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Russians assassinating people overseas - UK again
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https://www.theguardian.com/...d-on-salisbury-visit

First we have litvenyenko with pollonium and a trail all over London on to a BA flight back to Moscow

This time they used a nerve agent and I think 21 people are in hospital

It is almost unbelievable, but then you think it's russia so perhaps not
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Re: Russians assassinating people overseas - UK again [Andrewmc] [ In reply to ]
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Andrewmc wrote:
https://www.theguardian.com/uk-news/2018/mar/09/skripals-condition-still-serious-says-amber-rudd-on-salisbury-visit
First we have litvenyenko with pollonium and a trail all over London on to a BA flight back to Moscow
This time they used a nerve agent and I think 21 people are in hospital
It is almost unbelievable, but then you think it's russia so perhaps not

Fake News. False flag operation by liberals to discredit Russia. Take the Red Pill and see the truth.
Its a well established fact Russia loves western Democracies. So much so, that it actively participates in their elections.

Remember - It's important to be comfortable in your own skin... because it turns out society frowns on wearing other people's
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Re: Russians assassinating people overseas - UK again [Andrewmc] [ In reply to ]
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Andrewmc wrote:
https://www.theguardian.com/uk-news/2018/mar/09/skripals-condition-still-serious-says-amber-rudd-on-salisbury-visit

First we have litvenyenko with pollonium and a trail all over London on to a BA flight back to Moscow

This time they used a nerve agent and I think 21 people are in hospital

It is almost unbelievable, but then you think it's russia so perhaps not

How do we know it was the Russians.
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Re: Russians assassinating people overseas - UK again [Andrewmc] [ In reply to ]
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Andrewmc wrote:
https://www.theguardian.com/uk-news/2018/mar/09/skripals-condition-still-serious-says-amber-rudd-on-salisbury-visit

First we have litvenyenko with pollonium and a trail all over London on to a BA flight back to Moscow

This time they used a nerve agent and I think 21 people are in hospital

It is almost unbelievable, but then you think it's russia so perhaps not

Saw a blurb this morning about boycotting the World Cup. Pisses me off to no end that it was awarded to Russia.
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Re: Russians assassinating people overseas - UK again [Uncle Arqyle] [ In reply to ]
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Uncle Arqyle wrote:
Saw a blurb this morning about boycotting the World Cup. Pisses me off to no end that it was awarded to Russia.

Once again, the US has to lead by example. We've been planning to boycott the World Cup since last fall!

"The right to party is a battle we have fought, but we'll surrender and go Amish... NOT!" -Wayne Campbell
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Re: Russians assassinating people overseas - UK again [Uncle Arqyle] [ In reply to ]
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Quote:
Pisses me off to no end that it was awarded to Russia.

Me too. This is bullshit. Let's boycott!!
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Re: Russians assassinating people overseas - UK again [Guffaw] [ In reply to ]
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Guffaw wrote:
Andrewmc wrote:
https://www.theguardian.com/uk-news/2018/mar/09/skripals-condition-still-serious-says-amber-rudd-on-salisbury-visit
First we have litvenyenko with pollonium and a trail all over London on to a BA flight back to Moscow
This time they used a nerve agent and I think 21 people are in hospital
It is almost unbelievable, but then you think it's russia so perhaps not


Fake News. False flag operation by liberals to discredit Russia. Take the Red Pill and see the truth.
Its a well established fact Russia loves western Democracies. So much so, that it actively participates in their elections.

FTW!
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Re: Russians assassinating people overseas - UK again [Andrewmc] [ In reply to ]
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Don't worry, Trump will work out a deal with Putin to build a special task force to protect the world against future assassins.
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Re: Russians assassinating people overseas - UK again [burnman] [ In reply to ]
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burnman wrote:
Uncle Arqyle wrote:
Saw a blurb this morning about boycotting the World Cup. Pisses me off to no end that it was awarded to Russia.


Once again, the US has to lead by example. We've been planning to boycott the World Cup since last fall!



"I think I've cracked the code. double letters are cheaters except for perfect squares (a, d, i, p and y). So Leddy isn't a cheater... "
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Re: Russians assassinating people overseas - UK again [burnman] [ In reply to ]
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burnman wrote:
Uncle Arqyle wrote:
Saw a blurb this morning about boycotting the World Cup. Pisses me off to no end that it was awarded to Russia.


Once again, the US has to lead by example. We've been planning to boycott the World Cup since last fall!

Yes, you have and you've done a great job of executing that strategy. Its really hard to lose to teams like Panama but you pulled it off!
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Re: Russians assassinating people overseas - UK again [Uncle Arqyle] [ In reply to ]
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Saw a blurb this morning about boycotting the World Cup.

