Should be fun, how many TT's are there?

Does anyone know if it will be on NBCSN or Olympic channel?

I am using http://www.flobikes.com

That subscription has been gold since start of Dauphine!

To the previous poster, there are 60 km of ITT, but other than Thomas I don't see the rest of the GC Contenders being TT kinds. Ineos has Ganna to diesel Thomas around the peloton for the three weeks, but he should be putting the hammer down for himself in all three TT's. I see no reason why Ganna does not start with the Maglia Rosa for Sunday's stage.

I think fubo and flo bikes are the only places to watch in the US.

Just to get you warmed up for Stage 18 up Stelvio:

Remember the advert? Love it.....

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=3dqh0vxyZGE

All you guys remember El Pistolero putting down the hammer on Mt. Etna 2011 before setting his Everest Record during Covid19 2020?

Dev ,
Just a question on flobikes.com .I am in Toronto and enjoyed the TDF with Simon Gerrans and Ant Mcrossan doing the commentary .
I may have been naive with their $12.50 a month -cancel anytime but looks like I’m locked in for a year.
Were you aware of their policy when subscribing .

Hey I signed up for the so called $12.50 per month with the plan to cancel after Vuelta....are we screwed? I thought they credit you for the months that are unused? If not I paid them $150 for Dauphine+TDF+UCI Worlds + Giro+Vuelta+Giro+ Dauphine+TDF+2020 Classics + 2021 Classics. At this point, I don't mind giving some of my money to a company that will get my mind off this stupid pandemic and make the world seem slightly normal

But if I can cancel after 2020 Vuelta, I will and restart next year for Giro. I don't find following 1 day racing as exciting as stage racing (mainly because there is a multi day chess game in stage racing, where each day fits into the big picture....single day racing, you only have that day's impact on itself)

That was my exact plan , but I have had no luck contacting them as I wanted to check how easy it was to cancel .
I will continue with this mini project and advise if I figure out the process .
G for the Giro as the 3 time trials are definitely in his favour.

Cancelling looks pretty straight forward. https://support.flosports.tv/s/article/How-to-cancel. I didn't try it since I don't want to cancel yet.

Greg

From their support site:

What are my options for subscription plans? Which verticals are yearly ONLY and which are yearly AND monthly?

Yearly ONLY subscriptions ($150.00/year):

• FloBikes
• FloGrappling
• FloRacing
• FloSoftball
• FloWrestling
• Dirt on Dirt

So you guys are stuck with the $150 bill looks like.

That's $149.00 too much for FloGrappling.

Tried last night night to cancel , ain’t happening!

You basically had to cancel within the first 30 days otherwise you are stuck with the full years amount .

Yes Dev we are screwed!

You mean we needed to do 3x29 day subscriptions this fall and do the same thing next year? Looks like we got the full package of 2x TdF, 2xGiro, 1xGiro, 2xDauphines, 2xSpring classics, 1xUCI worlds for $150....so let's just clamp down and maximize our cycling viewing....2 days to the kickoff ITT in Palermo. Ganna for Pink on Saturday?

What’s the consensus on the EF Education bikes and kit? Wheeewwww. I like cool stuff as I am not a velominati kind of guy but that’s some loud kit. Lol.

Yes Ganna for Pink , Thomas and Dennis should both be in the top 10 .
Keep an eye on Tom Pidcock for Ineos Grenadiers .As there was no U23 road race in the World Championships the Brits threw him in the Men’s elite road race . He finished 42nd with Luke Rowe chaperoning him .
Today he just goes and wins the U23 World Cup in MTB ! He’s a tiny guy but definitely a new age cyclist , Cyclo-cross, MTB and Road Race specialist !

Well, that Supersix looks pretty cool:



Here is the start list of teams and riders. I did not realize Tony Martin will be there for Jumbo too. Not sure what he has in the older legs for the ITT but let's see on Saturday

^^^ that's Systemsix, not Supersix.

Anyway, I think the odds of Giro full completion are much lower than they were at TdF (which I still consider a wonder :) ) - both due to the virus, which slowly spirals out of control everywhere again, and also due to the weather. I can't see them finishing the Stelvio stage, for instance unless a sudden "local warming maximum" kicks in exactly in the necessary time.

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Need more W/CdA.

Most of us really don't care about bikes or names of bike. Do you remember what bike Indurain won each of his 5 Tours on or when Pantani did the Giro + TdF double? No one remembers bikes, just what the athletes did. The Giro has been had stages rerouted before due to snow on climbs (as has the Tour de France, Riis beat Indurain and won the 96 TdF on a 45km long stage to Sestriere). The Giro won't be cancelled because of snow, they will just change the route on that day.

As for the virus I don't know if you are Italian, but having spent time in Italy during a few Giro's and given what Italy went through in March and April and talking to Italian business associates, at a national level, like France, their govt will want to see this event through to the end. Right now, thankfully deaths and hospitalizations are very low in Italy from what I see.

Try this link. https://tiz-cycling-live.io/live.php

I am watching Binckbank Tour 2020 right now

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All I Wanted Was A Pepsi, Just One Pepsi

Team Zoot, Team Zoot Mid-Atlantic

Hey, I absolutely didn't want to sound somewhat "teaching" you about the bikes, just pointed out the correct bike name :)




I'm absolutely sure they all want it... just as we (non Italians) do. We'll see. Still "right now" says nothing about 2 weeks time. My country just went from 0.3% positive tests to 1.9% within 4 days, and new hospital admissions follow the same trend already.

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Need more W/CdA.

The wording is funny, but they know this. They mention the monthly cost, but only have YEARLY subscriptions. I contacted them after thinking I was being billed monthly, and getting locked in for the year. Cost $200 CAD. They responded right away and said they were doing a 30% off promo and refunded me approx. $60 CAD. Honestly, for all the content just from end of August, into December, it's well worth the $140 in my opinion!

Not to mention we have the London Marathon on FLOTRACK this weekend!!

My advice, contact them and ask for the same deal.

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__________________________
Matt Gervais

Definitely we don't know what happens in 2 weeks but what happens in your country or my country or another country may or may not play out in Italy. The shapes of the curves for both cases and deaths are totally different in Italy, Iran, Sweden, USA, Australia, Brazil, Austria, Taiwan, but hey, my guess is that the shape ends up being not dissimilar to some western European countries so you are likely correct, but that does not mean a race won't happen either. They have run Milano San Remo, Strade Bianche, Tirenno Adriatico all quite safely.

For USA-based viewers, Fubo.tv's cycling pass for the rest of the year, including the Giro, is $60. I found an American Express special merchant offer for Fubo.tv attached to one of my AmEx credit cards that brought it down to $40.

