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Anybody here built a rocker plate for their trainer?
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Wondering how much a difference in comfort people have notice with using a rocker plate with their indoor trainer. I subscribed to the Facebook group Zwift rocker plates which has lots of build options. I just set mine up but won’t have a chance to ride until later In the week. Hoping it makes indoor riding slightly more comfortable. Curious about others experiences.
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Re: Anybody here built a rocker plate for their trainer? [mickison] [ In reply to ]
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I don’t have a rocker plate but I did swap over to the rock n roll trainer from Kurt kinetic. It made a world of difference for me compared to a static trainer. I’m guessing a rocker plate will have the same effect.
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Re: Anybody here built a rocker plate for their trainer? [Parkland] [ In reply to ]
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Parkland wrote:
I don’t have a rocker plate but I did swap over to the rock n roll trainer from Kurt kinetic. It made a world of difference for me compared to a static trainer. I’m guessing a rocker plate will have the same effect.

Yep. Same idea. Some of the designs I’ve seen are pretty elaborate
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Re: Anybody here built a rocker plate for their trainer? [mickison] [ In reply to ]
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I "built" one.
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Re: Anybody here built a rocker plate for their trainer? [DrTriKat] [ In reply to ]
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DrTriKat wrote:
I "built" one.

Genius! The Facebook group is great as it has a wide range of solutions. Mine is just a pvc pipe down the center of my elite direto and some small inflatable bags under the outer legs. I don’t know that a full on platform would do much better
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Re: Anybody here built a rocker plate for their trainer? [mickison] [ In reply to ]
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I built one a couple of weeks ago actually and got in about 5 sessions on it so far. It seems to have a bit more comfort than before on my sit bones but not that world of difference others have reported (i.e. somebody once said they struggles to make an hour ok a trainer and the rocker let them go 3 hours....yeah, that ain't happening to me so far). 1 hour sessions are easier to get through for me and 90 minutes before I was struggling comfort wise to make the last 30 minutes. Now I still feel it but it isn't excruciating like before.

I can say the standing efforts feel less harsh on the quads since you aren't stuck in an awkward position trying to pedal when the trainer is fixed.

Next up is to work on my saddle/position because I know I haven't found the right combo yet. Current setup is ok but I've really got to fiddle with the position and tilt more before trying a different saddle.
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Re: Anybody here built a rocker plate for their trainer? [loxx0050] [ In reply to ]
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Yeah. I’ve never had huge comfort issues on indoor trainer. An hour is usually fine. 2 hours maybe some discomfort. But mostly it’s mental fatigue after 1.5 hours. I’m not interested in 3 hour trainer rides. But if my simple solution can make it a little better I’m happy
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Re: Anybody here built a rocker plate for their trainer? [mickison] [ In reply to ]
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I was having some saddle sore issues from zwifting so much. I built a Rockr Plate about 2 weeks ago. And haven't had any problems since.



I ordered the DYI kit from SBR and found the board design on the Rockr Plate Facebook site. Actually created a template of the boards with holes pre-drilled and then transfered the template to the final boards so as not to make a mistake. 3/4 in. birch boards. Will probably coat the top with Truck bed liner paint or just some carpet/rubber matting.

The benefit of the DYI kit was all the HW was included, including the mounts for my Kickr. You could get it yourself and maybe save $50. I spent about $200 all in.

I thought I might lose some power on it, but that hasn't been the case at all. It is a little bit louder than before, but the carpet or coating should solve that part of it.
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Re: Anybody here built a rocker plate for their trainer? [velocomp] [ In reply to ]
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Looks nice. I’m pretty sure a little movement won’t hurt for sure
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Re: Anybody here built a rocker plate for their trainer? [mickison] [ In reply to ]
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Rideandfish made something cool.
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Re: Anybody here built a rocker plate for their trainer? [Fishbum] [ In reply to ]
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Fishbum wrote:
Rideandfish made something cool.
Yup, mines on the Facebook group. Made it on a cnc at work.
I had saddle sore issues going longer than an hour on my Hammer when I first got it. The rocker took care of that problem, and my longest indoor ride was 4 hours. It’s stull not going to feel as natural as rollers however, but the rocker does help a lot.
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Re: Anybody here built a rocker plate for their trainer? [mickison] [ In reply to ]
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The problem with every rocker plate design I've seen is that the pivot point is below the floor. This in no way simulates what happens on a bike on the road. When you're riding, if your front tyre moves to the right, you lean to the left, and vice versa. The rear tyre more or less tracks along straight though.

My thought is that what you need is a roll axis that goes through the contact patch of the rear tyre, and up through the handlebars or so at the front.

In practical implementation, you could make the trainer (at the rear) tilt at floor level. But the front needs to move differently. The easiest practical way I can see to achieve this is with a 4-bar linkage supporting the front axle, with the lower pivots slightly wider than the upper pivots.

