtie, M.S.
Exercise Physiology
-USAT Level II

It's the same reason a guy like Dak Prescott who by all accounts is a "nice guy" is going to make more money in sponsorship then he ever will playing in the NFL and this includes when he finally signs a massive deal where he'll likely be top 5-7 player paid in the NFL.

He's sitting on a gold mine being the "clean cut" QB for the biggest franchise in the world.

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Brooks Doughtie, M.S.
Exercise Physiology
-USAT Level II

You aren’t the only one who had to hit the unfollow button.

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Side note, but for the Tim Don fans, came across these on eBay:

https://www.ebay.com/...tim+don&_sacat=0




Disclaimer: I have no attachment/relationship with the item or seller.

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ECMGN Therapy Silicon Valley:
Depression, Neurocognitive problems, Dementias (Testing and Evaluation), Trauma and PTSD, Traumatic Brain Injury (TBI)

He will make a lot in endorsements, but it won’t touch his 35+ million per year in salary if he returns healthy. Star football players don’t get the huge shoe deals NBA players get.

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Let food be thy medicine...

Your info is incorrect.

He currently makes $50mil a year on endorsements according to several different reports. And that’s without a “shoe deal” which yes nfl guys don’t do “shoe deals” like every star nba player.

His playing contract will never touch what he makes off the field. From an google search from Oct '20 article: From AT&T to Adidas, Beats by Dre to Campbell’s Chunky Soup and Direct TV, Prescott has inked 11 endorsement deals in his young career, and all of them pay him handsomely for his support.



ETA: But that big money from endoresments is also why he can stare down Jerry Jones and turn down whatever millions they've already offered him. He's not dependent on his what under $2mil/yr current contract. So he can play chicken with the cowboys and make bank when the 2 sides finally agree on some likely $30+ mi/yr contract.

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Brooks Doughtie, M.S.
Exercise Physiology
-USAT Level II

But again Dak has capitalized on the fact that he plays for the #1 franchise basically in the world or atleast the US and likely top 3 in the world and he's' a "good guy". He isnt caught by TMZ at the strip club at 1am (not that there is anything wrong with that), he doesn't make the team/company look bad ever, he's "wholesome" and everyone likes him. He isn't a "line stepper". He's also a good QB, taken the team to the playoffs I believe several times. He doesn't "suck" that's for sure.

He is a lot like Russell Wilson, and one of the knocks on RW is that he's "fake". Every post game interview for those guys is the same cliches "I gotta play better", "I'm going to work hard", "God has blessed me", and that shit sells to companies. It's easy because they don't create drama or controversy.

And so back to what I was saying earlier. One of the reasons the athlete I mentioned was getting 6 figure sponsor deals is because they saw the gravitation pull she had with people. This athlete was a great "role model" for the next generation....she was winning + "America's sweetheart". So that's why you get paid big bucks by companies, that's easy as hell to sell!

And one of the things I find most difficult with this sport is there is so little money that you can't just do it on winnings. Cus you better be top of food chain or you might not get much money. But how do you work your social media game when your working away for 30 hrs a week training and "trying to make it". It's why imo you have to "win" in order to get the big bucks in this sport w/ sponsors. I dont know many pack fodder pros that are well compensated. What Eric Lagerstrom and Paula are doing is fantastic and I think they are going to find their niche and be able to capitalize on that *eventually*. But man what they are doing is really really hard, and I think atleast from afar the digital side is a passion of Eric's (atleast it comes across that way). So I dont know if you could do what they do + train as hard as they do if you didn't like both "jobs".

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Brooks Doughtie, M.S.
Exercise Physiology
-USAT Level II

Just a point of clarification, Prescott was tagged in 2020. He’s making $31.4 million this year.

I agree with this view in that, I used to follow a certain athlete on I.G. but felt like product placement and the way posts were worded, were so POORLY done, I felt like it was forced down our throat. I mean--how can you be talking about how beautiful a day it is then pop in a comment about your chocolate milk and silky (name brand) bed sheets into the convo? I stopped following as it was just too fake to stomach. I understand it is their job to have a social media presence as part of contracts and such, but you have to be subtle about it or you lose people, for good. I won't even follow the athlete's spouse either--same thing. Don't watch any Youtube videos they put out...too contrived...not genuine. There's a right way and wrong way to do these things and some pros just need to hire a publicist or learn marketing better.

Good catch, and he'll likely be tagged again cus he doesnt need to sign with the Cowboys if he doesnt like the asking price. He wasn't "hurting" before even this year's franchise tag.

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Brooks Doughtie, M.S.
Exercise Physiology
-USAT Level II

That's sorta the interesting thing in all of this. And I wonder what companies think of their athletes turning into "product schills" that then turns off the very public and eyeballs you want. But then again I'm guessing it's all in the contract fine print that said athlete will come back with "you said 5 product plugs a week....i gave you 5 product plugs". But I think what I've found most interesting in all of this, I've taken your very viewpoint on it. I wont even open anything that is attached to the athlete within any social media, unless it deals with a race.

I've got a guy likely turning pro next year and he's a former military guy turned triathlete and I've mentioned to him that he needs to get more "social media savy"....and I just mean, getting an more active account. But there is certainly ways to do it and not be over the top. But then again being so "fake" but making 6 figures from it, I guess they can tell all the "haters" to F off. But the real thing isn't that we don't want to watch/view etc., it's we dont want that fake shit pushed down our throat. That was imo one of the issues I have with Triathlon Taren....And imo when a athlete/person steps over the line into the "schilling" world, imo they dont get the consumer back ever....and as you put it, anything attached to them sorta becomes persona non grata. It def is a fine line, and there are some who do it really well.