I'm watching the opening press conference now and wonder why no one warned me it contained an interpretive dance segment. (I am not kidding)

Velogames league is up to 4 teams

League ID : 652293710

2 weeks are hard to predict given the volatility of the pandemic and current trends in Western Europe. But after having spent the last week in Italy the situation is much more relaxed now compared to spring. And some people I spoke to mirror what I read about the world championships - the nation is proud to shed the image of being the country which brought corona to Europe and instead become a place which can manage large scale events in such circumstances.

The weather/snow situation is much more interesting from a tactical point of view. Do you wait until the mountain passes in the last week to attack knowing that they might not come?

This would be an interesting concept for a long tour - just stating that there will be a specific amount of time trials or mountain stages, but keeping the detailed routes secret until the day they will be ridden.

I like your idea of daily mystery routes. That would drive the marginal gains crowd nuts having something so far outside of their control.

What I want to know is if this is going to be a Grand Tour for the geezers now that Remco isn’t there or is there some other young punk who will show up and slay all?

I think the solid money is on Thomas because there are so many TTs. I would like to see Fuglsang or Kriewswik finally win a Tour. Nibali can alway surprise and he is an exciting rider, but he hasn’t shown that he has what it takes for a couple years.

I think there are plenty of climbs near Stelvio in the Bormio area that are optional backups that there will be plenty of climbs, it just might not be Stelvio at 2700m. For example this Stage 17 profile from Bassano del Grappa to Madonna di Campiglio you have nothing over 1700m meaning its likely to be snow free even late in Oct.





Here is the route map for the Stelvio stage leaving from Udine. There are several options from there, that could take in Motirolo and come back to Bormio without getting too high vertically and then ending up partway up Stelivio (ex intersection with Umbrailpass road @2400m.




In any case there should be several lower elevation options

I get the immediate interest in the equipment but that's like the eye candy or who is wearing what clothes at the Oscars.

No one remembers the clothing.

People remember how Pantani or Coppi or Moser or Hinault won the Giro....or we remember how Menchov crashed on the final day Rome ITT and the mechanic jumped out of the car and had him on a spare bike seconds later. Does anyone remember what bike Menchov won on?

I totally get the marketing angle but over time it's kind of forgettable. I also understand it's not a popular position on ST....I do remember what bike Giuseppe Saronni was on when he won the Giro but that's cause he is a member of the board of team UAE and the same brand is under Pogacar this year

I don't know what the award was, but I remember this dress.

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"Human existence is based upon two pillars: Compassion and knowledge. Compassion without knowledge is ineffective; Knowledge without compassion is inhuman." Victor Weisskopf.

I totally remember Cipo's bright red Cannondales, Pantani's Yellow and Green Bianchi's and Lance Red, white & Blue Trek's.
And I'm pretty sure Menchov was on a Colnago.
This is all just off the top of my head.

That is a pretty dress!

Nice to see Sagan bridging up to the lead group on the final climb today and logging some points for second in the sprint. I would have thought this finish was perfect for Michael Matthews:

Test tomorrow for Nibali and Fuglsang if they can get some time back on Yates and Thomas.

Etna's stats are a bit easier than Alpe d'Huez but a bit longer so it climbs around 200m more with some 13% in the final few km

Who can forget the Cipo skinsuit? I don't remember who won the Giro that year, but his skinsuit was memorable.

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"Human existence is based upon two pillars: Compassion and knowledge. Compassion without knowledge is ineffective; Knowledge without compassion is inhuman." Victor Weisskopf.

Dev ,
Flo bikes were accommodating with a 30% discount after I reached out to them .
My case was thatI under the impression I could cancel at anytime and not be tied to a 1year subscription.

Well I will keep that in mind for when I go to cancel (or not).

OK what a crazy day. Thomas crashes and loses 12 minutes, Yates has a "jour sans" and loses 4.5 minutes after being on fire at Tirenno Adriatico and the ITT too where he had a good day.

Does anyone have an status on Thomas?

Nibali and Fuglsang, Kruijswijk are the big GC winners today (and maybe Kelderman too). Yates is down 3:46 now. Its not the end of his Giro, but its a big hole.

For tomorrow, this climb looks like something guys like Matthews and Sagan can get over...or there is a breakaway:

I went to this video: https://twitter.com/.../1313114965620994051

Go to 20, 21, and 22 seconds. Advance it frame by frame and you can see a random water bottle on the road that Thomas hits. There is no way he would have seen it. It literally came out of nowhere and either got ejected from another rider, or a spectator. Once his front wheel hits it, he has no chance

Pretty hard crash for Thomas considering they were still in the neutral zone. No broken bones apparently, but his left hip must be sore. I hope he continues tomorrow, but I wouldn't bet on it.

All of the sprinters should make it over the climb tomorrow. I'll go with Gaviria for the stage win.

It will be interesting to see what Bora does. Work for Sagan to get stage wins and the points jersey? Save something to help Majka get a final GC result?

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"Human existence is based upon two pillars: Compassion and knowledge. Compassion without knowledge is ineffective; Knowledge without compassion is inhuman." Victor Weisskopf.

1988. And Erik Breukink won that stage by seven seconds. But Hampsten was second and earned the pink jersey. He went on to win the race.

I have my years mixed up. I was riding in the Pyrannees on May of 1988 when Hampsten won on Gavia! By the way if you have not read it, here is an article about that day entitled, "the day the strong men cried":

https://tourdivide.org/strong_men_cried


By the way, here is the link to the webcam on Stelvio:

https://www.snow-forecast.com/...rjoch/webcams/latest


It is bone dry, but a lot of snow in forecast from now till 18 Oct. Let's see

Well Sagan almost ended his drought of wins and now tomorrow we have a mountain stage that is pretty long 225km with the final 25km climbing coming between 188km and 213km.....then I read it is a technical descent to the finish. Probably wide open on the GC after tomorrow:



This stage should be built for Nibali with the techincal descent to the finish! Fingers crossed for no rain. They are done in Sicily and move to the mainland now.

Shot in the dark pick for tomorrow. Ulissi is 16 minutes down on the GC. He gets into the break, grits his teeth to survive the final climb, and wins his 2nd stage.

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"Human existence is based upon two pillars: Compassion and knowledge. Compassion without knowledge is ineffective; Knowledge without compassion is inhuman." Victor Weisskopf.

Catching up on all my cycling news for the day. What a day for Ganna

Here is a good write up from cycling stages. Looks like a breakway day? GC should stay roughly the same. The last 6 km is kind of rolling. From km 3 to km 2 remaining there is steep enough climbing that it should break into single sprinters, but no major leadouts. It looks decent for the likes of Sagan and Matthews.



