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Half to Full Marathon Pace Expectations?
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TriHack
Jan 28, 15 14:15
Post #1 of 13 (2305 views)
I'd like some of you to think back to your first marathon. Yep, we all need to start somewhere.

I've completed a bunch of 13.1s, but am coming up on my first full. I have my pacing down really well for the shorter races, but don't have a great sense of how I should adjust on race day. Especially since my longest training run will be 20-21 miles, and I've heard those last 5-6 miles are a whole different world.

I just finished a 13.1 at 1:48, so about 8:17 per mile (negative splits, and finished with nearly nothing in the tank). My long runs are around 9 min/mile which keeps my heart rate in zone 2, maybe zone 3 on a hill.

I'd like to come in under 4 hours, and am thinking start at an 8:45 pace and shoot for negative splits if I feel good and the heart rate is where I'd like it. But not knowing what's looming after that wall, any suggestions?
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Re: Half to Full Marathon Pace Expectations? [TriHack] [ In reply to ]
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kylekranz
Jan 28, 15 15:07
Post #2 of 13 (2254 views)
The last 5-6 miles are only tough if you do the first 10 too quickly and/or are not properly trained for that pace in the first place.

Best advice is to start slower than or right at goal pace and progress your speed as the race goes along.

For what it's worth, a 1:48 equates to a 3:47 full IF you race smart, etc.

If your long runs are in the 9 minute range, that would suggest a 9 minute avg pace is certainly doable.
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Re: Half to Full Marathon Pace Expectations? [TriHack] [ In reply to ]
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snaaijert
Jan 28, 15 15:31
Post #3 of 13 (2222 views)
TriHack wrote:
I'd like to come in under 4 hours, and am thinking start at an 8:45 pace and shoot for negative splits if I feel good and the heart rate is where I'd like it. But not knowing what's looming after that wall, any suggestions?

This doesn't really sound like a smart strategy if you are unfamiliar with your capabilities over a marathon. Plugging your 1:48 in McMillan gives you a 3:47 but we all know this is generally optimistic and without any indication as to your training, mileage etc it's hard to see where you stand but 3:47 is an 8:41 pace so setting off at 8:45 is really technically negative splitting but I say start out at 9 min miles. If you run 9 min miles straight you're still under 4 hours. If you really want to get closer to that 3:47 then I'd still start off at 8:50-55 and negative split it from there. Like the previous poster said, if you're unsure just start at 9 and go from there.Good luck
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Re: Half to Full Marathon Pace Expectations? [TriHack] [ In reply to ]
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feman
Jan 28, 15 15:32
Post #4 of 13 (2221 views)
One of the race pace calculators I use when plugging in your HM time give you an estimated 3:47:31- but that is if you are pacing correctly and staying fully fueled - hope this helps.
Graham Wilson
USAT Level III Elite Coach
http://www.thewilsongroup.biz
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Re: Half to Full Marathon Pace Expectations? [feman] [ In reply to ]
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TriHack
Jan 28, 15 15:35
Post #5 of 13 (2217 views)
Thanks everyone-

I think I'll follow your advice and start conservative... right around the 9 pace. I haven't found race predictors overly safe to set pacing (heck, my 920XT says I should be able to do a 3:15... I don't think I'll try that). For the first one I want to get it done, crack 4, and enjoy it, so that seems smartest.

Much appreciated.
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Re: Half to Full Marathon Pace Expectations? [TriHack] [ In reply to ]
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rbuike
Jan 28, 15 15:42
Post #6 of 13 (2207 views)
Probably best to start at that 9min/mile pace for the first half and let things build up a bit based on how you feel in the second half and once you pass 24 miles its time to go all in and enjoy the hurt :)

Rodney
TrainingPeaks | Altra Running | RAD Roller
http://www.goinglong.ca
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Re: Half to Full Marathon Pace Expectations? [TriHack] [ In reply to ]
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Born Aero
Jan 28, 15 16:11
Post #7 of 13 (2179 views)
If you pace right, figure 20-30s slower than half pace. Then do your long runs 40-60 secs slower than goal pace(assuming you do speed workouts as well)
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Re: Half to Full Marathon Pace Expectations? [bornaero] [ In reply to ]
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natethomas
Jan 28, 15 18:18
Post #8 of 13 (2095 views)
I think your pacing sounds a bit right. This past fall my wife ran a 1:47 as a tuneup half marathon before Marine Corps, and she ran 3:56 there in her first marathon, including a 1 min negative split. Marathon running is all about pacing, and going out to fast by 5-10 seconds, even though it's hardly discernible at the time, can ruin the back end of your race.
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Re: Half to Full Marathon Pace Expectations? [TriHack] [ In reply to ]
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ziggie204
Jan 28, 15 18:34
Post #9 of 13 (2078 views)
TriHack wrote:
I'd like some of you to think back to your first marathon. Yep, we all need to start somewhere.