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Brooks Doughtie, M.S.
Exercise Physiology
-USAT Level II

And I should say that I as a coach "need" to be social media savy etc. to grow my squad and support my athletes. I get the "hustle". I just cringe or maybe it's jealousy/annoyance when athletes turn their social media into product zombie bullshit. Maybe it's the game that is how it's to be played, but I've followed enough athletes etc to atleast recognize ones that are doing it they way I can enjoy their content....and ones that obviously cause people to turn away (evident by the ppl that have said like myself they got put off and ignore the content now). I think there is a way to do it without throwing it in your face every single post.

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Brooks Doughtie, M.S.
Exercise Physiology
-USAT Level II

Right. There's basically two kinds. Some athletes just post interesting or entertaining things and are always riding a specialized, wearing a nike sweatshirt or whatever. Others have a lot of posts where they "just wanted to share something with my followers that has completely revolutionized my mornings. It's lavender essential oils, and my followers can get free shipping with my code just for them!"

That sounds AWESOME. May I please get your special access code for this amazing product?

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http://www.fitspeek.com the Fraser Valley's fitness, wellness, and endurance sports podcast

When I own a business my sponsorship will be this catchy slogan....

Star athlete- "with this code you will pay double the asking price"

(it may or may not be an incredible idea...there are a lot of dentists out there I've been told)

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Brooks Doughtie, M.S.
Exercise Physiology
-USAT Level II

100% agree with this. Tri might be the closest thing to this still having an impact; mostly because a bike that is really aero is going to be good for a pro as well as an age grouper. That said there are plenty of people who go really fast on not the fastest bike, and vice-versa.
I think mountain bike racing would be the furthest to the other end of the spectrum. When you look at a world cup XC course that are no doubt very technical and a rider will benefit from the slack long low that is so "on trend" right now. But if you go to your local XC race; the course is probably more or less the same as it was 10-20 years ago. So do I really need a bike with "confidence inspiring downhill pedigree" also, a very high % of mountain bikers will never race, and I think the non-racing group would be pretty unlikely to watch a race. (I am a total XC guy for the last 15 years; and even I only got into watching pro races last year.
Also since a lot has been brought up about Kate Courtney. You do have to remember that when she left Specialized she was not the mega-star she is now. Since there has been a couple football analogies here; she was a first round draft pick talent who had not yet proved herself out in the pros; you knew she probably would based on her U23 results; but lets face it, there are a lot of talents that do not. She signed with Scott because she did not want to be the backup to Annika; then went out and won the rainbow jersey a couple days later. I think that one can be marked up more to poor communication; sounds like the team favored the euro pros while Specialized corporate wanted to bet on Kate, but somehow that did not get worked out in time and she went to Scott.

I don't know if it'll work or not but I'll bet you can get Peter Sagan to sell a special edition product that's twice the price but green.

As long as he brings the accent, I'll pay whatever the F he asks me too.

"anyone want to paarrttee"

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Brooks Doughtie, M.S.
Exercise Physiology
-USAT Level II

There is a guy I know on EMJ team that used to make posts about various random interesting stuff--but since on the team it's been mostly promo "ads" for the most part--I'd rather just sit down for a coffee or something to chat personally than read a product post--but I get he likely has to do that. I am betting B. Doughtie that you are right in that there must be "X" number of product posts per month to meet a quota of sort. I started looking into social media presence of other EMJ members & much of the same thing. If they're not big SM users they are pretty much pushing product. That kind of stuff from pros is a bit of a turn off to follow them--I found a few awkward product placements by Gwen J. on her sponsor's stuff. But at least she hasn't fully fallen to the non-interesting stuff. Posting food stuff & some interesting training tidbits. Showing a person side of things not just a product side push of stuff. Her husband Patrick looks like an amazing cook...he needs a cookbook.

same here. its sad that instagram and the like has turned into nothing more than a sponsorship / influencer outlet for so many.

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80/20 Endurance Ambassador

Edit #1: I'm sorry for the thread derail.

Not to be snarky, and an honest question..........but what else is it supposed to be?

Edit #2: I'm not on Insta or Twitter. I am on Facebook.

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Pink? Maybe. Maybe not. You decide.

at its heart and base social media is for people to share whats going on in their lives with their friends and families. if it were nothing more than that i would absolutely love it. unfortunately its turned into the cesspool of society with the vast majority of it being product placement / pushing and political arguments.

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80/20 Endurance Ambassador

In mountain biking nobody's watching or taking much notice of XC though are they? That's SOO last century.
What sells is 'enduro'. And it's pretty evident it does sell. Take a look at how many folks are over-biked at trail centres or even out in the normal hills. Very few routes really need 170mm travel. But plenty of folks riding 160-170mm travel enduro bikes.

I agree, and I think that is why the wins on sunday sells on monday is even less true in mountain biking.
Everyone wants an enduro bike, but even less people are going to watch an enduro event than will watch an XC race.

Totally agree there.
I think what does work to a degree for mtb, is that Enduro races better reflect what most mountain bikers want to do and actually do.
In the UK, XC is near dead and has been for years. 24 hr races are a shadow of their former selves. Its general trail riding and Enduro which is thriving. Its not about who gets to the top of the hill 1st. Most couldn't give a monkeys about that. But it's about who's fast back down hill. On something more normal than a full on downhill rig (and can be ridden uphill too as most times most riders don't actually have a chairlift or uplifts). So just maybe seeing good / great riders on a particular bike in mtb mags / web sites (rather than in person at an actual race) may help sales. I'm particularly thinking of brands like Transition, YT, Yeti, Pivot, Nukeproof and Commercial. And obvs Santa Cruz.