GIRO 2020 ROUTE STAGE 6: CASTROVILLARI - MATERA

Most climbing is clustered in the first half of the race. Almost from the gun the route goes uphill, which is likely to serve as a launch pad for the breakaway. The gradients are relatively shallow, so all types of riders could be in the mix.
After 20 kilometres the riders reach the highest point before a long descent leads onto the next climb. The length is approximately 13 kilometres and the gradients are – again – doable at around 4%. Another descent leads onto a flat intermediate phase.
The steepest climb of the day appears with roughly 30 kilometres remaining. The 6 kilometres ascent slopes at 6% before a gradual downhill ushers in the last 10 kilometres of the race. Which runs predominantly false flat uphill.
The 2013 Giro d’Italia served a finish in Matera after a flat stage. John Degenkolb took the spoils in a crash marked sprint finale.
Matera is a fascinating place. It has been inhabited from Paleolithic times to this day and it is extremely photogenic. Dozens of movies have been short here, including the new James Bond: No time to die.
Two intermediate sprints – at kilometre 62.1 and 135.1 – come with 3, 2 and 1 seconds each, while the first three riders on the line gain time bonuses of 10, 6 and 4 seconds.

I missed watching live all week. Work get in the way every day, but some of the replays have been nice. With Thomas out of the GC its a bit less interesting and now Yates ends up with a Covid19 positive test and he is out (and it explains his horrible climb up Mt. Etna). Demarre may wrap up the Points jersey at the rate he is going (and shutting out Sagan who is winless in a few years now). Today's win by Dowsett was awesome. A guy with no contract and whose wife expecting a child. Hopefully that makes his attractive for next year to other teams. I think Israel Startup Nation should keep him.






Tomorrow is a GC day. I am cheering for Nibali.

When does this thread turn into predictions of when it gets shut down due to COVID? #NegativeNancy

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808 > NYC > PDX > YVR
2024 Races: Taupo

Well I would rather discuss how there is 45km of TTing left and of the GC folks out there, there is no TT king who can take the giro on the TT.

Or let's talk about the stelvio pass weather:



Kruiswijk hopefully stays out of snow banks in the Dolomites and Alps on week 3.

here is what the top of Stelvio Pass Looks like exactly now from the webcam at the top of the pass, Looks like 4 inches of snow on the tarmac and minus 8C. Perfect skate skiing weather.

Whoa wait, didn't you just turn it to "giro gets cancelled due to covid" to "giro gets cancelled due to snow"?!

But really, I am hopeful too, I just am setting my own expectations here.

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808 > NYC > PDX > YVR
2024 Races: Taupo

Giro won’t be cancelled due to snow, But it’s a real risk, that the Big mountain stages will at least use a different route.
I dont see Nibali take the win - he sits on Fuglsang like he did on roglic last year, so someone else Will take it. That’s bad news for Fuglsang as well.

More like "Giro gets rerouted due to snow".

Here is the webcam today at 3 pm European time (time to take the skis out):

I just read that one of the Alpine stages may take the route over Finistre to Sestriere. That's the Froome assault route.









It still tops out at around 2200m and could have snow in Oct.

Hey, I kind of lost interest in the Giro with the sprinter stuff all wrapped up by Demare and the GC without Thomas and Kruiswijk and Yates. But starting yesterday to next weekend with two TT's and all these mountains its going to be insane.

Interestingly the link that I posted to the Stelvio webcam updates whenever you reload (vs a static link to a former image). 4 days to Stelvio and the road is actually clear of snow. It is full blown ski season at the resort through.

It is a long time ago that I saw a mountain stage where really surprises happened, one after the other of the General Ranking riders could not keep up on the last climb. I guess I have to be a fan of Kelderman (because I'm Dutch) but I must say I did not hear of him until this Giro, although he is already a long time in the professional peloton.

Great win from Geoghegan Hart yesterday, Sunweb did all the work for him and he crushed Kelderman in the last 200m. Also enjoying the commentary from Declan Quigly and Matt Stephens.

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"They know f_ck-all over at Slowtwitch"
- Lionel Sanders

Also Geoghegan Hart has moved way up the GC. Nibali keeps leaking away time at every opportunity you could leak ten seconds here, 5 there, 20 there on top of the TT loss he's managed to lose another 2+ min where he should not as a GC hope (same with Fuglsang):

1Joao Almeida (Por) Deceuninck-Quickstep59:27:382Wilco Kelderman (Ned) Team Sunweb0:00:153Jai Hindley (Aus) Team Sunweb0:02:564Tao Geoghegan Hart (GBr) Ineos Grenadiers0:02:575Pello Bilbao (Spa) Bahrain McLaren0:03:106Rafal Majka (Pol) Bora-Hansgrohe0:03:187Vincenzo Nibali (Ita) Trek-Segafredo0:03:298Domenico Pozzovivo (Ita) NTT Pro Cycling0:03:509Patrick Konrad (Aut) Bora-Hansgrohe0:04:0910Fausto Masnada (Ita) Deceuninck-Quickstep0:04:1211Brandon McNulty (USA) UAE Team Emirates0:04:2912Jakob Fuglsang (Den) Astana Pro Team0:05:07

Three days to go and Stelvio summit is wet but clear of snow:




I think I will book Thursday morning of vacation to sit on the trainer and ride Stelvio virtually with Nibali and crew. I really hope it goes off. I really love it when the Giro goes up Stelvio/Mortirolo/Gavia in and around Bormio.

Anyone have an update on talk of a reroute up Finestre to Sestriere later in the week?

Dev

Tomorrow Nibalis day on the descent from the Stelvio?

Stage 20 has been changed.

https://www.cyclingnews.com/news/giro-ditalia-french-covid-19-rules-mean-agnello-and-izoard-cut-from-stage-20/


COVID-19 restrictions in France have forced the organisers of the Giro d'Italia to massively change Saturday's final mountain stage to Sestriere.
The race will no longer climb the 2744m-high Colle dell'Agnello and cross into France for the Col d'Izoard, instead climbing to Sestriere three times.
The new 181-kilometre stage will include around 4,000 metres of climbing on wider, faster roads instead of the 5,500 vertical metres of the original 198km route.


This year's Giro could use a little spicing up. I'm not sure this will do that, but here's hoping.

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"Human existence is based upon two pillars: Compassion and knowledge. Compassion without knowledge is ineffective; Knowledge without compassion is inhuman." Victor Weisskopf.

