I'm gonna have to turn in my manliness card for this, but my suggestion to you is to think beyond the things you can buy for him or cook for him. There's a book called "The Five Love Languages". I'm guessing that yours is "receiving gifts", so that is where you are going with a 12 days theme.

But there is also "words of affirmation", "quality time", "acts of service" and "physical touch". The key is to learn which one or two of these things are most important to him and direct your actions appropriately.

http://www.fivelovelanguages.com/learn.html

Good luck.

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You're not stuck in traffic. You ARE traffic.

you're my soul mate.

ugh. i read that book, it's lame.

for the wine, make that a big gift too, but a nice one and make it French. then you have 3 French hens. put a hen ornament around the neck of it and call it a day.

for the milking maids, how about you take him out for a movie and ice-cream? or, you could make some ice cream yourself? or stay in and make ice cream floats and then watch a movie.

2 turtle doves can be some wildly good chocolate. wear some sexy red lingerie and you can share the chocolates and then get it on. (what? how else am i supposed to say it???)

5 golden rings, invite some friends over for margs. the glasses make 5 golden rings. you can get some gold colored salt for the rims. (there is yellow salt, i've seen it in stores). or you could just use Cuervo GOLD and there you have it. plus you get to get drunk too!

this with the other stuff you've got should make 12 things, right?

yeah, unfortunately it's very cheap...that would be a perfect one though.

Yeah, the book is lame, but the idea is worthwhile. That's why I only linked to the basics, which is all you need to know.

Most people subscribe to the golden rule of treat others as you want to be treated. But the better rule is to treat others the way they want to be treated.

If the bf has everything he wants, or is someone who can't stand clutter, getting him a bunch of things that will fill his house won't make him happy. Depends on where people are in their lives.

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You're not stuck in traffic. You ARE traffic.

i agree with you, it is a good basis. it helped me to understand that my husband communicates love through service--like cutting the grass, doing laundry, etc. whereas i am physical and give words of affirmation. when i want to make him very happy i do all the chores so he can rest, it thrills him.

awesome

i'd swap the shotfun shells for mud wrestlin tickets though

if you are both into the outdoors have you got one of these..?

http://jetboil.com/

they are truly awesome. very convenient, quick boiling and easy clean. love 'em

don't buy Black Swan if he knows wine. :)

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I'll be what I am
A solitary man

I hope, for his benefit, that you kept the physical as well...

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You're not stuck in traffic. You ARE traffic.

My dad really got into gardening lately, so I got him a really nice set of pruners that would last him.

http://www.amazon.com/...handed/dp/B000ITR83A

A bit pricey, but they last forever if you take care of them.

Give him experiences, not tangible gifts (he can, and will, buy those on his own). For example:

A hot air balloon ride.

A star gazing tour at the local observatory (I don't know if they have those there).

Oil painting lessons (assuming he has never done them).

Whale watching tour.

Rare plant hunting trip in China.

Antartica trip on a sailing ship from the 1800s.

Backpacking trip to Mt. Kilimanjaro.

OMG, did I just let my gay side shine through? For the record, I'm not gay; I'm gayish! Yes, there is a difference.

Wow. Next time I need date ideas, I'm PMing you!

The tomato growing contest is wicked cool! :) On that note, couple of gift ideas that are totally useless:

Upside-down tomato garden: http://www.hammacher.com/...OOR&cm_ite=67403

Ergonomic garden tools: http://www.merrifieldgardencenter.com/...2&openparent=237

Mini greenhouse: http://www.amazon.com/...kitchen-20/ref=nosim

Personalized garden stakes: http://simply-sublime.com/garden_stakes.htm

Not at all...niether one of us are big on giving or recieving gifts (we've already discussed this), and we both tend to buy what it is that we want, I went with this idea since me giving him 12 gifts means that I get to see him/spend time with him each day leading up to christmas...and the gifts dont' have to be actual things, but some are things like a pedicure (acts of service and physical touch), and me cooking for him (acts of service), and a DVD of his favorite movie that we can watch together cuddled on the couch (physical touch).

Great ideas...I really like the wine one, and the margaritas one.

Are you sure he'll be into the pedicure? I know girls are but...

You're the gayish one! you tell us!

Well, ever since I've known him he keeps talking about getting a pedicure....but he doesn't want to go to a manicure/pedicure shop because he's afraid he'll be seen getting one (semi joking about being afraid he'll be seen)

And every guy I've known that's gotten a pedicure (a good one) has liked it. It's not something they'd do every other week, like us gals, but they've all found it relaxing.

