Turn the wheel away from you, and use your fingertips. 8 fingertips work a lot better than 2 thumbs. Please don't use tire irons for installation, as you can cause damage to the sidewall fibers of your tire, and cause a future side wall blowout. If you are going to use any tools, get a bead-jack.

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Athlinks / Strava

Tried that too. And yes, I know, irons aren't recommended. I'm desperate. And pissed that I feel like I've thrown cash away.

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Editor-in-Chief, Slowtwitch.com | Twitter

I use tire irons on Reynolds wheels several times a week and have never had a problem.

I remember having the same issue, I eventually gave up and went down to my LBS where "my guy" had them on in 30 seconds. I didn't know whether to be relieved or pissed off. Anyway the problem is that you think those beads are tucked into the center channel but they're not. Unless you can tuck them in and hold tension on them they slip back to the outside rim. I'm still not very good at it but I can eventually get it done.

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"They know f_ck-all over at Slowtwitch"
- Lionel Sanders

If you have sun where you live, put the tyres in the sun for half an hour before you put them on the wheels. You will still be in a bad place if you flat in the race however.

Maybe warm the tires up. Pot of hot water on the stove, not boiling but not hand washing either. Or a hot summer car.

Then try.

In winter I sit them over a room vent.

What is your definition of centering the channel? Is it just that the tire bead is not sitting on the upper shelf? Because that by itself isn't enough in some cases.

The biggest trick I've learned is that you have to also pull the slack out. I may totally fumble how to describe this with words...but here goes.

1. Set the bead on 60-70% of the tire. This should be no problem.
2. The remaining 30-40%, face the wheel so that the unseated portion represents 10:00 to 2:00 on a clock where 6:00 is pointing to your waist.
3. With your right hand, hold the top of the wheel at about the 1:00 position and pull inwards to your waist.
4. Now use your left hand and pinch the tire starting from 6:30 and pull it towards 9:00.
5. Without fully letting go of the tire as you pinch, work your fingers towards 9:00 where you will now be pulling towards 12:00. Essentially what you're doing here is pulling the tire beads up against the channel removing all the slack. You should then notice that the section that was unseated at 10:00 can now easily seat to 11:00.
6. Repeat the same process now by using your left hand to hold at 11:00 (while pulling the wheel towards your waist), and your right hand pinches and works the tire from 5:30 back towards 3:00, and back up to 12:00. Again, you should feel that the section of tire that was only seated up to 2:00 can now easily get to 1:00
7. From here on, you generally have so much of the tire on that the last section from 11:00 to 1:00 can just pop on with thumbs. But if not, repeat the process on one or both sides to pull just that little bit extra slack.

It's really this process that makes all the difference in the world. I've had some funny moments where guys who have been riding for 20+ years, but just got deep channel tubeless compatible wheels struggle with flat changes. They're cursing and breaking out the tire lever with 25% of the tire still unseated. I usually just grab the wheel from them, and in 30 seconds I have it on for them with no tools...just a wink and a smile.

So, it appears that part of the issue is that the tire slides towards the outer bead during the mounting process. How on earth are you keeping it in the center channel?

I’ve dealt with some seriously frustrating bike issues before, but tires? Really? This is killing me.

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Editor-in-Chief, Slowtwitch.com | Twitter

THANK YOU. I’m going to try this tomorrow. I can picture how this is supposed to work.

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Editor-in-Chief, Slowtwitch.com | Twitter

GCN had a god video. https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=jvvXrlAUUfU
How To Fit Any Difficult-To-Fit Bike Tyre
The new tip that I took away from that was to seat the tire half way so it's in the deepest part of the rim channel. By doing so, there is less pressure on the tire.

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Indoor Triathlete - I thought I was right, until I realized I was wrong.

Last time I had this problem I went down to my LBS. Embarrassing when he took one look and simply flipped it on. Next time I tried, struggled for a wee while before it 'plopped' on. No idea why. Just hoping it's a while before I have to remove/replace the tyre.

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Trust me I’m a doctor!
Well, I have a PhD :-)

Watched that, and got nowhere.

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Editor-in-Chief, Slowtwitch.com | Twitter

If you’ve been putting in tires for years maybe something else is wrong?

Possible the wrong size tire?

Just based on the fact that they're tubeless-ready wheels, I'm about 90% confident that it's an issue with the center channel (i.e. what some others have said - not getting both beads down in the center channel around the entire circumference of the wheel).

Other things that can complicate this are:
-Rim tape thickness and slickness (which can make it harder to get into the channel)
-Tire age (newer = tighter)
-Tire and wheel combo that happen to fit particularly tight (to me, the Conti 4000 S runs pretty average in terms of tightness).