Looks like a perfect day (for Nov) on Stelvio. Clear and roads are dry. One of the Flobikes guys did the course recce ride yesterday and it looks awesome. Road is clear. Nibali was pretty awesome on the Stelvio descent in 2017. Then after that they have a 10km climb at 7% to the finish, but this does not tell the full tale (the 7%) because it starts at Bormio, already at 1600m up, so if I recall it ends around 2300m so after a long day with thin air and being chilled after descending Stelvio, there may be some casualties. I think there are major shifts in the top 5 after Thursday!

Here from cyclingnews.com:

race leader João Almeida (Deceuninck-QuickStep)...carries the maglia rosa into stage 18 with a slender 17-second lead over Wilco Kelderman (Sunweb) and an advantage of almost three minutes over Jai Hindley (Sunweb) and Tao Geoghegan Hart (Ineos Grenadiers), while Nibali lies 3:31 down in seventh place overall.

Looks like things have totally blown apart on Stelvio. Summit is snow free. Should be a fast descent to Bormio. No Andy Hampsten Gavia snowstorm replica day

A "how do I get my jacket on" day instead.

Very exciting.
Looks like Tao and Hindley have the momentum.
But I really can not say already Kelderman has lost. There is not only the mountain stage Saturday (less hard than today ?) but
also the TT on Sunday.

I think Saturday will be bonkers, I am sure that Ineos will try to blow it to shreds.
We will see if Wilco just had a bad day or if his form is really on the way down.
It all might down to the TT just like at the Tour.

According to a Dutch newspaper Kelderman said it has been the hardest day of his life in which he had suffered tremendously.

Todays stage of 258 km has been shortened after protests of the riders, according to the same newspaper (Telegraaf). It says it will be only 100 km. Starting at 13:30.

I just saw on Flobikes that Adam Hansen lead the rider's protest to have it reduced to 131km. That totally changes the racing today, but also the next few days as the recovery will be faster. What an epic day on Stelvio yesterday. It was straight up manno manno racing. None of this silly Ineos or Jumbo train business. It was another day when Nibali could have vaulted up if he had the fitness and legs.

This is really shaping up to be an excellent final week. Saturday + Sunday will be awesome with the modified mountain stage and ITT in Milano. Looks like now that France had their post Covid19 party they want to keep the other races off of the Aubisque+Tourmalet+Izouard. Bummer that Vuelta is losing Aubisque + Tourmalet!

Well you called it. I really enjoyed the triple loop around Sestreire...I really need to go ride it.

Bummer for Kelderman. Everyone hates Ineos but you gotta love it t when the tour de France winner drops out and the helper boys step up to win stages and then magically one of the your helpers is in a dead tie going into the final stage ITT for the overall win. I don't think Kelderman can close the gap on Tao and I don't think Jai Hindley can out TT Tao but that's why we race the race.

Will be very exciting tomorrow!

Also, could we please avoid having spoilers in the subject line of threads on bike races? Not everyone manages to see the live sessions (especially when there are two grand tours simultaneously).

Seriously...It’s like amateur hour around here!

Seriously? Spoilers are not okay. Next time leave the thread title alone and don't ruin it for those of us that didn't watch it live. Then people that haven't watched yet don't get the result spoiled, and those that want to read the thread can find out what happened when they open it.

Totally uncool.

Hey, this is 2020, not 1999, but even if you got on the internet and hoped to avoid any kind of news (be it a sports event or otherwise), you don't know how who is tied from the title. For all we know from the title, Nibali and Fuglsand launched from way out, and made up 6 minutes with Nibali then gapping Fuglsang for an additional minute (now that would have been crazy).

In any case rather than complain, who do you think ends up taking this. Jai won the ITT in Palermo, but that's a hard one to really judge based on winds everywhere.

OK but how do you know from the title who is tied? You don't know the players who may be tied. Its just setting the stage for tomorrow, without revealing who those players are.

Because if you have an elementary understanding of how the GC works, and been paying an ounce of attention, it's plainly obvious.

Just because you can be a twunt and ruin things for everyone else doesn't mean you should..

I think I get how a GC works, but there were several riders who could be tied. But you're complaining about getting on the internet, onto a sports website, where there may be comments about sport and that others should not talk about a race (in any form) just because you have not had your chance to see it? So at what point can people talk about the tomorrow's stage starting with two riders being in a tie in an open manner? Never? Or does it always have to be buried way deep in some comments

In general, most people on ST are not watching the Giro. But many on ST would be interested in a grand tour ending in an ITT with zero seconds separating the two riders. So for those people it is interesting.

It may feel like you got to find out results (you weren't told the result, you jumped to a conclusion), but for others they got to hear about something intriguing that never happens in a Grand tour (at least its never happened in 40 years that I have been following them).

No biggie for me, just a suggestion (look at the *Spoilers* 2020 Cycling Restart Thread *Spoilers*-thread. Possible to scroll past, without spoilers.) Knowing that it is tied after a stage is a spoiler, it gives away end results, a lot of possible outcomes are no longer viable, and hence makes it less exciting to watch.

Bruce Willis' character was actually dead the entire time

The crazy thing is I felt that with a once in a century event at at Grand Tour, we'd kick off an interesting and interactive wider discussion around the excitement of that from many who likely are not even watching (maybe not hard core cycling fans but now drawn in and would suddenly be very interested). Like when you are not a basketball fan and get sucked into following a championship in the final quarter of game 7 because it is exciting even if you have followed zero basketball all year.

It is cool that after 4000km of riding around Italy, dancing around a pandemic we are down to 15km of ITTing. Saying it is tied creates interest among triathletes who don't follow. That was the angle I was getting at.

But rather we got broiled down in another round of ST negativety.

It is awesome we can enjoy the races! I think your marketing efforts for Pro-cycling will have less positive effect than negative here though. I personally find it unlikely that it has the effect you wish for in any impactful way, but might get a few or more forum members not to use the forum for some time (not considered "safe"). Not the end of the world, but not putting spoilers in the subject line is an easy fix for that.

Other than that, keep the engagement up, you put a lot of great posts on the pro races here!

Perfectly avoidable if you'd just keep titles vague as it was. As others have said, if you know a few things about cycling this is a massive spoiler. If you don't, well yeah, then apparently you change titles to achieve some kind of weird goal of getting more clicks?

The general topic on cycling is an excellent example of how to handle this. It is even in the thread title. Once in the topic you can spoil all you want. But don't think making it very slightly vague like a bad tabloid isn't a spoiler.

C’mon peeps. There is suddenly more excitement about this then the whole race?

If you more then a casual fan, every cycling media outlet you follow gives it away instantly. If it was that important, then watch it live. I’ve streamed at work at times (when appropriate).

Exciting 3 weeks, with unusual suspects, and a way unorthodox dynamic with virus and course alterations. And an unprecedented finale.

Dev was pumped and based on the tepid banter in this thread was trying to drum up interest for tomorrow. Especially with it all coming down to the ITT.