Can you imagine how that would go over in England?

If the country boycotted the World Cup in Russia because a few Russians were killed in London there would be riots in the street.

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Re: Russians assassinating people overseas - UK again [Andrewmc] [ In reply to ]
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"I do respect him. Well, I respect a lot of people, but that doesn't mean I'll get along with them," Trump told O'Reilly.

O'Reilly pressed on, declaring to the president that "Putin is a killer."

Unfazed, Trump didn't back away, but rather compared Putin's reputation for extrajudicial killings with the United States'.


"There are a lot of killers. We have a lot of killers," Trump said. "Well, you think our country is so innocent?"

“Read the transcript.”
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Re: Russians assassinating people overseas - UK again [cerveloguy] [ In reply to ]
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cerveloguy wrote:
Andrewmc wrote:
https://www.theguardian.com/uk-news/2018/mar/09/skripals-condition-still-serious-says-amber-rudd-on-salisbury-visit

First we have litvenyenko with pollonium and a trail all over London on to a BA flight back to Moscow

This time they used a nerve agent and I think 21 people are in hospital

It is almost unbelievable, but then you think it's russia so perhaps not


How do we know it was the Russians.
Then perhaps the Soviets?

--------------------------
The secret of a long life is you try not to shorten it.
-Nobody
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Re: Russians assassinating people overseas - UK again [mck414] [ In reply to ]
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mck414 wrote:
cerveloguy wrote:
Andrewmc wrote:
https://www.theguardian.com/uk-news/2018/mar/09/skripals-condition-still-serious-says-amber-rudd-on-salisbury-visit


First we have litvenyenko with pollonium and a trail all over London on to a BA flight back to Moscow

This time they used a nerve agent and I think 21 people are in hospital

It is almost unbelievable, but then you think it's russia so perhaps not


How do we know it was the Russians.

Then perhaps the Soviets?


It could be Russia, but it could also be China. It could also be lots of other people. It also could be somebody sitting on their bed that weighs 400 pounds.
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Re: Russians assassinating people overseas - UK again [Andrewmc] [ In reply to ]
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Why did whoever it was go the the lengths of using nerve agent? If the Russians wanted him dead (not clear that they particularly did) why not use a less dramatic method, but then they did appear to use polonium last time, so they have form on unconventional methods.

Cui bono?
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Re: Russians assassinating people overseas - UK again [Nobbie] [ In reply to ]
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Yes, it was the Russians. It had to be as dramatic and viable as possible because Putin was sending a message. Snitches get stiches. And their families too. Russias political methods are now virtually indistinguishable from those of the mafia, with Putin as the Capo di Capi.

Nobbie wrote:
Why did whoever it was go the the lengths of using nerve agent? If the Russians wanted him dead (not clear that they particularly did) why not use a less dramatic method, but then they did appear to use polonium last time, so they have form on unconventional methods.
Cui bono?

Remember - It's important to be comfortable in your own skin... because it turns out society frowns on wearing other people's
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Re: Russians assassinating people overseas - UK again [Andrewmc] [ In reply to ]
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Anyone remember what happened to the main opposition leader to Putin 3 years ago? Murdered right in front of the Kremlin. I think Putin hired OJ to find the real killer.

Really, I really don't think anything is off the table to keep Putin in power.
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Re: Russians assassinating people overseas - UK again [Andrewmc] [ In reply to ]
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Time for the UK to decide - does it want the South East to continue to be Putin's hunting ground or say no to billions of Russian wealth parked in London real estate? They've turned a bling eye to 14 suspicious Russian deaths already but maybe this tips the balance. I'm intrigued why Putin made such a spectacle out of this one but I guess you don't know you've completely cowed a country until you rub murder in their face and get away with it.



"Are you sure we're going fast enough?" - Emil Zatopek
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Re: Russians assassinating people overseas - UK again [Bretom] [ In reply to ]
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We're going to be really cross if they do it again
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Re: Russians assassinating people overseas - UK again [Andrewmc] [ In reply to ]
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I suspect we have a cunning plan



"Are you sure we're going fast enough?" - Emil Zatopek
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Re: Russians assassinating people overseas - UK again [Bretom] [ In reply to ]
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We told them to stop and if they do it again we will tell them to stop again.........
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Re: Russians assassinating people overseas - UK again [Andrewmc] [ In reply to ]
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There are a lot of killers. We have a lot of killers. You think our country is so innocent?

The devil made me do it the first time, second time I done it on my own - W
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Re: Russians assassinating people overseas - UK again [Bretom] [ In reply to ]
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Bretom wrote:
I suspect we have a cunning plan

Baldrick, it's the worst plan since Abraham Lincoln said "Oh I'm sick of kicking around the house tonight, let's go take in a show!"
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Re: Russians assassinating people overseas - UK again [Andrewmc] [ In reply to ]
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No worries, the US has fully condemned it. We just aren't sure who we are condemning.