I'll draw a picture if this doesn't make sense.
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Re: Anybody here built a rocker plate for their trainer? [MattyK] [ In reply to ]
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English please.........

------------------------------------------------------------
"PAIN is nothing compared to what it feels like to QUIT" Wink
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Re: Anybody here built a rocker plate for their trainer? [Get2TheChopper] [ In reply to ]
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Get2TheChopper wrote:
English please.........

OK, I'll try, but I am mostly fluent in Engineer.

Imagine something like this thing:
https://tacx.com/...steering-frame-flow/



But instead of mounting the fork in a rigid frame, replace those two vertical links with bars that have a hinge/pivot/balljoint at each end.


From front on, it would look like this:




The green would be the frame of my contraption, and the blue triangle is the (imaginary) lower portion of the front wheel (that you have removed).

I think that would make for a much more natural feel. If you tilted the linkages forward slightly from vertical it would also provide some simulation of steering effect.
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Re: Anybody here built a rocker plate for their trainer? [MattyK] [ In reply to ]
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I think I follow you but a caveat is that a potential solution for what you’re describing is likely far more expensive than the current solutions for a simple side to side motion
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Re: Anybody here built a rocker plate for their trainer? [MattyK] [ In reply to ]
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That's a cool idea - thanks

------------------------------------------------------------
"PAIN is nothing compared to what it feels like to QUIT" Wink
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Re: Anybody here built a rocker plate for their trainer? [mickison] [ In reply to ]
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mickison wrote:
I think I follow you but a caveat is that a potential solution for what you’re describing is likely far more expensive than the current solutions for a simple side to side motion

And people pay how much for a Kickr Climb? (In fact this could be nicely integrated with one...)

Plus rocker plates are a crude simulation of real motion.

From 1:55:


Option B would be to mount the front wheel on a roller (passive or electrically driven), so you can move it quite freely and completely naturally.

<royalty cheques to matty at mattyisafreakingenius dot com>
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Re: Anybody here built a rocker plate for their trainer? [velocomp] [ In reply to ]
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Beautiful work! Just don't forget when deciding on a finish for the top surface that there is probably going to be a small river of sweat pooling up and drying there. You want to be able to wipe it up or you will have a sticky smelly smear. I have a trainer bolted down to a 1 1/2" thick fiberboard platform and I covered the top surface with inexpensive gray vinyl floor tile. Super easy to keep clean.
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Re: Anybody here built a rocker plate for their trainer? [mickison] [ In reply to ]
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Rocket... plane?! COOL! Oh. :(
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Re: Anybody here built a rocker plate for their trainer? [MattyK] [ In reply to ]
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I’m not saying there’s not a market for it. Judging by the rocker plate Facebook group there’s a lot of people who are looking for an inexpensive solution to provide a little bit of movement. Sure I’d love a completely natural feel on a rocker plate but another $500 might be too much. I’ll wait a couple years until more options come out
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Re: Anybody here built a rocker plate for their trainer? [mickison] [ In reply to ]
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The unit that Cycleops is developing intrigues me though because they aren't just building a side to side rocker plate but more of a "free-motion" type device (similar to free-motion setups for rollers....well, kind of). If that is well priced I'd definitely buy one honestly and retire my DIY one (hoping it is a decent amount cheaper than their Magnus trainer is the most I think it should cost).
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Re: Anybody here built a rocker plate for their trainer? [loxx0050] [ In reply to ]
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I saw that one moves forward as well. Does it move more freely than side to side and forward?
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Re: Anybody here built a rocker plate for their trainer? [mickison] [ In reply to ]
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I built one fir the back wheel only- pillow block bearings based. It definitely made a difference in comfort, but I wasn’t having bad issues before. I like the feel better.
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Re: Anybody here built a rocker plate for their trainer? [MattyK] [ In reply to ]
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This is very interesting. I built a rear-wheel version a year ago for my computrainer and I loved it. It was very basic though. I've since moved to a Kickr Core and Climb combo and have been planning my full-length rocker plate in my head and some basic drawings for about 4 months. I've actually been carrying around a notebook in my backpack so I can sketch stuff out as inspiration strikes.

As you say, the problem with current rocker plates is the pivot point is too low. When you lean, the wheel slides side to side as well. I actually recorded myself riding up a hill over a line I drew with chalk to try to estimate how much motion there was. Based on my crappy video and some equally crappy math, I think the actually pivot point is somewhere around 3 inches above the ground, but this obviously depends on how much you're leaning, how hard you're pushing the pedals, etc.

I have two design ideas to deal with this but neither is 100% there, IMO. The first is the basic version, where you have a board that the bike and trainer sit on , and that board is attached to an outside frame. The board is attached to the frame with pillow block bearings on the frame and linear motion bearings on the board, with a short shaft front and back. I would include a compression spring over the shaft. This would allow a slight back and forth motion, raise the pivot point, and allow side-to-side rocking. It wouldn't allow for any "sliding" of the wheels, like you illustrate.