Some skinny guy or gal in lycra on a hardtail with a 100-120mm fork is selling precisely zero bikes here no matter how high their VO2max and hematocrit levels are.

Rinny joins Amberger in departing Felt...

And Amberger joins Specialized.

Curious to see where Rinny is headed. Back when she was pregnant for the first time, she often repeated how supportive her sponsors were so I naively would have thought she'd stay with all of them until her retirement.

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Instagram
Youtube Channel
Meta Endurance

With the best intro Video ever on their social page. Man I love how laid back Josh is.

Surprisingly, xc is actually doing quite well in the US

I'm fairly certain Kate won the world championship while with Specialized, then switched to Scott that offseason. I also feel like I read that the signed the Scott contract after the championship.

"In the week before the 2018 world championship, Courtney and her mother worked out a deal with Scott-SRAM, managed by Swiss mountain-bike legend Thomas Frischknecht and led by Swiss world champion Nino Schurter. Days later she shocked fans with a world title of her own, catching and passing Langvad with superior technical skills on the final lap.
Her new contract came together before her world title but was not made public until early January; the global cycling audience couldn’t have known the vindication Courtney felt on that podium in Switzerland. "

American Muscle by Neal Rodgers. July 2020 issue of The Red Bulletan

I’ve heard rumblings for years that the Big Red S is moving away from triathlon. As someone who worked there from 2016-2018 . These moves tend to lead me to believe that’s still the direction they are going. They have so much tied up in UCI racing with sponsorships and ITU/Short course racing is much more popular. Plus, the latest version of the Shiv was just awful. Sure it’s aero but with that price tag? I would expect that the remaining Specializefd long course athletes will be gone when their contracts end as well. Just my perspective

Amberger riding specialized now

I wonder how localized that Sponsorship agreement is. It just screams to me that Specialized downsized their contracts. As much as I love Josh, he's funny as hell. Moving away from Lucy Charles and grabbing smaller contracts is just a kinda weird move.

---

Washed up footy player turned Triathlete.

I think it’s simply a sign of the current times. Go look at how much turnover has occurred at ESPN as they are going to younger, cheaper talent. My local tv network (WRAL) is one of the most productive markets in the country and they recently in last 18 months have “retired” 60% of the staff.

I also think even though bike sales are booming it’s not due to any uptick in sponsor promotions but because ppl just want a bike...any bike (well tri bikes obviously are low sales). The tri shop I work PT at does higher end ish bike sales. Our cheapest bike is roughly $1500 and I bet I’ve taken 100 calls or ppl coming to store since April from customers asking for under $1k bikes. In the 7 years I’ve worked at IOS I haven’t taken 15 calls or drop in from ppl asking for that price range. We just were a bike shop that showed up on their google search and were #5 shop checking inventory etc. so while the bike biz is booming I do think it’s easy to see why. So if you can’t justify the full expense anymore, I think you’ll continue to see cost cutting measures.

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Brooks Doughtie, M.S.
Exercise Physiology
-USAT Level II

Well, Amberger is clearly cheaper. But he is not younger.

Lucy Charles-27

Insta- 339k Followers
Twitter- 24.2k Followers
Facebook- 83k Followers
Youtube- 37.4k Subscribers

Josh Amberger-31

Insta- 45.1k Followers
Twitter- 7k Followers
Facebook- 7.6k Followers
Youtube- 317 Subscribers

And comparing this to ESPN isn't apples to apples at all. ESPN over inflated the industry and then went a certain way, some of their younger and highest rated talent already jumped ship as ESPN retained a certain POV. ESPN is struggling for its own soul as the worldwide leader.

I'm just trying to figure this out, is Specialized going to sponsor a bunch of smaller reaching but cheaper contracts to get back to the same activation?

I find Josh pretty hilarious, guess he decided to do a launch video. I wouldn't really call it a youtube channel but rather than an account...but I'm guessing this video was made weeks ago before Lucy and Specialized ended their relationship or he didn't know. Since she's mentioned at 3:13.

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Washed up footy player turned Triathlete.

Maybe it was Felt's choice and not hers? Maybe she got offered a lot more elsewhere....triathletes need to make a living too.

I'm just trying to figure this out, is Specialized going to sponsor a bunch of smaller reaching but cheaper contracts to get back to the same activation?

--------

But that's not really something anyone will know. For the same reason, we have no clue if said athletes came to the table and balked and the "new contract" because they rate themselves higher than what they were being asked (or had a better contract in their back pocket). So sometimes it's companies are cutting payroll, and sometimes it's the athletes themselves "valuing" themselves at a higher number that they maybe can get somewhere else. It's not always the companies fault when a sponsorship ends.




I took freshman econ and it was the only thing I basically remember.....Most of the time the value that people think their lives are is over inflated than the value that the market has for said person.


So I think it's important to note that there is always 2 sides to the discussion. Colin Kapernick before the whole long term exile, was given I believe 2 different NFL contracts.....he just balked at the money he was going to be offered and didn't sign to stay in the NFL, and that was while he was still an 49er's...this wasn't the whole "black ball" period. So there's always 2 sides of the story and it's not *always* the company being the big bad corporation who ends up ending contracts.

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Brooks Doughtie, M.S.
Exercise Physiology
-USAT Level II

So the idea he was blackballed is incorrect. I'm not going to get into this deeply because it ties into the discussion of you're only worth what someone is willing to pay you. During the "blackballed period" he worked out for several teams. I followed this intently. Many of the teams he worked out for after he had opted out of his contract with the 49ers (yes he could have still been cut and they likely would have done so, but they owed him guaranteed money) were interested in him, but only at back up money. They didn't want him as a starter, which is what he wanted the chance of. There's plenty of layers to that onion.