“We’ve been monitoring the incident closely, take it very seriously,” Sanders said. “The use of a highly lethal nerve agent against U.K. citizens on U.K. soil is an outrage. The attack was reckless, indiscriminate and irresponsible. We offer the fullest condemnation.”



“So you’re not saying that Russia was behind this?” a reporter asked.



“Right now, we are standing with our U.K. ally,” Sanders said again. “I think they’re still working through even some of the details of that.”



Pressed a third time, an annoyed Sanders answered, “Like I just said, we stand with our ally and we certainly fully support them and are ready if we can be of any assistance.”

This has to be intentional trolling at this point right? Trump has to just be fucking with us on Russia, right?

I'm beginning to think that we are much more fucked than I thought.
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Re: Russians assassinating people overseas - UK again [j p o] [ In reply to ]
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j p o wrote:
No worries, the US has fully condemned it. We just aren't sure who we are condemning.


“We’ve been monitoring the incident closely, take it very seriously,” Sanders said. “The use of a highly lethal nerve agent against U.K. citizens on U.K. soil is an outrage. The attack was reckless, indiscriminate and irresponsible. We offer the fullest condemnation.”



“So you’re not saying that Russia was behind this?” a reporter asked.



“Right now, we are standing with our U.K. ally,” Sanders said again. “I think they’re still working through even some of the details of that.”



Pressed a third time, an annoyed Sanders answered, “Like I just said, we stand with our ally and we certainly fully support them and are ready if we can be of any assistance.”

This has to be intentional trolling at this point right? Trump has to just be fucking with us on Russia, right?

Actually I think that is the exact thing that should be said. Stand with your ally and whatever they decide to do and to whom. It didn't happen to the US so why should they be accusing countries.
Mark
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Re: Russians assassinating people overseas - UK again [M~] [ In reply to ]
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M~ wrote:
j p o wrote:
No worries, the US has fully condemned it. We just aren't sure who we are condemning.


“We’ve been monitoring the incident closely, take it very seriously,” Sanders said. “The use of a highly lethal nerve agent against U.K. citizens on U.K. soil is an outrage. The attack was reckless, indiscriminate and irresponsible. We offer the fullest condemnation.”



“So you’re not saying that Russia was behind this?” a reporter asked.



“Right now, we are standing with our U.K. ally,” Sanders said again. “I think they’re still working through even some of the details of that.”



Pressed a third time, an annoyed Sanders answered, “Like I just said, we stand with our ally and we certainly fully support them and are ready if we can be of any assistance.”

This has to be intentional trolling at this point right? Trump has to just be fucking with us on Russia, right?


Actually I think that is the exact thing that should be said. Stand with your ally and whatever they decide to do and to whom. It didn't happen to the US so why should they be accusing countries.
Mark

UK has said Russia did it. Why should we be so reluctant to agree?

I'm beginning to think that we are much more fucked than I thought.
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Re: Russians assassinating people overseas - UK again [j p o] [ In reply to ]
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j p o wrote:
M~ wrote:
j p o wrote:
No worries, the US has fully condemned it. We just aren't sure who we are condemning.


“We’ve been monitoring the incident closely, take it very seriously,” Sanders said. “The use of a highly lethal nerve agent against U.K. citizens on U.K. soil is an outrage. The attack was reckless, indiscriminate and irresponsible. We offer the fullest condemnation.”



“So you’re not saying that Russia was behind this?” a reporter asked.



“Right now, we are standing with our U.K. ally,” Sanders said again. “I think they’re still working through even some of the details of that.”



Pressed a third time, an annoyed Sanders answered, “Like I just said, we stand with our ally and we certainly fully support them and are ready if we can be of any assistance.”

This has to be intentional trolling at this point right? Trump has to just be fucking with us on Russia, right?


Actually I think that is the exact thing that should be said. Stand with your ally and whatever they decide to do and to whom. It didn't happen to the US so why should they be accusing countries.
Mark


UK has said Russia did it. Why should we be so reluctant to agree?


I'm assuming its because we are going off of whatever the UK says. It wasn't our investigators, our scientists testing the nerve agent, is the UK even sharing the evidence with us? We can't point a finger but only can say we believe and trust our friend.

Also I recall May basically saying either Russia did it or they have no control over their highly secure military labs who make/store this stuff.