My more complicated design also involves the board for bike/trainer, and a frame. This time though, there would be a second bottom board, with the rocking motion between them, typical to how most designs are. I would use only pillow block bearings so it only rocks. I would then suspend the boards, attaching at the bottom board, to the frame. I thought about 4-point linkage (I notices my wife's glider ottoman uses that design) but I decided it would be limiting. I would just use a short steel cable, pulled out to the frame from the bottom board at perhaps a 35-45 degree angle. Gravity would bring the board back to the middle so no springs needed. This would allow side-to-side, front-to-back movement, including allowing the rear to move more than the front.

I haven't built either of these but I'm planning to build something soon.


--Chris
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Re: Anybody here built a rocker plate for their trainer? [mickison] [ In reply to ]
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Honestly don't know. Beside what you have found online so far there isn't much additional info out there that I'm aware of. I imagine it probably doesn't but you never know.
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Re: Anybody here built a rocker plate for their trainer? [mickison] [ In reply to ]
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I basically copied this video below bc I loved the idea of skateboard trucks as the flex/pivot points. I ordered a pair of longboard trucks for 9.99 on Amazon and bought wood/screws for ~$30, so ~$40 total and my time for my rocker plate.
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=BiVp4B5TU9Y




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Re: Anybody here built a rocker plate for their trainer? [mickison] [ In reply to ]
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I built one a month or two ago, it is ok. It was certainly not revolutionary. I am prob gonna do a ride or two without it to get a better comparison now that I am used to it. Building it was a fun project and I did not spend a ton of money so I don't have any regrets.

One thing that I do NOT like is the motion while standing. I found it easier to stand before the rocker. Now, when I stand, the bike tilts to the direction of my pedal stroke (i.e. on the down-stroke of my right leg, the bike rocks to the right). This feels like the opposite of what happens outside where you counter lean your bike on the down-stroke while standing. When seated, I have not noticed that effect.

Ultimately, the rocker motion is not the same as outside, but having some movement feels like an improvement over a rigid trainer.
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Re: Anybody here built a rocker plate for their trainer? [MattyK] [ In reply to ]
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Nice! ...is that drawn in Working Model?
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Re: Anybody here built a rocker plate for their trainer? [mickison] [ In reply to ]
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I'm always wondering if movement like that would have negative effect on longevity of Kick or Neo flywheel bearings, as well if it affect accuracy, after all flywheel will move like giant gyro.
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Re: Anybody here built a rocker plate for their trainer? [Koz] [ In reply to ]
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Koz wrote:
Nice! ...is that drawn in Working Model?
No idea. Shamelessly stolen from the internet (Wikipedia)

Another option for a high front pivot would be to mount the front forks to a pendulum hanging from a pivot suspended directly above it. (imagine hanging your front wheel from a hook supporting the rim.)
Or maybe pivot at the midpoint of the front axle.
Would have to investigate to see how this feels.
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Re: Anybody here built a rocker plate for their trainer? [mickison] [ In reply to ]
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Rocker plates don't have to be complicated to be valuable. I built something really fancy (I'm an engineer, so I don't do anything unless I have an excuse to overdo it :-)). But before I settled on something fancy, I had a simple platform with supports at the corners. then I put something in the middle so it would rock instead of bounce. It isn't like riding outside, but it is way better than nothing at all.

Good thread over on TrainerRoad, with posts like this one really summarizing: https://forum.trainerroad.com/...or-trainers/1981/103

-Mark Rebuck, http://www.markrebuck.com/
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Re: Anybody here built a rocker plate for their trainer? [velocomp] [ In reply to ]
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Cool, did you cut the plywood yourself or take it to a CNC shop?

velocomp wrote:
I was having some saddle sore issues from zwifting so much. I built a Rockr Plate about 2 weeks ago. And haven't had any problems since.


I ordered the DYI kit from SBR and found the board design on the Rockr Plate Facebook site. Actually created a template of the boards with holes pre-drilled and then transfered the template to the final boards so as not to make a mistake. 3/4 in. birch boards. Will probably coat the top with Truck bed liner paint or just some carpet/rubber matting.

The benefit of the DYI kit was all the HW was included, including the mounts for my Kickr. You could get it yourself and maybe save $50. I spent about $200 all in.

I thought I might lose some power on it, but that hasn't been the case at all. It is a little bit louder than before, but the carpet or coating should solve that part of it.

What's your CdA?
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Re: Anybody here built a rocker plate for their trainer? [sebo2000] [ In reply to ]
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sebo2000 wrote:
I'm always wondering if movement like that would have negative effect on longevity of Kick or Neo flywheel bearings, as well if it affect accuracy, after all flywheel will move like giant gyro.

