Thanks for pulling that. What was being said was just mean, almost bullying.

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"injustice anywhere is a threat to justice everywhere" MLK

thanks Jordan. it was a good call to pull it and i love this disclaimer. ST is great.

Jordan -

I started that thread because I was genuinely curious about the selection process, and why USAT/ITU would allow an unranked athlete a spot in a WTS race, and never intended it to be a personal attack against her. I don't know Kristi, and either fortunately or unfortunately, wasn't online and missed anything posted after mid-afternoon.

Nevertheless, I do think it's an interesting development in the OT saga, especially given the high caliber athletes left off the list.

I assume it's because no other athletes put their name in the running, but I think it's a questionable decision for USAT to allow that to go through without intervening, since there are a number of athletes on the bubble of being top 140 that aren't racing.

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What I find kinda interesting. What happens if she actually finishes as the top US woman in the top 9. She would get the 3rd spot, but would she have enough points to then make the ITU point requirement to be eligible to make the London start line? I think you have to be ranked in the top 125/140 on the points list or whatever. I'm not seeing her ranking on any of the points list as of this AM (maybe, I've missed it).

(This same scenario could have been with LV as well).

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@brooksdoughtie
USAT-L2,Y&J; USAC-L2
http://www.aomultisport.com

She'll most likely get lapped out, as was the case in her only other two ITU races.

http://www.triathlon.org/...risti_johnson/36302/

There are a few girls who are very close to that 140 threshold, but finishing top 9 in San Diego would give them more than enough points to move up.

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Twitter | Kancman | Blog

Brooks,
Do you know when the start list is finalized i.e. no more additions. I saw that Ben Collins was two people away from making it but I don't know when door shuts.

That would be interesting, so would figuring out how to build the starship enterprise this weekend. But I give both of those about the same probability of happening.

The point I was trying to make. There could be an athlete that gets an automatic spot on the USA's Olympic team, but yet cant take that spot. For a "trials", that's weird. Now whether it happens or not, it's just weird that there is a chance this woman could actually qualify but not qualify for the Olympics.

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@brooksdoughtie
USAT-L2,Y&J; USAC-L2
http://www.aomultisport.com

LOL

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How is that weird? Happens in track, for example, regularly...

Excuse my lack of track knowledge, but could you expand how it can happen in track?

You are saying a guy can make the olympic qualifier standard, make the 10k track event, finish in whatever "automatic" spot (i'm assuming top 2/3 in the race make the team in that event), and still not make the team? That to me is weird.

Again, I'm curious how it occurs in other sports. Seems odd to me that someone makes an "automatic" olympic qualifying standard, yet would then not be allowed to compete in the olympics for that country for which they obtained an automatic standard.

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@brooksdoughtie
USAT-L2,Y&J; USAC-L2
http://www.aomultisport.com

1. Athlete J spends the spring standards-chasing, gets Olympic A qualifier.

2. USATF says that at its selection meet, they will take the winner of each event to the Olympics as long as they have made the Olympic B standard required for entry. They will also take places 2 and 3 if all of the athletes have met the A standard.

3. Race day- it's hot and you get a tactical track 10K, which is won by Athlete K. Athlete K only has the B standard within the qualifying period, but USATF's rule says they have an Olympic spot as a B-qualifying event winner. Athlete J finishes 3rd, but in order for USATF to send three athletes in the event, all three must meet the Olympic A standard. So under USATF's rules, they have to send the B qualifier instead of the A qualifiers, and consequently Athlete J is left off the team.

You can even get messier when you get, say, winner at Trials gets an A time, but then 2-4 go B standards or worse (and don't have another A time within the right time frame) and for a few weeks after Trials, everyone goes standards-chasing and the #4 finisher from Trials can bump their way onto the team if they get an A standard at a subsequent meet and the #2 and #3 finishers don't.

Though this time around, there is no standard-chasing after Trials.

USATF Olympic athlete selection procedures:

http://www.usatf.org/...with%20signature.pdf

Ask Bryan Dunn, he can build it for you. Probability rising!!!

(This same scenario could have been with LV as well)



are you saying he has an american passport now ........

Set phasers on stun!

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There is a difference between the Trials qualifying standards and the Olympics qualifying standards. As FlJill explained, it's quite possible and common in fact to not have the Olympics standard yet make the team at the Trials.

I had always assumed that in order to make the track trials, you had to achieve both and thus a true "trials" type of event, where the team is finalized with said result of each event.

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@brooksdoughtie
USAT-L2,Y&J; USAC-L2
http://www.aomultisport.com

Ok, I feel like I need to weigh in (for some reason...).

