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Re: Challenge Atlantic City [GMAN19030] [ In reply to ]
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Maine has also been a very large event for them. I wouldn't discount that race from your analysis. I'd find it doubtful WTC would want it, given Timberman 1-2 weeks prior as well as Tremblant.

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Re: Challenge Atlantic City [sinkinswimmer] [ In reply to ]
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sinkinswimmer wrote:
thirstygreek wrote:
Not sure if you personally have an axe to grind with WTC competition but I will vouch for CAC (Half). It was a 1st class triathlon, from bib PU to the actual race to the great finish line setup. Maybe the site needs more attention but coming from the people who did the event I think it is largely positive feedback. I will be back 100% for sure. I actually earned myself a free room at Ballys for next year :)


Well, almost 600 did the full last year. 150 did it this year. Your'e right..that is GREAT positive feedback. Races that are so well run almost always see a 75 percent drop in participation.

My point, though, is that if Challenge wants people like me to try their events, they should do just that wee little bit to get me interested. I think rather than looking at it as an axe, it would be taken as constructive criticism. Since that word of mouth thing does not seem to be working for them, perhaps making the whole thing look first class would help.


Not sure how you earned that room at Ballys, but you may want to book another room just in case. Casinos are leaving AC faster than full distance registration
I did the Half, so I cant speak for the Full and why it dropped so much in participation. My wife and I had a blast and stayed until Monday afternoon. We don't gamble in general . I think she spent $20 on slots while I went to bed early pre-race. Post race though we ate some excellent food at a few stops on the Boardwalk, then as the beers kicked in we went dancing like fools at a couple different spots until 1AM. We havent had that much fun in a while without kids. So for me it adds value to be able to do all that at a race that is a 5hr drive away. I will say that MANY of the AC/Boardwalk people are a bit odd we just ignored them.

I am looking forward to Challenge Maine. This course is VERY underrated. As for the free room all it took was good credit, saw a sign for a free room if you're approved for a Visa. Applied -approved and there a free room for next year at Ballys/Ceasars. Stick that in the sock drawer.

"Base training is bull shit" - desertdude
Last edited by: thirstygreek: Jul 2, 15 6:53
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Re: Challenge Atlantic City [thirstygreek] [ In reply to ]
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Regarding the website stuff, I agree, that is something that bothers me when the organizers can't keep things updated, It's just attention to detail.

But as far as the drop in participation, I want to give them a one year pass and I think next year is the tell. The first year, with that horrendous swim course and the problems with the bike course, I think is what caused the drop in registration for 2015

They really cleaned up the swim and improved the bike course for this year. Granted it will take word of mouth, but I think people waited to see what they would change for the 2nd year and how it would work.
If it's getting positive feedback, which I think it is, it will be interesting to see if the 3rd year is a bounce back.

I think Atlantic City could be a great destination for a race like this. I root for that city, but it is on the ropes for sure. I feel like these races lack community support. We stopped in at a bar post race after we ate and it was a handful of locals just bitching about the road closures. The CRDA can be in full support of this all they want, but they aren't the ones that are going to blow through an intersection due to frustration and hit someone.

But ultimately, I really think they should consider dropping the full and really making a fantastic 70.3.
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Re: Challenge Atlantic City [rrheisler] [ In reply to ]
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rrheisler wrote:
Maine has also been a very large event for them. I wouldn't discount that race from your analysis.

There were 283 people that did the half last year. So yes... I'm discounting it. I don't consider 283 as a very large event. That's an age group for WTC.

Favorite Gear: Dimond | Cadex | Desoto Sport | Hoka One One
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Re: Challenge Atlantic City [GMAN19030] [ In reply to ]
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283 finishers is not 283 registrations. I'm also assuming that you're not looking at the Olympic, which draws a good-sized field, nor the aqua bike and relays.

The 2013 version of the event was also much larger. The Maine tri scene was very dead in '14 across the board (40-50% decline in registrations statewide) with a significant rebound noted thus far in the year.

