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2013 TdF thread (spoiler alert)

 

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jmh

Jul 17, 13 8:39

Post #676 of 792 (4813 views)
Re: 2013 TdF thread (spoiler alert) [flyrunride] [In reply to] Quote | Reply

flyrunride wrote:
Froome is just on point....

Is that code for something sharp?


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jackmott

Jul 17, 13 8:42

Post #677 of 792 (4800 views)
Re: 2013 TdF thread (spoiler alert) [styrrell] [In reply to] Quote | Reply

10 seconds between 1st and third.

Contador with a TT cockpit maybe wins. I didn't see him actually use the drops, just the hoods.

Froome doesn't switch bikes, maybe doesn't win.

Doesn't affect the GC much though

styrrell wrote:
Pretty much looks like very tiny differences due to equipment choice. Hopefully cyclenutz will crunch the numbers, but I doubt going full aero vs full ww vs bike change would be enough to alter the results by a significant amount.


Local running hero Liz Shelton gets her first TT bike and reports on Jack's Generic Triathlon
Aeroweenie.com -Compendium of Aero Data and Knowledge
Freelance sports & outdoors writer Kathryn Hunter


jmh

Jul 17, 13 8:43

Post #678 of 792 (4793 views)
Re: 2013 TdF thread (spoiler alert) [jmh] [In reply to] Quote | Reply

Who would have guessed that Andy would crush Cuddles today and move in 16th place?


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(This post was edited by jmh on Jul 17, 13 8:44)


jackmott

Jul 17, 13 8:45

Post #679 of 792 (4781 views)
Re: 2013 TdF thread (spoiler alert) [jmh] [In reply to] Quote | Reply

Cuddles either has a health problem or gave up today I imagine.

EDIT: OR DID HE PULL A VOECKLER!? haha


Local running hero Liz Shelton gets her first TT bike and reports on Jack's Generic Triathlon
Aeroweenie.com -Compendium of Aero Data and Knowledge
Freelance sports & outdoors writer Kathryn Hunter

(This post was edited by jackmott on Jul 17, 13 8:49)


jmh

Jul 17, 13 8:49

Post #680 of 792 (4761 views)
Re: 2013 TdF thread (spoiler alert) [jackmott] [In reply to] Quote | Reply

Peter Flax ‏@Pflax14m
In other news, Cadel was sweating like a pig, like he was ill in a bad way


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jackmott

Jul 17, 13 8:52

Post #681 of 792 (4746 views)
Re: 2013 TdF thread (spoiler alert) [jmh] [In reply to] Quote | Reply

On twitter Cadel just said he took it easy on purpose

#whoknows


Local running hero Liz Shelton gets her first TT bike and reports on Jack's Generic Triathlon
Aeroweenie.com -Compendium of Aero Data and Knowledge
Freelance sports & outdoors writer Kathryn Hunter


Pooks

Jul 17, 13 8:52

Post #682 of 792 (4743 views)
Re: 2013 TdF thread (spoiler alert) [jmh] [In reply to] Quote | Reply

Chapeau to Quintana (!!) and Schleck.


styrrell

Jul 17, 13 9:00

Post #683 of 792 (4713 views)
Re: 2013 TdF thread (spoiler alert) [jackmott] [In reply to] Quote | Reply

Sure and 1st through third were pretty much what people would've expected and in that order. Different equipment choices may have resulted in all sorts of unexpected results, but Froome & Contador are great TT riders and climbers, with Froome being better lately and shockingly with different strategies they finished pretty much as expected, maybe AC was a bit closer but Froome botched the switch just a bit and really didn't need to take risks decending.

jackmott wrote:
10 seconds between 1st and third.

Contador with a TT cockpit maybe wins. I didn't see him actually use the drops, just the hoods.

Froome doesn't switch bikes, maybe doesn't win.

Doesn't affect the GC much though

styrrell wrote:
Pretty much looks like very tiny differences due to equipment choice. Hopefully cyclenutz will crunch the numbers, but I doubt going full aero vs full ww vs bike change would be enough to alter the results by a significant amount.
Styrrell


Landyachtz

Jul 17, 13 9:32

Post #684 of 792 (4626 views)
Re: 2013 TdF thread (spoiler alert) [jackmott] [In reply to] Quote | Reply

jackmott wrote:
10 seconds between 1st and third.

Contador with a TT cockpit maybe wins. I didn't see him actually use the drops, just the hoods.

Froome doesn't switch bikes, maybe doesn't win.

Doesn't affect the GC much though

styrrell wrote:
Pretty much looks like very tiny differences due to equipment choice. Hopefully cyclenutz will crunch the numbers, but I doubt going full aero vs full ww vs bike change would be enough to alter the results by a significant amount.