I've seen this problem a LOT with new wheels. In fact, I stopped to help an older guy on a bike ride yesterday, with this exact issue. It was a fancy-pants loaded Madone with tubeless-ready Bontrager carbon clincher wheels (that have an internal TLR shape with raised bead shelf and dropped center channel). He didn't push the beads down into the channel, and was 100% stuck.

That actually reminds me, I helped our own Herbert with this issue a few years back, and he made a quick article for the home page (including a couple videos): https://www.slowtwitch.com/..._all_wrong_5258.html

The other X factor here is that I don't have any experience with those exact wheels. I have run in to some tubeless-ready wheels in the past that fit insanely tight with any tire. Like, so tight you wouldn't believe. One of these wheel sets ended up being delayed with their release to the public to fix the issue, and the other company went out of business. Point I'm making is that it is in the realm of possible that the rims fit really wonky. I borrowed some non-tubeless Reynolds wheels years back (58 / 72 combo), and the tires fit realllllllllllly loose. To the point where I was expecting the tires to blow off during inflation (they didn't).

These little quick clamps can help: https://www.irwin.com/tools/brands/quick-grip

Is this still with the Conti 4000's? Or I think you mentioned some Vittorias at some point? Reason I ask is that if it's Conti's, that sounds like it's probably an issue with the rim shape. Those tires are vulcanized and retain their shape pretty darn well, and shouldn't cause that issue. With Vittorias and other handmande tires (which lay 100% flat in the packaging), I have seen your issue, where the tire is reluctant to hold shape and wants to flatten out again - pushing the tire beads up onto the bead shelf. Had this issue on some Hed rims with Vittoria and Challenge clinchers.

Crank brother's speedier tire levers have worked for me where all else fails.

https://www.crankbrothers.com/products/speedier-lever

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=ZbO_03rKyPk

+ 1....Fantastic lever! You still need to get the tire down into the center channel, but this lever holds the tire in place while you do that. Another big plus is the design makes it virtually impossible to pinch your tube, which is a HUGE plus with latex. A bit bulky to pack, but well worth it!

Welp, did this whole routine this morning, and it got closer, but I'm still stuck with the last 10% or so refusing to budge. (Per Greg's suggestion, I swapped out the Vittoria's back to the Conti's to see if they would hold the bead better.)

I'm just flummoxed and beyond disappointed at this point.

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Editor-in-Chief, Slowtwitch.com | Twitter

Finnish at the valve will make all the difference.
Also make sure the rim tape is very tight and sits right to the bottom of the wheel well.
Conti 4000 on the new Reynolds are a bitch.

Have you tried taking off the rim tape and putting the tire on with NO innertube?

If it goes on then put it in the hot sun let it stretch then try putting it on the correct way

But then again think about it do you really want rims you can’t change a tire on when you are out riding or racing.

Maybe call the rim manufacturer?

If I'm racing, and I get a flat, my day's pretty much over anyways -- so that part doesn't bother me. I just want to fucking be able to put the things on, period.

I did call Reynolds, although I'm a second-hand owner, so they pretty much said "good luck" and sent me on my merry way.

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Editor-in-Chief, Slowtwitch.com | Twitter

It looks like one side is getting stuck on the outer bead shelf, and will not unseat from it.

Whiskey. Tango. Foxtrot.

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Editor-in-Chief, Slowtwitch.com | Twitter

With new tires: My front is tough. The back is near impossible.

Once you get the tires on they stretch just enough so if you flat you can change your tire. GP4000 I can do on the road with my hands only. The VCS I have my doubts and I race with levers to be safe.

If you still have the blue rim tape - it’s thick. Watch for any wrinkling or unnecessary overlap.

On the first install I try to mount in a fluid motion working both hands around the rim and finishing together. When the bead goes taught then I start back down at the bottom and push the bead toward center. I then work around again. I repeat this a bunch of times. Eventually it goes.

When lazy I use a tire jack.

Rarely I will mount without a tube - this way I can be rough with the tire. Then remove and insert the tube.

Glad I’m not the only one. You will get it.

The rear is on, but it has such a bad bubble in it that I'm going to need to take it off and try it again. The front is fucking impossible.

I really want to run the Corsa's on these, but I don't think I will ever be successful in getting them on.

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Editor-in-Chief, Slowtwitch.com | Twitter

Had this same problem trying to help out a friend with mounting GP4kS2 on a new set of Enves. I'd never dealt with TLR wheels before and had no idea there was a technique or trick. I destroyed two tubes and spent damn near an hour before finally having success but only by brute force and determination. I'm really happy with my Zipp 404 FC non-TLR wheels right now. Tires damn near mount themselves on those rims.