Well, as Ghia said, any man would love a pedicure, they are just afraid to be razzed about it. Personally, I would be embarrassed to have a stranger see the tan line left by my stilettos.

As an avid leg shaver, i don't have a (hairy) leg to stand on...

if he likes classical music you could get a CD of chamber music, a CD of horns playing classical Christmas music, or whatever. that might refer to pipers piping. you could play it as you cook, or have someone come over and cook for both of you.

for the maids milking, how about a cheese course? (sounds like you guys are foodies, so that's why i keep mentioning food...) then you could watch the movie Big Night, or some other movie that's about food. you could have small wedges of a couple of different cheeses and eat them during a movie, or have friends over, etc.

for the pear tree, you could get him a coffee mug that has a pear on it. or get him those little jelly pears that have the tips dipped in chocolate. there are all kinds of pear candies. or even a pear scent candle. there are also asian pears that are quite good sliced up in a salad, or sauteed. pears are great any time of year and holiday'ish. there are beautiful pear ornaments that i've seen in stores.

i have to look at the list again for more ideas. but maybe this is enough.

four calling birds:
does he like birds at all? this time of year is great for bird feeders, if he has some kind of place to hang it outside. get a small bird feeder with seed and the birds will come. you will most certainly have calling birds! and watching them is something you can do together.

you can also get a small bird book about birds in your area.

ok, that's all the ideas i have. :)

NTTAWWT!

Thanks...more good ideas. I'm going to start finalizing my list this week, so I can start buying/making plans this weekend...

I've got a screaming macaw you can have.

"(so whatever he wants he normally buys for himself)," - GhiaGirl

Hate to be a party-pooper .... but ..... obviously I can't speak for all guys ... maybe some guys here can help me out ... either confer or disagree ... but the above comment pretty much says it all.

Judging from myself, Guys just aren't great with recieving presents like girls. I know I'm very specific about what I want at any point in time and I'll go out and get what I want for myself. And it's usually not cheap. So if I recieve a present, chances are it's not going to be according to what I specifically want.

It drives my wife nuts. Christmas, birthday she insists on giving me something and when she tries to dig out from me what I might want to have, I'm pretty non-descript and less than enthusiastic. Usually I say there's no need don't bother. So she goes out and get's something anyway.

But my wife and all the GFs I had before marriage, never came across one that wasn't thrilled to get gifts. Now my Mrs is still convinced that making me happy is giving me gifts because it thrills her to bits ... for the 'thoughtfulness'. What really makes me happy is when my woman goes out of her way to please and spoil me a little ....

... nice dinner, rent my fav movie like James Bond or some action stuff, followed by nice massage ... followed by romantic foreplay ... followed by torrid sex.... she can wrap herself in a ribon and present herself in her birthday suit would be a great present!

OK here's a question for the boys .... which do you think will score more points with your lady? (someone you're with and has feelings for you or someone who is potentially developing interest in you and not some gold digging chick) ...

A) A one time $1500 present, something like an elegant piece of jewelry or a designer handbag and shoe set or an au couture dress.

or

B) A series of 5 approximately $100 thoughtful presents spread over half a year amounting to $500.

How does the female mind work and why?

I like the plant hunting trip to china, but that will have to wait (maybe in conjunction with the olympics or if they ever get IM China), our travel calendar for 2007 is already full (with races, conferences, weddings, and other backpacking trips).

Her BF would either have to be an avid bird watcher (statistically not likely), gay (not good) or a metro-male. (which is even worse)

Yes, I'm sure he's like that...as a matter of fact neither of us are big on getting gifts. That's why most of these things are small, mostly as a way to show my appreciation for/to him, little things that he'll remember or use regularly, or look forward to using (like the wine).

I'm trying to keep with the theme of 12 days of christmas, but they aren't necessarily 'presents' like most people think of, the books and DVD I mention all have some significance in our relationship, and are things I know he'd enjoy reading/watching/talking about.

Roo, here it is only November 28th and the amount of thought this girl has put into a Chrimstmas gift for her man is truly inspiring. You don't "get it" because GhiaGirl obviously has enough class to hang out with guys who are well beyond your level. If your idea of a thoughtful gift is a naked girl wrapped in a bow than perhaps you'd be better served on some other website.

i have 3 cats and 2 dogs, plus a backyard of wild birds that would love to have your macaw. honestly. send it right over!

