I run a 50 with 11-28 cassettes. Would probably have gone with 52 but SRAM doesn't make the x sync in 52 for 110 bcd. Raced one week with 11-25 and liked it but new cassette is 11-28. Wanted to make sure I had those extra gears if it got super windy around me.

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Do you mind me asking what level you are?
I'm relatively strong, FTP upwards of 350, so I reckon I might be able to get away with a 52, even on a hilly course

Other than bragging rights, why run a 52? A 50-11T will get you > 40 mph @ 115 cadence. It gets you 32 mph @ a cadence of 90.

For reference I crit race with a 50T up front and a 11-28 out back.

I use a 52 x-sync ring and an 11-32 most of the time. I can get up just about anything as long as it's not at a leisurely pace. For crit racing I will swap the cassette to something with a tighter cluster.

285ish FTP at 160 pounds or so. So not crazy high but not super low either. I will also say that my only negative thought about the 1x is if I wanted to use an 11-32 cassette (but many use it very well so I might be wrong!) I like a tight cassette without big jumps so going with a 50 might allow you to stay with an 11-25 so you don't have jumps. But I didn't notice anything different really between 11-25 to 11-28.

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Not sure why you would brag about a 52??

On flat sections I'm normally in the 54/15 range, so going any lower than 52 would mean significant cross into the lowest sprockets which damages drive chain efficiency.

My ftp is around 320 and I'm running a 52 13-25. I get up hills no problem. I have the wolf narrow wide which seems quieter than the sram xsync. Havent ever thrown the chain (11spd). 52x25 is virtually the same as the old 42x21 alot of us used racing in the 80s/90s.

I'm not sure either, but I can't come up with many reasons to run bigger than a 50 either.

Any data on cross chain efficiency on using the middle gears vs. using some of the gears at the lower end?

This is just me... but I'm more of a grinder and the small 1.5mph or so at 90 is a big deal.

Apparently I have the lowest w/Kg on ST and I run a 44x11-32. You can go fast in 44/11.

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/kj

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I'm about 170lb, 330FTP and I'm using a 46T and 11-28. I was just at American Triple T and I couldn't imagine running more than 46T up front. I'd spin out on some of the downhills, but I needed every one of those teeth going up. I'll likely use a similar setup for Tremblant 70.3 in a couple weeks.

I'm surprised how many people are using 50T+ on their 1x setups, unless they're on flat-ish terrain. I'm racing Maryland later in the year and I'll switch to a 50T and 11-25 for that.

I unintentionally tested 2 gear ratio ranges on the IMWI loop this weekend. My front der. cable broke. So I tried both the 53T and 39T. I DO NOT, I repeat DO NOT recommend a 53T when you have a 11-25 cassette. I managed, and still rode under 2 hours, but it wasn't pretty on 5 or 6 of the steeper hills. On the steepest climb, I nearly stalled out and found that 200W was all I could manage because I was down to something like 30 RPM, pushing as hard as I felt safe to do so without breaking something.

Using a 39/11 actually wasn't too bad. I spun out around 30-32mph, but was really a non-issue most of the time.

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I was living in SF training for Escape From Alcatraz a few years ago and my front derailleur cable broke. Accidentally discovered that 39/11-28 is a pretty damn useful setup. The bike I commute on in the city now is 42/11-28. Works great.

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/kj

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It's hilly in Bloomington Indiana so I've equipped my Titanflex Tri bike and Giant TCX Cyclocross bike with identical 10 speed setups... I have a 44T Wolf Tooth Wide Narrow upfront with a SRAM XX 11x36 (11,12,14,16,18,21,24,28,32,36) Mountain Bike Cassette in the back. SRAM XX MTB Rear Derailluer too. 44x36 gives me the same climbing ratio as a compact road bike setup but at the expense of some top end.
Generally the downhills in the area are 45mph coasting so no need to add power downhill...
For reference 700c wheel:
52/11 gearing @ 110 cadence = 40.40 mph
52/11 gearing @ 100 cadence = 36.73 mph
46/11 gearing @ 110 cadence = 35.72 mph (I don't spend much time pedaling faster than this, but I do spend alot of time climbing)
46/11 gearing @ 100 cadence = 32.48 mph
44/11 gearing @ 110 cadence = 34.17 mph
44/11 gearing @ 100 cadence = 31.07 mph (I think a 46T would be just about right as sometimes but rarely the 44T chainring is too slow)

What is your weight??? I would highly suggest something bigger than a 28. FWIW, collins rides a 36, Rapp only rides 30 but has alluded to using a 32 in the future, granted these guys also have 54t upfront. I myself use a 32, last week at Chattanooga I could have used an extra gear for one short section, in the 54-32 I held 415w for those 75 seconds.