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Re: Challenge Atlantic City [sinkinswimmer] [ In reply to ]
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sinkinswimmer wrote:
thirstygreek wrote:
Not sure if you personally have an axe to grind with WTC competition but I will vouch for CAC (Half). It was a 1st class triathlon, from bib PU to the actual race to the great finish line setup. Maybe the site needs more attention but coming from the people who did the event I think it is largely positive feedback. I will be back 100% for sure. I actually earned myself a free room at Ballys for next year :)


Well, almost 600 did the full last year. 150 did it this year. Your right...that is GREAT positive feedback. Races that are so well run almost always see a 75 percent drop in participation.

My point, though, is that if Challenge wants people like me to try their events, they should do just that wee little bit to get me interested. I think rather than looking at it as an axe, it would be taken as constructive criticism. Since that word of mouth thing does not seem to be working for them, perhaps making the whole thing look first class would help.

I DNF's the full last year and finished the Half this year. In order for this race and all other US Challenge races to be successful, they need honest feedback from anyone that is willing to provided it. The race director requests if from all participants via surveys, Facebook, Twitter, etc. He certainly is on Slowtwich reading this thread. I enjoyed the race on Sunday, but there are definitely some issues that need to be addressed right away...I haven't even looked at their website so many of your comments could be spot on and should be fixed. In as much as many people base WTC and Ironman branded races, their races are extremely well organized (my only gripe is the cost of their races).

There should be no reason that Challenge AC doesn't draw 1,000+ participants considering its location, but in order to do that it has to get the little things right (e.g. website, course length, etc.) and then market the hell out of it.

Jamie
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Re: Challenge Atlantic City [jwadtri] [ In reply to ]
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I did the full and my garmin measured 112 for the bike. Can't get closer than that.
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Re: Challenge Atlantic City [davetri1] [ In reply to ]
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davetri1 wrote:
I did the full and my garmin measured 112 for the bike. Can't get closer than that.
As did mine - but the half was actually 58 miles long, which is what I think people are complaining about. It wasn't advertised as being slightly long, yet it was. Personally I don't see it as a big deal but there were definitely a few people complaining loudly about 2 extra miles.

Hell even IM Chatt is "long" by a few...
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Re: Challenge Atlantic City [noofus] [ In reply to ]
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noofus wrote:
davetri1 wrote:
I did the full and my garmin measured 112 for the bike. Can't get closer than that.
As did mine - but the half was actually 58 miles long, which is what I think people are complaining about. It wasn't advertised as being slightly long, yet it was. Personally I don't see it as a big deal but there were definitely a few people complaining loudly about 2 extra miles.

Hell even IM Chatt is "long" by a few...

I got 112.2 on my Suunto, but I can't remember exactly where I started/stopped it relative to the mats.
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Re: Challenge Atlantic City [WelshinPhilly] [ In reply to ]
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THIS!!!


"Swim along the Bader Field side of the loop was interesting, especially on the second loop - I could have sworn someone was moving that inflatable Gatorade bottle along the shoreline just to fuck with us. "

I thought the same exact thing!

To breathe, to feel, to know I'm alive.
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Re: Challenge Atlantic City [sinkinswimmer] [ In reply to ]
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About this "That same lack seems to show up on race day based on reports (low signs, confusing course) based on some posts on this thread. "

We're talking a first year / second year race. Confusion can happen anywhere and I'd suspect many races run into this in their first few years. I didn't see any sign for a turn for the 2nd run lap at IMLP one year. Race directors didn't make it clear where this would be in any diagram or at the athlete meeting. And that was a 10+ year old event at the time.

I had zero problems following the CAC course either this year or last year (full disclosure, both times only doing swim-bike). Could some things be tweeked to be even better than they were this year, surely. But no part of this event, either this year or last year, was "bush league".

To breathe, to feel, to know I'm alive.
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Re: Challenge Atlantic City [Tsunami] [ In reply to ]
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Tsunami wrote:
About this "That same lack seems to show up on race day based on reports (low signs, confusing course) based on some posts on this thread. "

We're talking a first year / second year race. Confusion can happen anywhere and I'd suspect many races run into this in their first few years. I didn't see any sign for a turn for the 2nd run lap at IMLP one year. Race directors didn't make it clear where this would be in any diagram or at the athlete meeting. And that was a 10+ year old event at the time.

I had zero problems following the CAC course either this year or last year (full disclosure, both times only doing swim-bike). Could some things be tweeked to be even better than they were this year, surely. But no part of this event, either this year or last year, was "bush league".