This a 2 minute minor, not a major penalty in my book.

I do appreciate when people are courteous enough to not post spoilers in the thread title itself.

My plan was to watch the stage after work today (I don’t have a job where I can just stream it at work in real time). I decided to casually scroll through the forum during my lunch break To see if there were any new interesting threads and saw this and was disappointed as it made the stage slightly less enjoyable since I knew what was coming. Also a little disappointed that despite a number of people expressing frustration towards Dev in doing this he still didn’t change the title back.

As for the race itself, looking forward to the ITT as it will be an exciting finish. I’ll just have to make sure not to long on to the ST forums until after I watch it so I don’t accidentally see any spoilers in he titles.

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Matt

It’s Tao Time ! thanks to Rohan .

Well onto the race itself.
I think it's truly amazing that after 3 hard weeks of racing, 2 guys that weren't on anyone's list are now tied for the lead, and I bet that most of the people on ST never even heard of Jai Hindley, so lets appreciate this cool moment.

As for predictions, I would love for Hindley and Sunweb to take it but back to reality I just can't see ineos letting this get away fro them.

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http://www.instagram.com/cyclewise

I just realized that we have four hour record holders at the ITT: Brandle, Dowsett, Dennis, and Campanaerts. Plus Ganna.

And Brandle sets the early fast time at 51.1 kph....just 0.2 kph slower than triathlete Sanders on Friday :-)

Dowsett goes in at 18:21 or so at 51.3 kph (same speed as Lionel on the Velodrome) :-)

Some of us have been following the Giro without actually participating in this thread. We’re allowed to do that, aren’t we? It’s really not cool to put spoilers in the subject line, and that was most definitely a spoiler.

Damage is done now, but please just bear that in mind for future results. It’s possible to create buzz around the event without giving away results.

---

Swimming Workout of the Day:

Favourite Swim Sets:

2020 National Masters Champion - M50-54 - 50m Butterfly

My interest is coming to this forum to have an interactive discussion on some topics (it could be swimming, marathon running, triathlon, cycling). Without saying who the players are, I just said the thing is going into the equivalent of sudden death overtime.

So all you guys, following the Giro for three weeks, not participating in a discussion about the Giro, that's fine, but why are you coming to a forum to not interact about topics. If everyone views whatever event in realtime or a lag and there is no interaction about those events, then there's no forum anyway

As it stands, many of you chose to not discuss anything about the Giro for three weeks and then your only discussion is complain. It's like the fish thread. Only 5-10 people ever go in there and there are many interesting topics worthy of pulling other people in and if you just change the title (or start a thread specific to a swim topic) we will get more interaction (remember when we did a few monthly focuses, we got different people in).

With one day to go, we're never had a Grand Tour tied. I'm sorry but you actually don't know before going into this thread who it is although those in the know can guess. The rest, not following, well that's interesting.

Can we go back and talk about Campanaerts setting the provisional best time. We have Ganna is on the road now, Dennis to come. Dennis is going to be a bit fried, but Ganna should be good to go

Ganna was 32 seconds faster than Campanaerts the current hour record holder over only 17ish minutes. I don't think Dennis gets close after his hard efforts on Stelvio and Sestriere.

I hope for Hindley but expect Hart.

Ineos (Sky) in kind of the only team that always nails the TTs with their GC guys.

I think the best GC contenders are nowadays often the TT guys who lean out a bit and work on their climbing. The other way round does not go down so well.
But even then sky made sure that the mountain goat Bernal can ride a solid TT. Quintana, Bardet etc. did never manage that.

---

10k - 30:48 / half - 1:06:40

The Giro is really just happening in < insert name here >'s head

---

"What's your claim?" - Ben Gravy
"Your best work is the work you're excited about" - Rick Rubin

I think we had a nail biter here... my big question has been who is the best time trialist because of the multiple individual TTs in this Giro and to cap it off with a TT instead of the typical parade to the finish was a stroke of genius this time around, 2 riders tied one comes out a winner, couldn't write a better ending. Watching with anticipation, I sort of agree Hart is the man to beat and will likely win his first GC. Also interesting that Dennis came so close to Campenaerts separated by fractions of a second! Ganna is no double the TT rider of the year though.

I think Dennis would have been closer to Ganna and around half way between Ganna's time and Campanaerts had he not hammered himself into the ground during Stelvio and Sestriere. I am also baffled how Tao lost so much time to Hindley on the stage 1 TT with the downhill sections helped by his slightly larger frame. Thomas must be sitting at home happy for his team, but this parcours was perfectly built for him. Generally I am in the camp of "anyone but Ineos" but I am partial to Great Britain and a Londoner riding for a British team had me cheering all the way on Stelvio, Sestriere and today. It must have been a fabulous day to be in Milano watching this unfold live. And you have to hand it to team Sunweb for "most exciting team" of 2020!!!

So we ended up with an Aussie former world champion (Dennis) hauling around an English kid to beat a fellow Aussie. Tough day for Hindley. You didn't want either guy losing today.

Did I spot a “decals removed” Aerocoach arm cups setup on that Pinarello Bolide?

I did not notice that I just keep seeing 500W+ on the screen

I wonder how hard Tao really went in the first TT - maybe just focusing on a steady effort and not taking any chances? Because...it's not like he was there to win the whole thing lol. And Hindley might have just gone a little harder, taken a couple more chances.

I was "anyone but Ineos" too but after the tour, then GT going out and seeming a little ragtag for a squad that hasn't had any bulletholes for years, I've found myself cheering for them in the Giro and the Vuelta. I blame 2020, I guess! Some new, young heroes coming into the fray for cycling though, pretty dang cool.

---

DFRU - Detta Family Racing Unit...the kids like it and we all get out and after it...gotta keep the fam involved!

Sure, I’ll answer. Because this is a well-known, unwritten rule when discussing sports results. You just don’t do it. And we are making a small example of you mostly so you or others don’t do it in the future for other events. Just apologize and move on. It isn’t a huge deal, but you continuing to try to justify it is making it a bigger deal than it warrants.

What a day with 4 World Hour record holders on deck (and two of them kind of off the back and two right behind the UCI world champion) and Tao who did not have the pink jersey all three weeks grabbing it on the 23rd day!

I have few friends based near Milano and Bergamo from my previous work and it must have just been fabulous to have this Giro go all the way from Palermo to Milano given all the people dying earlier this year from Covid19. With all the bumps and bruises, kudos to the organizers even if a few things were imperfect during a second round of this pandemic ramping now at 20K cases per day (France was at 10K per day ending the TdF they are 40K per day now).

