Marcag,

Notes sync back and forth based on a series of simple rules, try it and you will figure it right out. On a daily basis, WKO4 only syncs back only about 30 days (there are a few underlying rules) so the sync runs quickly. Try this:

1. Check for updates - you should be on B296
2. Open the athlete details page and click the EDIT button on the TrainingPeaks Athlete line
3. Enter user info, wait to you get the account valid message, then change your sync from "Download only" (or what ever you have) to "Do Not Sync" then back to your "download only" and close UI.
4. Sync with TrainingPeaks.

That should trigger a full resync of all your files in TP. Let me know if any issues.

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Tim Cusick
TrainingPeaks WKO4 Product Development Leader

The Facebook Group is just a bunch of people talking about ideas and charts. You can do that here, either Andy or I tend to reply when needed and help where we can.

Is there something specific you looking for? Help? Advice? Have an idea of something you would like to analyze or track? Post it, can help!

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Tim Cusick
TrainingPeaks WKO4 Product Development Leader

To Andrew Coggan. Today I read your article about runner power metric. What runner power meter would you recommend for get best data?

Just FYI, I just had an exactly identical experience to refthimos in Post #249.

I'm a Golden Cheetah, user, but just got a coach who works in the TP/WKO sphere.

So I have my folder full of 5 years of FIT files that I wanted to upload for him. And I wanted to understand the WKO features he's using so I sprung for the ~$130 personal upgrade copy of WKO4.

Same as refthimos. I was surprised that WKO4 apparently has no native file-reading capability. So I downloaded Device Agent and tried to use that to synch to WKO4. It repeatedly either crashed or either froze so long that Windows asked me if I wanted to kill the program. I switched to synching to trainingpeaks.com. Same deal. So I started uploading in much smaller batches 3-4 months at a time. That seemed to start working. Although the interface isn't great. There's no progress bar or "circular arrows synch animation" like in other similar programs, e.g. GC, Xert. You just stare at the screen and hope it's doing something. Then just check to see if data is actually showing up.

Then I ended up having a bunch of duplicates because my crashing episodes apparently had done *something*. And there's no duplicate-detection like in Strava. So I had to go manually delete duplicates.

I think I got it all sorted out, finally. But what should have been maybe a 10-minute operation took me around two hours. Not an auspicious start to my WKO4 experience. I hope it's all uphill from here.

Edit: I understand this could be considered a Device Agent rather than WKO, issue, mostly. As a software engineer myself I suspect that the Device Agent file upload routine is actually blocking the main GUI event-processing thread. Which is a huge no-no in GUI design. But I'm reporting it to this thread anyway because I'm apparently required to use DA to do bulk upload to WKO4?

Could you provide a link to this article please? And in view of the fact that Andrew Coggan is a consultant for Stryd running power meters, my guess is that he would consider them to be the one to purchase!!

Trail,


In the athlete bar, hit new athlete. Assign a name, lets name him Joe Simple, or maybe Jane Simple.

Now drag and drop all 500 .fit files over WKO4 and drop, UI will pop up and ask if you want to assign those 500 files to Joe or Jane simple.

Then watch progress bar till complete.

Give it a try with any .FIT from the group, will see how easy it is.

...and Device Agent is going to die very soon, do not use it, messes things up. Use the native file parser found in WKO4 which can be drag and dropped or set to auto sync every hour with your TP account OR just plug in your Garmin Device and it will see it and automatically load any new files (like Strava but no KOM). Here is a great help article showing all the different way you can get files in: http://help.trainingpeaks.com/...out-files-into-WKO4-

I would start again as the crashes tend to happen when people mess with the folders. Close WKO4 delete using PC find and remove program then drag and drop the WKO4 folder in documents into the trash. For make, drag the application from finder into the trash, then drag the WKO4 folder into documents into the trash. If stable, you probably worked trough it but might be worth doing it right before you start, up to you, glad to help if you need it.

Should watch this "Getting Started" video as you get started, will help:

Here is a "playlist" of all the how to videos: https://www.youtube.com/...skGICU-jM_bzecPQuAjC

Here is a "playlist" to all the learning webinars: https://www.youtube.com/...H_fz5oO9UwwVm_KXsLQ3

I would join the facebook user group, they really are doing some amazing cool stuff. https://www.facebook.com/groups/WKO4powerusers/

Sorry for the confusion and frustration you had. We try to keep things simple and put out support materials to avoid.....

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Tim Cusick
TrainingPeaks WKO4 Product Development Leader

RMT,

Here is the article that is referenced: https://home.trainingpeaks.com/...r-running-with-power

I have not tested any of the running power meters as, that would mean I would have to run.... :-)

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Tim Cusick
TrainingPeaks WKO4 Product Development Leader

Thanks Tim :-)

No worries, it is a BIG change and easy to get things balled up. Let me know if you need other help, glad to get you rolling. The facebook gorup is really good, ask a question in there, get fast answers....plus lots of good ideas and new thinking.

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Tim Cusick
TrainingPeaks WKO4 Product Development Leader

Oops, confused you with trail.

The running thing is very cool but can tell you two things. You can always count on Andy's objectivity. He is working with them to help figure out what to do with the data and help progress it, not sell. The items that are developed in WKO4 are open and usable by any run power meter if the right data is present. Second, in my opinion, running with power is a little premature and everyone trying to raise to power conclusions, still needs time and thinking. Look at the article and Ideas Andy developed for WKO4, they are not "new power levels" they are based on an array of data such devices are making available to help better understand running before even getting into things like training intensity. All good learning but will take some time to mature.