But both cases likely come down to how much money the team/sponsor is willing to pay you and do you think that is what you're worth?

However, this is gonna be real funny if Lucy Charles ends up on a Felt.

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Washed up footy player turned Triathlete.

So I believe I read that Gomez is still an Specialized athlete, and so I think it is just showing you what the value is to Specialized. Gomez is racing all around short course and LC events, showcasing the best road and tri bikes, vs another athlete of Specialize is *only* doing LC racing. I think in the current climate more than ever, athletes have to showcase the "value" they are receiving in many industries. Read the comments on what the Shiv's value/perception is from consumers on this thread, and it's easy to see that the "tri" athlete was the big contract that cut/not renewed/ended (who ended it and why, we dont know specifically). I would be curious to know Vincent Luis's status as he's currently probaly the most famous triathlete in the world currently, even ahead of Gomez I would think *right now*.

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Brooks Doughtie, M.S.
Exercise Physiology
-USAT Level II

If you notice I put "black ball" in quotes because the NFL has even said this year they did Kapernick "wrong". But I dont want to go into detail on that, my point being......if an athlete views his value as something else than what he's being offered, said athlete can be the one to end the relationship. That was my point, you basically confirmed that.

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Brooks Doughtie, M.S.
Exercise Physiology
-USAT Level II

However, this is gonna be real funny if Lucy Charles ends up on a Felt.

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why? Inferior company?

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Brooks Doughtie, M.S.
Exercise Physiology
-USAT Level II

Nope.

Just if the athletes that left Felt and Specialized just end up flip flopping it's just a recycling of current athletes and not bringing anyone else through.

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Washed up footy player turned Triathlete.

Gotcha, I guess I laugh that threads like this always seemingly overwhelmingly majority of the time put the "blame" on the companies vs the athletes in contract talks. There are so many layers to contracts and such.


I'm guessing many companies bring in "new" athletes every year, they just dont get the same level of exposure that the "face" of the companies get (and also likely waaaay less money too etc).

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Brooks Doughtie, M.S.
Exercise Physiology
-USAT Level II

Whilst highly unlikely, I'd love to see full disclosure of pro triathlete contracts much like other pro athletes. Imagine the basting that athletes would get on this forum if the peanut gallery could critique an athletes self value, and likewise what a company is paying or not willing to pay a certain athlete.

I dont think I want to know just how little pro triathletes are making beyond the prize purses. For sure there are a very very few who are the "total package", but for even the majority of the top 20 ITU and LC athletes in the world, I wouldn't be shocked to recognize just how little money they are making.

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Brooks Doughtie, M.S.
Exercise Physiology
-USAT Level II

Yo, the Jerry Maguire of the ST board!

Perhaps I would consider your analysis rather parochial, but I'm very glad you liked the video :)

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http://www.josh-amberger.com/

Thank you for the kind words.

It was interesting to follow along with this thread!

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http://www.josh-amberger.com/

I mean, I'm a big fan, legit read or watch all your race reports, so more content please?


________

ETA: Not about this specifically but more with general sponsorship. I saw a former Bachelor Contestant just had a sponsored post with Hoka One One. For that one post they probably could have paid a professional athlete a full yearly stipend.

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Washed up footy player turned Triathlete.

Emma Pallant to Specialized

I saw this, and she talks about a team; specialized building something in terms of a team like BMC have?

Thank you for the Sworks joke. I used to go up to people on bling Specialized bikes and ask them if Sworks was an open mold company for fun. Awesome that a sponsored athlete threw it out there.

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***

Georgia Taylor Brown as well; obviously want to make sure whoever wins the olympics triathlon is riding a specialized, can see the logic behind that to be fair!

Best video ever! Hillarious
Liked the khaki landscaping kit, maybe Wattie can design one with some eucalyptus trees on it

Huge fan Josh. Keep putting out excellent content.

Might be she was talking about her team around her. She often talks about “the team works, the dream works”

Looks like she is staying with HOKA as well.

What would be interesting is understand the demographics of the followers for each and how they align with Specialized’s marketing strategy. Someone could have more followers but if half of those followers aren’t the demographic that specialize is marketing towards then maybe it’s not worth the price tag.

That video is dead set hilarious. Love your stuff, keep being you!

Lucy mentioned in her IG post that they took a punt on her in 2017 and signed her to a contract after she did well in Kona. If she’s been on the same contract since the. It’s likely it wasn’t huge. So maybe she’s moved to someone who’s offering more coin?

Broaden posted about leaving them the other day as well and said it was his choice to move on from them. Interesting to see where he ends up.

Lastly, our local athlete Hannah Wells has moved to Trek from a giant and is also moving on from both Under Armour and De Boer wetsuits. She mentioned she’s moving to a brand that’s active in both the swim and run space - I wonder who that could be?

I think triathletes are giving themselves more value with their youtube content and the PTO is creating a new value standard. They have more leverage with negotiations than previous years. It looks like Paula is in the drivers seat and Trek probably didn't offer her the money she wanted. It is likely Lucy is in the same boat as she is very marketable. Paula and Lucy have results plus content that can be VERY valuable to sponsors. Characters like Lionel, Sam Long, and Wurf sell controversy which is very marketable.....However, Josh and someone like Sebi are not polarizing but very very likeable. I actually enjoy their content the most. I believe most triathletes are offered a renewal contract based on what the sponsor feels they are valued. Then that contract is signed or rejected based on how that person feels they are valued. If the number is too low, they reject and shop around.

I am looking forward to seeing who Paula picks. I believe she has companies outbidding each other.