My first Giro was watching live in the Dolomites in 1985 on the stage that was going between somewhere near Bolzano and Val Gardena when we were riding from Cortina d'Ampezzo to Innsbruck on a self supported bike tour....Moser, Hinault, Saronni and crew all blew by. Biking around Italy during the Giro, I don't recall ever buying dinner, we just got treated to dinner in the restaurants every evening on account of pulling in on our bikes to watch the live coverage!














In terms of the discussion on spoilers and all that, maybe we can take it offline now. We're just going to have different points of view on the internet in 2020.

This isn’t a me and you issue. I have no issue with you personally. You’re a valuable contributor to the forum. The forum masses will decide whether they are okay with title threaded spoilers. My vote/opinion doesn’t count more than anyone else.

Just get slowman to change the forum rules and everyone has to follow them. Forum masses don't get to decide what other people do. I've been around for lots of masses coming and going. I'll follow what slowman asks us to do in his house. I just have a different set of values of what a forum is about (to discuss things freely), and what the internet in 2020 represents in terms of pro sports. But hey, if slowman decides what we need to follow I will follow it. I won't just follow masses because of a popularity contest though.

Wow.

Aw not again! I haven’t had a chance to watch Lionel’s hour attempt yet. Now you spoiled that too!

---

Scott in Whistler

I mean no offense to anyone with this remark, just a remark: if I don't want to read spoilers on endurance sports events, I stay away from Slowtwitch forum until I've watched said event. This allows me to control my own destiny concerning spoilers. Sometimes means I have to delay reading Slowtwitch, but such is life.

Wait through the credits for the extra scene that teases the next episode

---

"What's your claim?" - Ben Gravy
"Your best work is the work you're excited about" - Rick Rubin

I wasn't personally affected by the title change, but why should people stay off slowtwitch? It is not an endurance sport news site after all. A few of us managed not to spoil things for anyone with our Classics Thread, and yet we post all sort of spoilers in that thread.

The issue is narrow in scope and nuanced. It's whether we should allow thread titles to contain spoilers (post spoilers all you want within the thread). This would seem to balance the interest of those who want to talk about the latest events with interest of those who haven't had a chance to watch. It's a small courtesy and really does not burden anyone. Why not extend this tiniest of courtesies to your fellow forumite?

And as for @Dev, since you asked for it, I have requested that Dan personally consider the issue.

 
Hey, how about that awesome Giro !!!! That week 3 was one of the greatest of all time and the lead up into the last day ITT best ever, with a tie, plus 4 hour record holders and the UCI worlds ITT champ on deck in the start gate!!!!














As for people interacting on ST, I am not in favour of any restriction of open interaction. Titles of threads are important in terms of how they create engagement and interaction between us (vs restrict the interactions). If some people want interactions restricted for others because they need their personal viewing offline from ST protected, that's their personal view. Its not a forum rule that everyone has to follow (and generally I respect it anyway)

If everything has to be buried deep in thread in the equivalent of a private room for 5-10 people then that's Dan's choice and I will follow it if Dan does not want public knowledge of what is going on in the outside world in thread titles and then the forum interaction on that topic is largely restricted to 5-10 people. All good if this is what Dan says the rules are in his house.

But then Dan has to decide which events have restrictions on their updated situation in thread titles (be it announcing that Wurf got first to T2 in Kona in thread title, Richard Murray running 28.04 in a 10km, the real time standings of your local bike time trial, or the intermediate split at mile 20 at the Boston marathon, or where things are in a Grand tour going into tomorrow's stage).

I was aiming to strike a balance in terms of intiating discussion about a tied Grand Tour (first ever) on the last day, and who was in the tie (no one could know from thread title). I could have just said who was tied, but didn't.

I'll follow the rules Dan sets but won't be bullied into conforming to what a few squeeky wheels who make noise think everyone needs to conform to just for them. It may or may not be the best thing for the forum overall. Dan can decide that. I'll conform.

Poor you, playing the victim card already?

Wow, you're really obstinate about a simple request from just about everyone chiming in on this thread. You could have just as easily written a similarly intriguing subject line without giving it away.

We've managed to annually have 3-4 threads for "the bike racing nerds" over years, with a different OP each time, and all ascribe to the same philosophy of not spoiling it for others. SL doesn't give away what happened and anyone knows not to look at it if they don't want that day's outcome revealed. It's just a simple courtesy.

This is why I stick to our 'official' bike racing threads. In the years and thousands of posts in them, it's remained a no drama zone (other than racing-related).

Same here. I stay off social media when I don't want a spoiler, and clearly don't click into any racing-related threads if I don't want a spoiler, but it's poor form to post the spoiler in the thread title. I felt like it was common knowledge to not post spoilers within thread titles.

And to think, if he'd just left the thread title alone, it wouldn't have ruffled any feathers...

IDGAF if you spoil something inside the thread. That's why I don't open the "Official Bike Racing" post during a race I'm watching...ever. But to do it in the thread title is something else.

On the three other cycling forums I'm on, it's a guaranteed 30-day time out for posting a spoiler in a thread that doesn't say *Spoilers Contained* in the title, and Dev'd probably get banned for what he did here.

Either way, It was a good Giro, I'm equally gutted for Jai as excited for Tao. Going to be a fun next few years to watch.

It was fairly easy to figure out who was tied if you had been watching the last few stages (as I had) but hadn't got around to watching the final mountain stage - which I'll remind you had only just ended only a few hours after you posted it.

Either way, even if I had watched only to Thursday's Giro stage over the Stelvio, let's see if we can deduce who this might be...

TGH and Hindley are within a few seconds of each other.
Kelderman is in the lead by `10-15 seconds but fading fast

If you were a betting man, which two racers would you say were most likely to be tied after another mountain stage? Once I read your thread title, I knew exactly what happened. Kelderman was dropped, and the other two either only briefly distanced or otherwise equal on time bonuses. The odds of any other outcome happening are much more slim. Even Kelderman losing exactly 10 seconds would be fairly rare (why not 9s or 11s), when the alternative (and general trend of the race) was that TGH and Hindley were so equal in just about every way leading up to the final mountain stage.

Sure, I suppose if you hadn't seen any Giro, you'd wonder if it were Thomas vs Nibali or Yates vs Fuglsang who was tied. But spoilers for a Grand Tour don't usually work that way - we're all coming at it from varying levels of knowledge/how far we've all seen and for most of us, any knowledge spoils the race outcome. During the Grand Tour/Classics seasons, I usually am pretty good about staying off social media because of the potential to spoil the result before I've seen the action. I come to ST because I generally expect that unless I open this thread, it won't come to that.

Well , i’ll put my hand up and cop to the fact that i acted like a pedantic git a few times.