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Tim Cusick
TrainingPeaks WKO4 Product Development Leader

Thanks for the detailed reply! I guess I should RTFM before complaining. Or WTFV.

I'll try it out tonight.

lol..like I said big change, hard to get it. We knew when we did something this complex, be a learning curve. The funny thing is it can be the simple things that trip people up.....

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Tim Cusick
TrainingPeaks WKO4 Product Development Leader

Try never to SPAM events or items but here is a cool one. We (Dr. Andy Coggan, Dean Golich of CTS and some special guests) have been asked to put together a conference on Innovations in Training with Power for Endurance Sports. It will be more publicly marketed next week but trying to give early WKO4 adapters a head start as spots limited. USAT has confirmed 6 CEU and we expect final number from USAC any moment but pending for now. Feel free to ask questions. Here is the website with signup links if interested: http://www.itp4es.com/

Sorry again to promote, tell me if out of line.

Thanks!

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Tim Cusick
TrainingPeaks WKO4 Product Development Leader

Thank you to the National Institute for Fitness and Sport and IUPUI's Sports Innovation Institute for their support!

So I posted a while ago asking something similar but with no data. Hopefully with a bit of data this is easier to see.

I did a run that (for me) is a bit more hilly than usual. Avg pace 5:25/km now normally I run on the flat sub 5:00/km at a HR around 160bpm. During this run my avg HR was around 168bpm.

So my thinking would be that this is fairly obvious it's a hilly run and I'm working harder. Therefore I would be expecting more TSS and the NGP to be higher, in fact I would think NGP would be sub-5:00/km if I use HR as a guide for effort. However it came out at 5:21 NGP. This seems low and gives me a TSS for a hilly 19.8km lower than 22km on the flat at easy effort.

So the question is- is the NGP and TSS correct and I just need to man up- Im not used to hills enough. OR is the NGP and TSS reporting wrongly, maybe watch malfunction? Fenix 3. Or am I thinking off NGP wrongly I am assuming it is like NP in the bike where I would expect a hilly ride with bursts of effort to generate a nigher NP than avg pow.

Heres a screenshot

NGP is Dr. Steve McGregor's idea, so you may get a better answer from him. If I had to guess, though, the hills simply weren't long enough and/or you didn't attack them hard enough to really drive the algorithm.

As for your heart rate, maybe it means the run was harder than suggested by NGP, or maybe not...heart rate can be fickle that way. It is also well-known that average heart rate will be higher at the same average intensity when your effort is variable vs. constant. Finally, it is also possible that running uphill results in a higher heart rate for you than running on the flat, even at the same intensity, due to differences in muscle use.

What can be said with certainly: WKO4 calculates NGP the same way WKO+ 3.0 did, and the way TP does.

Hi all, I need some help here.

I´m using on WKO4 the chart "WKO3 CLASSIC CHART PMC RUN PACK", would like to show on it peal paces (p6,p30,p60,p120).
How could I add those metrics to show on this chart? Don´t really now the expression I need to use.

Thanks a lot!

Plenty of those availble, best to join the Facebook group and ask as lots of info is there: https://www.facebook.com/groups/WKO4powerusers/

Just join and post, users will help you out. You can also search the chart library.

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Tim Cusick
TrainingPeaks WKO4 Product Development Leader

Are there plans to have WKO4 and/or TrainingPeaks recognize Garmin multisport .fit files? Currently it looks like there's some data dropped on the floor from e.g. a FR920XT and triathlons or customised multisport events (an indoor run warmup to a strength training session.) Also: how does WKO4 and/or TrainingPeaks deal with the Garmin swim HR sensors that upload HR data after the workout has finished (HR appended to the end of the .fit file.)

BTW: dead-simple Garmin Connect bulk download tool: garmin-connect-export (as long as your system speaks Python.)

Anyone? Bueller? Golden Cheetah?

See two posts above...

What makes you think that TrainingPeaks / WKO4 do not deal with them? The post on Device Agent? Have you tried it? Upload it to TrainingPeaks and what happens?

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Tim Cusick
TrainingPeaks WKO4 Product Development Leader

The fact that the only time any FR920XT multisport files are properly analyzed by TrainingPeaks / WKO4 is when they're ingested via Garmin Connect sync, which splits them into individual sub-activities. Importing the raw, on-device FIT file into TrainingPeaks / WKO4 doesn't yield the same activity entries or analysis. Ditto for HRM-Swim data: MIA on both platforms.

I am trying to follow your chain of thinking and learn more to better understand. So your point is that you cannot download it directly to TP or WKO4 (the 920xt) as that needs to go through Garmin Connect. This is correct. Here are the instructions to load: http://help.trainingpeaks.com/...nt-to-Download-files

Now, to your point as you stated it. Garmin Connect breaks them into sub-activities and sends the raw data. Again, correct as far as I have tested, been a while since I looked at it. Your last point, you suggest it sends the raw data (correct) and TP / WKO4 comes up with different numbers?

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Tim Cusick
TrainingPeaks WKO4 Product Development Leader

All I want for Christmas: WKO4 and TP to be able to ingest and process raw FR920XT multisport / HRM-Swim FIT files straight off the device (via "Import / read file"), without requiring Garmin Connect in between. A basic expectation for any app / platform that attempts to cater to triathletes and wants to charge for the privilege.