Neo does not have a flywheel
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Re: Anybody here built a rocker plate for their trainer? [dgutstadt] [ In reply to ]
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dgutstadt wrote:
sebo2000 wrote:
I'm always wondering if movement like that would have negative effect on longevity of Kick or Neo flywheel bearings, as well if it affect accuracy, after all flywheel will move like giant gyro.

Neo does not have a flywheel

I wish more people paid attention to how well made and designed the Neo is compared to its competitors. People only see the couple of hundred dollar price difference to the KICKR and assume they’re essentially the same. They are not. There’s zero maintenance, zero calibration, zero moving parts, zero parts that wear, zero warming up, nothing.

2018 Races:
INJURED

Favorite Gear: Dimond Bikes | Desoto Sport | Hoka One One
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Re: Anybody here built a rocker plate for their trainer? [The GMAN] [ In reply to ]
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lack of need to calibrate is certainly nice but it's not like other trainers (kickr, hammer, elite direto, etc.) are junk.
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Re: Anybody here built a rocker plate for their trainer? [mickison] [ In reply to ]
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Never said they were junk. Other trainers just aren’t as good. The Neo is in a class all by itself.

2018 Races:
INJURED

Favorite Gear: Dimond Bikes | Desoto Sport | Hoka One One
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Re: Anybody here built a rocker plate for their trainer? [The GMAN] [ In reply to ]
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The GMAN wrote:
Never said they were junk. Other trainers just aren’t as good. The Neo is in a class all by itself.

"I wish more people paid attention to how well made and designed the Neo is compared to its competitors."

I'm not following your point then. Why do you think people are NOT paying attention to Neo quality and deciding the cost increase above some other trainers is not worth it?
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Re: Anybody here built a rocker plate for their trainer? [mickison] [ In reply to ]
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The Neo vs KICKR debate almost always comes down to people saying I’m not paying $200-$300 more for the Neo. The issue, at least with the vast majority of my discussions, is that people don’t really pay attention to why it costs 20% more and what are the long and short term benefits.

Example above. Dude makes reference to Neo’s flywheel having no clue it doesn’t use a flywheel. Tried to convince a friend last week to go with the Neo and to them is was only $1400 vs $1100. I know calibrations, warm ups, spin downs, and future maintenance and belt replacements are going to cause this person more than $300 worth of stress and agita.

2018 Races:
INJURED

Favorite Gear: Dimond Bikes | Desoto Sport | Hoka One One
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Re: Anybody here built a rocker plate for their trainer? [The GMAN] [ In reply to ]
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I can understand the the maintenance as with the kickr there is a belt to replace. I'm not seeing that calibration is a huge deal if it's just something needed on an infrequent basis. I get what your'e saying though if you're talking about the neo vs kickr. but it's more than a couple hundred dollars when you start talking about kickr core, tacx flux s, elite direto/zumo, etc.
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Re: Anybody here built a rocker plate for their trainer? [mickison] [ In reply to ]
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mickison wrote:
...... I get what your'e saying though if you're talking about the neo vs kickr. but it's more than a couple hundred dollars when you start talking about kickr core, tacx flux s, elite direto/zumo, etc.
I assume GMAN is refering to those comparing the Neo to the Cyclops Hammer and Wahoo Kickr and Elite Drivo which would be considered more equivalent, despite perhaps NOT being quite equivalent per GMANs argument.
In Europe the price difference between the above 4 trainers is very small. I think the Neo is typically about €1250 and the other 3 are typically about €200 cheaper. If you shop around you can often find the Neo cheaper than the the Kickr for example. I would only consider the Neo at the moment if I was thinking of spending in the region of €1k.
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Re: Anybody here built a rocker plate for their trainer? [The GMAN] [ In reply to ]
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The GMAN wrote:
The Neo vs KICKR debate almost always comes down to people saying I’m not paying $200-$300 more for the Neo. The issue, at least with the vast majority of my discussions, is that people don’t really pay attention to why it costs 20% more and what are the long and short term benefits.

Example above. Dude makes reference to Neo’s flywheel having no clue it doesn’t use a flywheel. Tried to convince a friend last week to go with the Neo and to them is was only $1400 vs $1100. I know calibrations, warm ups, spin downs, and future maintenance and belt replacements are going to cause this person more than $300 worth of stress and agita.

GMANT I had 2 kickrs (bought firs years back when NEO didn't even existed) and few months ago bought NEO (I love Made in Netherlands sticker and I like precision of it)

Do you have one? Because you sound like the one without clue about NEO ( Zero moving parts?) Are you sure there are no moving parts in NEO? What is that big heavy metal round plate with magnets on the inside, I call it flywheel, it is installed on some kind of bearing, that bearing depending on type, might or might not like wobble of the rocker.