But overall, yes, i like how the few of us kept the tradition going (i think it started circa 2014?).

I’d buy the first two rounds of Belgian Ale should i meet any one of the long time regulars in those threads. And to think, @trail and I once squabbled over what’s considered a flyer pick.

The tie could have been with a number of riders as you pointed out. Any guess of the permutations was in the realm of possibilities. Crashes, bonks and bonus times all factor into the uncertainty.

But if people want a safe zone where no results of any endurance sports are revealed hours after they happen, then slowman needs a rule for what sporting events can only be discussed deep inside threads and what is the the time cutoff after the event has happened. Once those are established I will gladly follow. But a bunch of guys inventing their own themes and saying everyone has to follow, well the number of messages I got in private suggests another view is out there too in 2020.

But rather than actually discuss an amazing race (you never showed up to discuss the race) we are broiled in multiple pages of negativity with people on the internet saying what behaviours they want from others. No problem, let's make it a rule. If not it's different people not liking how others behave.

You brought the negativity because you couldn’t help yourself by changing the title thread name. You specifically went out of your way to do that. You couldn’t just let the thread discuss the topic.

That’s fine. Notwithstanding my comments above, I really don’t have an agenda here. To be honest, I don’t even care about this specific race. I did care that you deemed it okay to to take it upon yourself to ruin a many-year-old forum tradition of not spoiling such results. If everyone—starting foremost with you—wants to live in the forum by the “rule” that unless Slowman bans it, it’s completely fair game, so be it. While I understand at the core that Slowman owns/controls this forum, I very much believe he prefers us to self-police our own behavior. Unlike you, I’m completely fine with that state of affairs and happy to capitulate to the preferences of the masses when it comes to something like this. Because I don’t own this forum and I don’t believe I am above it or should dictate my personal will upon it. We collectively make it work through Slowman’s grace. Just understand what you are advocating here and if—no, when—it comes around, you have no basis to complain as you stood strongly against it.

I won't complain if slowman chooses to make discussion of live sports only inside threads rather than in thread titles, a rule.

He can pick which events must be discussed inside threads only vs in titles and when it is OK to discuss outcomes in any form in titles.

The rest of us are welcome to influence him to make that a rule. Then it's clear cut. I will not complain with what he sets. I am just against random posters setting mob generated unwritten rules and calling them traditions. Lots of traditions change over time.

Mob???? That’s funny. I guess if we want to create labels, we could label you a dictator then. It was basic forum decorum for many years. Maybe it should be revisited in 2020. But, you didn’t start a thread to discuss. You unilaterally and blithely changed it. And then doubled down like only Trump would. I’m fairly sure Dan could give a rip about this topic. But the “f” everyone else attitude in the forum attitude that you have shown in this thread is surprising at least to me considering your long history on ST that lives and breathes through its members more than even Dan himself. I’ve made my point. Carry on. I’m done with this topic.

Hey man. This is not the hill to die on. In my opinion.

I jumped in early because I appreciate your general positivity and enthusiasm, and knew your motives were well intentioned. To me, spoilers are not that deflating. I have missed many big events for work, and didn’t care if I found out before I watched. But I also appreciate it is a big deal to many, and detracts from their enjoyment.

So, I implore you. Just let bygones be. Points taken.

In today’s day and age, expecting to remain spoiler free when going online could be wishful thinking. People want to interact and discuss things that happen, whether that’s movies, sporting events, TV shows, etc. Personally, I avoid forums, chat rooms, and all social media apps if I haven’t seen an episode of something I know will a popular topic of discussion. Unless there are general rules against it, I can’t ask or expect everyone else to hold their discussion and excitement while waiting for me to catch up.

You are conflating different issues. Again, no one is saying one shouldn't post spoilers in the actual thread. In fact, go wild about it, in the actual thread. What the vast majority of us (derisively labeled by Mr. Paul as "the mob") is asking is that no spoiler appears in the actual thread title. That's it.

Ask yourself, what good does posting actual spoiler in the thread title achieve, and what inconvenience is placed upon those who want to discuss spoilers in the actual thread itself? For the former, at the most, maybe a few more pair of eyeballs. For the latter, it places no additional tangible burden.

It's perhaps telling how little interest Mr. Paul's thread has garnered. Your post is the 120th in the thread, but only 69 of those 120 are posted before Mr. Paul changed the thread title to include the spoiler (that is to say, on the day of stage 20). Of the 69 posts, Mr. Paul authored 30 of those. Talk about a thread garnering little or no attention. In contrast, there were already more than 70 Giro-related posts in the other pro cycling thread by the end of stage 5. The Giro may have been tied going into the last stage, but it would appear that one of the threads that discusses the Giro on this site did way better than the other Giro discussion thread ;).

Well, Mr. Paul's got people's attention now, except it's not the type of attention one would ordinarily want. But then again, perhaps he believes that no attention is bad attention?

In contrast, the tradition of the Giro thread goes back at least five years, and the lowest participation was the 2016 edition, with 188 posts (still a good 60 posts more than what's in this thread, despite the instant thread containing numerous posts directed solely to the issue of spoilers). The highest participation was in 2018, with 645 posts. Without fail, each of these threads (from the 2015 one to the 2019 one, inclusive), had the word "spoiler" contained in the title but otherwise didn't spoil anything in the title. If it works well, and it it ain't broken, perhaps it means there's no need to "fix" it?

https://forum.slowtwitch.com/...o%20spoiler#p6925208

https://forum.slowtwitch.com/...o%20spoiler#p6619994

https://forum.slowtwitch.com/...o%20spoiler#p6300064

https://forum.slowtwitch.com/...o%20spoiler#p5936183

https://forum.slowtwitch.com/...o%20spoiler#p5536179

Not a long time regular yet, but I wouldn't mind sharing a few Belgian beers with a lot of the regulars in the classics thread either!

A "2 way tie tt to the finish" is pretty rare and super excitng, and can imagine someone thinks that deserves a better title than "giro stage 21 spoiler alert" but yeah maybe something like "WHOAH - SUPER EXCITING GIRO!!!!! ***SPOILER ALERT***" could convey the excitement while not telling what happened? Or is that already considered a spoiler?


Meanwhile....how bout these bars?

Bloody hell, with all that is going on in the world at the moment, all the crap we have been through this past year, people are getting their noses out of joint because a thread title said that that the Giro was tied for first going into the final stage?
People need to take a long hard look at themselves if this is causing outrage for them.

Some of us can handle and respond to multiple issues.

Hi Dev. Long time listener, first time poster (not true).

This thread didn't affect me one bit, but if you would like an impartial view?

There is no "rule" or law that states you have to hold a door open for an old lady when you walk out the shop. But I bet you do, because you are a nice bloke. I saw this thread and took it that people were just asking you to be a nice bloke.