I thought it was interesting Paula wore a Trek hat in their video this week. She's been in the TTL stuff a LOT but wore the hat - might be nothing but I think that Trek is probably seriously considering paying the money - they've done it with Holly and probably with Linsey Corbin - and while they got away with a lesser deal they are possibly responding to what offers that Paula is receiving. Heck - Holly wasn't on Trek when she won the world title in 2016...so they WILL pay if they see the value and it is there with Paula I would assume.

It's very interesting this time of the year for sure!

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DFRU - Detta Family Racing Unit...the kids like it and we all get out and after it...gotta keep the fam involved!

Yeah, the sponsors were VERY prominent in this weeks TTL video. Lots of Castelli/Argon/Rolf airtime for Eric, and Paula swapping her typical TTL hat for a Trek one (and still on her Trek). Even Flynn (the dog) now has a sponsor. Given the date, I'd assume those are their sponsors for 2021....but we'll see.

---

ECMGN Therapy Silicon Valley:
Depression, Neurocognitive problems, Dementias (Testing and Evaluation), Trauma and PTSD, Traumatic Brain Injury (TBI)

Then I checked Trek's triathlon site - still Holly, Linsey and Ellie Salthouse, so the plot thickens!

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DFRU - Detta Family Racing Unit...the kids like it and we all get out and after it...gotta keep the fam involved!

Here is Lucy's latest YouTube video where she is raffling off her "favourite Specialized frame" to raise funds for a local children's hospital charity..

WIN MY BIKE! - YouTube

.
.

https://racing.trekbikes.com/teams/regional-teams

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blog

This thing is the greatest cliffhanger of all time! JK - maybe they look to upgrade her to TFR then?

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DFRU - Detta Family Racing Unit...the kids like it and we all get out and after it...gotta keep the fam involved!

That seems like the most logical path but that may conflict with other sponsorships (zoot, zipp, etc).

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blog

Paula is gonna ride a Trek until a new partner sends her a bike. That's if Trek and Paula are even parting ways.

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Washed up footy player turned Triathlete.

2XU.

Agreed (except in those rare cases where it's a bad breakup). I'm just doubting that she would go out of her way to put on Trek logowear (that she has not worn previously) if she was leaving.

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ECMGN Therapy Silicon Valley:
Depression, Neurocognitive problems, Dementias (Testing and Evaluation), Trauma and PTSD, Traumatic Brain Injury (TBI)

I know she’s gone to 2XU for her race kit mate, and that could be her new wetsuit and running gear sponsor but they don’t do shoes?

Her post said she looked forward to working with the new brand for swim/run.

2XU is active in the running space. Just not with shoes.

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Washed up footy player turned Triathlete.

No Tim O'Donnell?

https://racing.trekbikes.com/teams/tfr-triathlon

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blog

Thanks....I hit the wrong link.

for all the talk that pro triathletes are irrelevant / don't matter / don't add anything, this thread sure does have a lot of pages discussing athletes swapping bike sponsors.

it's extremely short sighted to be saying I don't buy a bike because X is riding it. No, you don't directly, but each little bit adds up to brand awareness and brand image and brand trust. you only have to look at the growth of canyon across everything from basic commuter bikes to the highest end tt machines. quite different from the numbers riding ventums, parlees or argons.

would i buy a speedmax just because frodeno won kona riding one? not directly, but that, along with the image created from him and all the other riders on their bikes has certainly shaped an image of them as a brand in my head and that effect trickles through to their entire bike range.

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Feel the Speed

So is there a meaningful distinction between RVB's and Paula's prior sponsorship deals with Trek compared to TO, Linsey Corbin, etc?

I apologize if this has been answered already.

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@floathammerholdon | @partners_in_tri

I believe so but I don’t know the exact details. The TFR athletes seem to be required to use bontrager wheels, shoes, and apparel while Rudy/Paula are not. I’m guessing that the TFR athletes are paid more and have steeper bonuses in there contracts as well.

Ellie was in Paula/RVB’s shoes the past few years and was “upgraded” to TFR last year.

Edit: Paula is in a unique situation where she can probably demand the financial incentives similar to the TFR athletes without becoming a TFR athlete due to her sponsor obligations with zipp and zoot.

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blog

So true... and even if people don't end up on a Canyon only because Frodeno is riding it, I bet a huge number of people would be questioning their bike choices if he ended up leaving Canyon.

Trust is a big part of it. As a DTC brand, Canyon had to convince people that it made world class bikes and having Kona winners and ProTour teams using them was a big part of that. Giant needed to do the same (sponsor T-Mobile) to get people to consider a hi-end bike from a mass producer in Taiwan. Back in the '90s lots of "real" racers wouldn't consider a Cannondale until Cippolini/Saeco started winning races with them.

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ECMGN Therapy Silicon Valley:
Depression, Neurocognitive problems, Dementias (Testing and Evaluation), Trauma and PTSD, Traumatic Brain Injury (TBI)

Here's the thing, though.......zoot makes wetsuits, tri clothing, running only clothing, bike only clothing & shoes. Heck, they even may make swim only clothing, too!

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Pink? Maybe. Maybe not. You decide.

I think you’re right that it’s not so simple as I’ll buy brand x because pro y rides one.

I tend to think of it as validating a bike. If there was a new speed concept or whatever and no one in the top 50 rode it, could all the white papers in the world make it a big seller?