Yeah a full TT cockpit might have done it. He did have the Vuka Sprint bars on (from what I could tell), but it's not unfathomable to think he could have gained 10 seconds without the hoods and drops out there taking wind for 51 minutes.

Edit: In looking at the photos, it looks like he didn't use Vuka Sprint bars. Not sure why you wouldn't, unless the clip-ons couldn't fit on the Vuka Sprints.

________________________________________________________________
When you try to be good at too many things at the same time, you usually end up average in all of them. Heck, a triathlete should be well aware of that ;-) -Tom A.

(This post was edited by Landyachtz on Jul 17, 13 9:54)


Landyachtz

Jul 17, 13 9:38

Post #685 of 792 (4608 views)
Re: 2013 TdF thread (spoiler alert) [Pooks] [In reply to] Quote | Reply

Pooks wrote:
Chapeau to Quintana (!!) and Schleck.

Word from cyclingnews is that Movistar has signed Quintana's younger brother, Dayer.

________________________________________________________________
When you try to be good at too many things at the same time, you usually end up average in all of them. Heck, a triathlete should be well aware of that ;-) -Tom A.


kathy_caribe

Jul 17, 13 9:59

Post #686 of 792 (4562 views)
Re: 2013 TdF thread (spoiler alert) [Landyachtz] [In reply to] Quote | Reply

Landyachtz wrote:
Pooks wrote:
Chapeau to Quintana (!!) and Schleck.


Word from cyclingnews is that Movistar has signed Quintana's younger brother, Dayer.

I've totally forgotten about the yellow jersey and glued to white.
http://harvestmoon6.blogspot.com


Landyachtz

Jul 17, 13 10:01

Post #687 of 792 (4549 views)
Re: 2013 TdF thread (spoiler alert) [kathy_caribe] [In reply to] Quote | Reply

kathy_caribe wrote:
Landyachtz wrote:
Pooks wrote:
Chapeau to Quintana (!!) and Schleck.


Word from cyclingnews is that Movistar has signed Quintana's younger brother, Dayer.


I've totally forgotten about the yellow jersey and glued to white.

Something tells me we're going to see a Quintana in the white jersey for another 3-4 years (Dayer is 22).

________________________________________________________________
When you try to be good at too many things at the same time, you usually end up average in all of them. Heck, a triathlete should be well aware of that ;-) -Tom A.


flyrunride

Jul 17, 13 10:04

Post #688 of 792 (4540 views)
Re: 2013 TdF thread (spoiler alert) [jmh] [In reply to] Quote | Reply

jmh wrote:
flyrunride wrote:
Froome is just on point....


Is that code for something sharp?

Nope, I was just appreciating him taking the win. Contador seems true to his word though that he'll be in peak form in the last week, but we'll find out tomorrow if he can challenge or threaten the yellow jersey as his top form might not be enough to handle froomie and his parasites (jokingly).


justChris

Jul 17, 13 10:12

Post #689 of 792 (4523 views)
Re: 2013 TdF thread (spoiler alert) [cartsman] [In reply to] Quote | Reply

Some of the statements regarding bilharzia by Team Sky cannot be true.
http://velonews.competitor.com/...rzia-parasite_295548

My wife works as a post-doc studying infectious diseases, primarily researching schistosomiasis - which is the more common, scientific name for bilharzia.
The treatment for schistosomiasis/bilharzia is biltricide (Praziquantel) as mentioned, but the treatment is a one-day treatment. Reference here: http://dailymed.nlm.nih.gov/...75b1916b8#nlm34068-7 under dosage and adminsitration.

If schistosomasis/bilharzia was diagnosed in 2010, Froome should have been given the one day treatment and it should have no longer been an issue. The only reported occurrences of when the initial treatment does not eradicate the infection is when a heavy worm burden is in the system (i.e. a lot of worms infected Froome.) Even in those cases, treatment does not drag on for 18 months+. A heavy worm burden would also make the symptoms more severe than "I was always getting little colds and coughs, nothing serious".

Thus, it's unlikely to claim that it's still in his system (as of January according to the above article), unless he got re-infected by continuing to come into contact with contaminated waters. Given his reported history with this infection, that would be stupid.

There are other inconsistencies with the claims given:
"It’s not something that just disappears. It’s a parasite. It lays eggs. They might be dormant, then the eggs hatch, then they lay more eggs" - Completely false: Eggs laid in humans do not, and cannot hatch; they can only hatch in fresh water (after being excreted by humans). They also need interaction with snails before the hatched eggs can infect humans again. Source: Under Pathophysiology/Life Cycle - http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Schistosomiasis, also fairly common knowledge for those familiar with the infection.