It will be interesting how the UK acts, not only did they go after someone on UK soil, but the nerve agent hurt a UK citizen & police officer and also risked injuring a lot of innocent bystanders (other UK citizens).
Last edited by: AndysStrongAle: Mar 13, 18 7:30
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Re: Russians assassinating people overseas - UK again [j p o] [ In reply to ]
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j p o wrote:
M~ wrote:
j p o wrote:
No worries, the US has fully condemned it. We just aren't sure who we are condemning.


“We’ve been monitoring the incident closely, take it very seriously,” Sanders said. “The use of a highly lethal nerve agent against U.K. citizens on U.K. soil is an outrage. The attack was reckless, indiscriminate and irresponsible. We offer the fullest condemnation.”



“So you’re not saying that Russia was behind this?” a reporter asked.



“Right now, we are standing with our U.K. ally,” Sanders said again. “I think they’re still working through even some of the details of that.”



Pressed a third time, an annoyed Sanders answered, “Like I just said, we stand with our ally and we certainly fully support them and are ready if we can be of any assistance.”

This has to be intentional trolling at this point right? Trump has to just be fucking with us on Russia, right?


Actually I think that is the exact thing that should be said. Stand with your ally and whatever they decide to do and to whom. It didn't happen to the US so why should they be accusing countries.
Mark


UK has said Russia did it. Why should we be so reluctant to agree?

In this circumstance I think it is the smart move to simply support your ally instead of accusing someone outright. Makes you look better on the world front which is why I think someone other than Trump made this call.
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Re: Russians assassinating people overseas - UK again [j p o] [ In reply to ]
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j p o wrote:
M~ wrote:
j p o wrote:
No worries, the US has fully condemned it. We just aren't sure who we are condemning.


“We’ve been monitoring the incident closely, take it very seriously,” Sanders said. “The use of a highly lethal nerve agent against U.K. citizens on U.K. soil is an outrage. The attack was reckless, indiscriminate and irresponsible. We offer the fullest condemnation.”



“So you’re not saying that Russia was behind this?” a reporter asked.



“Right now, we are standing with our U.K. ally,” Sanders said again. “I think they’re still working through even some of the details of that.”



Pressed a third time, an annoyed Sanders answered, “Like I just said, we stand with our ally and we certainly fully support them and are ready if we can be of any assistance.”

This has to be intentional trolling at this point right? Trump has to just be fucking with us on Russia, right?


Actually I think that is the exact thing that should be said. Stand with your ally and whatever they decide to do and to whom. It didn't happen to the US so why should they be accusing countries.
Mark


UK has said Russia did it. Why should we be so reluctant to agree?

Trump now basically agreeing with the UK, sorta:

The president went on: “It sounds to me like [the British] believe it would be Russia and I would certainly take that finding as fact. As soon as we get the facts straight, if we agree with them, we will condemn Russia or whoever it may be.”

https://www.thedailybeast.com/...-poisoned-former-spy
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Re: Russians assassinating people overseas - UK again [Kay Serrar] [ In reply to ]
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Kay Serrar wrote:

Trump now basically agreeing with the UK, sorta:

The president went on: “It sounds to me like [the British] believe it would be Russia and I would certainly take that finding as fact. As soon as we get the facts straight, if we agree with them, we will condemn Russia or whoever it may be.”

When it comes to immigration or executing drug dealers he speaks like the ultimate Alpha Male. As soon as the subject of Russia comes up he turns into a dithering school boy.
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Re: Russians assassinating people overseas - UK again [trail] [ In reply to ]
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trail wrote:
Kay Serrar wrote:

Trump now basically agreeing with the UK, sorta:

The president went on: “It sounds to me like [the British] believe it would be Russia and I would certainly take that finding as fact. As soon as we get the facts straight, if we agree with them, we will condemn Russia or whoever it may be.”

When it comes to immigration or executing drug dealers he speaks like the ultimate Alpha Male. As soon as the subject of Russia comes up he turns into a dithering school boy.

Pee tape

===============
Proud member of the MSF (Maple Syrup Mafia)
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Re: Russians assassinating people overseas - UK again [j p o] [ In reply to ]
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j p o wrote:
UK has said Russia did it. Why should we be so reluctant to agree?

we've had 2 years of this. occam's razor. time to admit the obvious.

Dan Empfield
aka Slowman
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Re: Russians assassinating people overseas - UK again [trail] [ In reply to ]
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When it comes to immigration or executing drug dealers he speaks like the ultimate Alpha Male. As soon as the subject of Russia comes up he turns into a dithering school boy.

Trump is always the first to make accusations when it involves things like bombings. He has no problem making accusations about terrorism or the involvement of Muslims. But as soon as Russia's involved, he suddenly proceeds with caution.