Did they not sponsor ONCE first - late 90s, I think - with Saiz pushing towards the compact frames because they were lighter/stiffer?

altayloraus wrote:

Did they not sponsor ONCE first - late 90s, I think - with Saiz pushing towards the compact frames because they were lighter/stiffer?

yeah, the OCR/TCR frames were originally ONCE bikes. their black/yellow schemes riding in team time trials were a nice look for giant. it was, in retrospect, a hugely important bike:

https://inrng.com/...cestor-of-your-bike/

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____________________________________
https://lshtm.academia.edu/MikeCallaghan

http://howtobeswiss.blogspot.ch/

Currie to Felt

Yep - he posted on his FB page:

https://fb.watch/2T9moLhaP3/

Where will Lucy Charles end up? Surely a big brand given she’ll always be at the front on the bike.

Agree. XC racing is covered quite well and the popular AG races sell out quickly. The bikes are still sought after and expensive. Even in areas that have large mountains XC racing is holding its own. Yes, there is a big enduro following but not everyone is into that. Most of the bigger ski resorts have embraced it as a means to survive or even profit during the summer months. Even so XC chugs along. Every big mountain event I have been to has a slate of XC and short track races. Spectators especially love short track because they can see the race unfolding in front of them. Especially now since the World Cups are so technical. Hoping that Sea Otter next fall (hopefully) will reflect that type of course.

Lucy on Felt. On her husband Reece's Instagram you can see a picture from the back on the bike:
https://www.instagram.com/p/CJ3B6GGB438/


If you zoom in on your phone, you can recognize the V on the back of the seat post, which is similar to the one on the new Felt AR disc and the seatstays also seem to match from the rear view.


https://www.triathlon365.nl/wp-content/uploads/2020/01/Felt_AR_Studio_Gallery_08_1024x1024.png

Trend on the LC post is it is a Giant... I can't tell either way though

sure, except it's nothing like the AR.

looks like she's on a Tarmac SL7. seatstays attach in the right spot to be a Tarmac, and they have that little flare out where they attach.

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Swimming Workout of the Day:

Favourite Swim Sets:

2020 National Masters Champion - M50-54 - 50m Butterfly

Reese is on an old Giant Propel

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Swimming Workout of the Day:

Favourite Swim Sets:

2020 National Masters Champion - M50-54 - 50m Butterfly

I can tell she's on a modern aero bike with disc brakes and seemingly integrated cabling (though could just be well hidden!)

narrows it down I know haha

I think that it may be the new scott foil

Both, Reece and Lucy are using their old bikes. Reece has his 2015 Giant Propel and Lucy is riding her Tarmac with a black sticker on the brands name. Just like she did with the Boardmen. Seems like they didn´t get their new bikes yet. I don´t think that they couldn´t find a new sponsor yet. But it could be possible that they weren´t able to produce it yet due to corona. Tells me that it can´t be a Canyon (Thank God) since all Canyon send already plenty of their bikes to everyone who wanted some. So they don´t seem to have any supply bottleneck.

I first guess would be Scott. But I wish it would be Trek as they hopefully seek for new athletes to show their new SC :)

is this mention of a new Trek SC wishful thinking, speculation, or known to be true...?
Just asking because i would love for it to be true!

I’m pretty certain there is a new one coming. The grapevine has been muttering about it, just not sure when.

Hopefully Lucy isn’t on a Canyon. Trek/Scott or even better Cervelo please..!.!

The grapevine has muttering about it for a solid 3+ years. I wouldn't hold your breath.

I can assure you there is no new SC coming this season, probably not ever.....

Jeroen

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Owner at TRIPRO, The Netherlands

I haven't kept up with this whole thread, but I'm fairly certain no one has yet named the bike I believe she'll be riding. Though, mine is just an educated/informed guess. Not completely sure the deal went through.

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Jim Manton / ERO Sports

ooh spill the beans? Quintana Roo?

I really really hope it's not ventum

Hmm. Do Jeroen and the other guys at KU have enough money to get Lucy? If they were going to get a single athlete that will sell the most bikes, it's probably her.

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Benjamin Deal - Professional - Instagram - TriRig - Lodi Cyclery
Deals on Wheels - Results, schedule, videos, sponsors

New Plasma?

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Let food be thy medicine...

I would just add that at present, Canyon have suspended all shipping to the UK due to Brexit, which may have held bikes up. There were also delays in early December due to Covid etc.

https://www.canyon.com/en-gb/blog-content/december-shipment-update.html

Haha and I can assure you there is a new SC coming. Whether it’s called that still is another matter, but there is a new TT bike coming from Trek.

I’m still surprised Specialized and Lucy parted ways. They get heaps of coverage of her as she’s always first out onto the bike and at the front of the race until the run if not winning.

That same reasoning is also likely behind them picking up Josh. He’s always out first so again they’ll get lots of coverage.

Hahaha, I can also assure you that it is not a Kú or they kept that a secret for me as well. But I must I would wish she was on a Kú, that would have been awesome, but not gonna happen. At least not for now.

Jeroen

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Owner at TRIPRO, The Netherlands

Well, let’s see who is right ;-) Can’t say more about my source, but I sure wish they would drop a new tri disc brake bike.

Jeroen

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Owner at TRIPRO, The Netherlands

I'm sure you can't spill any details, but can you share when you think the new trek TT is coming?

Seeing Kristians latest YouTube makes me question the speed of the Shiv, from what he said it seems like hes found a faster bike for him and it is enough to give up his potentially lucrative Specialized deal/Not renew it. Doesnt seem to be much bang for buck with the Shiv.

I wouldn't read too much about the Shiv into this:

-His value is in ITU/Oly racing, so he'd be on a road bike. The new Tarmac is getting raves.

-We're near peak aero, so even the abomination (aesthetically) that is the Shiv Disc probably doesn't give up much/anything to other top offerings.

-This year's sponsor is always soooo much better than what I was riding last year.