I've completed a bunch of 13.1s, but am coming up on my first full. I have my pacing down really well for the shorter races, but don't have a great sense of how I should adjust on race day. Especially since my longest training run will be 20-21 miles, and I've heard those last 5-6 miles are a whole different world.

I just finished a 13.1 at 1:48, so about 8:17 per mile (negative splits, and finished with nearly nothing in the tank). My long runs are around 9 min/mile which keeps my heart rate in zone 2, maybe zone 3 on a hill.

I'd like to come in under 4 hours, and am thinking start at an 8:45 pace and shoot for negative splits if I feel good and the heart rate is where I'd like it. But not knowing what's looming after that wall, any suggestions?

If you are putting in serious mileage (40+) and are just slow. . . then maybe 8:45/mi is possible. The difference of pace between those two distances is quite variable depending the person and their training. The more fit you are, the more miles you are putting in, the closer those two numbers can be. But if your only running 8:20/mi on your halfs, anything under 9/mi is asking for trouble imo.
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Re: Half to Full Marathon Pace Expectations? [TriHack] [ In reply to ]
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cwhyte
Jan 28, 15 20:41
Post #10 of 13 (1996 views)
Well, your times are close to mine, so I'll just tell you not to do what I did last year...a very bad bonk. I ran a 1:44 (flat course) half last May (first half in 10 years) and was over 19 miles into my first (somewhat hilly) marathon in October at a 9:00/mile pace when I completely ran out of gas from poor nutrition/hydration. Anyway, the result was a 6+ mile long grueling slow walk to the finish at 4:43. I'll try again this year, hoping to learn from that mistake. Good luck!
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Re: Half to Full Marathon Pace Expectations? [cwhyte] [ In reply to ]
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awenborn
Jan 29, 15 8:05
Post #11 of 13 (1866 views)
Now that's a proper bonk!

Again I'm in the same boat, hitting my first marathon in three months, looking to go sub-3:30 off the back of a 1:40 half-marathon last summer. A bit of a tighter squeeze than you guys, but I'm hoping a solid winter of base-building will help me out there.

I can see that nutrition and hydration are going to be a big hurdle already. I feel fine bashing around a half-marathon without any need for food or water, but that's just not going to be possible for a full-marathon.

Let us know how it goes TriHack!
Last edited by: aw3: Jan 29, 15 8:06
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Re: Half to Full Marathon Pace Expectations? [aw3] [ In reply to ]
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TriHack
Jan 29, 15 8:24
Post #12 of 13 (1838 views)
Yep, nutrition is my other concern, but I'm making sure I work that into my training with the on-course stuff as opposed to my normal selection. I'm also planning on a couple 4+ hour rides to just remind my body what it's like to keep moving that long.

I'm not really intimidated by the distance, but would really like to crack 4 hours for this first one. I'm coming off years of lower training volume due to having too many kids (well, my wife had them, but I had to help out after the fact) so there's a lot of rebuilding going on.
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Re: Half to Full Marathon Pace Expectations? [TriHack] [ In reply to ]
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KellyNCollier
Jan 29, 15 8:31
Post #13 of 13 (1829 views)
As the others have said, I'd start out on the conservative side. Like you, my half marathon time was around 1:47-1:48 and was shooting for sub 4:00 for my first marathon (although the race predictor said I could BQ!). I went out 8:40s - 8:50s because I felt great!!! for the first 16 miles... I totally crashed and burned, did a run/walk/limp/crawl for 10 miles to the finish, and didn't hit my sub 4. If I had gone out around 9:10s, I probably would have hit my goal.

Remember, the first one is an automatic PR! Save the ambitious goals for races when you have more experience at that distance.
http://trainingwheelsrequired.wordpress.com
@KellyNCollier
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