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Re: Russians assassinating people overseas - UK again [AndysStrongAle] [ In reply to ]
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duh duh dum dum dum,
another one bites the dust

https://www.theguardian.com/uk-news/2018/mar/13/russian-exile-nikolai-glushkov-found-dead-at-his-london-home?CMP=fb_gu



"Are you sure we're going fast enough?" - Emil Zatopek
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Re: Russians assassinating people overseas - UK again [Arch Stanton] [ In reply to ]
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"Am I jumping the gun, Baldrick, or are the words 'I have a cunning plan' marching with ill-deserved confidence in the direction of this conversation?"
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Re: Russians assassinating people overseas - UK again [Bretom] [ In reply to ]
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Thanks, Obama!
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Re: Russians assassinating people overseas - UK again [j p o] [ In reply to ]
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the russians got another one.

serious question. which country do you think would be less safe for a russian exile? the UK or the US? (the US under trump, i mean.)

Dan Empfield
aka Slowman
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Re: Russians assassinating people overseas - UK again [HoustonTri(er)] [ In reply to ]
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HoustonTri(er) wrote:
"Am I jumping the gun, Baldrick, or are the words 'I have a cunning plan' marching with ill-deserved confidence in the direction of this conversation?"






"Are you sure we're going fast enough?" - Emil Zatopek
Last edited by: Bretom: Mar 13, 18 14:32
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Re: Russians assassinating people overseas - UK again [Slowman] [ In reply to ]
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Turns out being a Russian double agent in the tied to UK Intelligence and/or politically opposing Putin is a dangerous business. Who would've thought?

Why this is all about Trump alludes me particularly given the long and growing list of opportunities to call him out. Anyways, carry on.

https://www.politico.eu/...ump-and-theresa-may/


U.S. President Donald Trump and U.K. Prime Minister Theresa May | Thomas Lohnes/Getty Images
Russia ‘must provide unambiguous answers’ about attack on ex-spy, say Trump and May
Russian officials have called on the UK to share case materials in response.
By CRISTIANO LIMA
3/13/18, 8:03 PM CET
President Donald Trump and Theresa May of Britain say that Russian officials “must provide unambiguous answers” about the attempted murder of a former spy in southern England, according to a White House readout of a call between the two leaders released on Tuesday.
The White House said that Trump expressed his “solidarity” with May during a call on Tuesday and that he vowed “to provide any assistance the United Kingdom requests for its investigation” of the nerve agent attack on Sergei Skripal, a former Russian spy, and his daughter that took place in Salisbury last week.
Last edited by: JD21: Mar 13, 18 14:41
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Re: Russians assassinating people overseas - UK again [JD21] [ In reply to ]
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JD21 wrote:
Turns out being a Russian double agent in the tied to UK Intelligence and/or politically opposing Putin is a dangerous business. Who would've thought?

Why this is all about Trump alludes me particularly given the long and growing list of opportunities to call him out. Anyways, carry on.

you're kind of glib about folks getting murdered. as if russia has a right to come to another country and murder its citizens or residents. but, to your point, the reason it's - again - about trump:

if you're aren't bothered by the fact that trump has - in one year! - singlehandedly wrecked the reputation of mainstream christianity in america, and revealed it as a fraud, okay. maybe that's not a concern of yours. fine.

if turning every country in the world against the U.S. is not a thing that bothers you, fine.

if his incessant tearing at the fabric of our governmental processes is cool by you, fine.

if a president who, as opposed to george washington, cannot tell the truth is groovy, okay.

if it's too cool for school that trump is systematically tearing down every bit of environmental protection, while a science denier, and by hiring for his cabinet science deniers, okay.

and i could go on for 3 pages. you get the point.

the reason it's a big deal here is that trump, by himself, has decided that russia is his political ally, and there are barrellfuls of evidence to support this. and, no, U.S. forces killing russian mercenaries is not evidence to rebut that because the U.S. forces were attacked, and defended themselves, as i understand it, and (correct me if i'm wrong) the oligarch in charge of that mercenary force was one of the 13 who was just indicted by mueller. and, besides, the US isn't putin's ally. it's a one-way relationship, with us getting the very short end of that straw.

so, circling back, if you're a russian dissident, you're going to resettle... here? in an administration that's probably going to email your address to the russian embassy?

Dan Empfield
aka Slowman
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Re: Russians assassinating people overseas - UK again [Slowman] [ In reply to ]
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It's not really to your question but I think the most interesting and telling aspect of this is how the attempted hit was carried out. Russian emigrees have recently killed themselves by hanging (while beating themselves on the back of the head) and jumping out of low story buildings onto spiked iron railings. They've also suffered inexplicable heart attacks after coincidentally ingesting natural poisons not native to the UK. My point is that since Livienko the method has not been toxins that are obviously and easily traceable to the Kremlin. And the hits, if that's what they were, have been quickly and quietly successful while Skripal's still hanging in there.

