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Sub 5 Hr Bike Split on < 200 watts
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Thoughts?

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Of course it hurts. The trick is not minding it hurts.
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Re: Sub 5 Hr Bike Split on < 200 watts [Recall] [ In reply to ]
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Possible. it depends how small you are.

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Re: Sub 5 Hr Bike Split on < 200 watts [Recall] [ In reply to ]
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There is actually a guy on here who did that at Austria. He posted a race report from Kona as well showing his frontal and it ain't much....tiny. I remember looking at that and thinking 'wtf?'. He has a sick position!
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Re: Sub 5 Hr Bike Split on < 200 watts [Recall] [ In reply to ]
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I rode 5:04 at IMC a few years ago with an average of 178 watts (this includes coasting) I weighted about 145ibs.

Bike was very cheap alum frame with mavic cosmic carbones, not too aggressive position.
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Re: Sub 5 Hr Bike Split on < 200 watts [pokey] [ In reply to ]
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But how tall are you?
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Re: Sub 5 Hr Bike Split on < 200 watts [mcdoublee] [ In reply to ]
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could be close, depending on course.
I did IMFL last month in 4.57.01 at 208w (217 NP), and I weigh in at 156 lbs with full aero gear, disc.
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Re: Sub 5 Hr Bike Split on < 200 watts [mcdoublee] [ In reply to ]
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5'10
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Re: Sub 5 Hr Bike Split on < 200 watts [Recall] [ In reply to ]
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In Reply To:
Thoughts?


My thoughts are that there must be at least one of the following going on to achieve sub 5
  • Very aero
  • Very small person
  • miscalibration
  • easy course
  • great pavement
  • no wind
  • drafting



Or all of the above.

For example, if Paula Newby Fraser or Natasha Badmann had a powermeter, I am sure we'd see numbers lower than 200W.

For the 145 guy doing almost 5 hours at IMC on 178, saying his position is not too aggressive (given ~3000 feet of vertical at IMC), I think other factors are at play (maybe some miscalibration). That's a 3255 Kjoule ride. Keep in mind it takes around 600 Kjoules just to lift a rider plus bike vertically up all the climbing on the IMC course. So that leaves around 2600 Kjoules for this rider to do a pancake flat 5 hour course.....that would translate to 144 watts on a pancake flat course for a 5 hour ride. Is this remotely in the realm of possiblity for a 145 lb rider with a not so aggressive position? I got my bullshit meter out on that one.

Please fess up to miscalibration.

Dev

Edit: corrected for 178W
Last edited by: devashish_paul: Dec 10, 10 14:03
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Re: Sub 5 Hr Bike Split on < 200 watts [devashish_paul] [ In reply to ]
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If the start and finish are at the same elevation, he'll get those 600 KJoules back.

Depending on RR, pancake flat course would put him at .22 - .24 for Cda. I don't know if that is bullshit, my frame of reference is much bigger ;-).
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Re: Sub 5 Hr Bike Split on < 200 watts [Recall] [ In reply to ]
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I did 2:30.xx at Timberman ... didn't race with my powertap but it is impossible that I went significantly over 200 and likely that I was below 190 (2x20 power only 230-ish) I'm small though, 5'4 and 122-ish.

Should also add that I started in the second-last wave and am not a good swimmer so no doubt benefitted from slingshotting past a lot of cyclists as I was one of the last people on the road.

Ride for show, run for dough.
Last edited by: ericlambi: Dec 10, 10 13:45
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Re: Sub 5 Hr Bike Split on < 200 watts [devashish_paul] [ In reply to ]
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Miscalibration echoes my thoughts. I don't know how but I've always thought my powertap reads low (despite "proper" calibration before every ride) based on peers' wattage #'s on rides. Either that or I'm slippery as an eel...

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Of course it hurts. The trick is not minding it hurts.
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Re: Sub 5 Hr Bike Split on < 200 watts [devashish_paul] [ In reply to ]
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In Reply To:

For the 145 guy doing almost 5 hours at IMC on 175, saying his position is not too aggressive (given ~3000 feet of vertical at IMC), I think other factors are at play (maybe some miscalibration). That's a 3200 Kjoule ride. Keep in mind it takes around 600 Kjoules just to lift a rider plus bike vertically up all the climbing on the IMC course. So that leaves around 2600 Kjoules for this rider to do a pancake flat 5 hour course.....that would translate to 144 watts on a pancake flat course for a 5 hour ride. Is this remotely in the realm of possiblity for a 145 lb rider with a not so aggressive position? I got my bullshit meter out on that one.


Sorry just new at this - when you say is a 3200 Kj course, how do you go to calories expended? A converter puts it at 764,489 cals so obviosly it's not that simple?
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Re: Sub 5 Hr Bike Split on < 200 watts [Khyron] [ In reply to ]
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he isn't speaking to the amount of energy your body would burn, but to the energy put into the pedals.

you would burn a lot more calories than you would put to the pedals.



Kat Hunter reports on the San Dimas Stage Race from inside the GC winning team
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Freelance sports & outdoors writer Kathryn Hunter
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Re: Sub 5 Hr Bike Split on < 200 watts [devashish_paul] [ In reply to ]
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In Reply To:
For example, if Paula Newby Fraser or Natasha Badmann had a powermeter, I am sure we'd see numbers lower than 200W.

Talking out of your ass as usual.

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Re: Sub 5 Hr Bike Split on < 200 watts [Khyron] [ In reply to ]
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178W*(5+4/60)+3600 = 3255Kjoules (the 4/60 = 2/30 = 1/15 = 0.06666 is to account for the :04 in his 5:04 split).