Oh. Ok. So just the websites are just bush league. Thanks for the clarification. So, what is the date for CAC in 2016? Just curious.
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Re: Challenge Atlantic City [sinkinswimmer] [ In reply to ]
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I found June 27, 2016. Registration is reportedly opening in September.

FWIW, I agree the websites need major work.

To breathe, to feel, to know I'm alive.
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Re: Challenge Atlantic City [Tsunami] [ In reply to ]
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Kudos to you, because I could not find it on the main Challenge site, CAC site or Facebook. Ironically, I asked because I am likely signing up for the half as it is not far from me and will fit in perfect for a test run for IMMD (another race I cannot believe I am going to sign up for). I agree with GMAN (and have said before) Challenge ought ot abandon the whole full distance in the US and focus on the half. If they put all their energies into putting on great halves, they may be able to build a niche. And of course...they can fix their websites. :)
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Re: Challenge Atlantic City [sinkinswimmer] [ In reply to ]
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sinkinswimmer wrote:
Kudos to you, because I could not find it on the main Challenge site, CAC site or Facebook. Ironically, I asked because I am likely signing up for the half as it is not far from me and will fit in perfect for a test run for IMMD (another race I cannot believe I am going to sign up for). I agree with GMAN (and have said before) Challenge ought ot abandon the whole full distance in the US and focus on the half. If they put all their energies into putting on great halves, they may be able to build a niche. And of course...they can fix their websites. :)

Honestly they kinda are focusing on the Half distance. Most of their races are Half/Oly. They only have two fulls in the US (AC and Cedar Point). I don't think it hurts to continue to include that as an option in those two locations. Of course I would prefer to see a larger crowd for the AC full as this year was quite lonely out on course.

The half at AC seemed to be a really good size race. I really do hope this continues as the venue is certainly unique and brings its own bizarre flavor. Dodging oblivious fat people on the boardwalk becomes a sick amusement on its own :)
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Re: Challenge Atlantic City [sinkinswimmer] [ In reply to ]
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Imo CAC is a much better full than IMMD.
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Challenge Atlantic City Race Report 9:14 [ In reply to ]
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Finally finished report at www.dreambigjp.net

THANKS to DELMO sports for putting this event on! Although there are many things that can be improved I LOVE this race! It's clear the race management cares about the athlete experience and I really believe if they can find a way to increase entries many of the problems can be taken care of. It's tough to run a race of this magnitude on a small budget. I hope it survives. It was the most exciting race I've ever been part of and a HUGE congrats to all finishers!

Jeff Paul
http://www.dreambigjp.net
XTERRA (Pro Deal Code- SA-JPAUL) GU Energy Kiwami, Zipp Wheels,
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Re: Challenge Atlantic City [davetri1] [ In reply to ]
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I think CAC was a solid race. There were just over 550 people in the 70.3 with a lot of no-shows. I might blame the storm the day before for scaring some off but man that made the weather perfect.

Is two miles on the bike course a huge deal? No. But I flatted with 55.5 on the gps and said to myself "Screw it, I'm half a mile from transition". Yeah, I was more than pissed to find that it was actually 2.5 miles because I would have made a very different decision at that moment. Just announce it in advance! It isn't going to scare anyone off and we can all be prepared properly. The map the day before the race said 56. The pre-race meeting the number 56 was thrown around. Then in the results it says 58. Every RD says "It's your responsibility to know the course" - I agree but I should know the distance. I know that where I flatted is the rarity but you can see why I even debated coasting in.

The run: It is what it is. The boardwalk is crowded and unshaded. The issue I had is that the volunteer at turn 3 was giving bad information to people and having people do a little loop before they could head to what was actually going to be turn 2. I stopped and explained to her that she was giving the wrong info and she said "Sorry, I am just a volunteer" - I thanked her for being there for us and explained the turns. Know your course, right?

I think Delmo is a very good RD. My suggestion is to take a good chunk of the run off the boardwalk and only have the final five miles up there. I don't think anyone really enjoys dodging the foot traffic and pedi-cabs so much that they'd be unhappy with a change.