She will take your finger off. And, for whatever reason, she only likes females. Do you have any males in the house?

i have a bitch pug, and 2 female cats that would love to tear that bird's guts out.

someone will take your bird. maybe a ronchie old lady would like her, one that would teach it to cuss and drink gin.

I haven't met a dog or cat yet that will stand up to my big red chicken.

"as a matter of fact neither of us are big on getting gifts" - GhiaGirl

Yeah my Mrs usually sings that tune too. But when I give her something, anything as long as it represents thoughtful, she's thrilled to bits. Somehow although I can't confirm but I do suspect you're similar in that femme way. You would not be putting such thought for your BF's presents if you weren't. If he didn't get you something for Christmas ... maybe global warming would be a thing of the past and the new ice age would be here -:) .... just a speculation.

As for me as a guy, I genuinely do not want anything and would be just thrilled to see the kids enjoy their presents and have something to give which will bring a smile to my wife's face. I'm getting myself my own Christmas present which is a pair of state of the art speed in-line skates with the 100mm wheels... and they're not cheap so I wouldn't expect anyone to buy them for me. Another thing I'm aiming for is a Carbon Soloist and that again is not el cheapo.

Actually those experiences gift ideas of yours are not a bad idea. As a bloke I wouldn't mind if my lady were to arrange a dive trip or something similar.

Hey nothing wrong with "back to basics".

Naked girls wrapped in a bow, we then proceed to jacuzzi, smoke some hooch, get into the mood. Sit her on the water jet, to get a little stimulation, and take it from there etc ..."back to basics"

When you've got four young joeys tearing the place up ... the above sounds pretty good to me and pretty much something attainable only in the nostalgic past.

Yeah but I can see it too; our tri girls here are fit of body and active of mind and never short on imagination.

Did you know that it is much harder (practically impossible) to put a fit girl down... lights out in bed ... than one who is basically sedentary? Fit girls can come and come and still be ready and willing for more, after your jaw starts aching and you've already blown your beans, whereas your everyday shiela will be buggerred by the 3rd or 4th set of quiverings. Well that's my experience anyway.

oh my

pictures, or it didn't happen!!

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Steve
TNO OT castaway

i'm convinced you're impotent.

That was so long ago, if I had pics they would be faded by now.

i have a bitch pug, and 2 female cats that would love to tear that bird's guts out.

I doubt a pug or a couple of cats could tear out a macaw's guts. My boyfriend has one and when she's in a mood there's no messing with her. The power of the beak is not to be underestimated.

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Awww, Katy's not all THAT evil. Only slightly evil. In a good way. - JasoninHalifax

Well I did managed 4 kids so far and one from my previous marriage which makes five. ..... hang on .... funny how my kids all resemble the neighbour! -:)

.... actually they don't .... so no wuckin furries there thanks! If I was about, I would hide your pug away if I were you though! I like puggies.

Raising respectable children is a sign of manhood, not having them. Based on your behavior on ST, I can't imagine the influence you have on these young lives is anything but negative.

...
Two roos a-drowning,
And an obnoxious Aussie roasting rotisserie-style!

Hey the thing kittykat was refering to was impotency not manhood or responsibility. It was meant I would say on her part as well as light hearted humour.

I bring up my kids just fine thank-you. Just because you don't agree with my political take on things on ST doesn't give you licence to get that personal. Too bad this is on the internet and not face to face. You sound just like a frikin bitch.

"Two roos a-drowning,
And an obnoxious Aussie roasting rotisserie-style! "

And what's this imature shit ... is it your idea of funnies? Maybe you can explain it cuz I sure don't get it and I seriously doubt anyone else does either. Before you point the fingure at someone else for a character flaw (which I seriously don't mind as long as it's just me you're pointing at) check out your own behaviour ...dickhead!

Oh, I'm a bitch alright. And since when is talking about fuqing someone's dog considered "light hearted." And I haven't read any of your political takes on anything, just senseless/childish humor. I'm allowed to get personal when you invite me into your life with stories of hot tub orgies, bean blowing, and beastiality.

Generally I am diametrically opposed to anything you type. I am shocked at how spot on this post is to what many of my "married with children" guy friends came to consensus over the holiday last week. It is damn near word for word!