It's pretty clear this isn't (just) about killing this particular guy. It's about creating an outrage that's just outrageous enough to demand a response without being so outrageous as to automatically lead to an inevitable punishment. It puts the onus on the UK, ostracized from the EU following Brexit and with justifiably little faith in the US, to figure out what it's going to do and with whom. If, as I'm sure Putin hopes, there is no coordinated response or the response is half-hearted then he will know, and more importantly Eastern Europe will know, that the EU and NATO are incapable of acting cohesively. And they'll remember that the next time he decides to push a button.



"Are you sure we're going fast enough?" - Emil Zatopek
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Re: Russians assassinating people overseas - UK again [Bretom] [ In reply to ]
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Bretom wrote:
Russian emigrees have recently killed themselves by hanging (while beating themselves on the back of the head) and jumping out of low story buildings onto spiked iron railings.
that's probably the way i'd kill myself. one of those ways. and if one didn't work i'd just try the other.

Bretom wrote:
It's pretty clear this isn't (just) about killing this particular guy. It's about creating an outrage that's just outrageous enough to demand a response without being so outrageous as to automatically lead to an inevitable punishment. It puts the onus on the UK, ostracized from the EU following Brexit and with justifiably little faith in the US, to figure out what it's going to do and with whom. If, as I'm sure Putin hopes, there is no coordinated response or the response is half-hearted then he will know, and more importantly Eastern Europe will know, that the EU and NATO are incapable of acting cohesively. And they'll remember that the next time he decides to push a button.
what we ought to have done years ago, after russia shut off the natural gas pipeline thru ukraine, was actively build a permanent natural gas "berlin airlift" to europe. we've lost a decade since then. we could have a second atlantic export terminal (in addition to the one we now have in the gulf of mexico).

we just haven't had a robust russian containment policy that aids europe, and we certainly took a big step back from being a reliable NATO partner over the last year. i actually wonder whether trump feels more simpatico with merkel, or putin.

Dan Empfield
aka Slowman
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Re: Russians assassinating people overseas - UK again [Slowman] [ In reply to ]
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Slowman wrote:
JD21 wrote:
Turns out being a Russian double agent in the tied to UK Intelligence and/or politically opposing Putin is a dangerous business. Who would've thought?

Why this is all about Trump alludes me particularly given the long and growing list of opportunities to call him out. Anyways, carry on.


you're kind of glib about folks getting murdered. as if russia has a right to come to another country and murder its citizens or residents. but, to your point, the reason it's - again - about trump:

Hmmm, has America ever crossed borders and killed one of our own citizens? I suggest you try some research.

if you're aren't bothered by the fact that trump has - in one year! - singlehandedly wrecked the reputation of mainstream christianity in america, and revealed it as a fraud, okay. maybe that's not a concern of yours. fine.

Really? Can you at least try to be honest. Those who already hated Christians (many on your website, possibly you?) still hate Christians. But hey, Christians could have voted for that bastian of morality Hillary Clinton.

if turning every country in the world against the U.S. is not a thing that bothers you, fine.


Blah blah blah. So you are a big Internationalist who thinks the United States shouldn't be allowed to protect our own interests. Big freaking deal.

if his incessant tearing at the fabric of our governmental processes is cool by you, fine.

Which processes? Can you elaborate? The games played by his predecessor were likely far more harmful to this country. A predecessor who did everything he could to tear our country apart. Or maybe you are talking about Obama weaponizing our intelligence community against a political opponent? I'm really confused by your post.

if a president who, as opposed to george washington, cannot tell the truth is groovy, okay.

President's lie. Every single one has. Including Obama, your hero. Stop trying to pretend this is the first liar we have had in office.

if it's too cool for school that trump is systematically tearing down every bit of environmental protection, while a science denier, and by hiring for his cabinet science deniers, okay.

A lot of environmental protections needed to go. This country is over regulated, and the environmental protection agency has been a tool of the radial environmental organizations for decades. Good for Trump.

and i could go on for 3 pages. you get the point.

I could go on about the idiocy, and hyperbole of your post for far longer. But it is a waste of my time. Nothing can, or will change crazy.

the reason it's a big deal here is that trump, by himself, has decided that russia is his political ally, and there are barrellfuls of evidence to support this. and, no, U.S. forces killing russian mercenaries is not evidence to rebut that because the U.S. forces were attacked, and defended themselves, as i understand it, and (correct me if i'm wrong) the oligarch in charge of that mercenary force was one of the 13 who was just indicted by mueller. and, besides, the US isn't putin's ally. it's a one-way relationship, with us getting the very short end of that straw.