Dan can change the rules, but he would probably say that he likes as few rules as possible and it is just better all around if people are nice to each other. Some people are telling you how they use this forum and are accustomed to other members respecting the "no spoiler in the title" custom and you are basically saying "bollocks, it isn't against the rules". Ok, that's true. But are you letting the door slam in the old lady's face?

Cheers,
Rich.

I read this excellent article about Geriant Thomas sitting at home, supporting his teammates winning 7 stages, but also having a tough time sitting out not having a chance to compete for the win:

https://www.cyclingnews.com/...in-the-giro-ditalia/


I felt gutted for him as I was kind of cheering for him from day 1 after he did not get his chance to even race the TdF. He is not getting younger, so I hope he has a solid chance at next year's Giro (I believe he is aiming for the double).


---------------------------------------------------


Responding in general terms to the banter that I caused with the change of title, believe it or not we had this discussion in many forms around 2003-05 when most were not around here on ST. Back then all we got were text updates on velonews.com and we could then view live stages on Outdoor Life Network at night. Some people wanted to discuss things as they happened live because the internet could give us live text already since the mid 1990's, others wanted no one to discuss Tour de France stages in near real time, because they wanted to view the coverage of Lance and crew that evening.


Like this year, there was always mud slinging. Some wanted their evening viewing not messed around with, while at the same time engaging in threads on the local Ironman event, or the latest bike release, others wanted to discuss today's racing (in any sport) in real time now and be alerted to when a discussion was going on.


If you look at the entire point of a forum it is to increase discussion and engagement on any topic. In the extreme if there is less discussion eventually there is no forum. Some will say, "keep the discussion behind the front door of a thread vs putting a sign on the front door of the thread to advertise what is going on inside".

A very recent example of this is a thread about taking a 100m swim time from 1:50 down to 1:30 vs the monthly fish thread. The former thread resulted in a large amount of discussion on the that swim topic. Conversely many of the questions on improving swim form when posted inside the fish thread filled with most of the best swimmers on ST may result in just one answer (if). In a few days, the thread about 100m times basically got as many posts as the monthly fish thread gets in an entire month and 6x the view.


What you see there is the sign on the door matters if the the idea of a forum is to create a discussion on a topic. If not, it is a semi private discussion for the same 5-15 people who frequent the topic, but no one else ventures in after a while (you see that in the fish thread with hard core swimmers, and cycling spoilers with fairly serious cycling fans...these are two examples).


Some events are worthy of an overt statement that creates interest from people who may not otherwise show interest or have not been following what is going on. Sometimes its not that important and the discussion is small and can continue inside a semi private club.


It may be an unpopular opinion for some who have a vested interest in not wanting their off ST viewing messed around with what is discussed on ST. So they will want people to conform in one manner. They will also be the most vocal if someone behaves out of line with their desire.


Others may not agree but they don't have enough vested to really voice anything. That's fine. But the number of posts for or against something does not logically make a certain behaviour something that must be conformed to. Then its a popularity contest and/or trial by internet.


There are lots of things that are unpopular and its easier to just conform than present an altenate way. So, I defer to slowman on what creates more overall engagement on the forum. I know that Echappist posted all kinds of stats (and we can all cherry pick stats), but a few thread on specific topics like the Planche de Belle Filles ITT or Pogacar's climb up Peyresourde created as much engagement over a few days those thread were discussed as an entire season of single thread posts.


But I won't convince people who don't want to discuss results in real time openly that it makes the forum more exciting for the collective to discuss them openly in real time. I understand the other point of view and many times, I get stages "spoiled" by social media because I am watching a stage part way, then go to a workout or a meeting and then while avoiding the internet, someone sends me a "did you know that.....xyz did abc via facebook or email, or just on TV in an airport depending on where I am. I do get that, but that's where I concede that I live in 2020 with media all around me and I subsequently go enjoy the stage knowing the results.


I believe we can agree to disagree on philosophies on how a forum is used. We can also remain adult (not you, just in general) and not call the person with whom we disagree names etc. or poke fun at people we disagree with or start comparing posters with polarizing politicians etc.


Generally I am respectful that what happens in a sport event need not be included in a thread title. A once in a lifetime tie going into stage 21 of a grand tour. The attempt was to strike a balance, create real time discussion while not giving away it all.


Moving into the future, while accepting that there is a cohort that wants no real time overt results shown in thread titles, I am glad to keep it under the hood in a thread, but there are exceptional cases where the thread title makes sense to be overt for larger discussion since we're in 2020 and not 1992.




----------------------------


PS. I have a funny story about real time results. It was Kona 1990. In Triathlon Today magazine there was an ad for the Kona Surf Resort. This is where T2 was at the far end of Alii Drive. There was no online coverage (CERN had barely invented the hypertext transfer protocol). I used the 1-800 number to call the Kona Surf resort lobby from the East coast. This is before there were call centers so the 1-800 number got you to the front desk of the hotel.


I knew that with the swim + T1 + 4:30 on the bike, the leaders would get to T2 at around 12:30 pm Hawaii time which was 6:30 pm my time. So I called the front desk at 12:25 and asked the lady at the front desk if she would go out to the parking lot and take down the order of the top 5 athletes coming in and write them on paper and if she did not know the names, just ask some of the people loitering around and if she could get the time of day when they roll in. I told her I was calling from Canada and wanted to know know what was going on to tell my friends. She was kind of amused, laughed and said, "If you care that much, I'll do it for you". I said I would call her back at 1pm. This was 7 pm my time to get the T2 results.


So she went out to the parking lot, took down all the names, I called her back, she had a chuckle, she gave me the results and I called all my triathlete friends locally (since most did not have internet) to discuss the live results. We must have talked about the what ifs for the entire 2:52 minute run that Mark Allen ran after a hellish wind day.


Different world, no forum, no internet, but a live sport going on and we had a blast over 5-10 local phone calls discussing Mark Allen, Pigg, Wolfgang, Kiuru and Tinley. 1990 was a breakthrough race for Kiuru from Finland. In 1996 we became friends at Wildflower and told him the story of me calling the Kona surf to discuss the live results and tracking them. Today he is a politician in Finland and we still stay in touch (him the athlete with the crazy sports fan)


PS. I think 1990 was also the year that Mark got a big pull from the press van (you can see the splits here on how he smoked Jurgen and others who biked 4:51 on a hell wind year: https://www.slowtwitch.com/...hers_Archive_58.html

What is funny about comparing this story from 1990 with 2020 is when we were starved for information, getting whatever we could was like a lifeline and connected us with our sport. Now we have an abundance of information so we want it limited