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ECMGN Therapy Silicon Valley:
Depression, Neurocognitive problems, Dementias (Testing and Evaluation), Trauma and PTSD, Traumatic Brain Injury (TBI)

The "peak aero" argument doesn't run both ways.

It's hard to make something much faster than a P5-6. But it's entirely possible to make something much slower

True. However we suspect peak aero *because* the performance of many of the top bikes begin to converge, indicating that designs and aero impacts are well understood and asymtoping.

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ECMGN Therapy Silicon Valley:
Depression, Neurocognitive problems, Dementias (Testing and Evaluation), Trauma and PTSD, Traumatic Brain Injury (TBI)

We assume peak aero because the fastest bikes are converging. If that meant that now it is easier to make a fast bike because you can check off a list of known aero features, you wouldn't have so many drastically different design elements.

- Some down tubes hug the front wheel (most bikes), others have a huge gap (Scott)
- Some seat tubes hug the rear wheel (most), some have a gap (Shiv TT), and some have none (beams)
- Some use full foils, some truncate
- Some use deep sections, some not
- And on and on

I'm not claiming the Shiv is slow, because we don't know. But the fact that older Cervelo, Felt, and Trek bikes are still fast, doesn't mean that newer bikes can't be slow.

Granted, "slow" does deserve some context. It is reasonable to assume that the difference between the fastest and slowest modern bike by the big brands is far smaller than the difference between the slowest and a round-tube bike. But for $X,000 and especially $1X,000 I wouldn't want to have something slow relative to its peers.

Given we don't know, i'm generally inclined to trust that specialized makes a good bike based on previous pedigree. The shiv tt, the transition, the first gen shiv tri, the venge, and the sl7 are all good aero bikes to the best of my knowledge, or at least were all good relative to other offerings when they were released. The current shiv tri is kinda meh to me, and I cant see myself buying one, but I also have no doubt that its fast.

I'm a long time Specialized fan and have owned more of their bikes then any other brand. I generally look to them first before looking elsewhere.

However, I've tried to talk myself into the new Shiv Tri a couple of times now but chosen not to. The reasons were:

1) Specializeds clear efforts to not show how aero (or not) it is when compared to their previous models. They have their own wind tunnel so clearly know this information but have chosen to hide this from customers.

2) Secondly, the base bar hinge region has had the needs for travel prioritised over that of aerodynamic optimisation. Not all of us need to fly with our race bikes and I'd much rather they offered a bar that was a well sorted as Cervelo's than to produce what it, frankly a massive frontal area - purely to incorporate the hinges and benefit a situation many of us will never encounter.

3) The 'optimised for Kona' yaw thing is not ideal bearing in mind many of us race elsewhere and in different conditions. I'm not sure who needs a bike tailored for a yaw that high. It's entirely possible that it is equally good at lower yaws compared to its competition but they haven't shared the evidence of that (see 1).

I really feel Specializeds always high quality products are losing sales because of poor engagement or understanding with their customer base.

He can't spill details or dates because there are none available. There are none available because nothing is coming.

Ordinarily, anything new for 2021 would have been announced months ago, to build hype, allow dealers to get in pre-orders, etc.

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Swimming Workout of the Day:

Favourite Swim Sets:

2020 National Masters Champion - M50-54 - 50m Butterfly

I saw an instagram pic of Reece riding a Giant in Dubai last week - so that's my pick...both Reece and Lucy are on Giant's this year.

Her “coming soon” announcement on Instagram... the lighting tells you but you have to think a bit outside the box. Think cycling and not triathlon.

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Jim Manton / ERO Sports

Well, they just sold in a few months what they normally sell in a year, so I think they’ll be okay. The only problem any company is having with sales right now is they have nothing to sell.

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Jim Manton / ERO Sports

Colnago

Think outside the box? Hmmmm!

Did everyone see what Slowman had posted and then apparently quickly deleted without a trace? I wonder if he really knows and spilled the beans prematurely.

Pinarello?!

i may have been a victim of fake news.

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Dan Empfield
aka Slowman

Red makes me think BMC or Pinarello.

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Strava

Red makes me think of Wilier.

Edit, or Bottechia.

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Swimming Workout of the Day:

Favourite Swim Sets:

2020 National Masters Champion - M50-54 - 50m Butterfly

Or they kept it very well hidden :-)

Jeroen

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Owner at TRIPRO, The Netherlands

Next hint, but maybe not the last...

It's a brand that's not synonymous with Triathlon, but it does have a presence in the sport.

I have to admit I'm having fun with this, though keep in mind I'm not completely sure. I will say I'm more confident today than I was yesterday. Pretty sure the deal got done.

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Jim Manton / ERO Sports

It's certainly either BMC or Pinarello then. Bmc seems less likely as it looks like they out most of their money into the BMC Tri Team.

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Benjamin Deal - Professional - Instagram - TriRig - Lodi Cyclery
Deals on Wheels - Results, schedule, videos, sponsors

Pinarello would be interesting. Maybe ineos will pull her onto their team. Lucy and Cam would be quite the duo for ineos' start in triathlon

Cannondale dipping into tri again? Or maybe factor?

you all will know monday. if you know, please keep it to yourself.

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Dan Empfield
aka Slowman

I don’t know what bike brand it is. But I do know that I hate hype marketing, teaser posts, talking about on a certain day an exciting announcement will be made. I blame Apple for creating this culture

But I get hyping things up gets more people talking, allows for more social media posts that leads to more clicks, yada yada yada. I guess I’m just an old at heart curmudgeon that doesn’t use social media and just like boring old press releases

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Matt

Just throwing my guesses out there and that I agree Pinarello is a good pick. But two other brands that come to my mind and would find very interesting are Cube and quite possibly Merida.

