What kind of riders win grand tours? (Page 2): Triathlon Forum: Slowtwitch Forums

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What kind of riders win grand tours?

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Jordano

Apr 16, 11 14:33

Post #26 of 31 (945 views)

Re: What kind of riders win grand tours? [FastandFun] [In reply to]	Quote \| Reply

FastandFun wrote:

%FTP wrote:

Has cycling changed? Or have just not watched enough races?

Yes and yes.

If you watch Versus... turn off the sound.

Yeah if you listen to the commentators winning the TdF is mostly about "finding your rhythm on the climb" and "Starting the TT with your engine hot", once you've done that you can't lose!

dave_w

Apr 16, 11 15:04

Post #27 of 31 (935 views)

Re: What kind of riders win grand tours? [%FTP] [In reply to]	Quote \| Reply

I always thought it was guys who could climb AND TT, with a decent team, but I think on ST the wisdom is it's "skinny guys who dope".

tri_yoda

Apr 16, 11 15:13

Post #28 of 31 (932 views)

Re: What kind of riders win grand tours? [CRTRI] [In reply to]	Quote \| Reply

CRTRI wrote:

what you must remember however is that Patani had a hemocrit level of 60% and Sastre is the only
tour winner in the pat decade to not have been bombarded with allegations of doping.

I think what you are saying is Pantani was doped to the gills. Nobody would dispute that. That was on the heels of Riis' win, and we know without he was doped by his own admission.

I think the most interesting winner is Sastre. He had good team tactics and won what was probably one of the "cleanest" tours. Assuming the main benefit of doping in the grand tours is recovery, one wonders if he was a good rider, with a great ability to recover naturally. Enough so that in the absence of widespread doping that is what put him over the top.

JollyRogers

Apr 16, 11 15:20

Post #29 of 31 (928 views)

Re: What kind of riders win grand tours? [Titanflexr] [In reply to]	Quote \| Reply

Titanflexr wrote:

You could classify CS and AS as climbers who can TT adequately when they want/need to. Sastre won in a weak year, and did so by team tactics. Schleck may have won his first Tour last year.....but that's up to CAS.

Fignon and Delgado also fit that mold - climbing strength with adequate (compared to the top race of truth specialists) TT ability.

Titanflexr

Apr 16, 11 16:06

Post #30 of 31 (917 views)

Re: What kind of riders win grand tours? [JollyRogers] [In reply to]	Quote \| Reply

JollyRogers wrote:

Titanflexr wrote:

You could classify CS and AS as climbers who can TT adequately when they want/need to. Sastre won in a weak year, and did so by team tactics. Schleck may have won his first Tour last year.....but that's up to CAS.

Fignon and Delgado also fit that mold - climbing strength with adequate (compared to the top race of truth specialists) TT ability.

Delgado definitely, but Fignon was also a top time trialist. He won several Tour TTs (including the final TT in his '83 win), won the GP de Nations TT (the unofficial world championship at the time), and in his famous loss to LeMond in '89 he finished 3rd in that TT.

__________________________________________________
In theory, there is no difference between theory and practice.

bjorn

Apr 16, 11 18:01

Post #31 of 31 (879 views)

Re: What kind of riders win grand tours? [tri_yoda] [In reply to]	Quote \| Reply

tri_yoda wrote:

CRTRI wrote:

I think the most interesting winner is Sastre. He had good team tactics and won what was probably one of the "cleanest" tours. Assuming the main benefit of doping in the grand tours is recovery, one wonders if he was a good rider, with a great ability to recover naturally. Enough so that in the absence of widespread doping that is what put him over the top.

Yeah, really clean. Only Piepoli, Beltran, Ricco, Fofonov, Schumacher and Kohl proved to be doping that tour.

I don't think one can make the case that even any of the recent tours were cleaner than the other. Maybe things are getting better but probably no drastic changes from year to year.

And regarding Pantani I have no doubt he was dirty but it's quite ironic that everyone here is absolutely certain he was doping when all he really got caught for was one "health" tests were the Hct wasn't actually much over the legal limit(not anywhere near 60%). Compare that to for example when Landis first got busted and how many defended him. Just sayin..

BA coaching http://www.bjornandersson.se Winter training camp http://www.racycles.com/...with-bjorn-andersson

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