And I would argue the Left, in an effort to excuse an election loss have done far more harm by attempting to begin a new Cold War with Russia. It is a very dangerous game. You, and your ilk are tools. Putin's entire goal is to disrupt our system. It is why he sponsored your anti Trump rallies. It is why his minions attack both sides, it is why much of the bot work came after the election. He saw an opening and took it. Putin loves people like you, a person who is unable to think for oneself. Sheep. led to slaughter by an evil man who wants nothing more then the Left in this country to keep it up. His dream would be an impeachment trial. He knows the day it occurred this country would be finished for decades. You either can't, or don't want to see the truth. Again, you, and your left wing friends are playing into Putin's hands and you aren't bright enough to see that. Sad, very sad.

so, circling back, if you're a russian dissident, you're going to resettle... here? in an administration that's probably going to email your address to the russian embassy?

Do you really think this? Again, how clueless and out of touch can people like you be? Scary stuff.

The hyperbole is YUGE in this post. Maybe grab a quick sip of wine and watch a pretty sunset.
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Re: Russians assassinating people overseas - UK again [Slowman] [ In reply to ]
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We did nothing to Russia because the previous administration believed Russia was in the past, not worth our time. Bush was no better, but Obama? Instead of dealing with real issues he spent his days splitting the country in two by focusing on identity politics. What a waste that man was.

Slowman wrote:
Bretom wrote:
Russian emigrees have recently killed themselves by hanging (while beating themselves on the back of the head) and jumping out of low story buildings onto spiked iron railings.

that's probably the way i'd kill myself. one of those ways. and if one didn't work i'd just try the other.

Bretom wrote:
It's pretty clear this isn't (just) about killing this particular guy. It's about creating an outrage that's just outrageous enough to demand a response without being so outrageous as to automatically lead to an inevitable punishment. It puts the onus on the UK, ostracized from the EU following Brexit and with justifiably little faith in the US, to figure out what it's going to do and with whom. If, as I'm sure Putin hopes, there is no coordinated response or the response is half-hearted then he will know, and more importantly Eastern Europe will know, that the EU and NATO are incapable of acting cohesively. And they'll remember that the next time he decides to push a button.

what we ought to have done years ago, after russia shut off the natural gas pipeline thru ukraine, was actively build a permanent natural gas "berlin airlift" to europe. we've lost a decade since then. we could have a second atlantic export terminal (in addition to the one we now have in the gulf of mexico).

we just haven't had a robust russian containment policy that aids europe, and we certainly took a big step back from being a reliable NATO partner over the last year. i actually wonder whether trump feels more simpatico with merkel, or putin.
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Re: Russians assassinating people overseas - UK again [Slowman] [ In reply to ]
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Quite the response. I was simply asking why Russians murdering Russians in the UK is on Trump. And how Trump's response aligning with the UK is wholly wrong or inappropriate. As to the rest of your diatribe, not relevant in the least to my reply or to this topic.

I imagine I support Trump even less than you, but I've been able to maintain my sanity along the way. Geez, you'd think I was bringing up the Clintonistas murdering their opposition on US soil.
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Re: Russians assassinating people overseas - UK again [JD21] [ In reply to ]
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doing nothing while an enemy attacks our ally = a buck fifty.
standing alongside our ally = priceless.

Dan Empfield
aka Slowman
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Re: Russians assassinating people overseas - UK again [Sanuk] [ In reply to ]
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Sanuk wrote:
When it comes to immigration or executing drug dealers he speaks like the ultimate Alpha Male. As soon as the subject of Russia comes up he turns into a dithering school boy.

Trump is always the first to make accusations when it involves things like bombings. He has no problem making accusations about terrorism or the involvement of Muslims. But as soon as Russia's involved, he suddenly proceeds with caution.

Our tools to influence Putin's behavior are pretty limited. What would you have Trump do to "punish" Putin? He's sitting on a huge nuclear and conventional arsenal, the EU is terrified of his stranglehold on their NG, and he doesn't give 2 shits about world opinion. What can we do that Putin would genuinely care about? Heck, when was the last time an American president strong-armed Russia, Reagan and short range missiles in Europe?

Sure, Trump's an embarrassment and the Russian situation is a shit-show. But that doesn't mean Trump's to blame. Nor is it reasonable to bitch at Trump for failing to prevent the problems or fix them.

Books @ Amazon
"If only he had used his genius for niceness, instead of Evil." M. Smart
Last edited by: RangerGress: Mar 13, 18 18:40
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Re: Russians assassinating people overseas - UK again [Slowman] [ In reply to ]
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Slowman wrote:
the russians got another one.

serious question. which country do you think would be less safe for a russian exile? the UK or the US? (the US under trump, i mean.)