I wouldn’t use the last year to judge how good a product is - everyone’s inventory has pretty much gone.

Merida is left field ! They still make that warp tri or whatever it was ?
Would be weird to see her on a cannondale for some reason. Just don’t see that.

I agree with pinarello as an educated guess. Her and cam. Actually cam had a cheeky post on her ‘all will be revealed’ Insta post so maybe it’s a sign he knows something?

What company did the hype a few years ago about the new product that was going to revolutionize bike riding?

Turned out it was a freaking helmet 😂

The colours in her IG post match with Ineos team in cycling...

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Sorry if my english is pretty bad, I am not english native

Joining Wurf???

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Blog: http://262toboylstonstreet.blogspot.com/
https://twitter.com/NateThomasTri
Coaching: https://bybtricoaching.com/ - accepting athletes for 2023

Maybe, cheaper than any other sponsorhip that Ineos are making at this moment

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Sorry if my english is pretty bad, I am not english native

Walmart

I love this prediction because it is both goofy and plausible at the same time. The family has infinite resources, and interest in cycling and their own bike brand. The only clue that it isn't WallyWorld is the hint of the color scheme. I don't think they have any red associated with the brand.

Has Viathon said anything about moving into the triathlon space? I could have sworn they meant to be a gravel only brand, then added MTBs, and now they have multiple road models. Like the only thing missing is a TT bike.

Did they fire their social media manager and not hire a new one? Haven't posted anything on instagram since June and nothing on Twitter and Facebook since their black Friday sale.

Looks like there was a thread posted here asking if the brand was killed: https://forum.slowtwitch.com/...Viathon%3F_P7405499/

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Washed up footy player turned Triathlete.

Quick thought beside all rumors of Lucys new bike sponsor: is it possible that SPECIALIZED clashed with RED BULL sponsorship?

It is interesting to see that Specialized stopped all their Red Bull Athletes. Maybe RED BULL wants to be the new main sponsor and that didnt work for SPECIALIZED and Lucy, Reece, Braden and Kristian.

....any thoughts or Infos?

I mean it is too bad, that we won´t be seeing this beast in action:





Credits to
https://nutandboltdesign.com/
https://www.instagram.com/nutandboltdesign/

That’s what I thought

Hmmm. She's now in Dubai.

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Washed up footy player turned Triathlete.

Which they are now being sued for
https://cyclingtips.com/...elmet-safety-claims/

Isn’t Richard Murray a Red Bull and SWorks sponsored athlete?

Marketing hype is very similar to a Pinarello reveal from a couple of years ago. But cervelo have a red logo as well?

Either way I find LCB about as charismatic as Gwen Jorgenson so won’t be buying anything she promotes. And let’s face it the majority of what both have to say is plugging sponsored items with dull abundance!

pretty sure Richard Murray is on a BMC?

Richard Murray is riding BMC

yikes - how do you really feel?

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____________________________________
https://lshtm.academia.edu/MikeCallaghan

http://howtobeswiss.blogspot.ch/

.
.
Guess you can't please everyone.

From a consumer perspective there has only been one product line pimped by a triathlete that I have ever purchased from in all my years in the sport and that was Tinley gear in the 90's.It was awesome stuff.I am a cheap-ass triathlete so there better be a good reason for me to pry my wallet open and no amount of product placement will do that.

From a fan perspective, I find Lucy,Reece and Lola among the few triathlon personalities that I am interested in following.They are fun to follow and when they pimp products they are open about it.
.
.

Yes, my mistake sorry.

Murray left Specialized in 2018.
I just checked. There are no Red Bull athletes left in the big S-Team.

Interesting

I had Merida in mind at the beginning thinking that her and Kristian may both switch to that, mostly because of the partnership between Bahrain and the brand - and KB riding in Bahrain with the prince (not sure about his title) who was on a Merida. But now if she is in Dubai it does not work that well anymore.

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Instagram
Youtube Channel
Meta Endurance

Joe Skipper is also in Dubai. Doesn't necessarily have to be product related for LCB.

Ordinarily at this time of year northern European pro athletes would be in Spain or the Canaries. As well as Covid issues, and having recently left the EU, Dubai is a very easy option for UK athletes to head to at the moment.

Paula Findlay just confirmed in the chat alongside the launch of her and Eric's weekly TTL video that she is, in fact, switching bike sponsors. Said the new bikes arrive tomorrow, and she'll reveal all soon.

Vincent Luis

How about a Look Mono Blade? LCB was in the Dubai Look dealer on their opening day.

A direct strike to the top of the nail with a large hammer there.

Seems kinda odd how every post that mentions a certain bike brand just magically disappears....

Hmmmm. Guess that confirms she's on Dodecahedron for 2021. At least twice as good as that other bike brand.

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Benjamin Deal - Professional - Instagram - TriRig - Lodi Cyclery
Deals on Wheels - Results, schedule, videos, sponsors

I vote Look too.

They do make pretty bikes, and the aerobar they released recently is super cool. I still think its gonna be factor though.

AND thread

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blog

Lucy is now following the.brand she will ride on Instagram, is that official enough to discuss now?

Good looking bike, I just don't understand why they have not build in storage for spares in that giant BB area, would it not be obvious to do so?

Doing a very quick scan of who she follows it seems like she follows basically all the brands....Felt, Argon 18, Cube, Canyon, Specialized....

That said it seems that Reece is following both Cube accounts and I didn't see him following any other brands...

Cube just posted to their instagram stories two pics with their triathlon bike - first one says "We've spent years perfecting our bikes." The second one says "Our new rider has spent years perfecting her performance".

Seem pretty obvious Lucy is going with Cube...