I agree that having my wife spoil me and tuck me in with a red bow (she still looks incredible after three kiddos) and nothing else, that there isn't a present she could purchase at any price that would make me any happier. For no other reason than sheer exhaustion from raising three kids under 6, this sort of one on one attention is very rare these days between the two of us and sorely missed on my part.

I too am very interested in the female perspective of the A vs B question about how the mind works. My wifee definitely likes presents, and I usually go the sparkly route, but if more quantity and frequency is better than so be it. I aim to please.

Kangaroo. Don't post any more reasonable points of view. It's not becoming.

Hookem

Well said hookem. Roo, here you go if you need a role model to become a real man some day.

Yeah you are a fucking bitch. Because a real man would never take things to this personal level over nothing. A bitch whose too fucking dumb to realize what constitutes joking around what is stepping over the line about other's kids and family. What are you anyway, some self gratifying high morale hypocrite? Am I busting your virgin ears with my dirty jokes which weren't even an attack on you in the first place? I've got a Golden Retriever named Tyson. You can fire away and go to town on him all you want; it's not the same thing. As I said in my previous post, you can direct any insult toward me you like ... that's no problem.

I've explained it.

If you're just an asshole who doesn't get it that's nobody else's fault. Like I said if it were face to face this conversation would end very abruptly.

"Well said hookem. Roo, here you go if you need a role model to become a real man some day."

Don't assume that you are qualified to give your unwanted stupid advice to anyone else. Save it for yourself.

Oh I'm no role model. Just a guy killing time till the clock strikes five.

I've been slacking in my lurking lately. Apparrently Roo has ruffled your feathers and vice versa. Heated debate is good for the heart and the mind, but neither of you should take anything anyone types into a keyboard so personally as to go off like this. I try to type as if my 6 yo was proof reading.

There you go. My role model moment for the day.

Now fuck off! I'm going home.

I still want to know which is better: A or B!!!!???? A little help...women of ST?

B, definitely

Wait, what is A?

What is B?

I'd rather have 5 $100 dollar thoughtful gifts throughout the year than one $1500 gift at Christmas. Not that any boyfriend I've ever had would do either, but hypothetically of course...

Jodi

1) Generally I am diametrically opposed to anything you type.

Well you know opposing views especially on controversial issues on an internet forum is the norm. Sticking to the topic and a little ribbing thrown in is also usual. But getting into someone's family biz with negative comment and insult is a cowardly personal attack to do hiding behind the computer monitor where there are no consequences.

2) "I agree that having my wife spoil me and tuck me in with a red bow (she still looks incredible after three kiddos) and nothing else, that there isn't a present she could purchase at any price that would make me any happier. For no other reason than sheer exhaustion from raising three kids under 6, this sort of one on one attention is very rare these days between the two of us and sorely missed on my part."

You said it.

3) "I too am very interested in the female perspective of the A vs B question about how the mind works. My wifee definitely likes presents, and I usually go the sparkly route, but if more quantity and frequency is better than so be it. I aim to please. Kangaroo. Don't post any more reasonable points of view. It's not becoming.

OK just one last one for you...endure -

With option A) let's say you get 100 points for the fantastic $1500 present. But if you don't follow up that value is quickly used up.

Now with option B), you will get as high as 80 points or more for each $100, because for our women it's all about the thoughtfulness that makes you so adorable! Now 5 X 80 and that adds up to a whopping 400 points all from a relatively measely $500 bucks spread over such a long time frame. Futhermore since it is periodically spread out you never allow those brownie points to diminish and build on existing points like compound interest. Meaning you keep your lady a lot happier and beaming!

But in reality the man usually goes for A cuz that's what he would value most for himself and the lady goes for B which is usually what she would appreciate most for herself. The fact that both then get limited appreciation from their considerable efforts to their respective partners canunfortunately often be the source of some chagrin.

In fact it was things like this now that I think back that led to my first divorce. She just couldn't believe all the thoughtful things she was doing for me and me just taking it for granted which indicated to her that I just didn't love her enough which was a source of a lot of frustration. I remember once she planned a surprise birthday party for me and invited all my best workout mateys from the gym and martial arts who were really my inner circle as we had mostly been through Uni together as well and I was just ho-hum. That really pissed her no-end. Now I am older and smarter and feign appreciation.

So if I may be allowed to be a little presumptious, ... I would say there is a lesson to be learnt from that.

Now GhiaGirl ... do you still think your approach of the 12 little presents for the 12 days of Christmas is the best for your BF? For us men, one really stupendous present like P2C and we'll remember it and be indebted for life!