Here are a few serious problems with this girl being allowed a start in San Diego:

1. She lacks the ability, technical skill, and experience to be even in a Continental Cup. I'm 10000% sure she won't make it even halfway on the bike--this is a given. But my concern is if she panics in the swim start (almost a guarantee) and whacks some other poor girl who's worked *for years* for this opportunity. It would be a travesty if she freaked out and pulled off someone like Laura Bennett's goggles. She could easily impact the race even in the minute or two she's still with the field. Keep in mind, I can guarantee she'll be lapped out.

2. Some athletes have worked for years just to get on that starting line. It's seems like people are saying, "Oh well, she worked the system, good for her." That's BS. If anything, it just amplifies the issues that ITU racing is having in the US. The system is totally screwed when something like this happens. That's a deep seeded problem that is only being highlighted by this sideshow.

3. This coach is going to profit from her start, when in reality his decision to allow his athlete to even put her name on the list is highly questionable. Already it seems like they're pumping the fact that she got into Olympic Trials--again something that athletes and coaches work together FOR YEARS to accomplish. This is the kind of resume-booster that every triathlete--and coach--in America would love to send to potential sponsors and clients. Many sponsors give a massive bonus just for going to Olympic Trials. Once she starts that race, the toothpaste is out of the tube as they say, and no matter how she finishes (or doesn't) she can always say she attended the US Olympic Trials.

4. Similarly, if her coach didn't see this backlash coming (that we're in the process of dealing out right now), then he is even more out of touch with the sport than some have already said. Part of me feels bad for the girl because obviously she's taking a lot of heat right now--though only on some message board, keeping in mind I think she'll profit long-term--when in reality it's their ignorance that's to blame. Clearly someone (or everyone) in that camp has no idea what level ITU athletes race at. At the same time, he seems to think the triathlete community is a bunch of rubes that would fall for this stunt without viciously turning on him and his poor athlete.

The only reason I really decided to chime in on this one is because I really feel for the other Americans who have traveled for months, trained for years, and gone into debt probably for eternity. I've stood on street corners with these guys in far off countries loaded up with luggage and low on money trying to find a bus to do some race 10 hours away. I've watched them bounce back from injury and have incredible races, and I've watched some burn out in a blaze of overtraining. Unfortunately for everyone involved--both the true ITU athletes and this girl--it minimizes the work they have done and it trivializes the struggle they've gone through to get to this point.

I know the guys and girls racing this weekend would probably agree with me, but I bet they're all too busy getting ready for the most important two hours of their lives this weekend. Good luck to my US teammates, and I think we should all be proud of the work (almost) all of them have done to get there.

-Chris

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Thanks for your thoughts Chris - good to hear an insider's perspective.

Great insight Chris!

So what does that say about your national federation when the HP team is calling this type of athlete to fill it's races. Hell, what does that say about the WTS.

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@brooksdoughtie
USAT-L2,Y&J; USAC-L2
http://www.aomultisport.com

Nothing that hasn't been said before 100 times?? USAT is moronic.

My read is that if she came top 9 she would be eligible for the Olympics because she would satisfy bullet four below (she would be ranked in the top 140 of the 2012 WCS rankings, as there are only 58 women currently on the list for 2012 who have scored points). You only need to satisfy one of the five criteria to qualify.
C. Athlete Eligibility (from the ITU website)
All athletes must comply with the provisions of the Olympic Charter currently in force and only those athletes who have complied with the Olympic Charter may participate in the Olympic Games.
Athlete eligibility will be based on earning at least one of the following by 31st May 2012:

• Winning a place for their NOC at the ITU Continental Olympic Qualification Events;
• Winning a place for their NOC at the 2011 ITU World Olympic Qualification Event;
• Being among the top 140 of the ITU Olympic Qualification List;
• Being among the top 140 of the ITU World Championships Series Ranking;
• Being among the top 140 of the ITU Points List;

The criteria and the points system of the ITU Points List can be found here.

Like I said in point #2, I do think this has exposed a massive flaw in the system (both USAT and maybe ITU) and their process.

Hopefully this doesn't minimize the series as a whole, if that's what you mean when you say, "...what does that say about the WTS."

WTS races have always been the pinnacle of competition. I've never seen an athlete 12 minutes** behind in a WTS race, and believe me I'd remember that. They'd be way, way behind even ME...haha.

Unfortunately fuels the fire for those in the US that claim ITU racing is easy or not true triathlon.


**Taking her 6min. gap from Clermont x 2 as it was a sprint and not even accounting for the fact that Clermont is more like a 400m swim with 350m of dolphining. For perspective, I easily made the front pack at Clermont in 2011.

-Chris

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