the most interesting aspect of this is reading the official council minutes related to the proposal..

Was wondering if this was a take over of the HITS race which occurs typically the week before (for the 2018 race date, the 2019 etc dates are a week alter) at the same venue. But nope, HITS is excepted from the exclusivity clause as a pre existing race.

So, an attempt to smother HITS fire with a WTC branded race? Seems that way and seems to be in line with prior strategies

And holy cow that route? Bike looks a la Tempe 70.3 and the run is just....

My favorite part was reading about the Ambush Marketing.

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Hillary Trout
San Luis Obispo, CA

Your trip is short. Make the most of it.
https://www.slogoing.net/

WTC doesn't need to apply that strategy to HITS. As a series, it already died with just 2 offerings in Florida, 2 in California and 1 in New York left. However, this could be a death blow to an event that just can't get it right (see reviews of HITS Palm Springs in other ST threads).

I now have the routing number and the bank account number for the WTC bank account. Selling it to Russia in 3.2.1.....

does seem like a death blow to HITS the week before. Aside from the organizational issues with the HITS PS race, how many people will want to do a 70.3 race where the water temp is typically in the mid to upper 50's?

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Mike Plumb, TriPower MultiSports
Professional Running, Cycling and Multisport Coaching, F.I.S.T. Certified
http://www.tripower.org

My favorite is their math calculation:
"The cost would be $75,000 a year for three years ($150,000)."

does seem like a death blow to HITS the week before. Aside from the organizational issues with the HITS PS race, how many people will want to do a 70.3 race where the water temp is typically in the mid to upper 50's? //

I don't know mike, how many really did the 1/2 at hits anyway? I think the sprint and olympic were there best attended races, and those were in the low hundreds of athletes. And of course the long race was usually a couple dozen at best. Honestly I have no idea how they have kept going all this time anyway, certainly it has been a money loser since day 1. It really has to be someones pride involved with that series as there is no other reason for it to exist. They never really figured out how to put on a decent event after all those years and all those races. I mean it has been great for a few people that get to do a cheap low key race, but how long is this charity to a few athletes going to go on.


Perhaps this will be their out to finally pull the plug, blame it on Ironman. Now a lot of races have a righteous beef with Ironman coming to town and ruining otherwise successful races, but this will not be one of those cases. Or they will just put on the shorter events and the ironman, or some combination of the 3 and just continue, like a chicken with its head cut off, running around the yard not yet knowing it is dead yet..


And I think it is great that a legit race will be coming to town there, so the water is a little cold, whaaa! Not like you have to swim in speedos, 5mm wetsuits with hoods is fine..

Could be but at least it was an alternative. I did HITS Palm Springs when it was still run by... can't remember his name... ETA Mark Wilson?? The most recent HITS was by most accounts pretty much a disaster (had a few friends do it but they were less harsh than ST was). You couldn't pay me to do HITS again, but that might just be Lake Cahuilla and PS mornings in December :)

And I can't help but come back to that course..... It looks awful to me. But heck 70.3 brand in Tempe sells out, so people will do it

Man, I wish they would do a 140.6....awesome time of year to have one and awesome weather. Not into air travel expense for 70.3.

I also thought the profile of the ironman "core consumer profile" (247k/yr household income) was fascinating

It's per township/host so the math makes sense.

I guess this finally settles the "is triathlon participation declining?" question.



“As interest in golf falls by almost every measure, so-called endurance sports — triathlon, running, cycling are exploding in popularity.” - Michael Buteau

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Hillary Trout
San Luis Obispo, CA

Your trip is short. Make the most of it.
https://www.slogoing.net/

To bad Palm Springs isn't in EMEA (? Europe, Middle East, Asia.. ?) or Latin America. USA and Asia Pac. looks pretty flat

Pretty late in the season even for us So Cal people. Weather has not been great at HITS some years.

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Team Zoot So Cal

The article is gone? The link is not working for me....

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Next races on the schedule: none at the moment

Huh. WTC got wise and didn’t want its agreement public maybe , but it should be public record

Or it was the Russians.