What is funny about people saying we don't know yet who did it is that the Russians WANT you to know they did it. They want these guys to know that they are only alive because they let you be alive.

I don't think either country is 'safe', but given the option I think you may have a better chance in the US. But if Vlad says your time is up you better arrange your affairs no matter where you are.

I'm beginning to think that we are much more fucked than I thought.
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Re: Russians assassinating people overseas - UK again [j p o] [ In reply to ]
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I don't get what the issue here is. The Russians killed a handful of enemies of the state. So what? The U.S. has been running a large scale assassination program for going on twenty years now. Thousands have been killed not counting all the bystanders and general fuck-ups. This goes right down to whacking people because, "Hey! That Afghani garbage scavenger looks tall enough to be Osama, better kill him just in case." At least the Russians are not killing people because of their height.
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Re: Russians assassinating people overseas - UK again [Andrewmc] [ In reply to ]
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Novichok is back, with two more victims:
https://www.telegraph.co.uk/...pen-four-months/amp/
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Re: Russians assassinating people overseas - UK again [eb] [ In reply to ]
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eb wrote:
Novichok is back, with two more victims:
https://www.telegraph.co.uk/...pen-four-months/amp/

The USA has done bad things too. Putin can be trusted.

Maybe a joint USA/Russia task force should be created to find the real killers.

Just getting ready for the upcoming summit.
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Re: Russians assassinating people overseas - UK again [eb] [ In reply to ]
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eb wrote:
Novichok is back, with two more victims:
https://www.telegraph.co.uk/...pen-four-months/amp/

It's an odd one. They're not Russian, and they've got no apparent link to the intelligence or security community so seems highly unlikely they'd be targeted. So best guess is they've somehow come into contact with some novichok that was left behind from the previous poisoning 4 months ago, but if so it's strange that it's taken so long.

Or maybe Putin is just having people poisoned for shits and giggles now.
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Re: Russians assassinating people overseas - UK again [RangerGress] [ In reply to ]
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Our tools to influence Putin's behavior are pretty limited. What would you have Trump do to "punish" Putin?


The only way to "punish" Putin is to attack his and his friends money and to show that Russia isn't as strong as they used to be. Those are the only things Putin cares about. So, to start you can,


  • strengthen and widen the scope of the Magnitsky Act
  • Continue to call them out for their invasion of Crimea and Ukraine (Trump has been silent)
  • Stop praising Putin in public



He's sitting on a huge nuclear and conventional arsenal,


The only way Russia would use any form of weapon would be if they were to take back their Republics, like they did with Crimea and Ukraine. They did that because they knew the U.S wouldn't react. They know Trump is very unlikely to react either because he's never publicly challenged them and praises Putin. That's what Putin wants and Trump is simply playing along.


What can we do that Putin would genuinely care about?


As noted above, the only thing Putin cares about is his and his friends money and hanging on to power. Nothing scares him more than having his own people start a rebellion against him. He watched the death of Gadhafi in Libya over and over and was horrified by the downfall of Mubarek in Egypt.


Sure, Trump's an embarrassment and the Russian situation is a shit-show. But that doesn't mean Trump's to blame. Nor is it reasonable to bitch at Trump for failing to prevent the problems or fix them.


No one is blaming Trump for Putin but Trump is feeding into the strengthening of Putin by giving him a pass in Syria, not pressing him on Ukraine and Crimea, and praising his leadership. It's exactly what Putin wants.
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Re: Russians assassinating people overseas - UK again [cartsman] [ In reply to ]
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cartsman wrote:
eb wrote:
Novichok is back, with two more victims:
https://www.telegraph.co.uk/...pen-four-months/amp/


It's an odd one. They're not Russian, and they've got no apparent link to the intelligence or security community so seems highly unlikely they'd be targeted. So best guess is they've somehow come into contact with some novichok that was left behind from the previous poisoning 4 months ago, but if so it's strange that it's taken so long.

Or maybe Putin is just having people poisoned for shits and giggles now.

We may never know the truth, but the most likely explanation is that one of those two is a MI6 operative who is responsible for turning Russians to the British Secret Intelligence Service (SIS). It is likely a warning not to the British intelligence community not to keep turning their people.

Remember - It's important to be comfortable in your own skin... because it turns out society frowns on wearing other people's
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Re: Russians assassinating people overseas - UK again [FishyJoe] [ In reply to ]
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FishyJoe wrote:
eb wrote:
Novichok is back, with two more victims:
https://www.telegraph.co.uk/...pen-four-months/amp/


The USA has done bad things too. Putin can be trusted.

Maybe a joint USA/Russia task force should be created to find the real killers.

Just getting ready for the upcoming summit.

I hear OJ is available to head things up...
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