The only part I do not like about NEO is that little $hitty fan installed for no reason inside, my will get clogged with dust for sure, having said that NEO is way above Kickr.
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Re: Anybody here built a rocker plate for their trainer? [trailerhouse] [ In reply to ]
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trailerhouse wrote:
Cool, did you cut the plywood yourself or take it to a CNC shop?

velocomp wrote:
I was having some saddle sore issues from zwifting so much. I built a Rockr Plate about 2 weeks ago. And haven't had any problems since.


I ordered the DYI kit from SBR and found the board design on the Rockr Plate Facebook site. Actually created a template of the boards with holes pre-drilled and then transfered the template to the final boards so as not to make a mistake. 3/4 in. birch boards. Will probably coat the top with Truck bed liner paint or just some carpet/rubber matting.

The benefit of the DYI kit was all the HW was included, including the mounts for my Kickr. You could get it yourself and maybe save $50. I spent about $200 all in.

I thought I might lose some power on it, but that hasn't been the case at all. It is a little bit louder than before, but the carpet or coating should solve that part of it.

I also want to know this. I'm thinking of getting the DIY kit, but I don't have the tools to do the boards.
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Re: Anybody here built a rocker plate for their trainer? [dgutstadt] [ In reply to ]
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dgutstadt wrote:
sebo2000 wrote:
I'm always wondering if movement like that would have negative effect on longevity of Kick or Neo flywheel bearings, as well if it affect accuracy, after all flywheel will move like giant gyro.


Neo does not have a flywheel


It does have heavy round metal plate with magnets attached to it I call it flywheel. Once you start rocking that plate left and right it might or it might not affect the bearing. I guess u r not an engineer....
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Re: Anybody here built a rocker plate for their trainer? [TulkasTri] [ In reply to ]
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TulkasTri wrote:
trailerhouse wrote:
Cool, did you cut the plywood yourself or take it to a CNC shop?

velocomp wrote:
I was having some saddle sore issues from zwifting so much. I built a Rockr Plate about 2 weeks ago. And haven't had any problems since.


I ordered the DYI kit from SBR and found the board design on the Rockr Plate Facebook site. Actually created a template of the boards with holes pre-drilled and then transfered the template to the final boards so as not to make a mistake. 3/4 in. birch boards. Will probably coat the top with Truck bed liner paint or just some carpet/rubber matting.

The benefit of the DYI kit was all the HW was included, including the mounts for my Kickr. You could get it yourself and maybe save $50. I spent about $200 all in.

I thought I might lose some power on it, but that hasn't been the case at all. It is a little bit louder than before, but the carpet or coating should solve that part of it.


I also want to know this. I'm thinking of getting the DIY kit, but I don't have the tools to do the boards.

You can probably rent the needed tools for $30-40 from someplace like Home Depot. You should be able to get by with a drill and a circular saw.

I spent less than $100 building mine.
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Re: Anybody here built a rocker plate for their trainer? [sebo2000] [ In reply to ]
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The no moving parts wasn’t to be taken 100% literal. Yes, it has a an electronic brake/motor that spins around with your pedal stroke. My point was that it has no physical transmission mechanism (like a belt or chain) to drive the trainer. So no hard or fast moving part to make it all work.

2018 Races:
INJURED

Favorite Gear: Dimond Bikes | Desoto Sport | Hoka One One
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Re: Anybody here built a rocker plate for their trainer? [The GMAN] [ In reply to ]
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RE: Neo / Neo2


The GMAN wrote:
There’s zero maintenance, zero calibration, zero moving parts, zero parts that wear, zero warming up, nothing.

There is maintenance, parts that move, and long term wear on the Neo trainer. It's a hell of a lot longer between servicing than other trainers due to design, but it's not a solid state device. It also technically has a flywheel.... The disc/plate used with the magnets glued on the inside has some solid weight to it.

Neo Maintenance: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=vjSenyBHPa0
A Neo that's done 53,000km: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=4OkjvguSvlE

Shane Miller - GPLama
Web | Twitter | Instagram | Facebook | Strava | YouTube
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Re: Anybody here built a rocker plate for their trainer? [TulkasTri] [ In reply to ]
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TulkasTri wrote:
trailerhouse wrote:
Cool, did you cut the plywood yourself or take it to a CNC shop?

velocomp wrote:
I was having some saddle sore issues from zwifting so much. I built a Rockr Plate about 2 weeks ago. And haven't had any problems since.


I ordered the DYI kit from SBR and found the board design on the Rockr Plate Facebook site. Actually created a template of the boards with holes pre-drilled and then transfered the template to the final boards so as not to make a mistake. 3/4 in. birch boards. Will probably coat the top with Truck bed liner paint or just some carpet/rubber matting.

The benefit of the DYI kit was all the HW was included, including the mounts for my Kickr. You could get it yourself and maybe save $50. I spent about $200 all in.

I thought I might lose some power on it, but that hasn't been the case at all. It is a little bit louder than before, but the carpet or coating should solve that part of it.