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Hillary Trout
San Luis Obispo, CA

Your trip is short. Make the most of it.
https://www.slogoing.net/

go to the city homepage http://www.laquintaca.gov/...lendar/Event/9829/31 agreement is on the pdf of the agenda, though you will need to scroll down quite a ways.

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check out my blog http://theswimmingtriathlete.com

I've got mixed feelings...I love the option of a December race since I'm in San Diego. I love the fact it's not HITS. I wish it weren't the dead of SoCal 'winter' where I have to swim in butt-ass cold water. But I like the flatness - at least they didn't put a climb up the freaking canyon like HITS did 2 years ago.

But someone explain that run course - that doesn't look like it's anywhere near Cahuilla.

separate t1 and t2 - like in most of WTC races

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Next races on the schedule: none at the moment

Most? While not infrequent, it isn't close to common in my experience. I've done 12 IMs at 10 different venues, and only 2 venues had a split T1/T2. I've done even more 70.3s and can only think of two of those that had a split T1/T2. So I'm going to have to say that few WTC races have separate T1 and T2.

They reposted it without the bank wire instructions......or the Russians did it. The agreement starts on pg 179

http://www.laquintaca.gov/...howdocument?id=36368

It's okay I still have the screen shot.

Interesting. Except for IMAZ, every single WTC race I have done had a split t1/t2 setup. Logistically it is probably an easier arrangement, though it is probably costlier.

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Next races on the schedule: none at the moment

That run looks terrible. But then HITS was such a shit show, I won't miss it.

And finally the iron brand whores will see it's not HITS fault for super cold water, high winds, and sometimes freezing rain weather. The venue is spectacular..... Doesn't matter who puts on the show. Just don't have it in dead winter!

Better a golf course I guess than a barn LOL

This So Cal guy will be fat and lazy in December 2018 2019 2020.
Finally, Ironman has done something to help me
save some money and not spend it.

A push to November or April and they might have something.

Pete

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2017 Cervelo P2
2017 Cervelo S2
itraininla.com
#itraininla

seriously....ive never quite understood it.....i ALWAYS want more california 70.3 but why does anyone want to swim in 57 degrees in december?????

Haha fat..... don’t think so

I spoke at this city council meeting in support of the event. They are trying to fill a hole in their race schedule, while filling a hole in tourism here in the valley. HITS has always been a shit show for a number of reasons, but water temp is definitely a problem. We are just hoping that they will do it once and like the venue, but change the date in the coming years. Would love it to be a November race. Either way, I am supremely excited to sleep in my own bed before WTC race on my home turf!

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Salton Sea Triathlon Club
“I swim to get to the bike. I run because nobody gives a shit about aquabike.”

Seriously... What do you think WTC will do better than HITS? They will face the same problems

The cold water, mixed with cold concrete, cold air...I can take cold up top, but when my feet get cold, forget about it! I did a sprint Turkey Tri once in Socal in November...I vowed never again. Too chilly for this CA guy.

Seriously... What do you think WTC will do better than HITS? They will face the same problems //

Mark the course so no one gets lost. If they start with that then they are miles ahead of them. Then perhaps aid stations at other than random intervals, with actual people working them. Then maybe some finish line food and drink.


As to the cold water, how about just being truthful on what it is going to be, then maybe a few lifeguards in the water? It is not that hard to prepare for cold water if you know ahead of time, and if you can't, well you don't have to enter. December races in La Quinta can be a blast, it is almost always sunny and crisp. I did that old hits race a couple times there at that time of year, and other than all the things I mentioned earlier, it was a good bit of fun!

I also did that race and aide stations were manned, with finish line food and drink plenty. Although, I'm not sure the story for people still on the course after sunset...