Biltricide "basically kills everything in your system" - also false, same link above about the treatment under Adverse Effects - "In general BILTRICIDE is very well tolerated. Side effects are usually mild and transient and do not require treatment." Thus, a week of not being able to ride his bike is a ridiculous statement.

I'm not sure why they would lie to / misinform us about something like this....


fishgo

Jul 17, 13 10:21

Post #690 of 792 (4486 views)
Re: 2013 TdF thread (spoiler alert) [jackmott] [In reply to] Quote | Reply

jackmott wrote:
On twitter Cadel just said he took it easy on purpose

#whoknows

Even Cavendish beat Cadel on the TT today.


OldFart

Jul 17, 13 10:23

Post #691 of 792 (4476 views)
Re: 2013 TdF thread (spoiler alert) [Kay Serrar] [In reply to] Quote | Reply

Kay Serrar wrote:
Carl Spackler wrote:
You do realize that Cadel Evans attacked Andy Schleck on that same descent a couple years ago and gained a bit of time, right? Was that an unnecessary, dangerous classless move as well?

And why would Contador work with Froome when Kreuzinger was in the group up the road, and there was an opportunity to take time back?

It's a bike RACE, not a participatory sport like triathlon.


Not sure what the gap between Evans and Schleck was, but I'm guessing it was alot less than the 4:25 Contador is currently trailing Froome by. Also, if you have a 40 yard gap on someone on a steep descent, be as reckless as you want because if you crash you are only taking yourself out, but being reckless when you are all in a close group that includes many of the top GC contenders is less cool.

I get that it's a bike race, but my point is that you need to assess risk vs reward and in this case I think that with only a few km left in the stage, the risk of taking yourself and a number of the top GC contenders out of the race in a crash on a tricky descent was not worth it. Just my opinion, and apparently Froome's too. You're welcome to disagree.

And Contador had every motivation to get back into the group or he would have lost valuable seconds to Mollema. Which do you think Contador cares about more, Kreuzinger taking 10 seconds (say) back on Froome, or himself not losing 10 seconds to Mollema?


so why did Froome follow AC so close. Just back off so you can see the road. The risk rewrad for Froome to ride in a position to tickle AC's prostate makes even less sense than AC riding "recklessly"


Pooks

Jul 17, 13 10:33

Post #692 of 792 (4430 views)
Re: 2013 TdF thread (spoiler alert) [OldFart] [In reply to] Quote | Reply

OldFart wrote:
so why did Froome follow AC so close. Just back off so you can see the road. The risk rewrad for Froome to ride in a position to tickle AC's prostate makes even less sense than AC riding "recklessly"

This was also brought up on the NBC coverage today. I simply don't get it. If I find myself riding or racing near someone who I honestly feel is riding unsafe, the last thing I do is get on their wheel.


Kay Serrar

Jul 17, 13 10:37

Post #693 of 792 (4407 views)
Re: 2013 TdF thread (spoiler alert) [OldFart] [In reply to] Quote | Reply

OldFart wrote:
so why did Froome follow AC so close. Just back off so you can see the road. The risk rewrad for Froome to ride in a position to tickle AC's prostate makes even less sense than AC riding "recklessly"

I don't disagree at all. When I saw them bunching up and overlapping around some of those hairpins I had exactly this thought. And I think it would have been funny if when Porte, Froome and Contador were a few seconds back after the mishap on the descent, the Sky guys had said, "hey Contie mate, if you don't want to lose time to Mollema you better get us back into the group, because frankly we don't care about a few seconds lost to these other guys." That would have been good to see. After all, Contador caused the problem, so he should help fix it. Well, if he had any class... ;)

And to the earlier 'know-it-all' poster, yes Contador may not care about the difference between 2nd or 3rd place, but the only realistic way for him to win the TdF is if Froome crashes out or has some other catastrophe, and if that happens then Contador needs to have overtaken Mollema to win. So I stand by my assertion that Contador was indeed very motivated to get back to the group with Mollema after the crash. But then what do I know...


OldFart

Jul 17, 13 11:11

Post #694 of 792 (4333 views)
Re: 2013 TdF thread (spoiler alert) [Kay Serrar] [In reply to] Quote | Reply

Kay Serrar wrote:
OldFart wrote:
so why did Froome follow AC so close. Just back off so you can see the road. The risk rewrad for Froome to ride in a position to tickle AC's prostate makes even less sense than AC riding "recklessly"


I don't disagree at all. When I saw them bunching up and overlapping around some of those hairpins I had exactly this thought. And I think it would have been funny if when Porte, Froome and Contador were a few seconds back after the mishap on the descent, the Sky guys had said, "hey Contie mate, if you don't want to lose time to Mollema you better get us back into the group, because frankly we don't care about a few seconds lost to these other guys." That would have been good to see. After all, Contador caused the problem, so he should help fix it. Well, if he had any class... ;)

And to the earlier 'know-it-all' poster, yes Contador may not care about the difference between 2nd or 3rd place, but the only realistic way for him to win the TdF is if Froome crashes out or has some other catastrophe, and if that happens then Contador needs to have overtaken Mollema to win. So I stand by my assertion that Contador was indeed very motivated to get back to the group with Mollema after the crash. But then what do I know...