I also want to know this. I'm thinking of getting the DIY kit, but I don't have the tools to do the boards.

I cut the wood myself. Created a template of thin wood first, Drilled all holes and assembled to confirm everything was right. Then used the template on top of final wood to draw the shape. Then used jigsaw to cut. Sanded the edges and then put the thing together.
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Re: Anybody here built a rocker plate for their trainer? [velocomp] [ In reply to ]
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Same for me.. 2 pieces of 2x x 4’ birch from Lowes... drew a template around the kickr and used a jigsaw to cut it out. Routered the edges (not necessary) and sanded it. Ordered the pillow block bearings and shaft from Zoro.com. Got a couple of small yoga balls from amazon. Maybe cost $100.
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Re: Anybody here built a rocker plate for their trainer? [MattyK] [ In reply to ]
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MattyK wrote:
Koz wrote:
Nice! ...is that drawn in Working Model?
No idea. Shamelessly stolen from the internet (Wikipedia)

Another option for a high front pivot would be to mount the front forks to a pendulum hanging from a pivot suspended directly above it. (imagine hanging your front wheel from a hook supporting the rim.)
Or maybe pivot at the midpoint of the front axle.
Would have to investigate to see how this feels.

I came to see if anyone had previously described my rocker plate mods, and when reading the thread wondered if what was desired was an overhead swing system where the plate the bike / trainer sits on is suspended off the floor.

Anyway, re moving the front wheel independent of the back, my idea is to use the bearing system of a lazy susan, so on standing efforts I can work on keeping the front wheel straight vs my trainers' block firmly holding it in one orientation. I've got the device but confess I haven't tried it yet

To breathe, to feel, to know I'm alive.
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Re: Anybody here built a rocker plate for their trainer? [Tsunami] [ In reply to ]
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Tsunami wrote:
I came to see if anyone had previously described my rocker plate mods, and when reading the thread wondered if what was desired was an overhead swing system where the plate the bike / trainer sits on is suspended off the floor.

Imagine mounting your trainer on this:

It shouldn't fall over because the pivot is above the centre of gravity, but I'm not sure it wouldn't feel really weird.

Quote:
Anyway, re moving the front wheel independent of the back, my idea is to use the bearing system of a lazy susan, so on standing efforts I can work on keeping the front wheel straight vs my trainers' block firmly holding it in one orientation. I've got the device but confess I haven't tried it yet

That might do something (interested to hear your results), but I'm not sure what that something would be, unless there is a feedback system between the steering angle and the leaning process.

I've come to the current conclusion that the most realistic thing to do (I mentioned on page 1) would be to support the front wheel on a motorised roller. And the back end (trainer) on a single balljoint at about ground level. That way leaning and steering should be reasonably natural. With careful setup it may be possible to make it reasonably stable/self-centering/less likely to fall off than a set of rollers). But I'm working in theory only. Getting me on a trainer is hard enough as it is...
Last edited by: MattyK: Jan 28, 19 16:52
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Re: Anybody here built a rocker plate for their trainer? [MattyK] [ In reply to ]
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Yep, there you go.

Oh, and I tried the lazy susan out. Not bad...

To breathe, to feel, to know I'm alive.
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Re: Anybody here built a rocker plate for their trainer? [velocomp] [ In reply to ]
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I just finished one myself based on a couple of designs I saw on the Facebook Rocker Plate Forum.

Just to give credit where it is due, here's a link to the forum, and I'm not posting pictures of mine, but rather the ideas that I took from 'Martin SSpeed' and 'McGwire' Forum users. Here's their two inspirations:

Martin SSpeed used pillow bearings, inflatables on either side to balance and fixed cups to hold the trainer in, and the unit is only built to the size of the trainer.
- I liked that it's not a full size unit (less parts = less cost). It can be constructed from two 2'x4' pieces of plywood.


-The idea of Pillow bearings is cool, but man that get's expensive fast! It costs around $10-$12 a pillow bearing (from princessauto.com) of which you need four of them. Next, you need a rod to run through the pillow bearing and that costs about $30 for an 8 foot pole. And let's not forget nuts bolts and washers and that all seem to cost about $1 each at home depot.




The McGwire board was different in that it didn't rely upon pillow bearings, but rather vibration dampeners. A two pack costs $20 and it's all you need to support you and the trainer (it has a load capacity of 2220lbs).


So, I decided to make a hybrid of the two. Smaller unit that uses vibration dampeners. Instead of inflatable balls on either side, I stuck with beginner tennis balls (orange dot and green dot) with different levels of squishiness that I stole from my kid (he's in a tennis academy).

This is my version 1.0. with 1/2" plywood. I'll likely make another version out of 3/4" plywood and make the cuts/holes nicer. The movement seems pretty good, but the improvement in comfort hasn't quite been as dramatic as some have reported. I'll likely do more research on what others are doing differently.