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Around 71kg

I personally wouldn't recommend the 28 route, it is one of those things, it is all hunky-dory until it is not. I think you would be safer with a 30 or 32. If you are concerned with aero of a larger cassette that is one thing that I can't help with, but if weight is an issue the SRAM XG-1190 Cassette in 11-32 is still sub 200 grams.

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The logic of all this is not about aero so I don't mind the big cassette.
Which rear mech do you run?

I am still running the Shimano DI2 with Berner cage. I talked to Jason at Friction Facts and the clutch derailleur puts extra tension on the chain and causes even more friction losses.

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On my road bike I run a 44t chain ring with a 10 speed 11/28 cassette. I live around DC where we don't have mountains (at least not west coast mountains) but a lot of short, punchy hills. Even though it's a bit of a grind sometimes, 44x28 usually works quite well. I've been on several fast group rides and have had no problems hanging on the flats or slight downhills with 44x11.

On my TT bike, I just installed a 50t chainring and a 11-speed 11/32 cassette. This gives me the same low end as the 44x28 with the high end of 50x11. I almost never need more than 50x11 - if I'm spinning that out I should probably just tuck and coast.

I've done a couple races with this setup and love it. I'm planning on racing IMLP with the 50t-11/32, though I'm slightly tempted to go with the 11/36 just to have the extra bailout gear. I use Wolf Tooth chainrings on 130 or 110 bcd cranks.

FWIW, I'm 142 lbs (64.4 kgs), 5'10", FTP of 270w and a FTP w/kg of 4.2.

I use a 52 with a 11-26 rear. Would have gone with a 50 if I didn't have a 130, but I do ok with the rollers in eastern PA. If I have to go to a 28 or higher I will, but I don't like the large spacing.
Only do short course - which helps as in addition to less distance the courses tend to be beginner friendly

Have you had the chain drop often? Just curious.

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No chain drops on either of my bikes with this setup at hundreds of miles and I'm not using a type 2 clutched rear derailluer. The wide tooth chainring is enough for street usage to never drop a chain in my experience. My cyclocross bike even sees rough/rooty singletrack duty in the "Gravel Grovel" race each fall and it's never dropped the chain.

Thanks.

I have a 10 speed sram setup, what would be a good rear mech to run a 32 on?

I am not familiar with 10 speed at all - you are going to probably need a mid-cage RD though.

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I'll echo the no-drops. I have used both Wolf Tooth and Sram X-Sync chainrings and the only time I have ever dropped a chain is in a crash (CX race).

I commute daily through San Francisco and dropping/hopping curbs, crossing train tracks, potholes, terrible pavement, etc has not led to any drops. Only used standard Shimano and SRAM derailleurs without a clutch.

If you use a narrow/wide ring, you do NOT need a clutch for chain retention.

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/kj

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I am running a 46t front ring matched up to a 11/28 rear. For training rides this has been OK for now. I have done some training rides on the course for my next race and I am finding that I am not needing anything more than my 23 so I am thinking about running an 11/23 for that race and keeping it tighter spacing for the race.

I am still playing with the set up but maybe a 50t front ring as well would be a nice option to have as well.

Thanks, I think I'm going to put a SRAM wifli on there

Thanks for all the info everyone.
I think I'm going to go with a 32 at the back and a 50 on the front.

I'm a bit of a spinner, owing maybe to the short cranks, 155s. I risk losing a bit of easy leverage in the saddle if I slow down on hills. So I think it's best to go with caution!

So I've been looking at the courses

One of them has a longish section of 7% grade but that's about it.

The other has lots of short sharp hills, mostly only 0.5k long, around 7-8% but one has a 12% section in.

I've never been good at judging hills but 12% is fairly high!

155 cranks then definitely a 50. When I was on 162.5 I had a 52t and that was plenty. Even at 165 I used a 52t for some time. When I went back up to 172.5 I bumped up to 54t

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Can anyone recommend a chaining, 50t in 130bcd?
All the sram x sync ones seem to be 11bcd for 50t

I was going to say Wolf Tooth but it looks like they only have 44t and 52t and nothing in between? I take it you have a crank that is also a power meter?