My guess is this is why the wheels were for sale.......

Hate to tell you, but if you're following all the suggested "tips and tricks" already noted.....your pretty much just screwed.
I had two pair of DT Swiss PRC's (tubeless) and Schwalble tubeless tires were a bit of a PITA to mount.....they were doable, but required some work......then I tried some Conti 4 Season tires.....no way the Contis were ever going on those set of wheels - so I sold both sets of wheels. No way I am ever riding a set of wheels where it's going to be that difficult to mount or fix a flat during a ride.

I now have two sets of Reynolds Aero wheels (tubeless) and the Schwalbes are easy on and off (Haven't tried the Conti tires yet). I'd like to try the Conti 5000 tubeless, but if they are difficult to mount I'll return them and continue with the Schwable tubeless.

Hmm... sounds like it's probably a wheel issue, especially since you're using a very common tire and have tried everything else suggested in this thread. Personally, I won't ride wheels that fit tires SUPER tight... not worth getting stranded somewhere.

One last option - I recall that the older Schwalbe Ultremo ZX (tube-type clincher) was my go-to tire for wheels that ran large or were very tough to put tires on. Older carbon/aluminum Zipp wheels (i.e. 404 clincher) are a great example, because the rim channel was completely flat with no dropped center. Even Zipp's own Tangente tires were an absolute beast to install, but the Schwalbe's weren't bad. Not sure if they still make that tire, but it might be worth a shot.

I couldn't get my tires back on my rims either. I stuck them in the dryer for 10 minutes, then was able to get them on.

Kudos, that's a nice idea. Pretty warm but not too hot.

How much air do you have in the tube when you're trying to seat the tire?

It is good practice to put a little bit of air in the tube to ensure it goes in with no folds. But once you get the tire on 70% of the way, you should already have the tube properly set in the rim channel 100% of the way. Once you get to this point, you can let all the air out of the tube.

For tighter fits, if you have some air in the tube, it will naturally push the beads apart a few mm, thus you negate the ability for the beads to be dead center in the channel.

After that, it's just a bit of finesse. If you can get to the point where you only have 10% left, then I'm almost certain that you can repeat the pinching and pulling process to squeeze out a mm or two. Because that's really all you need.

I did a hair dryer on mine to warm them up, also did a little baby powder on the rim. Still took some doing to get that last bit over but it worked.

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"You can never win or lose if you don't run the race." - Richard Butler

I open the valve, blow in, close it, then let air out after i get the tube 90% of the way there.

I may give this thing one more try tonight and take a picture or three where this thing is getting stuck.

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Editor-in-Chief, Slowtwitch.com | Twitter

Have you been able to get the tire on without the innertube in it?

Haven't gotten home yet to make another attempt at it.

Judging on the other thread on the front page, it certainly appears that I'm not the only one having a hell of a time with tubes and TLR wheels.

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Editor-in-Chief, Slowtwitch.com | Twitter

Yes, and yes (although it took a lever to finish the job).

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Editor-in-Chief, Slowtwitch.com | Twitter

Same experience with Reynolds and Schwalbe Pro One going on very easy. Same with Roval CLX64 wheels on my ; both Pro One and S-Works Turbo went on pretty easy. GP5000TL went on very easy on my Synapse, which has the Cannondale carbon wheels. I've never flatted on any of these wheels. I keep the air at 80-85. Never going back to tubes.

Well, I managed to get the front on, and it actually looks OK.

I swapped to a latex tube, which actually helped for some reason or another. It still took about 15 minutes, I did snap a tire lever, and I've got a blister the size of a nickel on a thumb, but I got there.

With this wheel it REALLY wants to grab the outer channel and stay there and not budge. The amount of effort to even get it unseated back into the center channel was ridiculous. I don't look forward to re-attempting the rear to get it seated correctly.

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Editor-in-Chief, Slowtwitch.com | Twitter

Way back when Conti tires did not play well with Mavic rims and I learned to use a tire lever inserted opposite where the bead is still off. Use one hand to hold the tire (again the area where the bead is off) with a thumb on the bead to put tension on it. Use the lever to push the tire bead away from the rim sidewall (toward the rim center) and slide it around toward the area the bead is off. Repeat by inserting the tire lever in the same location as before but slide it around the other direction. Again, repeat doing this in both directions until the bead pops on the last bit by itself or it is close enough to push over with your thumbs. By repeatedly pushing the bead toward the center of the rim and sliding lever toward your hand you are forcing the bead into the smaller diameter area in the center of the rim and dragging any slack in the bead toward the area still unseated. The technique takes a little practice to keep constant tension on the bead while using the lever to move and slide the bead but it will come easy.

