The 4000S is more aero, the Grand Prix TT *might* have better rolling resistance.

So, run the 4000S up front
maybe the TT in the rear

or maybe 4000S everywhere!

---

---

Kat Hunter reports on the San Dimas Stage Race from inside the GC winning team
Aeroweenie.com -Compendium of Aero Data and Knowledge
Freelance sports & outdoors writer Kathryn Hunter

At all yaw angles or just high yaw angles? I was watching track world championships and world cups recently and there are nations known for doing their aerodynamic homework on gumwall tires, which makes me wonder what I'm missing if the tread/casing transition is an aerodynamic mess.

I have a 2012 p2 and I went with latex tubes and a 23 and 25 set up. Course I weigh a lot more than you(200) and tried goign with 25 up front too. That didn't work. Was too big to fit in the fork. And I usedthe Conti4000sii(i think) I have nothing to back this up but I was happy with them and I had a much better bike split than I was expecting.

pretty much all, but the track guys are using a different tire than the 23mm vittoria EVO, so the same aero disaster will not apply, and especially since the differences are large only at yaw angles that track guys wont see

---

---

Kat Hunter reports on the San Dimas Stage Race from inside the GC winning team
Aeroweenie.com -Compendium of Aero Data and Knowledge
Freelance sports & outdoors writer Kathryn Hunter

There are faster tires than a 4000S, but do you trust the puncture resistance? Based on Frodeno's experiences in 2 races this season, I can;t say I'd put a Turbo Cotton on my bike. Maybe that's unfair and there are other reasons for the punctures... but it doesn't give me a warm & fuzzy feeling.

---

TrainingBible Coaching
http://www.trainingbible.com

Frodo didn't have a puncture.
I would trust a turbo cotton, brand new, on reasonable courses like kona.

The ultimate option if you are scared by tires like that, and the supersonics, is the attack/force combo.

They still have a puncture layer, I would have no fear with those even on rouge courses.

---

---

Kat Hunter reports on the San Dimas Stage Race from inside the GC winning team
Aeroweenie.com -Compendium of Aero Data and Knowledge
Freelance sports & outdoors writer Kathryn Hunter

The new Zipps Tangente Course and Speed should be pretty darn good too. Tom's rolling test had the Speeds ahead of the 4000s, and Course nearly there. The original Tangente was very aero, so if these retain that aero (& it's likely they're at even a bit better) they're going to be hard to beat. A tire like the course could be a new all-rounder. FWIW - the 23 course is narrower than the 23 4000s

---

Thoughts on being an Urban Triathlete

I thought Frodo did have a puncture at Hawaii and I also thought he punctured at Frankfurt. The problem in general with Kona is the you ride on is the major road in Hawaii. You end up having a lot of really tiny wires from tire blowouts from trucks, plus sharp rock, and other. Any tire is going to be a problem in Hawaii and I think the best thing to do there is run sealant as that is exactly the type of flat that would most likely to be fixed by a very small wire prick.

---

---

Save: $50 on Speed Hound Recovery Boots | $20 on Air Relax| $100 on Normatec| 15% on Most Absorbable Magnesium

Blogs: Best CHEAP Zwift / Bike Trainer Desk | Theragun G3 vs $140 Bivi Percussive Massager | Normatec Pulse 2.0 vs Normatec Pulse | Speed Hound vs Normatec | Air Relax vs Normatec | Q1 2018 Blood Test Results | | Why HED JET+ Is The BEST value wheelset

supposedly was an installation error flat in hawaii, but that is just a rumor.

can't you ask him on the secret pro hotline? ;)

---

---

Kat Hunter reports on the San Dimas Stage Race from inside the GC winning team
Aeroweenie.com -Compendium of Aero Data and Knowledge
Freelance sports & outdoors writer Kathryn Hunter

Oh really, that is an interesting little bit of news. What about the Frankfurt flats? Also, was it his installation error or was it another tech?

---

---

Save: $50 on Speed Hound Recovery Boots | $20 on Air Relax| $100 on Normatec| 15% on Most Absorbable Magnesium

Blogs: Best CHEAP Zwift / Bike Trainer Desk | Theragun G3 vs $140 Bivi Percussive Massager | Normatec Pulse 2.0 vs Normatec Pulse | Speed Hound vs Normatec | Air Relax vs Normatec | Q1 2018 Blood Test Results | | Why HED JET+ Is The BEST value wheelset

Someone is on Kienle's side working on the inside of Frodo's team.

Joking aside, when someone flats 3x at one IM, and once at the other you have to wonder what the cause is.

Based on using a set of Zipp 808's in a 40 K TT which would be faster, the attack/force combo or a pair of GP 4000S II's?

Like Jackmott said, if you are a bit scared of flats, the attack/force combo is a really good crr/aero vs puncture resistance compromise.
Certainly better than a pair of 23mm 4000s.
Recent crr data from Tom A showed 1.5w lower on-road crr for attack/force vs a 23mm 4000s pair @ 40km/h.
https://docs.google.com/...?pli=1#gid=361584932

And the attack is more aero than 23mm 4000s on a wide front Wheel (data on zipp 303 and the new line of Hed Wheels come to mind, there might be more), so that comes on top of the 1.5 saved from crr. Puncture belt is the same in both cases, but a bit less "rubber" in attack/force, so they will wear faster. I have used several attack/force pairs with latex tubes for races only in 3 years now. Never had a flat on them.

Kind of strange that the attack/force combo does not get more attention. Have anyone seen a pro race them?

you are fast, you should be using something more like the 20mm ss up front on the 808 fc vs the 23mm 4ks. I seriously doubt the attack or force(whichever is used up front) can compete aerowise with the 20mm SS even if they rolled better. they'd have to roll better than the best tire Tom A has in his current blogspot

Thanks Jeff. I have been using R4 aero 700 x 22 on my 65 mm Bontrager Aeolus wheels on front and the same tire on the rear with my Mavic Open Pro with PT hub and disc cover. But I am pretty sure I am going to get the 808's with a new rear disc cover. I also haven't been using latex but I think I am going to give the Vittorias a shot.

I never bothered testing my R4 aero, as it just looked too big to be fast. relegated it to training tire

This will not get to the best tire choice for you, but I will present one data point from two tunnel runs. the only difference between the two is the front tire. this does not take into account rr or puncture resistance or peace of mind of the fearful user or anyone that will throw out that to win you have to finish, etc...............

this is only one data point for consideration but seemed to pan out in the field as well

the gp 4000 was a gp 4000s on 808 fc wheel

note the percent change a simple tire change can make in the overall bike alone drag

Seems some of these clinchers are way better than a less than perfect glued ironman schwalbe tubular

does anyone have the manufacturer market share statistics for road/tri bike tires?

0.010 change in CdA

Hmmm.