To the poster who said, "you get all those stored joules back", you're right, you get some of them back, just not all, so my implied calculation for a sub 150W ride for a 5 hour ride is off. Climbing Richter and Yellow lakes you're going at 15-20kph and coming down you're ripping at 60-80 kph. There's a shitload of your stored potential energy joules blowing up in the wind....maybe not all of them, but most of them.

Even if we say that his "equivalent flat course" wattage is sub 165 for a 5:04 ride, would you buy it? He said he is 5'10" and 145 and not too aero.
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Re: Sub 5 Hr Bike Split on < 200 watts [Paulo Sousa] [ In reply to ]
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In Reply To:
In Reply To:

For example, if Paula Newby Fraser or Natasha Badmann had a powermeter, I am sure we'd see numbers lower than 200W.


Talking out of your ass as usual.




Classic



To add to the post, it also depends how big the guy is you are riding 7 meters behind and how fast he is going.

Ruble Triathlon Coaching
Coach to 88 PR's across IM, 70.3, Oly, Marathon, and Half Marathon since 2015
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Re: Sub 5 Hr Bike Split on < 200 watts [Little5] [ In reply to ]
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In Reply To:
There is actually a guy on here who did that at Austria. He posted a race report from Kona as well showing his frontal and it ain't much....tiny. I remember looking at that and thinking 'wtf?'. He has a sick position!


Here. Norm power of 185w at Austria for a 4:58 split. I raced Austria really light at around 132lbs (height 5'9). Pic below is from Kona this year, with an identical position to Austria.



Kona was norm power 192w for a 5:05 split, but I was heavier at ~136lbs.

Nick Baldwin | @baldwin_nick | Facebook
Drag2Zero| ISPC Seychelles
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Re: Sub 5 Hr Bike Split on < 200 watts [Khyron] [ In reply to ]
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In Reply To:
Sorry just new at this - when you say is a 3200 Kj course, how do you go to calories expended? A converter puts it at 764,489 cals so obviosly it's not that simple?
Keep in mind that 1 Calorie with an upper case C is 1000 calories with a lower case c. To add to the confusion, people often write "calorie" when then in fact mean "Calorie" or "kilo calorie." So 3200 Kj is 764 Cal, or 764,489 cal. However you obviously "burn" more calories that that, because your body not 100% efficient. As a rule of thumb, you burn about 1 Calorie to produce 1 Kj of work. So you would burn about 3200 Calories to produce 3200 Kj of work.
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Re: Sub 5 Hr Bike Split on < 200 watts [sesel] [ In reply to ]
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Dude that kills me to read 'I was heavier at 136'. How tall are you? I think I went through 136 around the 6th grade!
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Re: Sub 5 Hr Bike Split on < 200 watts [devashish_paul] [ In reply to ]
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OK, here is what i remember

I think that was 2005 which was a fast year for IMC.

Aero helmet.

I had 2 flats which shouldn't effect things as SRM stopped recording, ride time was 5:04:xx

I rode conservative on the uphills and tucked like crazy on the downhills and from what I remember I was able to get at least 60% up the rollers in the tuck position without pedaling.

I was quite aero but not crazy aero like some, I can stay in that position for quite a long time.

It was an SRM Pro, could it have been off poss but not by much, on the flats my normal power was in the 190's.

The number was well under 200, normalized power may have been low 190's.

I have not raced for 4 years due to children, but now thinking I should come back to kick your skinny ass.
Last edited by: pokey: Dec 10, 10 14:50
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Re: Sub 5 Hr Bike Split on < 200 watts [Recall] [ In reply to ]
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Why not?

I'm 5'11, 137lbs did IMC in 5.37 on 168w two years ago comfortably & conservatively and I could have been alot more aero.
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Re: Sub 5 Hr Bike Split on < 200 watts [juha-pdx] [ In reply to ]
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In Reply To:

I'm 5'11, 137lbs

Holy smokes! Do you guys know what food is? Damn!!!!
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Re: Sub 5 Hr Bike Split on < 200 watts [Little5] [ In reply to ]
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Without turning this into a thread about racing weight, being really light will obviously reap greater rewards at hillier races. If I'd been 4 lbs heavier at Austria, which is a fast course, those 4lbs would not have made a huge difference. Contrast that to a course like IM France, where extra weight is a BIG liability, 4lbs would cost more time.

I'd rather obsess about my position and equipment rather than weight. Same with the weight vs aerodynamics argument. Stuff the weight and go with the most aerodynamic option.

Nick Baldwin | @baldwin_nick | Facebook
Drag2Zero| ISPC Seychelles
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Re: Sub 5 Hr Bike Split on < 200 watts [devashish_paul] [ In reply to ]
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I reckon I'd need <200W for 112 miles in 5 hours based on what I've done for a 50 mile TT. My last one was 1:57:35 at 256W AP 259W NP, so 4:23:23 pace for 112 miles. By my calculations that equates to 186W to do 5 hours. I'm 5' 10" 70kg. I'll admit that the 50 mile TT course was pretty flat, only 270m of elevation gain & loss according to the Garmin. It was also a very good road surface. But it was very cold, I started my ride at 7:35am, average temp was around 12C for the ride, so I was wearing leggings which would have made me a bit less aero than normal. Also, my Cinqo reads 1.3% too high according to a static torque test, so my real power was about 3W lower than the figures above.

This is my riding position:
http://www.kimroyphotography.com/...mp;g2_serialNumber=1
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Re: Sub 5 Hr Bike Split on < 200 watts [pokey] [ In reply to ]
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Sadly, my ass is not that skinny and I have aeroness envy on account of problems with my stomach currently limiting how low and tight I can ride. That being said the slope of your SRM may have been off AND you may have not zero'd it out). Sorry to hear about the flats....that really sucks. As for not racing IM due to children, you're a smart man. I wish I had taken that break myself....they are only small for so long and you never get that back.
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