I don't know much, but I do know that the earlier 'know it all poster" is actually quite, no, make that very knowledgeable about bike racing.

A) AC knew that Sky would get him back b/c Porte was pulling hard, so why help when you are about back. If he had lost time to Mollema I am pretty certain he felt more than comfortable that he would takes quite a bit of time back from him in the TT (as he did). Also Mollema is hanging on in the mountains and with the 3 days to come I think it is as safe a bet to say AC will take time (quite a bit of it) out of Mollema as it is to say Froome will win.

ok back to other stuff. Is Perraud (sp?) the 1st rider to break his clavicle twice in 1 day?


jsiege11

Jul 17, 13 11:18

Post #695 of 792 (4309 views)
Re: 2013 TdF thread (spoiler alert) [Kay Serrar] [In reply to] Quote | Reply

Haha, so I'm having this vision of an all "classy" cyclist TdF:
Rider 1 - "Jolly good day old sport, what do you say I help you win the stage?"
Rider 2 - "Oh heavens to betsy my good chap! I could never! Here, let me pull you to the stage win!"
(naturally, they are British)

All kidding aside, I do think you have too much expectation of "class" from these guys, almost like they need to be classy to a fault. It's a race, they are competing. yes, there is etiquette, but I don't think Contador "owed" Sky anything after the slide out. I think most people are agreeing he didn't owe sky anything.

I agree too, if Froome was so upset with Contador sitting in, it's up to him to make him not do it (sit up or drop him). But taking a free ride isn't unclassy, it's bike racing.


Il Falco

Jul 17, 13 11:48

Post #696 of 792 (4247 views)
Re: 2013 TdF thread (spoiler alert) [Power13] [In reply to] Quote | Reply

Thank you. It had to be said. Whatever is left of Omerta, it just plain is NOT the same. Easy to accuse right now - you'd be applauded for it in some quarters.

If SKY is currently doping, then the real mastery is in the secrecy. David Millar came out in defence of Froome, and his sister works for SKY. Froome is not Armstrong - he isn't a world-celeb with a Texas-sized mean streak and a pack of pitbulls and political connections. He has a girlfriend with a twitter account.

It would be amazing to find out that the fired ex-SKY staff (Julich, Leinders etc.), and the ex-riders (Mick Rogers, Cavendish etc.) were all keeping their mouths shut in this day and age.

And yet the results are stunning. I agree.


jmh

Jul 17, 13 11:49

Post #697 of 792 (4247 views)
Re: 2013 TdF thread (spoiler alert) [jmh] [In reply to] Quote | Reply

Can any of you smart folks about all things performance enhancing explain these tweets to me?

Bill Strickland ‏@TrueBS10m
My understanding—which has to remain unattributed—is that only poorer, less astute & more desperate riders resort to EPO/blood trans now...


Bill Strickland ‏@TrueBS8m
…& the richer, more developed, more aggressive programs are into (or much of the way to) things that may not even technically be "doping"


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Suffer Well.


jackmott

Jul 17, 13 11:52

Post #698 of 792 (4233 views)
Re: 2013 TdF thread (spoiler alert) [jmh] [In reply to] Quote | Reply

There is probably a grain of truth to that, but trends don't mean one guy can't buck the trend.


Local running hero Liz Shelton gets her first TT bike and reports on Jack's Generic Triathlon
Aeroweenie.com -Compendium of Aero Data and Knowledge
Freelance sports & outdoors writer Kathryn Hunter


Carl Spackler

Jul 17, 13 12:05

Post #699 of 792 (4192 views)
Re: 2013 TdF thread (spoiler alert) [OldFart] [In reply to] Quote | Reply

On top of all that, Kreuzinger and Contador are essentially tied on GC. In those situations you'd never help an adversary get back up to your teammate. That's just basic racing strategy.

I flinched, them grimaced when Peraud went down a second time. He has stones to get up and keep going after the first one, let alone continue to push it.

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Jason N

Jul 17, 13 12:09

Post #700 of 792 (4172 views)
Re: 2013 TdF thread (spoiler alert) [jackmott] [In reply to] Quote | Reply

I just feel really bad for Peraud. Dude broke his collar bone when crashing during a practice run, decides to give it a go anyway as the highest Frenchman in the GC...manages time splits in the top 20...then crashes again at the exact same corner landing on the same shoulder.

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