Last edited by: beston: Jan 27, 19 16:38
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Re: Anybody here built a rocker plate for their trainer? [beston] [ In reply to ]
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My first guess is the vibration dampeners work "too well". But obviously I don't know. Finally decided I want to build something like this so I'll be keeping an eye out for these threads and the FB group.
Thanks for sharing.
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Re: Anybody here built a rocker plate for their trainer? [Chan] [ In reply to ]
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While I can't exclude that the vibration dampeners are worse than the pillow bearing approach, I get a lot of side to side movement/flex with the dampeners (so I don't think it's the difference between pillow bearings vs. dampeners).

Even with the dampeners, I still have to use some kind ball/cushion on the side to help stabilize the rocker. I've been using tennis balls (three per side), and I suppose I could mess around with how many I use to see if I can't get a better 'feel' with fewer balls on either side
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Re: Anybody here built a rocker plate for their trainer? [beston] [ In reply to ]
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Maybe this is not an issue for much of the readership here, but I'll share this. Love the minimalist idea of a plate that is only as big as needed for the trainer. However, as a person of shorter stature, I think I'd have a challenging time getting on / off my bike without the full length board under it. The trainer already puts it a couple inches higher. The trainer plus rocker would add, what, 6 inches to the hight needed to clear the saddle?

To breathe, to feel, to know I'm alive.
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Re: Anybody here built a rocker plate for their trainer? [beston] [ In reply to ]
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So just to add to the conversation and with the caveat that today is the very first day of my research.

I've noticed there's a huge difference in the dampening capabilities of the dampener. From say 10lbs to hundreds of lbs. I've seen several builds with dampeners from different sources so I'm hoping to understand more how much force different people's completed builds dampen. I know there's more than one measurement. I think one is static and one is shear force.

Anyways I understand that's not your issue but this may help anybody as uninitiated as me.
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Re: Anybody here built a rocker plate for their trainer? [Tsunami] [ In reply to ]
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Full length boards are cool, but I'm not sure a full length board would be much help for a shorter person. I've always just clipped in with my left foot and swung my right foot over. No need to straddle the bike before clipping in.
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Re: Anybody here built a rocker plate for their trainer? [beston] [ In reply to ]
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That is my technique as well. Trainer or not, I mount the bike pretty much the same way. fwiw, i measure a scant 66"

My YouTubes

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Re: Anybody here built a rocker plate for their trainer? [Tsunami] [ In reply to ]
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I use a 5 gallon bucket turned upside down as a step stool for getting on/off. Takes a little bit of practice, but works great.
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Re: Anybody here built a rocker plate for their trainer? [Tsunami] [ In reply to ]
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I think I'd rather keep the rocker itself minimal. Less rocker inertia definitely seems preferable to me. Plus I'd prefer less bulk. I also think a stationary platform is going to be a better for mounting. Why not just make up a little step? A standalone step is simple, all you would need but you could attach it to the rocker base if you wanted to ensure it doesn't move. Surely that's a better solution than a big, heavy, unnecessary platform?
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Re: Anybody here built a rocker plate for their trainer? [Tsunami] [ In reply to ]
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Just mount your steed like one of the knights of Ni! /pink.
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Re: Anybody here built a rocker plate for their trainer? [Chan] [ In reply to ]
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Chan wrote:
So just to add to the conversation and with the caveat that today is the very first day of my research.
I've noticed there's a huge difference in the dampening capabilities of the dampener. From say 10lbs to hundreds of lbs. I've seen several builds with dampeners from different sources so I'm hoping to understand more how much force different people's completed builds dampen. I know there's more than one measurement. I think one is static and one is shear force.

Anyways I understand that's not your issue but this may help anybody as uninitiated as me.

I've seen the differences in load capacity and deflection too. When I saw the dampeners in person, some of that made sense as the <100lb capacity dampeners were very small (like an inch high).

The one that I bought has a relatively huge load capacity (2200lbs) and what I thought was lower deflection. (link here). I thought it would be too stiff, but I don't think that's the case since the board easily deflects laterally, so much so that I need some kind of cushion out on either side to keep the unit centred (not tipping over) while riding (I've just used tennis balls as my cushion).
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Re: Anybody here built a rocker plate for their trainer? [Tsunami] [ In reply to ]
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The height difference is more like 3 inches rather than 6 (2x12mm plywood sheets+2 inches of spacing between the boards) but you do need to consider your weight is also a big factor in rocker plate design.

The less a rider weighs the lower the design tolerances are for a rocker. In effect the more mass you are throwing around on the bike the less details like the floor being level, the trainer being counter balanced and/or the location of the inflatable balls being spot on matters. As rider mass decreases the forces created by your movements on the bike decrease as total fraction of the system and your room for error drops significantly.