For starters, they might review the following thread for the long list of problems with HITS execution: Missing course marshals, missing timing mats, HIM run course .6 mi short, better traffic control, zero transition security, aid stations miles off from the published maps, etc., etc., ad nauseum.

http://forum.slowtwitch.com/forum/Slowtwitch_Forums_C1/Triathlon_Forum_F1/HITS_Palm_Springs_P6159099-2/

• Vet their course layout properly
• Clearly mark the course and man areas of possible confusion
• Provide traffic control at intersections instead of telling athletes they have to stop at all stop signs and stop lights
• Ensure safety of athletes by addressing issue of residents with loose dogs running on the course
• Have a decent number of stocked and manned aid stations
• Use a timing system that actually works and doesn’t completely drop out for every third athlete
• Route a much more interesting run course
• Reach out to the local tri community and work with local support to glean local knowledge instead of flatly ignoring all input (already happening)
• HOST ABOUT A TRILLION TIMES BETTER EVENT THAN HITS EVER HAS

Should I continue?

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Salton Sea Triathlon Club
“I swim to get to the bike. I run because nobody gives a shit about aquabike.”

• Have enough water safety personnel available to design a swim course that isn't 4 loops, in which one-third of each loop is along the shallow end of the lake allowing athletes to walk (instead of swim).
• A run course that isn't more than 3 miles short.

[My only experience at this race was doing the full in 2014]

That was bad and it has only gotten worse. It’s in my backyard so I always do it.

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Salton Sea Triathlon Club
“I swim to get to the bike. I run because nobody gives a shit about aquabike.”

Funny, cause iron brand did these screw ups in other races. Think it was boulder 70.3 that was short this year, other races people getting hit by cars, etc etc

I found my old thread from the very first HITS series race in La Quinta(Palm Springs). IT was fun to go back and read through it, some posts from Support Crew(RIP) talking about her and Joe's(Bonness) experience with Hits in Florida.

I was full of hope for that series back then, it was in my back yard at the time. Unfortunately all these years later they seem to not have gotten any more traction. Perhaps Ironman can do a bit better, then we can really see if there is a market for a Dec. race in Southern CA.

http://forum.slowtwitch.com/..._two_races_P3663911/

It's clear you don't like Ironman. While IM has made most of those mistakes across dozens of races over the years, HITS managed to make them all in a single race. That is THE difference and why HITS has shriveled into irrelevance.

You don’t seem to have a good sense of where your feelings stop, and objectivity starts. Go to an IM then go to a HITS event. If you can’t see the difference staring you in the face, you may need to adjust your electrolyte intake, just a bit. Or you’re just trolling with your blatantly disingenuous remarks.

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Salton Sea Triathlon Club
“I swim to get to the bike. I run because nobody gives a shit about aquabike.”

been to both... just a price difference in my eyes, and yes IM may have a more stacked field due to prize money, but that is all

That is demonstrably NOT “all”

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Salton Sea Triathlon Club
“I swim to get to the bike. I run because nobody gives a shit about aquabike.”

Interesting move....

I guess they wan to try out if enough people jump on a race where production cost is lower, making up for the possibly lower customer revenue stream.

We will see how that turns out, but my guess is that race will be profitable, and giving other winter races there the death knell is an added bonus.

They count on the Lemmings, who can be counted on.

OK, cmon. Why lemmings? I am based in LA. I dunno if I'll race it but let's say I decide to do a 70.3 or so late in the season without doing too much travel.
My choices are:

1. Cabo 70.3 - about 2hrs flight, with the distinct possibility of some poor schmuck's corpse being hung from the underpass that I'd be riding thru.
2. Arizona 70.3 - an option, but if I am getting into Tempe fuckin' lake, it'd better be for a Kona slot..
3. Superfrog - also an option.

That's it. So if I wanna race in November, my options are in the midst of the gang warfare, or in Florida or worse. Palm Springs make sense as a replacement for Silverman. No real 3rd party options, except for HITS, with all the warts. What else you got?

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Next races on the schedule: none at the moment

why havent you done this race? http://www.trickortri.com/

for lemmings meant ironbrand only races.

also if you allow superfrog on your radar that opens more 70.3 possibilites. santa cruz, chula vista challenge

The problem with Trick or Tri (and Chula Vista) is the bike course. The ToT features 7 loops for the 70.3, mixed with the Olympic/Sprint folks, entering, exiting, all at different speeds. It sucks, with it being close to traffic being the only redeeming quality. Chula Vista has 4 loops, which is a little bit less sucky, but still. The run course consisting of 3-4 loops is not too terrible. The 70.3 options at both races drawing 100-120 participants every year is another negative.

