My experience with Maffetone zones and the swim is that you can swim harder than you think and not exceed your MAF ceiling. I check my pulse for 6 seconds and then add a zero. It not's perfect, but it will get you close. :-)

thanks I was thinking more on maybe not even paying attention to HR during the swim as it is working different muscles and not sure even if the theory of the training method applies to swimming anyway.

I don't know if the training regime is appropriate for swimming but if you want to monitor HR there's an ear lobe monitor (I think finis makes them) that attaches to your cap and tells you your HR whilst swimming. Now if it could play music between.....

Maffetone is for all 3 sports, he even has a take on how you should lift weight, etc. So he would tell you if you are doing MAF for the bike and run and not swim (like drilling threshold and V02max, then you are not really training via MAF. Check out his website for more reading.

While I don't agree with the idea that a single formula can apply to many people, the general idea of maffetone (improving performance at low heart rate) is relevant to IM. So, my personal approach is to figure out for myself what my own low HR is (and it won't be 180 minus my age), and use that as a key benchmark of improvements relevant to IM. That means, incorporating some low HR blocks into my running, but more importantly measuring "average pace @ low HR bpm" as a key performance indicator for the run, and avg watts @ low bpm for the bike (a different bpm). I don't do any intentional low HR work on the bike, I just think there are many more useful ways to improve before you need to do that.

Now, when it comes to swimming, I think the idea of "low HR training" is one of the worst ideas. With swimming, you can swim hard, and swim long, without risking injury. Most regular triathletes whose programs I see, swim way too little, and not hard enough. Adopting a maffetone approach would be the worst use of their time. If you are time crunched, swim hard. If you are not time crunched, swim hard and long.

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My 2 cents - honestly, if you were 'running too hard' before but trying to do your best at running (meaning not necessarily constrained by bike/run training time demands), you almost certainly weren't running enough mpw.

There's no such thing as run easier with less volume and get faster. The reason BarryP or other incremental method works is that it forces you to get in run volume, which is more easily done when you're running 5x/wk compared to 3.

But in terms of your original question, I've made some good progress on my swim in the past year by increasing my swim volume a lot, and even the intensity whenever I can. I've been skipping the bike for the past 3 months, focusing all on swim then run. I've been surprised with how much beatdown the hard swims have - they definitely affect my running. I just find that as compared to when I was pure runner, I just don't have the same energy available to hammer the volume or intensity on the run when I'm swimming hard. Sounds obvious, but it's a weird feeling - legs aren't sore or even that tired, but I just can't run faster than recovery pace on a lot of days, as I'm just so generally tired.

When I was a truly bad swimmer not too long ago, I couldn't beat myself down hard enough to ever get this feeling, but as I get stronger on the swim, the more it takes out of me on the run workouts. It's now enough that I know that if I hammer the swim one day, I'm going to pay for it on decreased run performance in the next workout.

It's not a training method you need (BarryP, Maffetone). Seeking one out isn't the solution you should be searching for.

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Well of course. MAF running has a different effect on the nervous system. Swimming has less impact.

My MAF is 138 in running ...aka around 75% max Hr
My swimming 75% of max Hr in much lower. In fact around 8-10 bpm

The OP should be doing Hr test on each sport then train in zone 2

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Obviously you have never done a 200 IM or 400 IM really really hard.

Highest heart rate I have ever experienced.

Obviously true, that's why the swim soooo long in triathlon, b/c it just does not tax the body that much. Clearly you have not done much swimming:) Check out lightheir's response, and he's coming from the "pure runner" viewpoint. Also, see sentania's response regarding swimming HR at the end of a very very hard 200 or 400 IM. As he says, your HR is off the chart at the end of these races:)

Swim hard and swim often. Swim mostly short intervals, i.e. 50s, 100s, 150s, and 200s. Do an all-out time trial of 500 or 1000 yds every few weeks to see if you are progressing. Don't worry about your HR in the pool, it will be high enough:)

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"Anyone can be who they want to be IF they have the HUNGER and the DRIVE."