Indoor triathalon? That is just wrong. Where are your numbers?

Why not swim in all those great lakes nearby?

I still want to know which is better: A or B!!!!???? A little help...women of ST?

I get both. Whenever my boyfriend sees something that he thinks I'd like (quite often a handbag) he picks it up. He goes a little over board at Christmas.

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Awww, Katy's not all THAT evil. Only slightly evil. In a good way. - JasoninHalifax

I guess we could cut a hole in the ice for the swim, put snow tires on the bikes and wear boots for the run...

Actually at U. Wisconsin there was a club that would play upside-down underwater ice hockey every year using the ice on Lake Mendota. Good times...

Jodi

Does he have a brother?

You made that up

Ha! He's far from perfect, but he is generous.

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Awww, Katy's not all THAT evil. Only slightly evil. In a good way. - JasoninHalifax

I guess it may have just been a publicity stunt for the underwater hockey team (which practices in pools). Strange sport, but true.

Jodi

"I'd rather have 5 $100 dollar thoughtful gifts throughout the year than one $1500 gift at Christmas. Not that any boyfriend I've ever had would do either, but hypothetically of course... " - Jodi

But of course you would. Because you are simply a red blooded female of the human species.

If you ever get a BF who goes out of his way to give you B) .... you can be pretty sure he's the one who is really dedicated to you ... because he's actually going against his grain to pull it off.

To those doubters, ask yourself, why do women make such a big deal about getting a bunch of flowers or/and a box of chocs? Not that expensive.

If us men were to get something like that from a nubile wench newbie, the little gift would simply be a sign of anticipated things to be had and the imaginations would start a running. For the ladies the flowers and the chocolates in themselves are like the big deal, so much so the man is hopeful it will please enough to get a little something in return. Unless the dude is repugnant to that girl, those simple flowers an expression of thoughtfulness sure will get some good leverage.

There might be hope for Roo yet. How do you clean up and look in a suit?

Well like I said, you can throw anything you like at my comments, insult me personally no problemo. But I'm glad you seem to see where I'm coming from. I would kiss and make up except my name's not Mark Foley or Ted Haggard.

Okay, honestly I'm hoping for a trip somewhere with him...some place where we can spend an entire 3-4 days together, where he's not on call, I don't take my bike and go for a long ride...

There are things I want for Christmas, but mostly those are things that I'll tell my parents and my family (they still hound me about what I want for Christmas...I guess they too think I'm hard to buy for), but they are things like a roomba and/and or scooba, a new camelback, an automatic dog/horse waterer that hooks up to an outside water spicket etc...

The BF always cooks great food for me, feeds me great wines, takes me to great shows, so I want to make sure that he knows I apreciate it all,

Well, the whole 12 days of christmas is actually going to end the 24th, then on the 25th, he'll have nothing left to unwrap except me....or that's my plan anyway ;-)

Or maybe I only need 11 'gifts' and I'll be the 12th...I think that might work...4 Calling Birds could be the iPod (music), 3 French Hens (1 bottle of French Wine, One bottle of nice Cognac, one nice champagne), 2 turtle doves (some homemade...or high end....chocolate caramel concoction), and a partridge in a pear tree (me...of course for the pear tree...I'd just get a pair of green heals....)

 

Now GhiaGirl ... do you still think your approach of the 12 little presents for the 12 days of Christmas is the best for your BF? For us men, one really stupendous present like P2C and we'll remember it and be indebted for life![/reply]Yes, because I know the BIG things he wants...and they are way out of my price range this year. The BF has been great about doing little things for me and doesn't expect a lot in return, heck he's thrilled when I take his dog on a hike (cause he's still at work...and that way when he gets home he can relax and not have to try to tire the pooch out)

pugs are cute! and like a typical pug parent, i think mine are absolutely sensational.
(was only kidding about the weiner thing. but i guess you know that)

Holy crap.

I pull something out of my arse, jot it down expecting a solid hour of flaming, and arrive home to read this borderline civil and respectful drivel!?

Jodi. Thanks for your opinion. I've thought this for a while, but it's nice to get some perspective once in a while. Where it comes from you can never be certain, as in this case the best worded, sensible male perspective came from Roo. Whodathunkit. Regardless, thanks to you, roo, and everyone that has contributed.