If you are vertically challenged I am going to guess you are on the lower end of the mass spectrum and that means you need to take extra care with rocker plates.
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Re: Anybody here built a rocker plate for their trainer? [Tsunami] [ In reply to ]
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Tsunami,

For my home-made rocker, I purchased two of these multi-purpose folding mats: I use one under the front wheel riser block and another one as a step-stool. Folding the mat in half works great and is the ideal height.

@Kid
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Re: Anybody here built a rocker plate for their trainer? [mickison] [ In reply to ]
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I recently built one and it has made my rides more comfortable for sure. I went with the minimalist approach.

I used 4 vibration mounts and two racquetballs. I like the racquetballs the best as they "give" more than other balls I tried. Plus, they are small enough that they work without cutting holes in the wood (one less thing to do).

https://www.amazon.com/gp/product/B00DNF8ZGK/ref=ppx_yo_dt_b_asin_title_o00__o00_s00?ie=UTF8&psc=1
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Re: Anybody here built a rocker plate for their trainer? [scott8888] [ In reply to ]
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Hi folks, thanks for all the responses. The Wahoo Snap holds my bike with 700 cc wheels, 1.5 inches off the ground. The SBR Rockr I purchased is 3.5 inches tall, for a total stack of 5" which indeed would be significant if I had to clear the saddle from the floor. The bike, on an unstable platform and the trainer was initially held on with velcro straps, is in a tight spot in a bedroom so yes, I do straddle it on the platform vs stepping on the pedal for extra height. Goal is to not gauge the wall with my cleat. Now that I have the Snap secured with eye hooks screwed into the platform and hose clamps around the base bars and through the eye hooks, I could probably do the pedal step and over thing.

To breathe, to feel, to know I'm alive.
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Re: Anybody here built a rocker plate for their trainer? [beston] [ In reply to ]
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beston wrote:
While I can't exclude that the vibration dampeners are worse than the pillow bearing approach, I get a lot of side to side movement/flex with the dampeners (so I don't think it's the difference between pillow bearings vs. dampeners).

Even with the dampeners, I still have to use some kind ball/cushion on the side to help stabilize the rocker. I've been using tennis balls (three per side), and I suppose I could mess around with how many I use to see if I can't get a better 'feel' with fewer balls on either side

I've been wanting to build a DIY rocker plate, and leaning toward the vibration dampeners route. Now that you've had some time on yours how do you like it?

What I like about the dampeners idea versus pillow bearings is the possibility of having a slight amount of fore/aft motion and (maybe?) a bit of up and down dampening – do you notice any fore/aft and up/down give to your rocker?

Part of why I ask is because I noticed SRB is now making a simpler and less expensive Rocker Pod Lite ($150) that doesn't use dampeners or pillow block bearings. Seems like a simple, solid option but I imagine having some additional motion and dampening would make indoor riding all that much better.
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Re: Anybody here built a rocker plate for their trainer? [Northy] [ In reply to ]
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I have been using the rocker for about a month now and I think there is some benefit to using it. I don't get numb nuts quite as quickly and I like the side to side sway of the bike. Occasionally, I will take short breaks on the trainer after about an hour or so, but I don't need the breaks as much as I used to.

I live close to an Ikea and I picked up a scrap piece of desk-top (literally, the top of an ikea desk) for $20 and I created a full length rocker. I now use 4 dampeners ($40) and 4 green dot tennis balls ($10), Ikea top ($20), plywood base ($25), and hardware (nuts, bolts, washers, feet, $30). So, I've spent $125 on the Rocker. I wouldn't say I've saved all that much over buying it from SBR.

I might switch up to inflatable cushions as it could make it easier to correct for slight out of level issues when I'm on the bike (the trainer isn't perfectly balanced L/R).

As for forward and back movement. I noticed MORE back and forward movement with only two dampeners at the rear, and I didn't like it! The motion was too jerky and not a smooth swaying motion. While I do feel some movement forward/back with 4 dampeners, it is less jerky than before (I like it better). YMMV.

I have seen some (on the facebook rocker plate forum) use pillow bearings, rods, and springs to create for fore/aft movement. I imagine that's the route you'd want to go






bottom image is inverted 180˚(?)
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Re: Anybody here built a rocker plate for their trainer? [Northy] [ In reply to ]
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Northy wrote:
beston wrote:
noticed SRB is now making a simpler and less expensive Rocker Pod Lite ($150) that doesn't use dampeners or pillow block bearings. Seems like a simple, solid option but I imagine having some additional motion and dampening would make indoor riding all that much better.


That certainly seems to be a much more economic option, $150 vs $375-500.

Has anyone tried the Rocker Pad Lite? The price difference is huge. Do you get what you pay for or are they just overpriced?

I’m not about to build my own. I would like to see the pros and cons of the cheaper model.[/reply]
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Re: Anybody here built a rocker plate for their trainer? [velocomp] [ In reply to ]
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I've been looking for this template - do you still have it and/or can you post its location?
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