Santa Cruz 70.3 is definitely an option but it is pretty early in Fall when you have more options.

Again, a December race in Palm Springs might be a total bust, but I think that it will draw enough interest from both the local and the snowbirds.

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Next races on the schedule: none at the moment

well also superfrog also has low turn out was it 200 this year? with 4 bike laps... awful run on the sand

Sorry, HITS is by far the worst race ever. At least in PS. The worst part is that they endangered their athletes. No excuse for that.

I would never race with them again

Heard it was HORRIBLE in 2016. Seemed like they fixed a lot of things in 2017. Of course, I only did one of the shorter distances so I can't comment on the 70.3/full, but it was well run, fun, and competitive.

Also, water was mid 60's this year, no rain, no wind, 70 degree weather.

Weather is hit or miss that time of year, but I'd sure like another 70.3 or 140 in socal.

 Are you serious? 200 people are superfrog?! That is crazy low! It’s almost like Ironman didn’t figure out that no one wants to pay $550 for a boring course 70.3.

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Salton Sea Triathlon Club
“I swim to get to the bike. I run because nobody gives a shit about aquabike.”

not that hard to look up, Superfrog had 559 finishers and 139 that either didn't finish or didn't start for a total of 698. Still low numbers by Ironman standards. I would expect that Palm Springs 70.3 would have similar numbers.

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Mike Plumb, TriPower MultiSports
Professional Running, Cycling and Multisport Coaching, F.I.S.T. Certified
http://www.tripower.org

Since folks on here seem pretty in-the-know... any updates on whether this race is actually going to happen?

I did the HITS race one year and my biggest gripe would be the water temp and general coldness of the morning. However, by the time I finished it was bright, hot, and sunny. I wish they would consider doing a 10am start or something similar.

Nothing official from Ironman yet. I’ve spoken with the mayors and they said WTC is supposed to be announcing this week.

http://www.desertsun.com/...ber-2018/1000988001/

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Salton Sea Triathlon Club
“I swim to get to the bike. I run because nobody gives a shit about aquabike.”

And here is the official! Hope to see you all in my backyard in December!! Salton Sea Triathlon Club will be hosting a bash like no other!!!
http://www.ironman.com/...a.aspx#axzz53EZ5xzbK

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Salton Sea Triathlon Club
“I swim to get to the bike. I run because nobody gives a shit about aquabike.”

So is anyone going to give this a whirl?

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Next races on the schedule: none at the moment

I’m registered

I ended up being a volunteer for the HITS 1/2 in ‘16 due to
I person at aid station at turn around, out of nutrition so I gave him everything I had in my car. I drove to the full turn and took a lot from him as there were very few full participants. The road that was used is a “run off” from I-10 so the accident that happened routed traffic down this road. Semis on winding downhill roads and a race don’t mix. I changed 2 flats, gave out 2 water bottles, and tried to convince a girl pushing a wall mart style mtb up the hill at mi 20 to quit.
Nobody at transition for bags that were just thrown everywhere fromT1
The fly infested horse park was the biggest EFFIN joke ever. Oh and they had no lights on the runcourse.

HITS is a GD joke and I wish for the safety of participants that they would go away

IM branded race will be night and day difference

I'm a definite maybe. I'll see how I feel in Oct/Nov.

Rather than freeze yourself off at either race, challenge has stepped up the game with a 70.3 in ensenada Mexico near by, same time frame $200

I don't think the Pacific Ocean is going to be that warm in December, though.

Ok I am contemplating signing up for Indian Wells, after reading all of this what kind of temps are we looking at for the swim? Also anyone know any logistics, can you swing it with no rental car with the two transitions. Thanks

Pretty sure that you'd need a vehicle there.

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Next races on the schedule: none at the moment

Water probably low 60s at warmest

You’ll need a car

Sad...was all about this being my first 70.3 until I broke my clavicle.

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Washed up footy player turned Triathlete.