I will rethink my gift giving strategy for this holiday and the year to come. I don't think any amount of gifts can tell my wife how much she means to me, but if she will appreciate more and smaller gifts than one large expensive one, then that is what she will get. She seems to be pretty normal, at least as normal as a hysterical woman can be. That is normal for women, correct? I learned to stir the pot from Roo:-)

somewhere between the words "bitch and "suit" i got lost in the arguement.

but, just to be on point, it's not really that clean or healthy to pull things out of your arse. a person could get hurt doing things like that!

She will take your finger off. And, for whatever reason, she only likes females. Do you have any males in the house?

A lot of people don't realize how long those birds live. I heard on NPR one time that it actually is a problem with what to do with these birds as they often outlive their owners. I think it is not uncommon for them to live to 80-90 years. Most people don't get them until they are 20 or 30 so you can do the math and see the problem. Also, from what I understand they are terribly territorial. On that same NPR story, they had one instance where the female bird thought that it was mated to her owner, and it was a really serious problem when the guy married a woman. I'm not sure how the bird figured it out that it was now number 2 but it did. I'm pretty much an animal lover, but you can keep your bird!

Bernie

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"Slowbern has always made astute observations."-Casey 03/10/2009
2013-2014 Detroit Lions---13-3 until proved otherwise.

Yeah I think pugs are 'cute' too ie ugly but adorable, but I'm more predisposed to the bigger working dog breeds. Basically I like all dogs, except the ones that yap uncontrollably all the time and hump people's legs. But that's not the dog's fault. If I come across a dog owned by a girl who starts humping my leg .... that gives me an excuse to hump her leg. If she complains I'll say that her dog started it!

My weiner thing.... go ahead kitty ... say and do whatever turns you on! -:)

OK Hookem, let us know how it works out. In fact I'm sure your wife will have that feeling of being so much more appreciated all the time.

Merry Christmas to you and all the family and you and the Mrs have a va-va-voom one too. I'm hoping to get some too .... hmmm what pressie can I get? ... something that says I am such a thoughtful guy....

Cheers

Well it sounds like you're all out to spoil him. Lucky GhiaGirl's Doctor Guy. He'll be relaxed then he'll be expending energy with a grinding GhiaGirl I assume...... yeah .... lucky fellar .... 12 days of Christmas ....yeeee-har giddy-yup! He'll be or remain trim and slim without even going for his training workouts.

Talking about doctors, you know, I've always been curious how a gynaecologist get's romantic when he get's home to his shiela. Examining sick, foul smelling, puss excreting, blistered pussies all day can't be much of a mood setter. Though for me I guess that could be a turn on ie an aquired taste, like caviar.

Cheers,

those birds get passed down in wills!
to each their own, but i prefer birds outside. lol.

those birds get passed down in wills!
to each their own, but i prefer birds outside. lol.

"...and to my youngest son, I bequeath Polly the macaw." Gee, thanks. My wife and I have several bird feeders of different kinds. My favorite is in spring and fall when I can put out the oranges and attract the migrating Baltimore Orioles. They are really cool looking birds. The woodpeckers at the suet feeders are fun also. My wife was all in lather a month ago because she spied the White-crowned Sparrow at one of the feeders. One of my ideas for a Christmas present for my wife this year is to get her a meal-worm farm so that she can grow meal-worms to feed the bluebirds. I'm such a romantic!

Bernie

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"Slowbern has always made astute observations."-Casey 03/10/2009
2013-2014 Detroit Lions---13-3 until proved otherwise.

I actually care for 3 parrots and belong to a nonprofit organization that rescues unwanted/problem birds. Many owners don't realize what they're getting into when they take on one of these feathered guys. Because parrots are so intelligent, they need mental stimulation and interaction. Therefore, they often suffer mental abuse as well as physical. Typically, these birds live 50 to 60 years but there have been cases of parrots living 80 +.

http://www.wasatchavian.com/

That book (five love languages) saved my parents marriage and has enhanced mine. It helped me to see that my wife and I express our love differently, and instead of offering words of affirmation to my wife - I do better by spending time with her or doing something for her.

Excellent book!

yeah, and there are special bluebird feeders! that is an awesome gift.

i love woodpeckers and feed them the most--but also titmice, nuthatches, wrens and a few other birds eat the same thing the peckers do.

good stuff!

I think you're just trying to get roo started with all the bird names

Have you seen the documentary The Wild Parrots of Telegraph Hill?

I'm no bird lover, more like bird phobic, but I found it really interesting.