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I have P1 pedals.
My cranks aren't as short as the OP - I use 165, but figure I could do with a 50t. The cranks are a bit special so I don't want to change BCD

I can't get over the fact that we have an apparently 5w/kg ametuer triathlete here. Can't be many of those around even on ST :)

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Me?

There are plenty around surely.

Here goes the front door brag, and the explanation.

FTP around 360-380, tends to vary a little but tests indicate.

This is also going uphill, in aero I'm shocking!

Weight 69-71kg.

CdA - 0.26!! 0.26 dammit! This is post wind tunnel!

Have I solved your mystery?

Your front door brag is well earned.

I don't think there are hardly any age groupers. A few sure.

I live right outside Minneapolis / St. Paul. There are some very fast triathletes here. A few that are generally in the running for Triathlete of the year / etc. I can't imagine anyone is 5w/kg.

I am close on a road bike, but I can't touch it in the TT position. 5 w/kg on a road bike seems like a completely different ball game to many of us than 5w/kg on a TT bike which to me makes it super impressive.

Unless I'm completely in the dark I don't think the top pros are making much over a legit 5w/kg on their TT bike. I think even Lionel is only like 5.3 on his potentially happy Powertap pedals?

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Another quick question.

If I was to run a 52, just so I could use it for TTing, I would use a 32 at the back.
The jumps on this are huge,

Can you in theory run half a climbing cassette - so the top 3 sprockets being 25-28-32 and then using the bottom set from a normal cassette so something like 11-18.
Would that jump from the 25 to the 18 cause too many issues?

How do y'all size your chains? I'm going to be using a 50t, 11-32, and 6870 DI2 Ultegra (med cage). Does SRAM's "big-big plus 4*" apply to this drive-train as well?

*Is the quicklink included in this 4 or not?

I'd rather take the gradual jumps of the stock cassette than a huge jump mid-cassette.

But then again, I've been riding a 10-speed 11-28 for ages, and SRAM 1x 10-42 off-road, so maybe I'm just less bothered by small jumps.

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ZONE3 - We Last Longer

For a 10 speed 11-32 set up I ran a standard SRAM Force mid-cage RD (also worked on an 11sp set up)

The new SRAM X1 Force and Rival (clutch) RD's are compatible with both 10 & 11 speed. I changed to an X1 Rival RD as I did get one or two chain drops with the standard RD (very rare, however). Since then I haven't dropped a chain once.

Oh and my current set up is a 54 front, 11-32 rear 11sp.

My ideal cassette ratio would be the following, alas I can't find one anywhere... :(

11-12-13-14-16-18-21-24-27-30-34

I run a 52T ring and 11-28 for racing. 11-32 for training or hilly races. Perfect for me.

I did big big plus 2 then the quick link. I think that's what shimano prescribes? Maybe arts cyclery? Forgot where but that's what I did and so far so good! Don't want it too tight but also didn't want it too slack since 11-32 is a big gap. But honestly not sure how much of a difference the extra two links make.

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I changed to a 50/34, 11/25 170mm 9-speed (I'll post my "budget build" shortly). I was previously using 53/39, 175mm. Position feels better but the race this weekend will be the test I guess. I'm between 250-250 ftp on the powerbeam.

Btw, I need to get some good tips on how to ride time trials (I'm trying to change from a swim focus to bike focus). Looks like here is a good place. 350ftp and up?? Damn man that's as fast as Justin Rossi. I just saw the trainer road videos on YouTube and he averaged like 370 watts for the Nationals 40k tt!! Awesome video btw.

No experience with this aspect sorry. As for jumps not the big of a deal IMO. Don't even notice.

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Sorry to bring this up again.

I'm considering converting to 11spd, it will cost a considerable amount as I currently have a set of 10spd zipp 808s.
With all the extra money and faff, is it worth it for 1 extra gear?

Nope.....train more or lose weight, get a better skin suit or helmet....just my two cents.

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"see the world as it is not as you want it to be"

Wtf has that got to do with the question?

The questions was specific to the thread regarding 1x setup, and going from 10-11 to give the extra range.

It has nothing to do with anything you mentioned, so what you said was stupid and a typical I'm going to ignore your question and try and put you down.