I had a good experience and will consider racing it again. If I were Challenge however I'd consider pushing back the date to September. With Eagleman/Syracuse so close it is in a dead zone. With the demise of the Princeton 70.3 it could really fill a hole in the Fall. My 2 cents.
Last edited by: Jerseydave77: Jul 2, 15 13:43
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Re: Challenge Atlantic City [Jerseydave77] [ In reply to ]
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I actually LOVE the boardwalk run. I did the full last year when we left the boardwalk and that was the worst part of the race. I do think they could improve it by marketing more to people down there what is going on. I don't mind dodging people on the course...I think it all adds to the excitement. I've done many other IM where the run leads you out to where no one is at on the course and I enjoyed being able to see familiar faces every 5 miles rather than at the start and finish. I think the boardwalk run is what COULD make this event majestic but you are right...lots of things to fix.

Jeff Paul
http://www.dreambigjp.net
XTERRA (Pro Deal Code- SA-JPAUL) GU Energy Kiwami, Zipp Wheels,
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Re: Challenge Atlantic City [Jeff Paul IA] [ In reply to ]
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Jeff Paul IA wrote:
I actually LOVE the boardwalk run. I did the full last year when we left the boardwalk and that was the worst part of the race. I do think they could improve it by marketing more to people down there what is going on. I don't mind dodging people on the course...I think it all adds to the excitement. I've done many other IM where the run leads you out to where no one is at on the course and I enjoyed being able to see familiar faces every 5 miles rather than at the start and finish. I think the boardwalk run is what COULD make this event majestic but you are right...lots of things to fix.

Last year they had out sandwich boards in the crowded parts of the boardwalk saying "Race In Progress". None this year. I am sure that might have helped. IN any case I much prefer this year's version without the run to Margate. That was just too hot out there on the asphalt. Staying on the boards the whole way was much better. If I remember correctly, you were the overall winner, so congrats!
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Re: Challenge Atlantic City [Jerseydave77] [ In reply to ]
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Either September or mid May!
I think the weather in AC mid May would be a perfect for racing. Probably less crowded as school is still on.
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Re: Challenge Atlantic City [noofus] [ In reply to ]
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If the trams were just a bit faster you could pull in behind one of them, they clear a pretty nice lane ;)


Rodney
TrainingPeaks | Altra Running | RAD Roller
http://www.goinglong.ca
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Re: Challenge Atlantic City [noofus] [ In reply to ]
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noofus wrote:
davetri1 wrote:
I did the full and my garmin measured 112 for the bike. Can't get closer than that.
As did mine - but the half was actually 58 miles long, which is what I think people are complaining about. It wasn't advertised as being slightly long, yet it was. Personally I don't see it as a big deal but there were definitely a few people complaining loudly about 2 extra miles.

Hell even IM Chatt is "long" by a few...

I don't understand all the bitching about this. Same day our results reflected the 58mi. We all raced 58mi on the bike. It was not an advantage nor disadvantage. There's no one racing that race who is so damn precise with their power outputs that 56mi is perfect for an ideal run but 58mi destroys their legs and the run is ruined. It's all non-sense. Sorry they didn't tell us 58 in the first place. Life goes on. The race otherwise was a blast. Considering the weather conditions exceptionally run. I'd have done the full if there wasn't a half option as well. I think that plays into the attendance drop. I can also tell you that I had several teammates who had originally signed up for the full (6 I believe) and ultimately transitioned to relays bc of injuries. Wonder if that happened with others as well. I'll definitely go next year again no doubt. The other races these guys put on (Delmo Sports) are packed and solid races. They were doing AC well before Challenge came along and specialize in ocean front community races. Yes there are improvements (aid stations for the 100th time), but for a second year race under a new brand, they did a nice job and attendance was solid.
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Re: Challenge Atlantic City [cmd111183] [ In reply to ]
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Anyone have any info regarding the status of the FULL for 2016? Site still has no info, would imagine they need have something up there soon as people start to make summer plans. Really hope the have this race again, the full....enjoyed and think there is so much upside to the location and the venue.
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Re: Challenge Atlantic City [jonnies] [ In reply to ]
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RD is involved with my tri-club since he has so many local races his company runs out here. My understanding from several folks and from the Facebook group from this year's race was that end of Sept was when we should look for registration to open up.
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