Modifying this will also be useful to get the tire off, use the lever to force the bead away from the rim sidewall around the entire circumference, pinch the tire with one hand and slide your thumb to put some tension on one side of the bead. Continue by inserting the tire lever opposite your hand (that is pinching the tire) and slide it toward your hand, repeat in both directions until there is enough bead to pull off by hand or use the lever to assist.

I have had tire/rim combinations where once is enough and other where it took 15 so please be patient. Maybe this won't help you (because you have been working so hard already I suspect like others here the rims are no good) but will help someone else. I hate to think of anyone on the road who is capable of fixing a flat but unable to because of technology changes.

rich

Is it safe to use a kool stop tire jack on carbon rims? They've been a thumb saver for me with my HED Jet Black wheels.
The jack is not made of steel, but I don't know if the direction of force it places on the rim would be too much for a carbon rim...


https://www.amazon.ca/...8754439296&psc=1

My Canyon came with Reynolds Strike wheels and after reading the issues I was concerned how I would deal with a flat on the side of the road - several people said you're screwed and will need to find a car ride home. Luckily for me me first flat happened on a ride with an expert wheelbuilder who showed me how to do it and we were rolling again in 5 minutes. Since then I've had flats, worn tires, etc and so worked with the wheels a lot and it's really not that hard once you know how to do it. I've been riding Conti GP4000.

Key is to push the bead away from the rim towards the center but you need to do that on both sides of the wheel (drive and non-drive). Both need to be unseated in order to create enough slack. The unseating is easy, with your thumbs push the tire off the rim towards the center and go around in little steps until one side is done; then repeat on the other side. Then the tire will sit loose and you can pull one side over the rim to insert a tube. You can easily insert a tube but again when doing so push the tire back towards the center of the rim so the bead won't seat. When you're trying to mount the tire, start by pushing as much slack as you can towards the end point (opposite end of where you're start mounting the tire) and repeat this a few times as you go around it. You should have just enough slack to mount the tire at the end without needing tire levers.

I've come to the conclusion that certain wheel/tire combos are terrible, bordering impossible and others not so bad.

My everyday wheels are an old set of Bontrager XXX Race Lite aluminum clincher wheels (Bonty does not make these anymore). These things are absolutely bomb proof. I can almost do a tube change with these completely barehanded with Conti 4000 and now 5000 clincher tires. I just need a bit a lever help to get the OFF process going and it all goes quickly from there.

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Steve Fleck @stevefleck | Blog

I can do the Contis lever free on my normal training hoops (they are also pre-TLR clinchers).

I can't ever see getting the Vittorias on, which is a damn shame. I bought them specifically for this set up.

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Editor-in-Chief, Slowtwitch.com | Twitter

This and deadlift. Step on the tire and pull with your hands just like doing the dealift. Tire is just tad bit small.

PM'd you.

Just put on a new set of GP5000 tubeless on a new Reynolds AR58/62 wheelset. Right out of the box, with NO soapy water or anything, the tires went on with just one lever at the very end for a bit of leverage but only because I am lacking hand/finger strength right now in one hand after breaking it recently. If I had used something to lubricate the beads and hand some more strength I probably would not have needed the levers. I really just put the tires on too see how easily they would go on. Tight, as tubeless should be, but not difficult at all.

Yes, I've heard the new AR series are significantly better at tire fit versus the Strikes.

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Editor-in-Chief, Slowtwitch.com | Twitter

To compare with the 2017 Strike 60s that I had, getting tubeless on was a pain in the ass. Almost impossible. Schwalbe pro one went on okay, and S-works turbo went on ok, but anything else was an impossible fight and I just gave up.

I have no experience with the tire jack...I wish I could say it was safe for carbon rims. Sounds like something to check with the rim mfg for.

rich

p.s. sorry for the late reply

Just to make you a bit more frustrated..........

Reynolds Aero 45's......saw I had a deflated tire sitting in the garage....popped the tire bead and tubeless tape needed replaced. Using a single tire lever easily removed the tire, installed new tape and remounted tire easily by hand.....inflated with a CO2. Decided to check the other wheel and add some fluid......same - popped the bead and removed tire easily with a single lever......remounted easily by hand.

There are good systems out there!

You may want to rethink the CO2

Yea, I know....but I have been doing it for years without a problem yet although a compressor or large volume floor pump is on my "buy" list.