I missed his second reply.....but I didn't see a problem with his original reply?? You asked if it was -worth- it to upgrade, and he mentioned things that were better value... I've done the 11 speed 'upgrade', and can honestly say that other than being compatible with the more recent components, there is pretty much zero value in having 1 extra gear, and the money is better spent on the things he mentioned, better skinsuit and helmet, if you don't already have those things.
If you already have those things, and you are still concerned about -value-, then look to other things (better hydration system, new shoes, etc??). If you aren't concerned about VALUE, then go for it, upgrade to 11.

See now THATS a different question, if I had asked whether changing to 11 speed was better value than those things, it would have warranted his answer.
But what I wanted to know was -

IF it's a hilly race and you are running a 1x setup is it worth spending the money to upgrade, has anyone who has made this change noticed a difference.
Added to that the clutched type rear mechs seem to come in 11spd, so this would be an added benefit.

Ah, OK! :)

So I have a question too (not to you specifically)... Regardless of 10 or 11 speed....what is the real advantage of the single chainring up front?? Are that many people getting dropped chains when switching to small ring?
And if you do choose to do that, is it just a special wide chainring that you install on a regular crank, and a rear derailleur with a longer cage (if necessary)??
I know in Tremblant, on the steep sections at about the 70km mark, I was happy to have my 36 small ring (with 28 in back)!! :)

I think the main logic is being more aero. For me it's a different reason, related to biomechanics.

Yes, you need to use a single ring that is either narrow wide or full height teeth.

Mech depends on the gearing at the back

The new Sram 1x RDs will also run up to a 36T large cog with a mid cage unlike the original wifli rd whuch is maxed at 32. There is a long cage version as well.

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I might have to get a 4iiii power meter now. Lucky for me they are 25 minutes away and I can drop off.

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I don't see it as being worth it to upgrade all that stuff simply for the one extra gear.

If you really need a granny gear, just buy a second cassette with a wider gear range for hilly courses and swap back and forth as needed. I don't have a 1x, but cant recall the last time I actually shifted into the small ring up front, so I ride my bbke like it's a 1x. Having ridden both 10 and 11 speeds, I don't find any extra usefulness out of that 11th gear personally, and I ride a lit of hills.

Thanks, that's really useful stuff

There are cassettes available that would allow you to keep the same wheels so you do not have to change out the wheels OR maybe these are new enough that you can change the body out to 11 speed. There are ways around every potential problem.

The other thing that you can do is use your current set up and just purchase a front 1x designed ring and give it a go. This is what I did as I wanted to see what it was like. I have a 46t front and running an 11/28 rear. I did however use a standard front ring and so far I like what I have tried and I am not any slower on the courses that I have run before with 2 X 10. I am actually faster on a few courses with less training.

I don't know your financial situation so tough to say but you are prob going to have to move to 11 speed at some point unless you are trying to hold out for 12 speed. I feel like now is as good time as ever.

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I've been running a 50t Wolf tooth up front with a 11-32 11sp cassette & Integra 6870.

I find that the combination of Di2 and 1x setup results in me shifting more often, and lets me focus more of my pedal stroke and posture, as I don't need to think about gearing aside from pressing a button. With 11 gears the jumps aren't disconcerting and are easily manageable.

Suffice to say, don't see myself going back to 2x.

Hi I'm building a new Tri bike and am going to 1x11 setup and have 3 questions I have not been able to answer with search or google. I willuse a Sram 1x11 chainring (48 or 50) and a Sram Force 1 rear derailleur (clutched type):

1. What chain should I use? Sram 1170 11speed chain? Or Shimano Ultegra 11sp?
2. Can I use an Ultegra cassette?
3. If I start with an 11-32 cassette and then change to an 11-28 cassette will I have to shorten my chain.

Thanks,

Rob

1. What chain should I use? Sram 1170 11speed chain? Or Shimano Ultegra 11sp?
Doesn't matter. KMC is also very popular.


2. Can I use an Ultegra cassette?
Yes. The exact gears differ a little bit between cassettes though. Ultegra is 11-12-13-14-16-18-20-22-25-28-32 while the equivalent SRAM 1170 is 11-12-13-14-15-17-19-22-25-28-32.

3. If I start with an 11-32 cassette and then change to an 11-28 cassette will I have to shorten my chain.
No.

Thanks I get to work on it right now...